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ninjahedgehog
Feb 17, 2011

It's time to kick the tires and light the fires, Big Bird.


BurntCornMuffin posted:

As someone who uses a Steam controller for this game on occasion, I would shoot myself if I had to use a 360 controller. This game has a lot of pointing and clicking, which is one of the things the Steam controller is actually really good at.

I mean, one could do cursor emulation with 360, I've done it in the past, but it really sucks for that. A good decision was made.

Did you ever use a 360 controller for EU? It's not just moving a cursor around, your move orders snap to tiles really fluidly and all of the commands are hotkeyed. It work really well and I'm also disappointed they don't have it in XCOM 2.

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many johnnys
May 17, 2015

Ugly In The Morning posted:

The difficulty curve almost feels like Long War. Not quite "Ha, a drone will squad wipe you because flying beats all your cover and makes me hard to hit" hard, but it expects that you beat Classic Ironman already. I have had to do a fair bit of savescumming at this point.

It's easier than it looks, and if you have a run go bad (or hell, if you've savescummed a bit so far), try starting a new game on Veteran (the "normal" difficulty).

Let go of the idea that things will go your way all the time. Manage your resources properly. Keep branching out into new areas around the globe, but it's also okay to spend a lil intel in the black market (just make sure you've got enough to keep expanding). Be willing to call in an extraction and fail a mission while getting your guys out. If you save-scum so that everyone survives and you win missions all the time, you're playing a different (and worse) game. Don't worry too much about the avatar meter itself, just keep expanding toward the next facility or objective. If it maxes out, you still get some time to complete an objective to push back against it.

(In fact, save your avatar facilities for when the doom clock maxes out - if there's a Dark Event that arbitrarily gives Avatar more points, it'll be assigned to a facility if possible, allowing you to undo that too. This does NOT include the blacksite on your starting continent - that's a story mission and not a proper facility raid).

It took me a few failed runs before I had a successful one, and it felt like I had earned it. Even in my successful run, I had to make some hard choices and had a good deal of deaths (most of them rangers).


additional point: it' used to be possible to "ride the clock" but isn't as much anymore. When the doom counter maxes out, a clock starts giving you 20 days (15 on Commander) to push back against it otherwise you lose. When you do something to remove progress from the project, it goes back into the squares view. And when the doom counter maxes out again, it starts again.

In the past, the clock would restart back from the beginning, which means you could just let it count down without worry, and then when you've got a few days left, push back and then you get all 15/20 days back. Now the clock resumes from wherever it left off (unless you've only got like a week left, then it'll reset back up to a week I think).

many johnnys fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Jun 22, 2016

many johnnys
May 17, 2015

Some random tips because I want to :justpost: :

Make sure to keep expanding all over the place, the money owns. Build those comm towers if the intel costs are getting prohibitive (I'll sometimes pay 2x for a farther contact, but never 3x).

If you start your geurilla tactics school early, you can get squadsize five before your first terror (retaliation) mission. You can also put rookies into it for a free level-up into whichever class you want. So it's not random anymore!

Weapon tech is still the most important research and you need to keep on top of it.

The black market refreshes every month. Their selection always includes some weapon parts, some pcs bonuses, two personnel (expensive), and some money. Occasionally rushed research. If I can afford it, I usually get the cash and a weapon mod.

If the black market is interested in your alloys or elerium, yeahh boiiii you're gonna be rich. Don't get stupid and sell all of it of course (since you need them later), but you get a lot of bang for your buck. If they're going for normal price, only sell them if you are desperate. Never ever sell the elerium cores.

You can also sell some corpses on the market. You'll need some various trooper corpses to research better armor, so look up which ones you need and sell the rest. The aliens themselves you can just chuck on the black market once you've researched them and bought whatever they're good for (except for Faceless, you can never have too many mimic beacons).

