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Panzer Skank posted:Request for the thread at large: if you just watched that video and you didn't see the twist coming, please post your immediate thoughts in reaction to it in the thread (cause that's the best bit lmao) SMaster777 posted:"gently caress YOU NATHAN YOU SON OF A- .......What. The. gently caress!?!?" I figured Nathan was just doing his thing and everyone else was studiously doing their best not to know anything or was being snowed under by threats from the Prescott family operation. I suppose in a game with such a small cast of suspects (because really none of the kids apart from Nathan are portrayed as possibly being involved, except maybe Victoria) you've got to be deeply suspicious of anyone showing almost any sign of lax morality because chances are it's not as simple as 'obvious suspect committed crime'. So what clues did I just not cotton onto? Fresh in my mind is 'person taking picture of Nathan and Rachel' and that weird rear end comment in class which was linked earlier but anything else apart from 'Mr Jefferson is pretty bad at ensuring the safety of the children at the school'? Also I get the point that involving the authorities completely shortcircuits the story arc and so can't happen for narrative reasons but you have just received a text mentioning a missing girl and fairly obviously indicates someone trying to hide her forever: why, why why would you not involve the police!?! This is Black Panthers level of 'gently caress the police, snitches get stitches'.
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Apr 22, 2016 20:41
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namesake posted:So what clues did I just not cotton onto? Fresh in my mind is 'person taking picture of Nathan and Rachel' and that weird rear end comment in class which was linked earlier but anything else apart from 'Mr Jefferson is pretty bad at ensuring the safety of the children at the school'? I only just noticed this one in my playthrough for the lp: the letter taped to the computer monitor in the dark room   It's completely different in tone from the letters from Nathan's father, and the bottom is torn off so we can't see who actually wrote it. In retrospect it seems a lot more like it's coming from a hosed up mentor rather than Nathan's dad, right?
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Apr 22, 2016 21:26
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I remember when I played this the first time I figured there would be a twist if only because if the answer was "Nathan did it all" there wouldn't be an entire episode of the game left. I still didn't see Jefferson coming though. I suppose the hints are all there if you're looking for them, but I was figuring it would be something like Nathan roping the entire Vortex club into this poo poo like a cult, or maybe that the game would suddenly take a hard turn into sci-fi land and it'd be time travelling Rachel Amber. Jefferson had just been absent from the plot for such a long time that he kinda faded from my mind as a suspect.
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Apr 22, 2016 21:27
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Panzer Skank posted:I only just noticed this one in my playthrough for the lp: the letter taped to the computer monitor in the dark room  Speaking as someone who didn't catch the twist coming, holy poo poo. It seems obvious now.
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Apr 22, 2016 21:29
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I actually didn't figure it out until Jefferson showed up just as Max and Chloe were about to leave, because why else would he show up if not to turn heel at the last moment?
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Apr 22, 2016 21:40
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Yeah, Jefferson showing up at the party was a strange one for me. Okay party and award speech whatever, but he shows up just as Chloe and Max run out of things to do at the party and then there is Jefferson for no real reason, who notes that they're 'on a mission'. It immediately tripped me as suspicious... and then I forgot to hold onto that thought for the next 5 minutes.
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Apr 22, 2016 21:59
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There is also the phone call (polsy link) Jefferson has towards the end of episode two, which at the very least sounds suspicious, and could be Jefferson trying to calm down a freaking out Nathan, and therefore could be the phone call referred to in the note.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:02
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Surprise Pizza posted:There is also the phone call (polsy link) Jefferson has towards the end of episode two, which at the very least sounds suspicious, and could be Jefferson trying to calm down a freaking out Nathan, and therefore could be the phone call referred to in the note. Nathan is actually with Victoria sitting on Max's desk in the classroom when Jefferson is on that call.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:04
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I honestly didn't think it would be Mr. Jefferson. I was expecting it to be Nathan's dad, stepping in to try to clean up a mess his son made or something like that. That being said, somehow I wasn't that shocked.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:12
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Surprise Pizza posted:There is also the phone call (polsy link) Jefferson has towards the end of episode two, which at the very least sounds suspicious, and could be Jefferson trying to calm down a freaking out Nathan, and therefore could be the phone call referred to in the note. Wiseblood posted:Nathan is actually with Victoria sitting on Max's desk in the classroom when Jefferson is on that call. I guess the developers just messed up a bit. What probably happened was that Victoria was occupying that desk on her own or with her friends and then during development someone who didn't really think a lot about it suggested adding Nathan instead. Or Nathan isn't the only one of Jeffersons minions.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:18
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let me tell you about my theory about Nathan having a body double
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Apr 22, 2016 22:31
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Jefferson took Max to the dark room to install an AI of Nathan into her brain.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:38
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Paul Zuvella posted:Maybe it was just me, but this twist was hilariously obvious to me and honestly the weakest part of the game in my opinion. I laughed pretty hard at the reveal because I suspected Jefferson since his introduction. It was a punchline to a six-month long joke. I also agree that the reveal is weak, but probably not for the same reasons (I would explain more but it might get into spoiler territory). To the game's credit, I don't think the twist is entirely random or without predicate. The game gives several hints that something isn't right with Jefferson, and doesn't make the clues too obvious. His conversation with Kate is a good example because it's such a reversal from his genial attitude during class and just plain mean for anybody in his position.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:47
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If Max had only made a submission, she wouldn't be in her predicament now. Seriously though, the Jefferson reveal took me a little by surprise but mostly because of that sick head shot.
