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Diogines posted:I guess I am writing this because I feel badly for Goons who made... more er "sensible" votes and got an Enkidel they are not happy with? The sensible thing probably would've been to accept that Naomi would go off into some loveless political marriage, and get ourselves set up as a prosperous merchant. Like, really. I think I could get behind that idea, if we were doing it over. The life-goal of "Be Narod" is one I still consider wise, for the time.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:34
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The problem is that, with a game of this sheer magnitude, it'll be impossible to make everyone happy. Some of us are still upset that we aren't High Priest of Asherah, others are mad that we didn't set up a little love shack with Paebel somewhere, not to mention the Goons still waiting for the day we make Puabi into waifu #3, after Snarls and Naomi. Personally, I don't think I'll ever be "happy", hell, I'm still upset that Ethan died - for the handful of you that still remember that - but, I'm having a hell of a fun time in this journey, and with the arguing. I think the debates and the (mostly) friendly arguing is one of my favorite parts of this game, that and watching everyone else's character development like Uriah and Danal and our kids.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:43
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Vavrek posted:The sensible thing probably would've been to accept that Naomi would go off into some loveless political marriage, and get ourselves set up as a prosperous merchant. It's too late. Uriah is our Narod.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:45
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Diogines posted:
You motion to the innkeeper for being you a beer. The contracting walls and ceiling slow a bit as the innkeeper, cleaning a cup with a rag behind the bar looks to Ishamal who nods once. There is a certain sort of very bitter herb like a horseradish plant in Ur which some Blooded men enjoy in their beer. Blooded men because it would be torturous to others. It is much more bitter than horseradish. Still, some swear by it, however it is definitely an acquired taste.  The innkeeper takes a large spoonful of the stuff from a jar behind the bar, too large in fact and places it into a cup of beer which he brings to you, setting it on the table in front of you. The walls and ceiling all seem to be moving towards you. You say to Ishamal. "Thanks for the heads up. I won't stop trying to save these people. Sorry you can't be here." You take a sip from your beer. It is terrible, far too bitter. Ishamal takes a sip from his own cup and says "It was required to tell you." You want to place down the beer... but you can't and you continue to gulp the stuff down. It should only be had in sips... Ishamal adds "To speak even a word in kindness or sympathy for your situation would only embolden you. To give you orders would only cause you to defy them on principal. I will give you truth-" your mouth is burning. The cup should be empty but it does not run out, you choke and gag from it even as your eyes water and your mouth burns from the hot spices.  Ishamal's tone is not angry but is dark and grim as he speaks "Ithma perishes and Uriah screams in a maddened rage even as he is coated in his friends blood, trying to return the dead to life. Nahari, David and Asahel drag him from the remains somehow and he weeps day and night at what he has done, inconsolable. He deserves better but does not get it. Your mens confidence is shattered." STOP! STOP! You try to yank the cup from your lips but you cannot and gallons of the foul bitter drink goes down your choking throat. The walls are closing in on you, closer and closer by the moment as the building distorts and moves you closer to the door. "Uriah is deep in his grief but not for overly long. He perishes in the next confrontation, as do many of your men though you survive somehow, your Well greatly diminished." The door is getting closer, even as you choke at rancid beer. "None of your men survive the next encounter and even the terrified Gebabans who run for their lives are dead or... worse by the following day. Ruth escapes with a handful of young men, she and they alone, far from safety or home. Asahel and David are truly courageous, at the end. Later Naomi..." You reach the door. 
Diogines fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Jan 18, 2016 |
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Jan 18, 2016 23:52
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Open the door.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:55
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TheCog posted:No one dropped us in a dangerous situation? We, of our own free will, knowing we weren't allowed to use the arsenal at our disposal, because using it can set off a nuke under our feet and kill everyone we love, decided to go off into the monster infested wilderness, where we judged we had the skills to survive without using the arsenal. But when we did this, we accepted there was a chance we'd run into thing we couldn't beat, and we'd take losses, or die, because, as we were explicitly told over and over, dying is better than becoming a hunger demon. This is very true. We wanted to come out here and got in over our heads because we're trying to do an impossible thing. But as you said the alternative is to do what Ishamal does and what the Melachim want which is nothing. They want us to have free will and not influence us, but they really seem to want us to sit at home and let the world spin. Nothing wrong with that (as far as we know), but it doesn't make for a good story. In other news I got to use the phrase "The situation is not so dire" with one of my patients today. So thank you for that.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:58
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Develop an acquired taste for super bitter drinks. We can handle it next time.
