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We wants it, the preciousssssssss. loving snype. 1931, March 1st: Oswald Mosley forms the New Party, which later merges into the British Union of Fascists. Tesseraction fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Mar 7, 2016 |
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Mar 7, 2016 11:15
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Lord of the Llamas posted:One of the scarier parts of that Jess Phillips puff piece: And this is the problem with modern politicians. They want power, but simply for it's own sake. Not power to create a better society, but just I want to be in charge. The power of the state is like the One Ring in Lord of the Rings. It corrupts and destroys, and in the hands of even good people you have to be very careful. In my role I have power over others. I can make decisions that cause people real hardship. I am essentially part of an unaccountable legal system that can take things away from people. And I agonise over it, because people with that sort of power should discharge it responsibly, and should be mindful of the fact that power comes with the potential for victims. As for the comment about the air war, not criticising Corbyn every chance she gets might have an effect on the air war.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:17
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*searches for the releveant quotation* Haha wow, apparently “Those who seek power are not worthy of that power” goes all the way back to Plato.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:17
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Paul.Power posted:*searches for the releveant quotation* I should really read up on Greek philosophy, slamming people with two or three thousand year old quotes sounds like a fun time
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Mar 7, 2016 11:20
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Didn't Plato also say that democracy is a really lovely form of government due to idiots being able to vote in stupid ideas/people?
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Mar 7, 2016 11:22
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Tesseraction posted:Didn't Plato also say that democracy is a really lovely form of government due to idiots being able to vote in stupid ideas/people? I think he said it's not the optimal form of government and it would be better to be ruled by enlightened and compassionate aristocracy created from a society designed to instil rulers with those values or something.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:29
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Tesseraction posted:Didn't Plato also say that democracy is a really lovely form of government due to idiots being able to vote in stupid ideas/people? That checks out, Plato was one smart dude.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:30
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The only philosopher worthy of the name was Diogenes
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Mar 7, 2016 11:35
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OwlFancier posted:I think he said it's not the optimal form of government and it would be better to be ruled by enlightened and compassionate aristocracy created from a society designed to instil rulers with those values or something. The problem is politicians believe exactly the same thing and that they fit this description. Born to Rule, Divine Right, Establishment Entitlement.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:35
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Ancient Greeks also liked to claim that the youth were destroying society and that it would all crumble thanks to them and their stupid loving fads. So they were several thousand years ahead of the curve there.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:36
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OwlFancier posted:I think he said it's not the optimal form of government and it would be better to be ruled by enlightened and compassionate aristocracy created from a society designed to instil rulers with those values or something. As I recall it was a hierarchy of Philosopher King > Technocratic Aristocracy > Democracy. His arguments were that the corruptions of them get exponentially worse, in this case Dictator > Traditional Aristocracy > Mobocracy. Of course, this was before we had the modern tools to Holocaust people or prepare the Killing Fields, so he might have revised his views somewhat given modern information. We do live in a mobocracy, though, just a mobocracy of the press.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:36
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Epictetus, Marcus Aurelius and Seneca get a pass i guess even though seneca and I have a troubled relationship.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:37
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Also, if you're talking 'bout Greek conceptions of democracy it's worth remembering that the famous Athenian/pure/direct democracy is a very distant relative to our own. It was simultaneously much less representative (being open only to free male landowners over a certain age) and much more representative of the whims of those who qualified for the franchise by being a direct democracy rather than representative.
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Mar 7, 2016 11:46
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Being fair representative democracy isn't working out that great for us either.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:04
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Pissflaps for philosopher king.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:05
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Phoon posted:I'm going to a ladywood meeting next week but I think it's just branch - it was such a huge hassle to join the party here, I needed three copies of ID that I don't think many young people will have eg paper bills, a council tax bill within three months (when birmingham city council only typically sends out one bill a year). I managed to scrape together some stuff that technically didn't fit the criteria (plus I wrote a short letter to go with them) but a friend of mine has been trying to join for three months or so without success ...that seems a bit hosed up. All I had to do was join up online and I automatically got my party card in the post and put on the Oxford and Abingdon mailing lists. It shouldn't be harder to join Labour than it is to actually vote!
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Mar 7, 2016 12:05
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Guavanaut posted:Pissflaps for philosopher king. Philosopher blowjob queen of hollywood, surely?
