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a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


Meinberg we are TD bros, so if you tell me if you are scum or town I won't shoot you again. You have to admit, that "he's not picking up on town vibes" post should have gotten you straight executed.

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a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


SirSamVimes posted:

Alright. I can't detect someone's alignment, but I can detect... well, pretty much everything else. All I'll say is that TheNinthLayer was telling the truth about his specialisation being at range (although I personally would have probably allocated his stats differently), and also he's Livireen. So I'd say that makes him trustworthy.

I investigated him because a) he requested a position which is something that I can confirm or prove false, b) he is a good scumhunter as town and I wanted to try to clear him early.

What specifically is it about what you can detect that confirms him in your mind?

Meinberg
Oct 9, 2011

inspired by but legally distinct from CATS (2019)

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Meinberg we are TD bros, so if you tell me if you are scum or town I won't shoot you again. You have to admit, that "he's not picking up on town vibes" post should have gotten you straight executed.

I can promise you that I am town. Hopefully with me not LARPing this weekend, I should be able to be more useful to town on D2. I mean, maybe.

If I wasn't terrible at Mafia.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

What specifically is it about what you can detect that confirms him in your mind?

The fact that he was telling the truth about his preferred position and that his culture is Livireen. It's still possible that he's scum, but these two things make it unlikely.

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

I'm definitely not drunk posting but here's a picture of me putting furniture together right now

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


SirSamVimes posted:

The fact that he was telling the truth about his preferred position and that his culture is Livireen. It's still possible that he's scum, but these two things make it unlikely.

I don't really see how either could confirm anything, but you would have a better idea than I would so I'll roll with it.

merk
May 20, 2003

##interact

Jose Valasquez posted:

I'm definitely not drunk posting but here's a picture of me putting furniture together right now



This makes me want to drink.

tuckfard
Dec 9, 2003

Just chillin
Ugh that was my entire Christmas break

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


A scum who requests to be in the backline would probably have melee capabilities to cause sabotage. A ranged person can not even hit friendly targets, and his sole melee ability deals 1 damage (lol). Also, Livireen is one of the Qal cultures.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


I like your fireplace. Also I am going to go on hiatus until battle results get posted and the scum make their move. Ttyl dudes.

King of Bleh
Mar 3, 2007

A kingdom of rats.

SirSamVimes posted:

A scum who requests to be in the backline would probably have melee capabilities to cause sabotage. A ranged person can not even hit friendly targets, and his sole melee ability deals 1 damage (lol). Also, Livireen is one of the Qal cultures.

Both of your assumptions here are incorrect.

EccoRaven posted:

- During Battle, if a scum-aligned player has a MELEE ability, they may use it only on THEIR OWN rank. A scum-aligned player with a RANGE ability may use it only on the rank directly ahead of them.

<snip>

NOTE: there WILL be some "Bad" Cultures in the "Good" thread, and vice versa. Not all the heterogeneous cultures will be scum-aligned. Do not use culture to predict alignment you racist.

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

I think Merk has my back.
more self-protection from WLOTM!

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


I know that people outside CAN be outside of their team's cultures, but that's not likely. However, I didn't realise that part about ranged abilities on scum. Regardless, with his skills he could have built for a strike against his fellow ranged targets but he didn't.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


kaschei posted:

more self-protection from WLOTM!

Kaschei, I already admitted that I am defensive. I don't see what your point is here.

I want to win and I believe that when I am in battle that we can. Unfortunately, I couldn't predict Quan's lurker only strategy.

QuoProQuid
Jan 12, 2012

Tr*ckin' and F*ckin' all the way to tha
T O P

For those of you who are participating in the battle, please be sure to check the other thread before submitting your actions.

Thanks.

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Kaschei, I already admitted that I am defensive. I don't see what your point is here.

I want to win and I believe that when I am in battle that we can. Unfortunately, I couldn't predict Quan's lurker only strategy.
I think it's scummy and the extent to which you do it makes it alarmingly so. It also used to be your justification for pre-announcing your target and then that changed when you needed to argue that your power was trivial and the entire purpose was content, which was hilarious on its own and I feel like bringing up again:

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

I didn't admit anything, I used the example of voting to illustrate how stupid it would be to ask me to be open about who I am attacking.

Clearly you see how admitting my target would likely make it impossible to be effective. This is a game with heals and stuns. If it is possible to avoid those things when attacking someone I view as scummy, why wouldn't I?

Conversely, it is in my best interests to prove myself as townie ASAP because of reasons... so I propose that being completely open about the presence of the ability, is the way to do it.
(emphasis mine)

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Please explain to me the difference? My power is repeatable. I'll shoot someone tomorrow as well. The trade off to being open about it on day one (putting me in danger of being stunned) as opposed to doing what you are saying is that it got everyone talking and forming meaningful connections immediately. The damage that my day-attack does will not instantly kill anyone (I'd imagine). So the trade off in doing a minor bit of damage (versus getting the thread talking) was worth it to me.