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Jan 18, 2016 23:58
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"Only one has perfect knowledge. I reject your soothsaying. El will provide" Then chug that cup deeply while staring Not!Ishamal in the eye. e: Ahahaha Ishamal just totally bailed us out. In giving us a "lesson" he's basically told us what our most likely future is and now we can plan against it.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:00
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Voting to pray some more. I love praying.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:02
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As far as I'm concerned, and I think I'm not alone in this, the banning from Ur will open a new chapter in Enkidel's life. Sure, it's unfortunate, we made poor decisions and will suffer for it, but what is a story without suffering? If Enkidel always made the right decisions, I think the story would be pretty boring. As much as Diog is not building any narrative structure into the story, and as much as we try to be genre savvy, I think that our conceits and failures produce a much richer and more narratively compelling result. I can't wait to see where this leads. Next time there's a vote on what adventure to embark on, a trip to Baitel finally won't be an option. If Enkidel doesn't immediately faceplant into an even bigger demon, who knows what we'll discover in the future? Maybe with a few centuries of penance we can even win back some trust. Or maybe we'll finally give the establishment the finger for good and leave to found our own civilization. Whatever happens, I expect it will be at least as interesting as what we've done so far.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:02
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Basically yeah, we can sit at home and auto vote "Do what Ishmael says" and get the high score but it would be a boring story. The other option is do things that aren't optimal which leads to ruin, but at least it's an interesting ruin. Kick in the door, vomit bitter beer over everything and rage rage rage against the darkness.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:06
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Stop the flow of [???] to Uriah He's gonna gently caress it up and accidentally explode Ithma instead.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:07
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Voting to ban Ishamal from Kavodel.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:08
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Hope for a better outcome, perhaps this is praying but I am not so sure anymore. Open the door.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:08
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after we wake up gather our balls Inform them we received word from on high, these people may not be saved They are to go north, to Zepath, in the break between demon assaults we hopefully have. They take Snarls We will stay here, hoping that El will smile upon us Else all shall perish here, except ourselves If they refuse we do what is necessary to move them, including reveal our wings and poo poo Re-evaluate our options when our balls are safe
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Jan 19, 2016 00:08
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Wonder in an equally grim and dark tone: "And just out of curiosity, how much of that is just bad luck and culmination of circumstance, and how much is being orchestrated to punish me?"
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Jan 19, 2016 00:09
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SerSpook posted:after we wake up gather our balls No, don't do any of those things.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:09
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Stop the flow of [???]. Savor the nuances of the beer. We're more blooded than anyone, it stands to reason that we can develop a taste for more bitter beer than anyone! Ralith fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jan 19, 2016 |
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Jan 19, 2016 00:10
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Tsyni posted:No, don't do any of those things. No, we should do those things, they are good and might spare our Balls. We already lost a pair to Ishamal, let's not lose this set
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Jan 19, 2016 00:13
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Diogines posted:We run the game in a simulationist manner, which is to say what happens happens and nothing is done for "narrative" reasons. Nothing happens because it is cool or fair or dramatic or tells a good story. I do think a more result oriented voting scheme would help goons generally, but that's not really Diogs responsibility. I don't know, what I'm trying to transmit is that I love this game, and it wouldn't be the same without all the wrong-voters I report every time, and that its ok that we screw up.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:15
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Also, the drink is bitter? Fine! Drink deep from the bitter beer. Savor it. We ordered this beer, we're going to finish it.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:19
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Diogines posted:"Uriah is deep in his grief but not for overly long. He perishes in the next confrontation, as do many of your men though you survive somehow, your Well greatly diminished." The door is getting closer, even as you choke at rancid beer. "None of your men survive the next encounter and even the terrified Gebabans who run for their lives are dead or... worse by the following day. Ruth escapes with a handful of young men, she and they alone, far from safety or home." Ah-ha! It's a fake! Ruth is a man! Grasping at straws, I know. If this truly is Ishamal, he is telling us what we already know - to continue the way we currently are is to fail. That's the bitter truth. Drink even deeper, refuse the door. Accept the "truth" of things. The only way we make it out of here is to stop deluding ourselves that we can save all of these people. Even if we continue to try to save them, we must accept what is likely to happen.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:19
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Task Manager posted:Ah-ha! It's a fake! Ruth is a man! Yup.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:21
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the_steve posted:Wonder in an equally grim and dark tone: "And just out of curiosity, how much of that is just bad luck and culmination of circumstance, and how much is being orchestrated to punish me?"
