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Burkion posted:Yet the funny thing is, at least for the first season (the second season I guess the Dub just didn't give a poo poo) they out right stated that Matt wasn't his real name, and instead that the more western names were all Nicknames. I totally have a coworker named Kari. Although she pronounces it like Carrie, instead of with the long A.
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Dec 8, 2015 22:53
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Craptacular! posted:I already reached that age where calling your bad guys Jesse and James was eye-rolling cringe, but renaming a guy from Yamato to Matt seemed to strike a balance of being both relatable to western audiences while also being a nod to the source. But it's not just "censor the angels and the devils." Digimon's approach to that has always been skitzophrenic; Angemon and Devimon get kept in all their obviousness, while we got Creepymon at the same time. Seraphimon kept his name from the start, while they called Cherubimon "Kerpymon". It was like they couldn't decide what they were doing, and everything just became a mess from the start. That digimon that's based on an intermediary stage of an insect? Kurirasarimon. Oh wait, the Tamers dub is calling him Chrysalimon. But now he's Kurisarimon again! For a time there were two Digimon the US was calling Kumamon. LordKnightmon has TWO different dub names as far as the anime goes, and while Frontier was airing, the merchandise put out by Bandai in cards and video games was referring to him and Dynasmon as LordKnightmon and "Dunasmon". ChibiKamemon, the Digimon from Xros Wars who's obviously a kid version of Kamemon from Savers/Data Squad gets called ChibiTortamon in Fusion, a reference to a digimon he in no way resembles. There's this general, recurring issue of the right hand never knowing what the left is doing as far as the localization goes, and frankly, that's embarrassing for what's supposed to be a multimedia franchise. I think I'm perfectly justified in deciding not to bother at all. Nodosaur fucked around with this message at 23:15 on Dec 8, 2015 |
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Dec 8, 2015 23:07
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Well that's what almost 20 years of existence will bring you, especially since while Pokemon is limited to introducing new Pokemon with each generation of main games, Digimon will introduce new kinds as often as possible(helps that they don't have to come up with a full evolution line for each new idea they have, it'll often slide right into an existing one no problem) Burkion posted:To be fair That's partially due to no Digimon game ever having more than about 500 of them at a time, and most have less than 300, would love for them to do a Digimon game some day that had all of them, and had a battle system that wasn't rear end
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Dec 8, 2015 23:09
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Dark_Tzitzimine posted:I'm so glad we barely had this kind of issues with the latinamerican dub. Although is funny that we got "Demon" and "SkullSatanmon" but they still changed Paildramon and Omegamon names. The Latin American dub was incredibly inconsistent in what names it used. Humans always used their western names, Digimon could go either way, attacks were always their Japanese name. Terminology (like Digivolution) always used the English terms, though that was inconsistent in a different way (evolution terms tended to stay in English despite being a Spanish dub during transformation scenes, giving the weird "Agumon Digivolve a..." rather than "Agumon Digievoluciona a...", but outside of that it was correctly translated into Spanish). That said, beyond that weirdness, it was an amazing dub and it will always have my childhood love even when I went and watched everything subbed. No cuts, the original BGM was kept in its entirety (with openings and endings translated into Spanish), and the VAs tended to do a really good job. Also Omegamon is a better name if only because Omnimon breaks the alpha and omega theme with Alphamon. Burkion posted:Like I THINK everyone's real names were listed in the first episode except for Kari (which...isn't an English name I think?) except...maybe Joe. Joe is his real name. Jyou/Jou/whatever is the fandom (and Crunchyroll, somehow) not realizing the name is meant to be Joe to begin with. Hell, check Tri, the Chosen's names appear written in roman letters in the opening and his name is written as Joe. It was always Joe. drrockso20 posted:That's partially due to no Digimon game ever having more than about 500 of them at a time, and most have less than 300, would love for them to do a Digimon game some day that had all of them, and had a battle system that wasn't rear end Now, now, let's not ask for too much. A Digimon game with a good battle system might as well be impossible, outside of card games (Digital Card Battle is really good guys).