It's okay to fail missions. The penalty for failure on its own is not that bad. Worst-case, you lose contact with the region, costing you a bit of monthly income. Unlike the first game, you can get regions back. If a mission goes upside-down (or looks like it will), pull out. Don't skip missions outright though if you can help it.

The Shadow Chamber is better in this game. It allows you to unlock plot missions (which helps with the avatar counter), and also tells you what enemy types are going to be in a mission before you deploy. That info helps a whole lot.

Early on, rotate through a number of soldiers to build up your roster. Later, it's safer to just buy them. You can get new soldiers from Home Base each month for funbucks, or from the Black Market by spending Intel. I usually get the homebase one, and spend a lil intel on the money package to offset the cost a bit.

Most missions have a timer of 8 turns. With the opening stealth, that gives you plenty of time to achieve the objective. Council Missions have 12 turns, but require escorting someone, rescuing someone and then escorting them, or capturing someone.


Explosives are very very good just like before. Destroying cover owns.

Flashbangs disable an enemy's abilities. If you flashbang a sectoid, it loses access to PSI, and also loses any zombie it animated. If you flashbang a codex, it can't split into copies.

The Experimental Ammo and Experimental Grenades projects are good. The fancy special grenades are particularly powerful early on (although they're worse at destroying cover). When you get access to Experimental Armor, don't make any, they're bad.

When you get access to E.X.O. or W.A.R. suits, they are awesome. Try 'em. With EXOs (mid-tier) Research Experimental Heavy Weapon until you get a shredder gun, and use a shredder gun. Otherwise I prefer rockets. WAR suits you want the Blaster Bombs or Shredstorm Cannons.

Height bonus is good especially early on. But if you bunch together on a rooftop you will probably get grenaded if possible, and the floor gets destroyed so the fall will hurt you even more. You can use this against enemies on roofs yourself.

If you have stealth active (at the beginning of most missions), you can move up very aggressively. Watch out for blind corners, but otherwise feel free to go go go. Be sensible and aware of what you'll reveal of course. But the enemy sight range is very short until you go hot, so take advantage of this to beat the timer much easier.

A ranger with Phantom will stay stealthy even if everyone else goes hot. If the rest of your units can mop up on their own, you can continue to use the Phantom to scout ahead aggressively. Warning: being careless with this is why I lost most of my rangers and had to keep buying new ones. Phantom Rangers are extremely helpful on missions where you don't start in stealth, such as retaliations.

Both sniper paths are good. The pistol-wielding Sharpshooter can put out an amazing amount of damage very quickly. Even early game you can fire two or three times a turn. Later game they are monsters. Give them special ammo. They are really good in missions where you need to keep mobile, like council missions. Since they specialize in a ton of fast weaker shots, they can be foiled by armor.

The standard long-range Sniper doesn't become a monster until later-game, but they still help. They're good in missions where they don't need to move much, like providing support-fire in retaliation missions. They are awesome at facility raids. They're also good at Destroy The Beacon missions. Squadsight has an accuracy penalty now, which gets harsher the farther out of sight the enemy is. Offset this by moving them up strategically, or giving them scopes, or keeping them up high. You cannot miss the beacon.

Hacking is neat, but the best hacks are unreliable. You can boost hacking by leveling up, improving your Gremlin level with research, and by upgrading the Skulljack item and bringing one along. You can shut down robots pretty reliably if you keep up, and take total control of them less-reliably. Failing a hack will buff the robot though, so don't write any cheques you can't cash. You can also zap enemies for a lil guaranteed damage - this is amazing for picking off weakened foes.

You know this by now, but Specialists are essential on any "hack the terminal" mission. They can do it from far away, which owns. If the angle is bad, blow a hole in the wall. Once the terminal is hacked, the mission timer disappears.

Medic specialists are less essential in this game, but you especially need them when chrysalids start showing up. They can also cure poison, acid, and being on fire. If the shadow chamber says there will be a chrysalid, best be safe and bring a medic.

Grenadiers are great. If you upgrade their launchers, they are even better.

