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DuckConference posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/44k218/intel_disables_tsx_transactional_memory_again_in/ cpu design is hard 
Anime Schoolgirl fucked around with this message at 13:50 on Feb 7, 2016 |
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Feb 7, 2016 13:47
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From how the read threads by now, it's that Intel apparently advertised TSX support on some i3 Skylakes in the ARK by mistake, even tho it has been disabled from the beginning for market segmentation reasons (probably for the same non-sensical reasons why in the past non-Ks had VT-d enabled, while -Ks didn't).
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Feb 7, 2016 17:06
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Artificial market segmentation is the reason for the whole VT-d thing on K processors. If you could get a K i7, have VT-d, and overclock the hell out of it then you're basically at some of their Xeons in terms of performance.
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Feb 7, 2016 21:15
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Combat Pretzel posted:ASUS CUV4X-D with two P3-933. Woah.... If I knew more about building computers back then, I so would have gotten one of those. That thing would have been amazing with like 512mb ram back when. A friend of mine built a dual CPU AMD setup like a year or two later, but it was those Athlon MP's and the system just never ran right. He had to downclock it and just hope it would run right for nearly any gaming which was unfortunate because it was pretty cool and XP saw the 2 CPU's at the time so it was a bummer. But 2 of my old 933's would be downright fantastic for years I would bet. The main reason I got a new P4 1.8 back then, was because I got the Ti 500 and the CPU was just not able to feed it what it needed. Putting it into the 933 showed only a little performance boost over the 2 MX, but in the 1.8 that card absolutely screamed at the time playing games like Tribes 2 and Giants, Right up until it burned up.
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Feb 8, 2016 04:13
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Rukus posted:Artificial market segmentation is the reason for the whole VT-d thing on K processors. If you could get a K i7, have VT-d, and overclock the hell out of it then you're basically at some of their Xeons in terms of performance. The typical Xeon customer is not interested in overclocking. And you would still lack ECC memory.
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Feb 8, 2016 15:27
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Additionally you'd never overclock a piece of server or workstation hardware. Imagine running a day long calculation only to have the machine crash at the last minute.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:11
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I'm confused about the new CPU requirements for windows 10. For those of us who are never installing Windows 10 no matter what- what's will be the best/final intel CPU available? It's so bizarre to talk about the "final" hardware we'd ever be able to run, never thought I'd see this day in the tech world. Goddamn.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:19
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Though there are incidents where Xeon powered servers are overclocked and used.... I remember there being an article for CCP that the servers they hosted some parts of EVE on, (Jita and Large Scale Battles?) were on some newfangled servers that were Overclocked 4.4Ghz Xeon's that were water cooled and the fastest servers of their kind at the time. (Like in 2012/2013..)
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Feb 8, 2016 17:20
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Pryor on Fire posted:I'm confused about the new CPU requirements for windows 10. For those of us who are never installing Windows 10 no matter what- what's will be the best/final intel CPU available?
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Feb 8, 2016 17:24
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In a previous life we'd overclock Xeons that were part of a ~$10 million cluster for shits and giggles. There is no such thing as a "day long calculation" that the server is going to crash right before it completes, clusters or mainframes like this are constantly reading/writing data and crashes don't really matter much, just have to reprocess some segment of the model that never completed when it should.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:25
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Pryor on Fire posted:I'm confused about the new CPU requirements for windows 10. There are no new CPU requirements. Pryor on Fire posted:It's so bizarre to talk about the "final" hardware we'd ever be able to run Because that's not a real thing? td4guy posted:Newer CPUs aren't just gonna stop working with Windows 7/8.1. The older OSs just simply won't be able to take advantage of any new features. Of note is that older Windows OSes rarely did take advantage of new CPU features except through major service packs, or through CPU manufacturer software.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:25
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Pryor on Fire posted:For those of us who are never installing Windows 10 no matter what For example there are people still running windows XP at home and asking at the computer store (I work at one) how to set up a new system with XP, since their old one has just died. These people are just SOL. This is already just barely beginning to happen to windows 7, which has no built in usb3 drivers and no built in sata drivers for some new motherboards at this point. So installing windows 7 on a brand new system built today can actually require you to jump through some hoops - cause you're putting a 6 year old OS on new hardware. The workarounds are easy but it's only going to get harder from here until it's eventually impossible, ie at the point when the drivers you need for new hardware simply don't exist.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:31
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Eh, Xp machines can still get a free antivirus that works, firefox works on loving SP2, and you can do the reg hack and even get security updates.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:42
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People who think they understand Windows enough to weigh the pros and cons of upgrading their billion+ LOC operating system and then determine that the hundreds of thousands of man hours of development made that operating system unacceptably worse are themselves, in fact, The Worst. Upgrade. If you can't stand Microsoft then install Linux or something. Stagnation isn't a real option outside of single purpose machines that use the OS as a glorified I/O library.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:45
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The driver model between windows 8 and windows 10 isn't that different is it? It may not be supported but you can probably use windows 10 drivers on windows 8 like you could use Vista drivers on windows 7. I wouldn't be worried about the drivers and hardware compatability as much as security holes that just won't get patched. If you are really stuborn there are options. You can compile your own browser from open source projects. You can use ancient add-on cards to get audio/networking.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:49
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NihilismNow posted:The driver model between windows 8 and windows 10 isn't that different is it? It may not be supported but you can probably use windows 10 drivers on windows 8 like you could use Vista drivers on windows 7. Yes but there's also no reason to be using Windows 8 if you're the kind of person who hates Windows 10. 8 has all of the downsides and none of the upsides.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:51
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https://thestack.com/iot/2016/02/05/intel-william-holt-moores-law-slower-energy-efficient-chips/fishmech posted:Yes but there's also no reason to be using Windows 8 if you're the kind of person who hates Windows 10. 8 has all of the downsides and none of the upsides.