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Dec 8, 2015 23:47
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Blaze Dragon posted:The Latin American dub was incredibly inconsistent in what names it used. Humans always used their western names, Digimon could go either way, attacks were always their Japanese name. Terminology (like Digivolution) always used the English terms, though that was inconsistent in a different way (evolution terms tended to stay in English despite being a Spanish dub during transformation scenes, giving the weird "Agumon Digivolve a..." rather than "Agumon Digievoluciona a...", but outside of that it was correctly translated into Spanish). If you're curious about the latinamerican dub, you should check here (everything is in spanish of course) http://es.doblaje.wikia.com/wiki/Digimon Aside of listing all the cast involved on the series, there are some pretty interesting trivia facts about it. Dark_Tzitzimine fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Dec 8, 2015 |
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Dec 8, 2015 23:55
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TFRazorsaw posted:There's this general, recurring issue of the right hand never knowing what the left is doing as far as the localization goes, and frankly, that's embarrassing for what's supposed to be a multimedia franchise. I think I'm perfectly justified in deciding not to bother at all. I never knew about that kind of thing, though my reaction is to go by whatever Bandai is using in games and merchandise etc,since it's officially their thing and anime licensors are just screwing it all up. I didn't watch anything more than Adventure, but I know where you're coming from remember when Final Fantasy IV was "FF2/4j" because it was released stateside with a different Roman numeral. But the truth is that in most conversations acknowledging the "4j" part in many didn't relate to Japan's FF2. It was a needless clarification included only for the speaker to burnish their knowledge of video games that didn't get released in their region. It's this dickish "well in Japan... [adjusts glasses]" thing that always got tiresome. Fortunately, Square eventually brought out everything and re-aligned the Roman numerals. The same is true of "Super Mario 2", which is still usually a modified Doki Doki Panic in most English conversations; though mostly because Nintendo sought fit to title the original as "The Lost Levels." The takeaway of all this is that in both examples someone made an effort to align Japanese and western localizations for things after a few years of Japan Experts forever reminding us that (foo) in Japan is called (bar). I don't know if Digimon has ever made that effort, but if you just say gently caress it all and call everything by it's Japanese name then you confuse not just fans of the poorly handled anime dub but fans of anything across the entire franchise who didn't immerse themselves in the Japanese property.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:02
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I'm sorry, but I don't know what to tell you. This is what I choose to run with. But no, to answer your question, there has never been any effort to align things more closely.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:23
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To be 'fair' Digimon never took off in the states like Pokemon did. So there was never really a need or effort to get things to work more in line with one another. Tri actually has taken more steps towards the English side of things if anything- I seem to recall they used some of the dub names in the earlier promo stuff and subtitled trailers. Also I never knew Joe's name was......Joe. Always just blindly believed others when they said it was something more Japanese.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:26
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Burkion posted:To be 'fair' Digimon never took off in the states like Pokemon did. So there was never really a need or effort to get things to work more in line with one another. It never was. Tri confirms that it's meant to be Joe, despite Crunchyroll subbing it as "Jo". But romanization is kind of a confusing mess to begin with so I don't blame anyone. Even moreso when his name is not written in katakana as would be expected from an English name, so it'd be logical to assume it is not meant to be Joe. Reminds me of Guy Shishioh, whose name is written in kanji yet the series itself romanizes it as "Guy" rather than "Gai". The efforts Tri took (such as using "Digidestined" in subs and in the site Takeru uses to contact the international Chosen Children...albeit misspelled as "Digidistined") are actually not new at all. The International Chosen for Australia in 02 used "Digidestined" rather than "Chosen Child" as well, and the Mexican one's Gotsumon used the word "Digievolucion" (wrongly, since it should've been "Digivolve a..." as per the Latin American dub). The Japanese side of Digimon has never ignored the dub exists, and I think that's praise-worthy! Shows how much Toei/Bandai cared about keeping an international fandom.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:39
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Not really? I mean, they throw a few names around in English (while using more Japanese ones) in the sub and the promo material they released in the west, and the words "digidestined" appears written, but the term "chosen children" is still what's spoken. It's far from being a massive tonal shift. They've also used nods to the foreign localization before, also; Gotsumon says the Latin American version of "digivolve" instead of "evolve" in the episode where Ken and Yamato are in Mexico. As for "Joe" verses "Jou", I wouldn't get too far ahead of yourselves. Toei has always been kind of inconsistent about how names are written in English. Kimeramon and Submarimon are rendered "Chimairamon" and "Sabmarimon", and they wrote Miyako's name as "Kyo" whenever it was rendered in English for years.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:41
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Dark_Tzitzimine posted:I'm so glad we barely had this kind of issues with the latinamerican dub. Although is funny that we got "Demon" and "SkullSatanmon" but they still changed Paildramon and Omegamon names. Omnimon seems so much more fitting for a fusion that (we thought) transcended the final level than Omegamon which sounds cool, but seems kind of random. Keep in mind, he was around long years before Alphamon existed so the alpha/omega theme wasn't around yet.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:48
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TFRazorsaw posted:Not really? I mean, they throw a few names around in English (while using more Japanese ones) in the sub and the promo material they released in the west, and the words "digidestined" appears written, but the term "chosen children" is still what's spoken. It's far from being a massive tonal shift. You are just a bundle of joy and sunshine aren't you
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Dec 9, 2015 00:50
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You don't really need to read offense into everything other people say.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:56
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It was kinda strange they changed one Japanese surname to another Japanese surname, but I guess it was to stop kids from making a joke about spelling Yagami backwards.
