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Longbaugh01 posted:Yeah I don't think ninjas are the problem. I think the issue is that the Punisher stuff was much more compelling but mostly in those first four episodes. Then you get stuff that wasn't as compelling, then more engaging stuff when Fisk shows up, and then it sorta wet noodles from there to the end. Yeah, the Punisher stuff was easily the best. And there was a huge missed opportunity in integrating the story better: You had Claire quitting her job because she didn't want to be quiet about the reanimated ninjas at the hospital. She has a conversation with Foggy about it. And you have Karen who is both working as a reporter and hanging out with the Punisher. They could have used that to easily integrate all plots. Instead, Claire just leaves her job, Foggy just stays annoyed at Matt, Karen is supposedly a great investigative reporter who can't even figure out that Matt is Daredevil, and the Punisher only helps out Matt in the end through sheer plot contrivance.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:10
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BrianWilly posted:That just gets into completely subjective reactions, which is why I suggested earlier that how invested you are in the plot has a lot to do with how willing you are to accept the intersection of fantastical and mundane genres. Like, there's people who are typing the words "I get so bored when the ninjas show up" and I can't understand that. I don't understand the rationale for that. I get excited when the ninjas show up. It meant the plot was moving and that something exciting was about to happen. And all that's even before considering all the "It didn't go anywhere" complaints which just seem flat-out wrong to me. Ninjas showing up just meant we'd get yet another boring Arrow-esque fight scene. Season 1 had great fight scenes, Punisher had good to great fight scenes but all the ninja ones were pretty boring. Really didn't help that even Nobu -the big bad ninja- felt like a nameless mook either.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:11
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joepinetree posted:Yeah, the Punisher stuff was easily the best. And there was a huge missed opportunity in integrating the story better: Blazing Ownager posted:Do you really think they're going to invest time next season explaining poo poo like the giant holes in any satisfying way? I sure don't. This is why I'm having such a hard time grokking the Hand complaints. Differences of opinion is one thing but half the responses come across like people just don't know how to watch TV or something.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:19
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BrianWilly posted:people just don't know how to watch TV or something. Welcome to TV IV
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Mar 22, 2016 07:28
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Chomposaur posted:I think that part was actually intentional. He struts into the courtroom after blowing off the rest of the trial and then delivers a self-aggrandizing monologue that doesn't help the case at all.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:31
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Longbaugh01 posted:Wait. I know all about TMNT being a take-off on Daredevil, but is Casey Jones a take-off on The Punisher?! Because if so, my mind is truly, and completely, blown. I'm not sure. I would actually be curious if anyone with actual knowledge of comic books of the era could confirm it. A lot of the similarities could be coincidence. They are both depicted as obsessive, violent, less philosophical alternatives to the main protagonists. Both think skulls look cool and tend to carry an arsenal of weapons around. But that description could almost fit "Batman parody" just as well.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:51
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Hey so that was pretty cool. Can we go ahead and kick a hooker out of a window, though? The faster we get to Typhoid Mary the faster I can start mainlining this show directly into my veins via IV.
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Mar 22, 2016 07:55
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Chokes McGee posted:Hey so that was pretty cool. I can't wait till Bullseye shows up, either in Daredevil or Punisher.
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Mar 22, 2016 08:21
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coyo7e posted:Except for the part where Frank was already under duress and shot down Matt's monologue, when it appeared to be working. Honestly it still annoys me that Matt never even tried to tell Foggy what he overheard the bailiff say - there's just a vague "someone got to him" line. Like, he objectively knows that someone got to Frank and caused him to tank the trial. It's like they realized that cluing Foggy in on that tidbit might make his annoyance a little less reasonable so they just never allowed it to happen.
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Mar 22, 2016 08:30
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Blazing Ownager posted:I have a sneaking feeling both Netflix shows will get a brief cameo in Civil War. AoS will never be mentioned in the movies since it is somewhat the bastard stepchild of the MCU. Coulsons death was the catalyst for the second half of Avengers then AoS came in and went "nah."
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Mar 22, 2016 10:23
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BrianWilly posted:This is why I'm having such a hard time grokking the Hand complaints. Differences of opinion is one thing but half the responses come across like people just don't know how to watch TV or something. And I am having a hard time understanding why you people don't even seem to understand the complaints about the Hand. Look, unresolved mysteries and hooks for other seasons or other shows are fine. TV shows do that all the time. Whatever. But this season, it was the central plot. What are these ninjas up to? I don't know, let's spend an episode tracking down these train cars, and wow, they're full of...dirt? What a mystery, I want to know more! Let's spend another episode or two tracking them further, and wow, we found a giant hole in the ground! Its so shocking that we'll make it an episode cliffhanger! And now let's drop this thread entirely, and find out nothing more about it in favor of pointless fights against faceless ninjas -- we don't need to find out what they're up to, let's just punch them all in the face instead The general feeling is that this makes for a weak story - the hero thwarts the villains, but never finds out what he was thwarting in the first place, even after they teased it for multiple episodes. If you can't "grok" why that might bother people, I think you're the one who doesn't know how to watch TV.