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Feb 8, 2016 17:54
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I remember the cool thing was to use Windows 2000, even past the point where XP was pretty good.
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Feb 8, 2016 18:00
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Pryor on Fire posted:I'm confused about the new CPU requirements for windows 10. For those of us who are never installing Windows 10 no matter what- what's will be the best/final intel CPU available? Find a Linux distro that you like, and run that. Maybe start with Mint?
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Feb 8, 2016 18:01
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Cardboard Box A posted:https://thestack.com/iot/2016/02/05/intel-william-holt-moores-law-slower-energy-efficient-chips/ So their big money clients get the performance per watt that's apparently been driving Intel's R&D for a while and I get to pick up a somethinglake i5 and not upgrade for a decade because I'm just an idiot who plays videogames? Sounds great to me.
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Feb 8, 2016 18:04
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canyoneer posted:I remember the cool thing was to use Windows 2000, even past the point where XP was pretty good. I remember people buying fancy 64 bit CPUs and 16 GB of memory, but still insisting on using them with (32 bit only of course) Windows 2000, and complaining it wouldn't support all their stuff.
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Feb 8, 2016 18:12
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Cardboard Box A posted:Media Center I still use WMC7 for my CableCard tuner/recording purposes. I'm a dinosaur
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Feb 8, 2016 18:19
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Pryor on Fire posted:I'm confused about the new CPU requirements for windows 10. For those of us who are never installing Windows 10 no matter what- what's will be the best/final intel CPU available? Why don't you want to install Windows 10? It's been one of the smoothest new OS installs I've ever done. It sounds like you're making life hard for yourself, and then complaining like it's not your fault.
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Feb 8, 2016 19:19
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fishmech posted:Yes but there's also no reason to be using Windows 8 if you're the kind of person who hates Windows 10. 8 has all of the downsides and none of the upsides. This was rendered false for those that actually like Touchscreen laptops. My dad's Asus Vivobook updated itself to 10 and he couldn't quite figure out anything until I showed him. Even after a while 10 really did poo poo all over the entire touch interface stuff that made Windows 8/8.1 actually work really with on a Tablet/Touch device. Went back to 8.1 and got everything back the way it was for him for now. Tablet Mode is not an answer for removing the Touch IE* (Since Edge doesn't quite replace IE just yet for those who use it still) and it broke/removed nearly all the apps like Mail and such that were working fine in 8.1, then installing 10, it removes them all and doesn't update the start menu with what you were actually using. The overall move on a PC with 7/8.x on say a desktop not using the Windows 8 style apps is fantastic don't get me wrong, but for someone who actually adopted the 8/8.1 apps and controls, to just rip those back out and replace with a more clunky style is sort of a kick to the nuts. And Microsoft has been doing that a lot since 8 dropped not to mention with Zune and Windows Phone. They keep releasing good stuff and because a handful bitch enough about something they don't still know how to use even when it's been around sine 95, they remove instead of just offer both in the next version. Stop it! *Also I know IE AHH! Evil! but with my home wifi being filtered through ad-blocking in my router, IE is about as safe as any other browser and the touch IE in 8 wasn't bad for those that don't want to use the touchpad and actually like the swipe gestures for tabs and such. Now on the hardware front, if you aren't running the latest greatest OS at the time for your hardware, you are just missing out on performance/features that you could otherwise enjoy. My 3930K ran a bunch better on 8 then it did on 7 (and yes 7 didn't see the X79's chipset drivers out of the box which does take a little extra effort to get running then). And 10 runs on it even better which was nice. Plus DX12 is 10 only.