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Dec 9, 2015 02:11
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It's more that Kamiya and Yagami are written similarly. That's how the "Kyo" thing started, along with some of the weirder dub names like "Halsemon."
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Dec 9, 2015 02:42
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Bandai seemed to give less of a poo poo than Saban did and neither were ever on the same page when it came to names. The dub at least tried to interpret the Japanese names most of the time, like actually calling the Cherubimon the right name, whereas Bandai seemed to have translators with a tenuous grasp of Japanese, frequently confusing B and P characters (example: ピヨモン (piyomon) as ビヨモン (biyomon)) and not even trying to change them into English (apokarimon or kurisarimon instead of apocalymon and chrysallimon) When it comes to the mythology-based ones I don't blame them for not getting it right though. (agnimon to agunimon, hours mom to halsemon, etc) but that kind of thing still bugs me just because I've been romanizing katakana for over 15 years I might be getting some of this stuff wrong though because I'm doing this all from my memory of being a 10 year old digimon nerd who practically lived on the internet.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:02
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Considering how Yagami and Kamiya are almost the same with reversed word sections, it feels like it might have just been someone transposing the Japanese characters by accident. After which, once it passed marketing and legal, Saban just shrugged and ran with it.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:32
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Burkion posted:Also I never knew Joe's name was......Joe. Always just blindly believed others when they said it was something more Japanese.
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Dec 9, 2015 13:47
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Twiddy posted:Understand that these purists to Japanese names sound like they're very similar to the people that say the main character in Hellsing is Arukaido, not Alucard. Oh My God are there really people out there that loving stupid? There can't be ...who am I kidding that sounds EXACTLY like some of the Digimon sites I hung around in the early 2000s
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Dec 9, 2015 17:44
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I knew someone who called Joe 'Jyou'. And while I still speak to her sometimes and she's a good person and all that, she was also the first person I had to have that "why are you sprinkling English sentences with Japanese words" conversation with.
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Dec 9, 2015 18:22
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... Except "Jou/Jo/Jyou" is actually a name that happens to sound like a western one, while "Arucard" is a transliteration. They're not the same thing. At all.
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Dec 9, 2015 19:23
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TFRazorsaw posted:... Except "Jou/Jo/Jyou" is actually a name that happens to sound like a western one, while "Arucard" is a transliteration. If I'm reading his thing, they mispronounced as Jyou deliberately. That kind of bullshit that people think you remind them of when you have different intentions. It's why I confused you with that other jackoff earlier in the thread because on some subconscious level I must have compared the two of you, even though you're far more reasonable.
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Dec 9, 2015 19:31
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You know that person didn't say the thing you accused them of either? Because all he did was say what he thought sounded more believable for the character. So please don't compare either of us? I'm not really comfortable with that. The point is Jou's name has a bunch of ways of being written, and sometimes even Japanese sources spell it the same as "Joe". It doesn't mean that his name is a Western one (anymore than Ken's name is short for Kenneth) or that the other spellings are inaccurate. spelling ut that doesn't mean his name is literally an English one, or that it's the same thing as "Arucard" or "Edo and Aru" bullshit. Nodosaur fucked around with this message at 19:57 on Dec 9, 2015 |
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Dec 9, 2015 19:49
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...How do you 'mispronounce' Joe as Jyou? It's the exact same word phonetically, albeit with a longer 'J' sound, which doesn't matter in English anyway. I've pretty much always used the Japanese names, mostly because I stumbled across them online when I was a kid and figured out the dub names were all intended to be nicknames. It felt cool at the time. Tri's also only out in sub right now, so I figure it's just less confusing to stick to one set of naming conventions.
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Dec 10, 2015 04:29
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I've met a number of people enamored with Japan who are somehow incapable of pronouncing Japanese words. Probably something like Gee-yo, I would guess.