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Mar 22, 2016 11:32
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Stick showing up to finish off Nobu was totally poo poo. Give me a scene of the crazy cult ninja dude being interviewed by a poor confused policeman, and degrade him by dressing him in prison whites, like the hero of the show actually wanted. It would have been a nice payoff for all his whining about not killing. Instead the murder-parade partied on, drowning out poor little Daredevil.
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Mar 22, 2016 11:51
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Nipponophile posted:I think there are people in this thread who honestly think that when Punisher's not on screen, the other characters should be asking "Where's Punisher?" hell yeah
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Mar 22, 2016 12:11
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I did enjoy the second season, overall. My main issue was that the story with Elektra, and mainly the dialogue and interactions between her and Matt, seemed to be randomly oscillating back and forth, sometimes not making much sense (up till and including the final episode with Matt's totally not (?) marriage proposal to her). And other than that, even though I like that the story depicts a deeply flawed Matt, and many times is actively making him less sympathetic to the viewers, it seems that he is making circles, not actually growing up and learning from what he goes through. And in this season, at times it was like a regression to a teenage-mind set. I am "this", so I better drop all else, even though that includes my only friends and connections to the world I am trying to save/protect. It does feel like he was struggling with the whole trying to be a hero and lead a normal life, and ultimately comes up with this stupidity as a life choice.
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Mar 22, 2016 12:25
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Longbaugh01 posted:Wait. I know all about TMNT being a take-off on Daredevil, but is Casey Jones a take-off on The Punisher?! Because if so, my mind is truly, and completely, blown. This is a pretty decent question, but I don't think there's anything particularly obvious in the comics that say "yes" to it in the same way the Foot / Splinter do. Feel free to read about the original incarnation and draw your own conclusions though: http://turtlepedia.wikia.com/wiki/Arnold_Jones_%28Mirage%29 My impression from reading the comics is that Casey is more of just like a somewhat unhinged dude who isn't very smart or skilled and spends a lot of time being just kind of a fuckup. Good article about that here: http://tmntentity.blogspot.com/2010/05/casey-jones-badass-or-loser.html It does say "was created as a parody of vigilante characters that were in comics." but without any particular source. The stuff in the second paragraph about Hun loving with his family is from WAY later comics, so I don't think it really applies to the question. The second half of that paragraph about him watching a lot of TV and deciding to do something about criminals is more accurate to his initial appearances. "It is later revealed in commentary on this miniseries by one of the initial creators (Kevin Eastman) that they had intended for Casey to have become a vigilante because he watched too many bad cop shows (like Peter Laird used to), as opposed to the more popular storyline of the hero doing the same thing after seeing their family killed in front of them" Haha, the trivia section: "Kevin Eastman said his personality was based off Kurt Russell's character Jack Burton from Big Trouble in Little China. However, Casey Jones' first appearance actually predated Jack Burton's first appearance by a year. " So tl;dr, not really? But it's not impossible he was in some way influential. I imagine you'd have to track down the specific comics that inspired TMNT and see if Punisher was in them or doing similar stuff in his own comic at the time. Light Gun Man fucked around with this message at 12:31 on Mar 22, 2016 |
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Mar 22, 2016 12:29
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Oh Snapple! posted:Honestly it still annoys me that Matt never even tried to tell Foggy what he overheard the bailiff say - there's just a vague "someone got to him" line. Matt tried several times -- in the moment, then again after outside the courthouse -- but Foggy was too pissed at him to listen. It also probably wouldn't have mattered much to Foggy considering how mad he already was about everything else that had happened in the season.
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Mar 22, 2016 12:37
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foggy is a whiny rear end in a top hat. "whats that? you save people's lives on a regular basis including my close personal friend karen page? gently caress you. i dont care if you can literally hear people desperately pleading for help and dying every night
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Mar 22, 2016 13:20
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Terror Sweat posted:foggy is a whiny rear end in a top hat. Nah, Foggy is great and awesome. I get the feeling he'd be less pissed at Matt if he'd actually shared what the gently caress was happening when he was out at night in his Halloween costume punching people.