The "gunner" build of the grenadier is super-powerful at the late game. Stack aim bonuses on them (scopes, PCS +aim), and watch them tear stuff apart.

PSI is still the strongest in the game. They are their own class now, and they gain experience, stats, and powers from spending time in your PSI chamber.

Very late game, you want to have some EMP Grenades and Bluescreen Rounds for when the Shadow Chamber says there are robots. EMP ignores armor and does a shitload of damage to mechanical units, and has a chance to also shut them down for a turn. Bluescreen Rounds ignore armor and add an extra +5 damage against bots - your sharpshooter could potentially be firing FIVE SHOTS IN A TURN, turning them into robo-killers. They do nothing to pure organics.

And lastly, know when to pull out. I said it before, but failing a mission is not a harsh penalty in XCOM 2. Losing good soldiers is. It's better to fail a mission and get out your remaining troops, than it is to fail a mission and then ALSO lose your troops. If things get too dangerous, GTFO. Calling in an extraction will be one of the hardest calls you have to make. Most of my failures have been the result of doubling down when I should have folded. This is one of the things that makes council missions so dangerous - you can't call an extract, you have to get to the end.


other people please add good and cool tips

raverrn
Apr 5, 2005

Unidentified spacecraft inbound from delta line.

All Silpheed squadrons scramble now!


Always start with a Guerilla Tactics School, start training Grenadiers and don't stop. When poo poo goes to poo poo and you take four newbies on a mission, the difference between four rookies and four Grenadiers is loving MASSIVE.

Mister Bates
Aug 4, 2010
Is Wet Work still broken or did they finally patch that?

MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

If mis-clicks are an issue for you (and who hasn't loving mis-clicked once or twice) do this: Click your ability, say flashbang, move the mouse cursor to where you want, then LET GO OF THE MOUSE, and press the number key to activate the actual throw. This has saved me countless times where a slight move in the mouse would mean my flashbang/whatever would not hit all enemies needed.

many johnnys
May 17, 2015

MF_James posted:

If mis-clicks are an issue for you (and who hasn't loving mis-clicked once or twice) do this: Click your ability, say flashbang, move the mouse cursor to where you want, then LET GO OF THE MOUSE, and press the number key to activate the actual throw. This has saved me countless times where a slight move in the mouse would mean my flashbang/whatever would not hit all enemies needed.

Spacebar works too. Hitting a key to execute manual aim is more reliable than clicking the cursor.

I also remapped reload to backspace, because I kept hitting it by accident when I try to turn the camera with E.

wolfman101
Feb 8, 2004

PCXL Fanboy
Honestly, 8 turns seems too little for impossible difficulty for some of the mission types. Having to fight 4 pods means you aren't going to be double moving much. Trying to avoid pods to sneak up on the objective seems to just mean you are going to take even longer because you are fighting two pods at once a turn later. Maybe I am missing something?

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
True Concealment is, imo, one of the best mods in existence and XCOM shouldn't be played without it. Mission timers starting while enemies have no idea you're even there is stupid, and so is having half the missions in the game ignore one of the biggest mechanics they introduced in XCOM 2. It makes timed missions easier if you play them well, and near impossible if you don't, cause you have fewer turns (after breaking concealment) to finish the objective, and if you're not milking your concealment to skip at least one pod you'll probably lose.

Mister Bates
Aug 4, 2010

Magres posted:

True Concealment is, imo, one of the best mods in existence and XCOM shouldn't be played without it. Mission timers starting while enemies have no idea you're even there is stupid, and so is having half the missions in the game ignore one of the biggest mechanics they introduced in XCOM 2. It makes timed missions easier if you play them well, and near impossible if you don't, cause you have fewer turns (after breaking concealment) to finish the objective, and if you're not milking your concealment to skip at least one pod you'll probably lose.