I'll be willing to acknowledge that my idea was a failure, but only in the sense that there are still like 7 people who haven't said gently caress-all, and I am sure that at least one or two of them are scum, so whenever I flip it wont really matter with regards to them.
(emphasis mine again)

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


I never announced that my ability was strong enough to kill someone, you are misrepresenting things intentionally.

The Ninth Layer
Jun 20, 2007

Sorry for lack of posting still in Vegas I get back tomorrow.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


The reason I didn't preannounce the target had nothing to do with whether or not the damage went through you dolt.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


But for real I might ask Ecco to replace out, or just post my damage numbers and suicide because when only 8 out of 25 people care enough to post regularly, why bother?

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

But for real I might ask Ecco to replace out, or just post my damage numbers and suicide because when only 8 out of 25 people care enough to post regularly, why bother?

:emo:

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

You posted 100 times more than the next most active poster, maybe you're just posting too much?

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Haha murder kill murder kill.

Meinberg
Oct 9, 2011

inspired by but legally distinct from CATS (2019)

Jose Valasquez posted:

You posted 100 times more than the next most active poster, maybe you're just posting too much?

Come on, don't exaggerate. He only has literally 2.3 times the number of posts than King of Bleh.

Seriously, WLOTM, you gotta chill a bit. Just because people aren't posting at the rate that you want doesn't mean that they're not engaged in the game and putting out content.

Puntification
Nov 4, 2009

Black Orthodontromancy
The most British Magic

Fun Shoe

These they are the best :3

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

Here's my rendition of day 1

Puntification
Nov 4, 2009

Black Orthodontromancy
The most British Magic

Fun Shoe

Jose Valasquez posted:

Here's my rendition of day 1



this seems like a pro-jacasta cartoon, we should turbo you tomorrow for this open sedition

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

Puntification posted:

this seems like a pro-jacasta cartoon, we should turbo you tomorrow for this open sedition

It's satire you peasant

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Stab stab stab.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply

*makes star wars lightsaber nooses while swinging a broom around*

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

I HEX YE!!!


Puntification posted:

this seems like a pro-jacasta cartoon, we should turbo you tomorrow for this open sedition

Look at this loser taking Kelly seriously

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

I never announced that my ability was strong enough to kill someone, you are misrepresenting things intentionally.
First, you keep objecting this way as though I've assumed this, but I haven't. I don't believe you about your role so I'm not ruling out worst possibilities but the relative power of your role has nothing to do with my criticism, which is that the way you have tried to leverage it to protect yourself is scummy. I do want to point out that if someone else dies you have plenty of outs - how could you have guessed Quandary would pick Scummy So-and-So for the battle? etc. You don't have to have picked a target just because you said you did, and that's even assuming that you have a role mostly resembling what you've claimed.
You've shifted from

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

I didn't pick randomly, I picked a scum.
to

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Please explain to me the difference? My power is repeatable. I'll shoot someone tomorrow as well. The trade off to being open about it on day one (putting me in danger of being stunned) as opposed to doing what you are saying is that it got everyone talking and forming meaningful connections immediately. The damage that my day-attack does will not instantly kill anyone (I'd imagine). So the trade off in doing a minor bit of damage (versus getting the thread talking) was worth it to me.
So your claimed motivation went from "I think I found scum and I'm doing something [useless] about it" to "hey everybody's talking and that's good right?" Meanwhile you are unable to talk about who the scum is that you think is worth shooting lest you further tip your already-quite-tipped hand. If you really thought they were scum worth shooting, you would have just loving cased them, because them dead from lynching would be a much better result than annoyed from weakvig.

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Clearly you see how admitting my target would likely make it impossible to be effective. This is a game with heals and stuns. If it is possible to avoid those things when attacking someone I view as scummy, why wouldn't I?
I don't know, why didn't you avoid "stuns" and shut the gently caress up? This can't just be a rhetorical question, it needs answering. Your answer is;

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Conversely, it is in my best interests to prove myself as townie ASAP because of reasons... so I propose that being completely open about the presence of the ability, is the way to do it.
My answer: this is sheer self-preservation. If you were town, you outed yourself as a power role for the sake of preventing a hypothetical power role lynch (your own) that was not in the foreseeable future, as you can't seem to stop reminding people. What is the point beyond saving your skin? "Because of reasons."

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

I'm very sad that my keyboard caused an incorrect semicolon-where-colon-is-appropriate and the rules of mafia forbid me from correcting this error

tokenbrownguy
Apr 1, 2010

imo moon has an ability that triggers off being targeted by night actions.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


Lowtax, fix the forums.

Meinberg posted:


Seriously, WLOTM, you gotta chill a bit. Just because people aren't posting at the rate that you want doesn't mean that they're not engaged in the game and putting out content.

Sure. I'll chill. I am just annoyed by a combo of things with regards to this game. A bit about all the shade being thrown at me based on mechanics (even though if the town knew my full ability sheet they would understand why I posted like I have), a bit about the terrible loving lynch from last night that was the embodiment of giving up and doing what's easy, and a mix of other things.

I'm definitely not going to post as much during D2. Maybe someone else will come in and put forth some effort.

Jose Valasquez
Apr 8, 2005

WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:

Lowtax, fix the forums.