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Jan 19, 2016 00:21
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Jesus.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:22
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This feels very sketchy, it plays on our worst fears and... I don't know, it seems awfully out of character of Ish to talk like this. I think the issue with this story and with how the world reacts to us as characters is that the PtB are immortal and as such percieve time in a way we couldn't possibly understand and as such they could never percieve time the way we do. Add to the fact that we as players of this CYOA wants to do things in timespans of a few years, whereas I figure the PtB would rather us do things (or to be honest, not do things) for tens of years. This presents a pretty big problem for how we're going to play Enkidel, because it wouldn't make a fun game if the updates Dio does would only recollect for every year passed in the game instead of being able to micromanage most major (and minor) events happening to us. The PtB would probably rather we would've done the things we've done to happen in a timespan of perhaps 2-300 years, and even then we'd probably wouldn't have done even half of what we've done during that time. How do people view Enkidel? I view him (and try to vote) as a kind, greedy, curious person who wants to change everything for the better for mankind, who is skeptical of his own faith (and who wouldn't, with all the mixed messages and poo poo he has seen and taken part of) and as someone who truly wants to understand everything.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:24
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the_steve posted:Wonder in an equally grim and dark tone: "And just out of curiosity, how much of that is just bad luck and culmination of circumstance, and how much is being orchestrated to punish me?" It is all us We knew this could happen when we left. We gambled on super good luck or literal divine intervention. These did not happen.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:24
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Greggster posted:This feels very sketchy, it plays on our worst fears and... I don't know, it seems awfully out of character of Ish to talk like this. We will know based on Ithma's state when waking up I guess. But this looks like wishful thinking to me.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:28
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Serioustalk folks, lets assume for a moment everything Ish is saying is true: What do we do? As I see it, there are three choices 1.) We say "so sorry gebians", get the balls, and leave. We can bring a few of the young men, but that's it. If we do this, it would have been better to teleport the children, but its better than everyone dying. 2.) We stay the course. What Ish is saying comes to pass. Everyone dies. We are filled with grief, and weak, we may go hunger, we might not. Regardless, it makes a successful, heroic trip, into a disaster. 3.) We send the balls away, we love them too much to see them all die, and Kavodel needs them. Say "gently caress it, this is on us Gebians", I said El would deliver, we'll deliver. Make an altar, vow to give out next two centuries to whoever El says, no questions asked, even if he doesn't provide any help here. Grab the Gebians, leg it to zepath, in a deathmarch. Probably die on the way there. Accept this fact, this is our atonement for hubris of thinking we could save everyone and taking the telport and using it wrong. We're not doing this as a finger to the Melachim (even though it could be taken that way), we're doing it because mercy is never misplaced. Because we made a promise, and we're going to do our best to keep it, even if it kills us. We're just not going to let our children and balls die beside us. 3.) is my vote, personally.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:33
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the_steve posted:Wonder in an equally grim and dark tone: "And just out of curiosity, how much of that is just bad luck and culmination of circumstance, and how much is being orchestrated to punish me?"