I'm playing a nearly-unmodded game until I can beat the game at least once (basically just cosmetics and voicepacks), but True Concealment is so good that I can't imagine not using it.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
Yeah the only things I'm running are cosmetic slash user interface mods (stuff like on the post-mission screen it displays how many days people will be out when they get wounded), True Concealment, and 100% Sword Accuracy. Probably gonna turn off Sword Accuracy cause I don't care about it, but True Concealment is, as far as I am concerned, the true XCOM 2 experience. It doesn't make the game any easier (imo) it just makes it better.

Mister Bates
Aug 4, 2010
It's the little things that really sell me on this game, like how the alien transports in supply raids have an immediately-visible reason for being stopped in the middle of nowhere (the Resistance blew up a segment of train tracks, there was a rock slide, this convoy got hit by a car bomb), or how the main menu changes based on what kind of mission you played last and what time of day the mission took place. The presentation in this game is top-notch and the world they put together is really compelling.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
Holy gently caress I had my Ranger kill eight enemies in one turn with Serial (she got it from the Advanced Warfare Center and it's godmode) during the final mission to save my butt. Just BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM over and over. Putting a Superior Scope and Superior Extended Magazine on her shotgun was a good investment.

I'm gonna miss that Ranger so much, more than once when a fight was looking a little dicey and she'd just walk out and blast four or five enemies to rescue the mission, and she pulled out all the stops with this final mission.

Solarflare
Apr 21, 2008
Spectrum mod question for anyone that's playing it: am I supposed to be able to have access to the full suite of weapon upgrades without doing any research? I'm not running any mods outside of the maker's recommended list right now, but for some reason everything shows up, which is pretty gamebreaking.

edit: I do still have the ignore missing content mod still active, but there's no missing content to ignore so I can't see how that could be the problem.

Solarflare fucked around with this message at 11:05 on Jun 23, 2016

Deltasquid
Apr 10, 2013

awww...
you guys made me ink!


THUNDERDOME

Solarflare posted:

Spectrum mod question for anyone that's playing it: am I supposed to be able to have access to the full suite of weapon upgrades without doing any research? I'm not running any mods outside of the maker's recommended list right now, but for some reason everything shows up, which is pretty gamebreaking.

edit: I do still have the ignore missing content mod still active, but there's no missing content to ignore so I can't see how that could be the problem.

Which full suite of weapon upgrades? I haven't played in some days and it got updated recently but I didn't have any game breaking stuff available to me.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Magres posted:

True Concealment is, imo, one of the best mods in existence and XCOM shouldn't be played without it. Mission timers starting while enemies have no idea you're even there is stupid

Mechanically sure, but the reason for it is that ADVENT saw the giant vtol fly in and drop people off. The timer isn't for your guys, it's the countdown until some UFOs come in to blow up Firebrand.

Jastiger
Oct 11, 2008

by FactsAreUseless
In this game I always thought :xcom: was for missing 99% shot chances and stuff or being crit with heavy cover and tons of armor and smoke screens and stuff.

But it seems in THIS game its less about the shooting and the goddam hacking. I've failed more 70%+ hack attemps than I've missed 80%+ shots its crazy lol.

But....:xcom:

Alkydere
Jun 7, 2010
Capitol: A building or complex of buildings in which any legislature meets.
Capital: A city designated as a legislative seat by the government or some other authority, often the city in which the government is located; otherwise the most important city within a country or a subdivision of it.



Jastiger posted:

In this game I always thought :xcom: was for missing 99% shot chances and stuff or being crit with heavy cover and tons of armor and smoke screens and stuff.

But it seems in THIS game its less about the shooting and the goddam hacking. I've failed more 70%+ hack attemps than I've missed 80%+ shots its crazy lol.