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Mar 7, 2016 12:06
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Demarchy would be the best system for democracy. At least it would make sure that all MPs didn't go to the same school.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:07
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Guavanaut posted:'Negro' replaced 'colored' as the preferred and polite word for Americans of African descent back when 'black' was considered offensive and derogatory and 'African' was considered to imply foreignness. And the euphemism treadmill keeps on rolling. The historical term 'Colored' and 'people of color' aren't the same thing, though (the latter also includes Asians, Indians, hispanic people, etc).
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Mar 7, 2016 12:10
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Tesseraction posted:Being fair representative democracy isn't working out that great for us either. I'm instinctively in favour of direct democracy with a universal franchise but it has problems of scale at the level of a modern nation, I think.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:13
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Oh, the Graun has noticed that millenials are hosed http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/07/revealed-30-year-economic-betrayal-dragging-down-generation-y-income Also shows a mild-loving of people in their mid-life crisis age range, so I guess we have that to look forward to, too.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:13
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I will graciously condescend to accept the titles of Dictator for Life and Pontifex Maximus.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:14
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Oberleutnant posted:I'm instinctively in favour of direct democracy with a universal franchise but it has problems of scale at the level of a modern nation, I think. I am okay with it in a nation with a universally educated populace and a responsible press. So basically I'm not okay with it in any existing nation except maybe Iceland.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:15
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82vl34mi4Iw Explains the origin of the term. It then became "people of colour" to make sure that it wasn't gender-exclusive. "People of colour" is a social union. A term of solidarity. Surely UKMT would be approving of that.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:15
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feedmegin posted:The historical term 'Colored' and 'people of color' aren't the same thing, though (the latter also includes Asians, Indians, hispanic people, etc). People of color will be ruined in the same way eventually. e: Oberleutnant posted:I will graciously condescend to accept the titles of Dictator for Life and Pontifex Maximus.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:20
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Oberleutnant posted:I'm instinctively in favour of direct democracy with a universal franchise but it has problems of scale at the level of a modern nation, I think. Again if wal-mart can payroll 2 million people profitably I think a government can handle 60 democratically.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:23
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Tesseraction posted:I am okay with it in a nation with a universally educated populace and a responsible press.  Ddraig posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82vl34mi4Iw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xiL95jR44E
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Mar 7, 2016 12:23
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OwlFancier posted:Again if wal-mart can payroll 2 million people profitably I think a government can handle 60 democratically. I don't think it's a problem of administration or infrastructure, just a problem of getting 70 or 300 million people to keep up with the sheer volume of poo poo the government does on a daily basis (locally, regionally, and nationally) and take an active interest. I'm not saying it's a reason not to do it, it's just a difficult element.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:25
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Oberleutnant posted:I don't think it's a problem of administration or infrastructure, just a problem of getting 70 or 300 million people to keep up with the sheer volume of poo poo the government does on a daily basis (locally, regionally, and nationally) and take an active interest. I'm not saying it's a reason not to do it, it's just a difficult element. GovBook. Like Facebook except you can actually vote on all the retarded political posts that pop up on your timeline.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:27
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That just made me think of GoveBook.  I don't know what that would be, but I know I don't like it. And that he'd think it's an excellent idea.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:29
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Oberleutnant posted:We need to abolish the state and all coercive systems of control and make a purely voluntary direct democracy I'll set up the wiki
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Mar 7, 2016 12:29
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Guavanaut posted:That just made me think of GoveBook. I'm trying to think of a social media joke name but I'm having trouble.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:30
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Tesseraction posted:I'll set up the wiki I'll make the website and design the tshirts, we can sell them on my etsy
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Mar 7, 2016 12:30
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OwlFancier posted:I'm trying to think of a social media joke name but I'm having trouble.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:31
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Guvnr Up to you whether it's political tumblr or grindr.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:33
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http://www.room151.co.uk/treasury/gla-to-move-into-mortgaged-backed-securities/ This will end well.
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Mar 7, 2016 12:58
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Gonzo McFee posted:http://www.room151.co.uk/treasury/gla-to-move-into-mortgaged-backed-securities/ Lmfao  London
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Mar 7, 2016 13:02
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Guavanaut posted:Only if I can abbreviate it to Pnus on official correspondence. Proceedings of the National Academies of Sciences
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Mar 7, 2016 13:04
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Gonzo McFee posted:http://www.room151.co.uk/treasury/gla-to-move-into-mortgaged-backed-securities/ Remind me, did our mortgage-backed stuff go boom in 2007/8, or was that just the hilariously under-regulated interaction between the American housing and banking sectors that hosed everything up for everything else?
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Mar 7, 2016 13:04
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OwlFancier posted:Guvnr That one's actually a black cab competitor to Uber.
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Mar 7, 2016 13:05
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