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Apr 22, 2016 22:52
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Didn't see that coming, but I was willing to apparently ignore several clues (that note!) because I was writing off Jefferson as a somewhat out of touch artist hipster who didn't know how to talk to teenagers. However, if I remember correctly the developers of this game are French, which is why the party is probably so strange to a lot of you. The drinking age for wine and beer is 16, and hard liquor is 18 (the driving age is 18 as well). I live in Europe and have seen parties like this one with the beer and liquor flowing right in front of teachers and other adults because the drinking culture is slightly different here. The developers likely didn't pick up on some of these minor differences between their high school experience and an American one, which is why the party seems so bizarre to everyone in the thread. EDIT: I mean, France is also strange in that their response to a major terrorist attack was to let school kids smoke inside school grounds because some ridiculous number of French children are chain smokers and the government was afraid that all the kids smoking at the edge of the playground were targets for terrorists. Anonymous Zebra fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 22:55
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if you look through David's surveillance data, you kind find out that another liscence plate went to the same coordinates as the barn. in the episode 2 outro montage, we briefly see Jefferson's car and the plate matches up to the other car that went to the barn. there were lots of clues.
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Apr 22, 2016 23:00
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I mentioned earlier anyone who wanted some spoilers should more closely examine the "clues" we put together earlier. Because the answer was written there, plain as day - only one other car had ever visited the Dark Room according to David's tracking, and that car belonged to Jefferson. It's pretty much a smoking gun, I loved how justified it as that not only did the characters overlook the obvious connection, pretty much everyone who played did too!
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Apr 22, 2016 23:00
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Wow, that was a great twist. I had seen the Mr. Jefferson skeptic posts in this thread but I never really bought it, and yet all the clues were there if I had bothered to look for them. Guess I didn't give this game enough credit! Max is going to have to bust out some hardcore time powers to get out of this one. I can only assume this is as close to a bad end as we get, since it's the end of the world and she's presumably trapped in the dark room. I actually have no idea how Max is getting out of this. Alt-Rachel crossing dimensions to save the day and bring Chloe back to life? And then everyone lived happily ever after?
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Apr 23, 2016 00:42
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Waffleman_ posted:Jefferson took Max to the dark room to install an AI of Nathan into her brain. Okay, seriously someone needs to write this crossover fic. Coffeehitler posted:Seriously though, the Jefferson reveal took me a little by surprise but mostly because of that sick head shot. He's a professional photographer. He's really good at head shots. 
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Apr 23, 2016 01:19
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I did not see the twist coming. Well, I had an idea it wasn't Nathan alone, because everything pointed to Nathan and so I thought that it just had to be someone else. But not Jefferson. It all makes sense in retrospect, but playing the game and hustling from plot point to plot point, I didn't pick out the details and thought Jefferson was just a harmless dork. Turns out no. When I saw it was Jefferson, I yelled "Oh you loving COCK" and I was worried my older neighbors were going to complain since it was late at night. But he needed to know he was a cock.
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Apr 23, 2016 02:08
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Lazy Bear posted:He's a professional photographer. He's really good at head shots. 
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Apr 23, 2016 02:11
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I remember laughing in disbelief at this twist. It's certainly hinted at throughout the game, and Nathan being behind everything is such an obvious red herring, but I think a lot of people playing this game are more or less too immersed in the narrative to not notice a lot of the clues that point to Jefferson? Also that note, oof. I never made that connection until just now. This is a great game.
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Apr 23, 2016 02:14
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Panzer Skank posted:Request for the thread at large: if you just watched that video and you didn't see the twist coming, please post your immediate thoughts in reaction to it in the thread (cause that's the best bit lmao)
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Apr 23, 2016 02:30
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I liked the twist as well, its pretty obvious in retrospect but the game does a really good job of keeping you focused on Nathan. Jefferson is always around in the background not doing anything quite wrong but being kind of inappropriate at the same time, which is easy to overlook because of how supportive he is for most of the game. Of course the really big warning signs are pretty miss able.