But....:xcom:

Dunno, had some :xcom: moments from BS shots lately. Had an otherwise good Blacksite (Only lost one rookie-ish Ranger so far to a flanking Sectoid but still had four soldiers on the field, was on the last pod) go tits up when some Muton critted my top-rank soldier for 10 HP through high cover. Try as I could I just couldn't quite pull that one out after the resulting panic spiral (and missing a 92% shot on said Muton) left me with two critically wounded soldiers to deal with the Commander and 2 Lancers grabbing the vial summoned.

wuffles
Apr 10, 2004

wolfman101 posted:

Honestly, 8 turns seems too little for impossible difficulty for some of the mission types. Having to fight 4 pods means you aren't going to be double moving much. Trying to avoid pods to sneak up on the objective seems to just mean you are going to take even longer because you are fighting two pods at once a turn later. Maybe I am missing something?

It can be very tight, especially early on, but it's almost always possible to make the timer with room to spare if you do the following:

1. Move aggressively right from the start. If you have 8 turns you always start in concealment. Make those first moves count by covering as much ground toward the objective as possible.

2. Engage the first pod on your second turn if possible. Sometimes you'll want to do so on your third, rarely will you want to fight on your first. This goes back to point #1, you need to cover as much ground as possible in concealment and getting closer improves your odds of landing shots. But here's the rub: if you advance too far in the concealment phase, you're now more likely to be engaging the second pod at the same time as the first and that's a recipe for disaster.

3. Don't waste any APs. For example, if you're going to shoot at an enemy ask yourself: can I move forward first, then take the shot? Don't just take a shot and blow an AP that could have been used to advance. Always be looking to advance during a fire fight, not just on turns without enemies engaged. If you're as far forward as you can comfortably go on that turn, check your ammo situation - is it worth reloading before taking the shot? If you can finish an engagement with your forward-most troops, do so and then dash the others up from the rear (but don't extend past your forward troops). This means you'll be doing very little, if any, overwatching.

4. Take calculated risks. If you're already revealed, blue-moved your point man forward and still haven't seen any enemies, look to see if you can advance him further into high-cover. If you didn't reveal anyone, great, you can now cover a lot of ground with the whole squad at no cost. If you did, it sucks you've got to fight a man down, but you still made up valuable ground and the situation is typically manageable.

5. Get the objective, then mop up. A lot of times you can secure the objective without activating the last pod (or 2). Sometimes you have to hack a computer in the middle of a fire fight. You're going to take some lumps on legend, its your job to choose how and where you take them.

Continuing on that last point: once you have 5/6 man squads, it can be well worth taking a rookie for a trial by fire. By exploiting the AI's preference for easier targets, you can pretty much determine who is going to be shot at and sometimes you need a human shield soldier with that special set of skills. I tend to do this more on council missions, since those go tits up more often than others, and I'm more likely to need someone to stand in a precarious location while the rest of the squad dashes for the extraction zone :patriot:

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

My greatest(?) :xcom: moment was against the Avatars on Commander before the dodge adjustment. It mind controlled one of my other guys and I moved a soldier up to finish it off and rescue him.

"What do you mean he dodged both 100% to hit shots"

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?

RBA Starblade posted:

Mechanically sure, but the reason for it is that ADVENT saw the giant vtol fly in and drop people off. The timer isn't for your guys, it's the countdown until some UFOs come in to blow up Firebrand.

This is exactly what I thought as well. I don't think it is stupid. Concealment is on a tactical level (they do not know exactly where you are), not a strategic level (they do know that you are there, somewhere, as a giant ship flew in and dropped your dudes off somewhere). It makes sense to me that you would have limited time to get poo poo done after that, even if they don't know exactly where you are.

wuffles
Apr 10, 2004

The most :xcom: moment I've had happened just a few days ago. 2nd mission (the one just after gate crasher) and I get reinforcements called in on me while I'm mopping up the 2nd to last normal pod. I secure the objective and only have enough AP left to put 2 soldiers on overwatch.

Reinforcement dropship flies in and its an Advent Officer and 2 Stunlancers...on the 2nd mission :stonklol:

I can only manage to kill the officer and one stun lancer while wounding the other on that turn, while the last alien pod saunters into view. :cripes:

The last remaining stun lancer runs over and crit-kills the grenadier I modeled after myself, causing 2 soldiers to panic (one of which was holding the only flashbang). Only soldier with AP for the turn finishes the lancer, but its not looking good.