Sure. I'll chill. I am just annoyed by a combo of things with regards to this game. A bit about all the shade being thrown at me based on mechanics (even though if the town knew my full ability sheet they would understand why I posted like I have), a bit about the terrible loving lynch from last night that was the embodiment of giving up and doing what's easy, and a mix of other things.

I'm definitely not going to post as much during D2. Maybe someone else will come in and put forth some effort.
If we could see anyone's character sheet we would understand their posting a lot better. This isn't a new mafia concept. Perhaps you should reconsider how you play/post given the rules of Mafia don't support the way you are trying to play.

Who should we have lynched last night instead? What was the knockout case that we ignored?

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

All the shade being thrown at you is me. And it's not mechanics-based or dependent on your ability being lethal and you keep lying about that, changing your story, and making a vague mechanics-based defense. That and your being way more interested in mechanically clearing yourself than casing scum.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back
Grimey Drawer
Ecco posted in the other thread about how she isn't accepting battle actions until preliminary phase is over. I will accept actions for both phases now, but if you submit for battle phase and something happens to you in preliminary phase I won't let you change your action, so be hasty at your own risk.

Anyone who has already submitted their battle action can resubmit this one time just cause it may not have been clear (it totally was but reading is hard).

Also everyone so far had been doing this so you're all pretty great, but make sure you put the actual name of your action in the PM, not just ##shoot or whatever.

a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


kaschei posted:

First, you keep objecting this way as though I've assumed this, but I haven't. I don't believe you about your role so I'm not ruling out worst possibilities but the relative power of your role has nothing to do with my criticism, which is that the way you have tried to leverage it to protect yourself is scummy. I do want to point out that if someone else dies you have plenty of outs - how could you have guessed Quandary would pick Scummy So-and-So for the battle? etc. You don't have to have picked a target just because you said you did, and that's even assuming that you have a role mostly resembling what you've claimed.

You've shifted from

to

So your claimed motivation went from "I think I found scum and I'm doing something [useless] about it" to "hey everybody's talking and that's good right?" Meanwhile you are unable to talk about who the scum is that you think is worth shooting lest you further tip your already-quite-tipped hand. If you really thought they were scum worth shooting, you would have just loving cased them, because them dead from lynching would be a much better result than annoyed from weakvig.

I don't know, why didn't you avoid "stuns" and shut the gently caress up? This can't just be a rhetorical question, it needs answering. Your answer is;

My answer: this is sheer self-preservation. If you were town, you outed yourself as a power role for the sake of preventing a hypothetical power role lynch (your own) that was not in the foreseeable future, as you can't seem to stop reminding people. What is the point beyond saving your skin? "Because of reasons."

Emphasis is mine.

I'm posting from awfulapp, so please excuse any hiccups.

You are mostly correct in your read of the situation. I am going to address your points based on the blocks of text that you have posted.

1) Yes, scum could easily claim a similar power; however, I would argue that for as little sense as you feel my posting has, that doing so from a scum standpoint would make even less sense. We could go back and forth on this, but it is ultimately a point of WIFOM.

2) Yes, I slightly misrepresented the power of the attack. I did this at first to get people talking, as for all of my self preservation, if I were to flip, I want some hard opinions to remain for people to look at.

Looking at Narcos flip relative to the day one posting tells us almost nothing, and I would like to avoid that if possible.

After we got away from the mechanics talk, I became more open about the nature of the attack, because I don't consider my quasi-vig ability to be the focus of my character.

Hence the "reasons" that you are so hung up on. You are right that I would like to preserve myself and be put into battle because I think I could be very effective in it. Perhaps I am overestimating my power. Still, in my mind it made sense to be completely open about the fact that I would be attacking players I viewed as scummy, because I figured that info would get out anyway.

...

Now for some new stuff!

...

For anyone who is not Kaschei, I still maintain that he is not reading the thread in the way that a townie would.

Look at Meinberg's posts from last night and now look at my bold emphasis in Kaschei's post... Kaschei says that he doubts that I am being honest regarding the power and he also doubts that I even targeted anyone.

What's wrong here?

Meinberg openly claimed last night that he was the target of my attack! Why then, in the middle of his posting flurry, would Kaschei not read his claim?

He is not reading the thread like a townie should.

Meinberg is someone who many people found to be scummy based on his day one posting. Specifically the "dreadful" post about townie vibes.

Meinberg has openly corroborated that I attacked him. You can decide for yourself whether or not that means that I was honest when I said I thought I attacked a scum.

By extension, the fact that Meinberg is alive corroborates the second part of my claim, that the attack is probably not enough to kill anyone.

Look at what Kaschei has been going on about in my points of emphasis. Look at Meinberg's posts. How could Kaschei miss it?

He isn't reading the thread.

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a new study bible!
Feb 2, 2009



BIG DICK NICK
A Philadelphia Legend
Fly Eagles Fly


Jose Valasquez posted:



Who should we have lynched last night instead? What was the knockout case that we ignored?

I maintain that there were better cases on SSV, KoB, or even me.

Last night was basically a no-lynch.

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