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Apr 23, 2016 02:32
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I definitely had my suspicions about Mr. Jefferson, but I wasn't 100% sure, and no one else really fit the bill as mastermind besides maybe Sean Prescott, who has really just been in the background of the story. Definitely didn't notice all those clues that make it seem obvious with hindsight though.
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Apr 23, 2016 02:34
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"I could capture each of you in a dark corner and get something real" or to that extent during his lecture at the beginning of all this.
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Apr 23, 2016 02:34
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Panzer Skank posted:I only just noticed this one in my playthrough for the lp: the letter taped to the computer monitor in the dark room Most people are going to make the leap that this mentor is his father, but there are clues that it isn't. That note is hand written for one thing, I'm pretty sure everything we see from Nathan's dad is typed, and has a much more distant tone. That note is also talking about Nathan loving things up for the author, personally, when everything we've seen from Sean Prescott just indicates a staggering amount of disappointment and scorn. Also The Dark Room is entirely centered around some really hosed up photography. Sean Prescott is a real estate developer who is never shown to have any interest in anything artistic at all. Kinda weird that he had a whole bunker built for Nathan that he never looked at but I guess spending that kind of cash is easier for a man like Sean that dealing with his mentally unwell son. GlyphGryph posted:I mentioned earlier anyone who wanted some spoilers should more closely examine the "clues" we put together earlier. My main problem with that as a clue is that we have no idea of the significance of that location at the time. The only reasonable chance a player has at understanding the significance of that is if they already know what's there. Otherwise they'd have to constantly be looking at license plates and remember small details not pertinent to what they're immediately doing after finding out what goes on in that barn. It's great as an easter egg for subsequent playthroughs though. paragon1 fucked around with this message at 03:08 on Apr 23, 2016 |
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Apr 23, 2016 03:06
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paragon1 posted:My main problem with that as a clue is that we have no idea of the significance of that location at the time. The only reasonable chance a player has at understanding the significance of that is if they already know what's there. Otherwise they'd have to constantly be looking at license plates and remember small details not pertinent to what they're immediately doing after finding out what goes on in that barn. It's great as an easter egg for subsequent playthroughs though. Yeah I know that's kind of my point, it's just really cool the clear evidence was out there and totally justified that we didn't notice. I didn't mean to imply it was foreshadowing or anything, just impressive that they would put something like that in.
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Apr 23, 2016 03:13
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FractalSandwich posted:My immediate reaction to this video was "This is real fuckin' stupid." - but not because of the twist. The twist is fine. It's actually not even the thing that stuck out to me. The thing I was really thinking was: "I don't know why Max has time powers at all if she can never be allowed to use them when they matter most." but we did use her powers when they mattered most, we got away with spilling Frank's beans Anyway, count me as one of those who wouldn't have seen this twist coming, were it not for the fact that Jefferson's weird comment in chapter 1 was brought up. It's such an easy throwaway thing to forget. I like that the game gets you so focused on collecting evidence against Nathan that you might not even think about looking for any other clues.
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Apr 23, 2016 03:27
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Panzer Skank posted:Request for the thread at large: if you just watched that video and you didn't see the twist coming, please post your immediate thoughts in reaction to it in the thread (cause that's the best bit lmao) I am so irrationally upset I made my first post after like IDK 5 years or some poo poo. SO, I was pretty freaked out by Jefferson at the party???If they mentioned that the winner was going to be revealed at the Vortex club party, I completely forgot it. Also what the gently caress? Reveal the winner of a school wide contest to a club specific party??? in the VIP room??? where only like, 40% of the party goers are at?? I had been extremely suspicious of him for a long time, because he was the only main character with out any obvious flaws sticking out (other then that time he was a huge rear end in a top hat to Kate) but I had just suspected maybe he was banging a student or some poo poo. Did I want it to be Logan? I might have wanted it to be Logan. When Victoria was making her speech, I remembered how I felt watching Victoria and Mr. Jefferson having that conversation where Victoria tries blackmailing him. I told someone that Jefferson reminded me of some character from a movie, but I couldn't place it for some reason. It started bothering me again and around the time Nathan sent Chloe the text it hit me. "...he reminds me of that fucker from Hard Candy..." Then it hit me like a ton of brick and I'm sitting here angerly whispering "OH gently caress! OH!!! gently caress!!!" AND THEN EVERYTHING STARTED HAPPENING SO FAST AND GOD drat I DID *NOT* SEE THAT loving HEAD SHOT COMING THOUGH. I AM VERY UPSET AND INCONSOLABLE RIGHT NOW.
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Apr 23, 2016 03:41
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Yeah he's an enormous prick in that scene with Kate because he's actively trying to make her feel worse and push her towards what she does. I guess the most blatant of the moments in the game regarding "Jefferson is a bad guy" is when you can blame David, Nathan or Jefferson near the end of episode 2 and it's a little bit like "uhhh okay he was a prick but why is he a choice?" but now... I personally didn't see the twist coming the first time I experienced it but I also watch a lot of anime and in retrospect "the teacher is a bad guy!" is something that happens a lot and I should've kinda kept an eye on the one teacher with significant moments of interaction.