Sectoid fucks off into the fog somewhere behind a building, while he uses my zombified corpse to murder one of the panic'd soldiers (modeled after a RL friend..who was holding the flashbang). Now the soldier, modeled after my brother, that didn't panic the first time flips out and hunkers down in an easily flankable position :kingsley:

The solider I made after my wife attempts a flank from an elevated position on the closest trooper, but misses the ~90% shot. :suicide: Brother is merked by the troopers on the next turn, and now the wife has panicked again.

The 2 troopers take free flanking shots on her while she's panicked, but only one connects for sub-lethal damage. That's when my shambling corpse rounds the corner and finishes her off. Code black. :stare:

I could not stop laughing for almost 20 minutes.

Solarflare
Apr 21, 2008

Deltasquid posted:

Which full suite of weapon upgrades? I haven't played in some days and it got updated recently but I didn't have any game breaking stuff available to me.

This is what I mean, alllll the various gun types are available for purchase, with just a few gated off by needing engineers. It's probably some kind of bug causing shop purchases to not be gated off by research properly.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011

SlyFrog posted:

This is exactly what I thought as well. I don't think it is stupid. Concealment is on a tactical level (they do not know exactly where you are), not a strategic level (they do know that you are there, somewhere, as a giant ship flew in and dropped your dudes off somewhere). It makes sense to me that you would have limited time to get poo poo done after that, even if they don't know exactly where you are.

Imo "they know you're around but not exactly where you are" is what non-Concealment is, because the pods are standing around (or patrolling) on high alert because they recognize you and move to engage you as soon as you're visible, and if they knew exactly where you are then you'd more or less have the All Pods Always Active mod as your situation. When you're in Concealment they're being lazy bastards and not really paying attention because they don't realize at all that you're there, which is also why the Vigilant dark event exists - everyone gets orders to sharpen the hell up and pay better attention, but they're still not on "there are enemies nearby" high alert, they're just actually doing their jobs and standing guard instead of slacking off.

You're welcome to disagree with me though :) That's just where my thinking for "True Concealment makes more sense than vanilla Concealment wrt timed missions" comes from.

many johnnys
May 17, 2015

Magres posted:

Imo "they know you're around but not exactly where you are" is what non-Concealment is, because the pods are standing around (or patrolling) on high alert because they recognize you and move to engage you as soon as you're visible, and if they knew exactly where you are then you'd more or less have the All Pods Always Active mod as your situation. When you're in Concealment they're being lazy bastards and not really paying attention because they don't realize at all that you're there, which is also why the Vigilant dark event exists - everyone gets orders to sharpen the hell up and pay better attention, but they're still not on "there are enemies nearby" high alert, they're just actually doing their jobs and standing guard instead of slacking off.

You're welcome to disagree with me though :) That's just where my thinking for "True Concealment makes more sense than vanilla Concealment wrt timed missions" comes from.

I agree with what Concealment means, and the timers are contrived. They are often specific things like "the network connection is about to be shut off! Move and get that data!" or "self-detonating charges have been placed" and you are :rolleyes: conveniently :rolleyes: rolling in 8 turns before the cutoff.

I think they improve the gameplay so I'm willing to accept a bit of silliness.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
Oh yeah timed missions own bones, I just think they're silly with Concealment sometimes. I'd enjoy having timed missions designed around not having concealment though. Make it a relatively easy mission, but you also have to make the entire thing a rolling firefight - timed missions with concealment (without True Concealment) generally just mean I sprint past as many pods as possible.

Really, mission timers added a ton of room for interesting new missions.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

It's not like I've made much use of Concealment anyway. :haw:

Magres
Jul 14, 2011

RBA Starblade posted:

My greatest(?) :xcom: moment was against the Avatars on Commander before the dodge adjustment. It mind controlled one of my other guys and I moved a soldier up to finish it off and rescue him.