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Feb 8, 2016 19:40
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Skandranon posted:Why don't you want to install Windows 10? It's been one of the smoothest new OS installs I've ever done. It sounds like you're making life hard for yourself, and then complaining like it's not your fault. I have friends with high end laptops who treat windows 10 somewhere between a leper and death itself. It's weird. Pryor on Fire posted:In a previous life we'd overclock Xeons that were part of a ~$10 million cluster for shits and giggles. There is no such thing as a "day long calculation" that the server is going to crash right before it completes, clusters or mainframes like this are constantly reading/writing data and crashes don't really matter much, just have to reprocess some segment of the model that never completed when it should. This is absolutely A Thing in statistical computing. champagne posting fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Feb 8, 2016 |
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Feb 8, 2016 20:25
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Skandranon posted:Why don't you want to install Windows 10? It's been one of the smoothest new OS installs I've ever done. It sounds like you're making life hard for yourself, and then complaining like it's not your fault. I'll probably take the Win X plunge on my new PC come July, but I'm certainly not in any rush.. although the whole MS trying to force updates to people that obviously don't want it (hiding nag updates, etc) is becoming pretty annoying and actually turning me off of it.
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Feb 8, 2016 20:58
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Boiled Water posted:I have friends with high end laptops who treat windows 10 somewhere between a leper and death itself. It's weird. man the days before you could spin up thousands of servers at a time somewhere in the world and then decommission them instantly sure were weird
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Feb 8, 2016 21:02
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slidebite posted:I'll probably take the Win X plunge on my new PC come July, but I'm certainly not in any rush.. although the whole MS trying to force updates to people that obviously don't want it (hiding nag updates, etc) is becoming pretty annoying and actually turning me off of it. The people who don't want it are the computer illiterate who so desperately need to be protected from outside threats.
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Feb 8, 2016 21:02
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slidebite posted:I don't know - it's not like the Windows 10 thread is just made up of people talking about breakfast, it's a lot of people having issues with it albeit with varying degrees of severity. Not being in a rush is very different from "NEVER EVER EVER EVER INSTALLING WINDOWS 10! 3.11 FOR LYFE! PS WHY ARE THERE NO DRIVERS FOR MY GTX980 NO FAIR M$ YOU SUCK". Main reason I installed 10 was because I also got an Intel 750 and decided doing a fresh install was warranted anyways and might as well try 10. Has been working pretty smoothly so far.
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Feb 8, 2016 21:09
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I've only held off on the Win10 upgrade because I haven't found a conclusive yes/no "it works" for drivers on my HD4870s. 
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Feb 8, 2016 22:44
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Intel's got something working for most HD4000 cards - go to the Microsoft Update Catalog in Internet Explorer and search for your GPU's VID and PID from its Device Manager details if you want to like triple-check it. Don't know if it'll still Crossfire, but it's really only a stopgap anyway because even AMD retired all support for the cards. Almost three years ago.Pryor on Fire posted:In a previous life we'd overclock Xeons that were part of a ~$10 million cluster for shits and giggles. There is no such thing as a "day long calculation" that the server is going to crash right before it completes, clusters or mainframes like this are constantly reading/writing data and crashes don't really matter much, just have to reprocess some segment of the model that never completed when it should. Out of curiosity, once you've overclocked your Xeon how do you certify the numbers it gives you independently? After all, Intel's certification isn't valid anymore and you don't have their testing suites. dont be mean to me fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Feb 8, 2016 |
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Feb 8, 2016 22:47
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redstormpopcorn posted:I've only held off on the Win10 upgrade because I haven't found a conclusive yes/no "it works" for drivers on my HD4870s. They work. Of course they won't support DirectX 12 stuff, since they're 8 year old cards now, but they'll do all the same stuff they did in 7 or 8. My source is that they're what my brother was using in his Windows 10 computer, until he finally got a better system last month.