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Jan 19, 2016 00:34
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TheCog posted:Serioustalk folks, lets assume for a moment everything Ish is saying is true: This is true, people should read this.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:35
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Ralith posted:[b]Stop the flow of [???]. Diogines fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Jan 19, 2016 |
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Jan 19, 2016 00:36
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I dunno, I don't buy it. Ithma might die, sure, but in a way that is somehow Uriahs fault and covering him in blood? The wound is already sealed. Uriah isn't preforming surgery, he is faith-healing. Everybody but us dying, us failing spectacularly at everything? This all seems like all of our Worst Fears coming true at once. But, ok. Worst case scenario and what Dreamish says is right; We now know the future enough to prepare for it. Whatever happens, when we wake up we should call out for Amok or Azzazel. If we are truly banished, we need every edge we can get.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:36
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:I dunno, I don't buy it. Ithma might die, sure, but in a way that is somehow Uriahs fault and covering him in blood? The wound is already sealed. Uriah isn't preforming surgery, he is faith-healing. They will not answer. And we are not banned from Zepath yet
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Jan 19, 2016 00:38
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The PtB taking our Balls is expected considering our relationship to them. Removing the base of those that worship us and the inner core of a new kingdom makes sense as far as a punishment goes. This seems out of character for Ish, but only in the context of normal conversations. This is pretty brutal but only because we're at a crossroads. Tell Ishamal that we're sorry for all of this and to meet us on the border if he can. Bring booze.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:39
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TK-42-1 posted:The PtB taking our Balls is par for the course. Removing the base of those that worship us and the inner core of a new kingdom makes sense as far as a punishment goes. This seems out of character for Ish, but only in the context of normal conversations. This is pretty brutal but only because we're at a crossroads. They aren't even doing this They are letting our decisions do that
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Jan 19, 2016 00:40
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:I dunno, I don't buy it. Ithma might die, sure, but in a way that is somehow Uriahs fault and covering him in blood? The wound is already sealed. Uriah isn't preforming surgery, he is faith-healing. Ish is trying to get us to dump the gebians. Ish has never lied to us, when he can't tell us things, he just doesn't, but he's giving us now exactly how he sees things will go down. We saw *one* of the horrible demons in this wasteland, its gonna get *worse*. No, Ish is telling us how he sees it. What can help us in knowing that there are horrible demons out here? We already know. We still have 600 slow moving people, and are surrounded by death on every side. We did this. Us. We have to man up, and accept it. But not kill our balls in the process. They deserve better.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:41
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SerSpook posted:They aren't even doing this I'm thinking its more of a 'bad poo poo will happen and we will not help' which is the same as taking them on their own. E: If our magic really is a quantuum mechanics kind of thing, then very powerful beings must be able to see the multiverse and collapse the waveform into an outcome they desire.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:41
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TheCog posted:Ish is trying to get us to dump the gebians. Ish has never lied to us, when he can't tell us things, he just doesn't, but he's giving us now exactly how he sees things will go down. We saw *one* of the horrible demons in this wasteland, its gonna get *worse*. No, Ish is telling us how he sees it. What can help us in knowing that there are horrible demons out here? We already know. We still have 600 slow moving people, and are surrounded by death on every side. Yes
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Jan 19, 2016 00:44
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TheCog posted:3.) We send the balls away, we love them too much to see them all die, and Kavodel needs them. Say "gently caress it, this is on us Gebians", I said El would deliver, we'll deliver. Make an altar, vow to give out next two centuries to whoever El says, no questions asked, even if he doesn't provide any help here. Grab the Gebians, leg it to zepath, in a deathmarch. Probably die on the way there. Accept this fact, this is our atonement for hubris of thinking we could save everyone and taking the telport and using it wrong. We're not doing this as a finger to the Melachim (even though it could be taken that way), we're doing it because mercy is never misplaced. Because we made a promise, and we're going to do our best to keep it, even if it kills us. We're just not going to let our children and balls die beside us. If Ithma dies with Uriah covered in blood, do this.
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Jan 19, 2016 00:47
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