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Dec 10, 2015 04:35
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I straight up don't know poo poo about Japanese, so don't get into an argument on my account. What I was experiencing was the equivalent of people writing "desu" in the middle of traditional English. (This was online, nobody was actually pronouncing anything.) My point is that you have to be a little bit weeb to write such a westernized name in it's Japanese phonetics.
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Dec 10, 2015 04:36
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Craptacular! posted:I straight up don't know poo poo about Japanese, so don't get into an argument on my account. What I was experiencing was the equivalent of people writing "desu" in the middle of traditional English. (This was online, nobody was actually pronouncing anything.) From now on, I'm only going to spell it 大丈夫.
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Dec 10, 2015 04:41
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On the subject of romanizing Digimon names, it's important to remember that Bandai and Toei are absolutely terrible at keeping consistent romanizations, not to mention they tend to romanize names with very blatant mistakes (see how many -doramon you can find). In fact, they can even romanize a name in two different ways in one screen! On Joe, as I said, his name is not written as you'd expect Joe to be (丈, instead of ジョー), but nonetheless Toei themselves use Joe and every dub uses Joe so...it's likely meant to be Joe despite not using katakana, as a foreign name would usually.
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Dec 10, 2015 05:00
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Craptacular! posted:I straight up don't know poo poo about Japanese, so don't get into an argument on my account. What I was experiencing was the equivalent of people writing "desu" in the middle of traditional English. (This was online, nobody was actually pronouncing anything.) The problem is an issue of Romanization. There are several styles in use, but no one has established an official one, so everyone does what they want. It's probably the smallest possible issue regarding translation, so no one gives that much care to it. I know I don't.
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Dec 10, 2015 05:24
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The main problem I am having is who cares if they have a consistent naming scheme or stay faithful to ~Japan~ as neither is going to effect any non weeboo fan.
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Dec 10, 2015 09:02
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CharlestheHammer posted:The main problem I am having is who cares if they have a consistent naming scheme or stay faithful to ~Japan~ as neither is going to effect any non weeboo fan.
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Dec 10, 2015 09:21
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I think the most damning example of "Are you even trying. No loving seriously what?" When it comes to digimon dubbing is... this. How. It's not like Agumon is some digimon that's just shown up or doesn't have about 80 million variations or isn't a poster child for this series. It's loving Agumon. I will take inconsistent changed names on so many other digimon bit... Agumon EDIT: Clarification. I'm not mad about Augumon. I'm baffled. CharlestheHammer posted:The main problem I am having is who cares if they have a consistent naming scheme or stay faithful to ~Japan~ as neither is going to effect any non weeboo fan. What a loving retarded argument. So you're saying if you were reading a book and then in the next book a character was referred to by a different name, and in the next book another new name, who loving cares if it's consistent. You're stupid for expecting consistency. That is loving retarded. Onmi fucked around with this message at 12:08 on Dec 10, 2015 |
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Dec 10, 2015 11:43
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Yes I don't really care, until it was brought up here I didn't even notice it was a thing.
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Dec 10, 2015 16:00
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From what I've seen, the dub of Fusion is even lower budget than the Data Squad one.
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Dec 10, 2015 16:30
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How Did they gently caress up Agumon's name like that Oh wait it's based on the sequel to Xros Wars I am no longer surprised
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Dec 10, 2015 17:33
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Burkion posted:How It isn't, it's the actual Xros Wars dub, not Hunters. Hunters never used the Digimemories. It should be noted that it isn't the only time they hosed up a name either, just...it's a lot harder to ignore when it is the name of Digimon's equivalent to Pikachu.
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Dec 10, 2015 18:03
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I have to say, I can understand the complications from names changing across the franchise, but that's pretty incredible screwing it up on the exact same image.
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Dec 10, 2015 18:33
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On a related note, I was waiting in line for a comedy show with some friends the other day and I started telling them about Tri. We ended up talking about Digimon for awhile until the conversation came to a dead halt when I brought up Omegamon. Everyone just looked at me like I was crazy, until I realized I was using his Japanese name. Needless to say, they made fun of me for being such a huge dork, and I deserved it.
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Dec 10, 2015 23:00
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Onmi posted:I think the most damning example of "Are you even trying. No loving seriously what?" When it comes to digimon dubbing is... this. My precious anime spellings.
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Dec 11, 2015 01:22
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Some of them are LESS weeaboo, you know. Like... a good number of the Frontier digimon. They specifically changed Fairymon to Kazemon to make it more exotic. But again, it's consistency.
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Dec 11, 2015 05:20
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