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Feb 8, 2016 22:49
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fishmech posted:They work. Of course they won't support DirectX 12 stuff, since they're 8 year old cards now, but they'll do all the same stuff they did in 7 or 8. Ehhhhh... yeah... they work, but there's a big caveat speaking as someone who has a 4350, 4650, and 4850 and has tried all in 10. If you use HDMI, there's like a 7% overscan on AMD cards by default that is normally disabled in Catalyst Control Center. Catalyst Control Center will refuse to start with the Microsoft-provided drivers, which are your only option in Windows 10 on a pre-5000 series card. Your only ways in Windows 10 to actually use your whole screen and not get black bars (which drive me nuts, personally) is to either use DVI/VGA instead or to do registry hacks to disable the overscan. I haven't let this one issue keep those systems stuck on 7 or force me to buy a new GPU - the registry hacks aren't that hard and are effective, you should just be aware that this is a thing before you upgrade. Coincidentally, the newest cards available for AGP are 4000-series so if you still have a working AGP desktop and want to get hardware decoding to be able to play web video on an ancient CPU in Windows 10, it's good to be aware of this too. Eletriarnation fucked around with this message at 07:13 on Feb 9, 2016 |
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Feb 9, 2016 05:09
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NihilismNow posted:The driver model between windows 8 and windows 10 isn't that different is it? It may not be supported but you can probably use windows 10 drivers on windows 8 like you could use Vista drivers on windows 7. You can install a driver built for Windows 7 on Windows 10 (assuming nothing important changed in the stack) but you can't do the reverse.
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Feb 9, 2016 07:10
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Boiled Water posted:Additionally you'd never overclock a piece of server or workstation hardware. Imagine running a day long calculation only to have the machine crash at the last minute. The actual nightmare scenario: running an important simulation, only the overclock caused some of the output data to suffer silent, non-obvious corruption without causing a crash.
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Feb 9, 2016 07:33
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Col.Kiwi posted:This is already just barely beginning to happen to windows 7, which has no built in usb3 drivers and no built in sata drivers for some new motherboards at this point. So installing windows 7 on a brand new system built today can actually require you to jump through some hoops - cause you're putting a 6 year old OS on new hardware. The workarounds are easy but it's only going to get harder from here until it's eventually impossible, ie at the point when the drivers you need for new hardware simply don't exist. That's me, I bought 8.1 with cold hard cash because 7 refused to work with some of my USB3 ports. EdEddnEddy posted:The overall move on a PC with 7/8.x on say a desktop not using the Windows 8 style apps is fantastic don't get me wrong, but for someone who actually adopted the 8/8.1 apps and controls, to just rip those back out and replace with a more clunky style is sort of a kick to the nuts. Just accept you're SOL and a victim of a failed experiment half-heartedly initiated by an empty suit chasing fads to boost numbers in the next quarter. Sir Unimaginative posted:Out of curiosity, once you've overclocked your Xeon how do you certify the numbers it gives you independently? After all, Intel's certification isn't valid anymore and you don't have their testing suites. Speaking from a vastly smaller modelling/stats application scale: You just don't. You look at the output graphs and/or maps to see if they look weird and if you really, really feel like confirming everything got computed correctly you rerun the thing and hope the p values/output parameters/... don't change. You're probably not even using Xeons or ECC RAM in the first place, more likely your modelling PC has a previous generation i7 (if that) and 64GB of the cheapest RAM. Off you go, publish your result in a high impact journal! e: and don't forget that unis too cheap to buy their own supercomputers or even dedicated high powered workstations tend to have some weird sort of cluster computing where bigger computing tasks get parted out to a thousand lovely office PCs connected to the Uni network 
suck my woke dick fucked around with this message at 10:20 on Feb 9, 2016 |
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Feb 9, 2016 10:13
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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BobHoward posted:The actual nightmare scenario: running an important simulation, only the overclock caused some of the output data to suffer silent, non-obvious corruption without causing a crash. That's gonna replace the whale in my nightmare Welp.
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Feb 9, 2016 12:32
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Eletriarnation posted:Coincidentally, the newest cards available for AGP are 4000-series so if you still have a working AGP desktop and want to get hardware decoding to be able to play web video on an ancient CPU in Windows 10, it's good to be aware of this too.  I think you should be more concerned about how much longer your 8 year old hardware will hold up.
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Feb 9, 2016 13:46
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Eletriarnation posted:Coincidentally, the newest cards available for AGP are 4000-series so if you still have a working AGP desktop and want to get hardware decoding to be able to play web video on an ancient CPU in Windows 10, it's good to be aware of this too. I've never seen an AGP slot in my life. Are you sure they still exist? 
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Feb 9, 2016 14:35
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The last time I used AGP was....poo poo, the Radeon 9800 Pro.
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Feb 9, 2016 14:38
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