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Mar 22, 2016 14:43
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I guess I didn't mind the ninja fights as much because they gave a perfect opportunity to show off the durability of the new Daredevil suit, several times he totally no-sells direct blows and blades to the torso and head and it's awesome. Stick would call it sloppy but hey, he was sure kicking Nobu's rear end this time around and not getting chopped up by his drat hooked knife.
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Mar 22, 2016 14:48
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RareAcumen posted:Nah, Foggy is great and awesome. Matt did straight up tell him a story about saving a girl who was gonna get chopped up though.
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Mar 22, 2016 14:52
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net cafe scandal posted:I cant wait to see the hole again. I love hole.
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Mar 22, 2016 14:55
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They do a good job of showing how real Foggy's concern is though, he's really freaking out every time he thinks that Matt might be hurt or dead, and he does a lot of legwork to make sure he's OK. It's not selfish or anything.
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Mar 22, 2016 14:56
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Codependent Poster posted:Matt did straight up tell him a story about saving a girl who was gonna get chopped up though. How long did it take him to tell him about Electra? We already went through this last season when the situation was a dad sexually abusing his daughter anyway.
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Mar 22, 2016 15:06
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net cafe scandal posted:I cant wait to see the hole again. I feel cheated that we didn't get the hole story.
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Mar 22, 2016 15:11
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Chokes McGee posted:Hey so that was pretty cool. Nobu's redhead lieutenant is totally going to be Typhoid Mary next year.
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Mar 22, 2016 15:16
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Codependent Poster posted:Matt did straight up tell him a story about saving a girl who was gonna get chopped up though. The bigger issue I think was that Matt was really cagey this season with what he was telling people and repeatedly screwed up their professional life by not showing up, taking cases and then disappearing, and generally taking Foggy for granted.
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Mar 22, 2016 15:17
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Foggy is pissed off because Matt keeps leaning into Foggy to get the law firm to take really terrible cases, and then just flakes out, leaving Foggy alone to deal with impossible situations that he really didn't want to be in in the first place. Bailing on opening statement during the Castle case and leaving Foggy hanging was the ultimate dick move. Of course he's pissed off.
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Mar 22, 2016 15:18
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One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it?
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Mar 22, 2016 16:01
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zoux posted:One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it? I thought it might be a SuperHero Loses His Powers plot, but since they never went back to it, I was guessing he just had a concussion.
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Mar 22, 2016 16:07
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zoux posted:One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it? I think that was just because Punisher shot him in the head. But then he got better!
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Mar 22, 2016 16:11
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Yeah, I guess I just put more import on it because there are a ton of "Oh no! Matt's powers are hosed up" stories and I figured they were going there.
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Mar 22, 2016 16:25
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zoux posted:One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it? Yeah I guess it was just a little scene and not a big plot point. It was still really freaky to see him panicking after that glass fell. Foggy really should've been clued in that something's up with Matt considering that the blind man doesn't own cups and bowls and stuff that won't break if they fall off the counter.
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Mar 22, 2016 16:28
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jscolon2.0 posted:Nobu's redhead lieutenant is totally going to be Typhoid Mary next year. great let's the the Defenestrator in here and get this party started
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Mar 22, 2016 16:28
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So if Elektra is the Black Sky, what was the deal with that kid from the first season? Can there be more than one?
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Mar 22, 2016 16:35
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bobjr posted:So if Elektra is the Black Sky, what was the deal with that kid from the first season? Can there be more than one? Assume Black Sky just means Treasure from the Elektra movie.
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Mar 22, 2016 16:42
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Evil Ninja Dalai Lama.
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Mar 22, 2016 16:47
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zoux posted:One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it? My impression was that he got some sort of severe concussion from being shot point blank in the head, the armor absorbed the worst of it, but it was still a pretty severe blow.
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Mar 22, 2016 17:09
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I wish we had been shown more of how Matt "sees", i thought that was a cool part of the first season. I don't understand why they didn't do it at all in this one.
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Mar 22, 2016 17:21
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Oasx posted:I wish we had been shown more of how Matt "sees", i thought that was a cool part of the first season. I don't understand why they didn't do it at all in this one. Nah that seems just like a waste of budget. Ending Spoilers Only one time I can think of that it would have worked and enhanced a scene and that's when Stick is telling Matt to focus on the breath of the enemies
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Mar 22, 2016 17:35
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I didnt get the breath thing. How can he run around on roof tops if he cant sense the geometry around him.
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Mar 22, 2016 17:40
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