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Apr 23, 2016 06:05
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Kay Plays cottoned on to the fact that Jefferson was gonna be the bad guy in like the first five minutes of playing, it was great.
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Apr 23, 2016 06:13
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Specifically with his "I could take any one of you and tie you up and put you in a dark room" thing which is supposed to be framed as how you don't do things but oops that's how he do Also this thread has been due an effort post for a while and now that my favorite character is dead I should be able to have that up this weekend
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Apr 23, 2016 07:38
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never trust a dude who unironically quotes Lennon.
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Apr 23, 2016 07:48
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namesake posted:Also I get the point that involving the authorities completely shortcircuits the story arc and so can't happen for narrative reasons but you have just received a text mentioning a missing girl and fairly obviously indicates someone trying to hide her forever: why, why why would you not involve the police!?! This is Black Panthers level of 'gently caress the police, snitches get stitches'. They don't want him arrested, they want to shoot him in the face.
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Apr 23, 2016 09:55
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Tarezax posted:Kay Plays cottoned on to the fact that Jefferson was gonna be the bad guy in like the first five minutes of playing, it was great. I was watching her LP during my own playthrough (I watched her videos for a chapter after I'd finished it), so while I thought she was probably joking (at least a little) with her immediate "It's Jefferson, he's clearly evil," reaction, when I got to the end of episode 4, my reaction was more of a "Huh, she was right!" than a "Holy poo poo!!! Mr. Jefferson!!!" There's another aspect that she picks up on pretty early on that hasn't been fully revealed yet, too, so while I would recommend her play through as a good one, I'd suggest not checking it out yet if you don't want to be potentially spoiled on a fairly major plot point. --- On another, "avoiding spoilers" related note, I've played the Love Is Strange visual novel that I posted about a few weeks back, and we're now passed the one potential spoiler in it. In it, the photography teacher is not Mr. Jefferson, but a version of the Hawt Dawg Man with Jefferson's beard and glasses, who is, despite the beard, gender-neutral (referred to as "they" and called "Mx. Dawg"). Anyway, I'd recommend checking it out if you like the characters but would like something a bit lighter and fluffier (and gayer) than the direction the real game has suddenly taken. It contains 100% fewer people getting shot in the head!
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Apr 23, 2016 10:32
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ParliamentOfDogs posted:They don't want him arrested, they want to shoot him in the face. Chloe does, Max seems to be for stopping Nathan any way they can. Anyway it's not a point worth puzzling over too much because it would ruin the story if they did. So what happens if you blame Jefferson after Kates suicide attempt and he's not supposed to present the award? He still shows up as irresponsible dick adult at a party? Come to think of it he must have been right behind Chloes car the entire way after they leave for him to get them like that.
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Apr 23, 2016 10:37
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namesake posted:Chloe does, Max seems to be for stopping Nathan any way they can. Anyway it's not a point worth puzzling over too much because it would ruin the story if they did. Chloe is anti-authority anyway, believes the police are in the Prescott's pockets, and is so angry over Rachel's death that she just wants to straight up kill Nathan. Max, I think, would maybe go to the police/FBI, but knows that Chloe would go straight after Nathan anyway, and is more concerned with backing up and protecting Chloe - and she needs to be present at the confrontation to be able to use her powers. At this point, her priorities would be 1) Protect Chloe, 2) Stop Nathan, 3) Prevent Chloe from killing Nathan, in that order. quote:So what happens if you blame Jefferson after Kates suicide attempt and he's not supposed to present the award? He still shows up as irresponsible dick adult at a party? Come to think of it he must have been right behind Chloes car the entire way after they leave for him to get them like that. Jefferson's still the photography teacher, so he'd still be judging the contest, he'd just not be going to San Francisco with the winner as the school wants him out of the public eye for a while due to the Kate situation.
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Apr 23, 2016 10:51
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Surprise Pizza posted:Chloe is anti-authority anyway, believes the police are in the Prescott's pockets, and is so angry over Rachel's death that she just wants to straight up kill Nathan. Max, I think, would maybe go to the police/FBI, but knows that Chloe would go straight after Nathan anyway, and is more concerned with backing up and protecting Chloe - and she needs to be present at the confrontation to be able to use her powers. At this point, her priorities would be 1) Protect Chloe, 2) Stop Nathan, 3) Prevent Chloe from killing Nathan, in that order.
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Apr 23, 2016 10:58
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FractalSandwich posted:Too bad she wasn't prepared for having her powers instantly and completely turned off by a syringeful of kryptonite. Well, you know, there's having priorities, and then there's successfully executing on those priorities...They are two very different things.
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Apr 23, 2016 11:06
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