"What do you mean he dodged both 100% to hit shots"

I absolutely hate seeing "Dodge: Grazed" on 100% shots. How does that mechanic even work, anyway?

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.

Magres posted:

I absolutely hate seeing "Dodge: Grazed" on 100% shots. How does that mechanic even work, anyway?

It doesn't, anymore. They patched it so 100% shots can't be dodged.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
Oh I'm dumb then, it was probably some like 90% shot that I mentally rounded to 100%

brakeless
Apr 11, 2011

Has anyone else run into a bug that causes a suppressing soldier's model to move further and futher away from the cover they're using with multiple suppressions, even though they still count as being in cover? I'm running some suppression-related mods but I'm not seeing anyone reporting a bug like this in their comments.

Doobie Keebler
May 9, 2005

Magres posted:

Oh I'm dumb then, it was probably some like 90% shot that I mentally rounded to 100%

That's funny. I usually round 90% shots down to zero. That's what happens when you need it to hit, anyway.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011

Doobie Keebler posted:

That's funny. I usually round 90% shots down to zero. That's what happens when you need it to hit, anyway.

:xcom:


Yeah during final mission I had like 4-5 different 80-90% success chance actions (it was like a Mind Control, a Dominate, a Hack, and then a shot or two) all fail when I needed any given one of them to succeed for me to not be up a creek. I wound up having to burn through my Heavy Weapons on my Grenadiers to rescue things and was not happy about it.

Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames

Magres posted:

Oh yeah timed missions own bones, I just think they're silly with Concealment sometimes. I'd enjoy having timed missions designed around not having concealment though. Make it a relatively easy mission, but you also have to make the entire thing a rolling firefight - timed missions with concealment (without True Concealment) generally just mean I sprint past as many pods as possible.

Really, mission timers added a ton of room for interesting new missions.

That's that mod I was talking about. There's a retaliation variant where your squad, supported by resistance soldiers, have to hold out against an advent siege for 12 turns. It's really cool to try and find a defensible position and watch it slowly get eaten to shreds from misfire, grenades, and explosions. It's like a timed mini avenger defense.

Magres
Jul 14, 2011
Oooh yeah that sounds awesome! What's the name of it? I just finished a game of Veteran and I'm thinking Commander with more some more mods sounds fun

Kwanzaa Quickie
Nov 4, 2009
Pretty sure it's "Additional Mission Types" in the workshop. The cool thing about the advent siege mission is that you get to keep all the corpses at the end. :10bux::10bux::10bux: at the Black Market

Hexenritter
May 20, 2001


Bogart posted:

That's that mod I was talking about. There's a retaliation variant where your squad, supported by resistance soldiers, have to hold out against an advent siege for 12 turns. It's really cool to try and find a defensible position and watch it slowly get eaten to shreds from misfire, grenades, and explosions. It's like a timed mini avenger defense.

I've got that one installed, it can get nuts especially if you're surrounded by explodey bits. My first ever experience with that retaliation mission, I also skulljacked my first officer, which introduced me to the Codex. Let's just say that holing up near a couple of large oil tanks did not end well for most of my squad.

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.

Bogart posted:

That's that mod I was talking about. There's a retaliation variant where your squad, supported by resistance soldiers, have to hold out against an advent siege for 12 turns. It's really cool to try and find a defensible position and watch it slowly get eaten to shreds from misfire, grenades, and explosions. It's like a timed mini avenger defense.

Is there an incentive to keep the resistance soldiers alive? Do you get to keep them?

Hexenritter
May 20, 2001


Mzbundifund posted:

Is there an incentive to keep the resistance soldiers alive? Do you get to keep them?

Yep. Any resistance soldiers you have under your control when you evac/end a mission end up in your roster.

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Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames
Just so. Additonal Mission Types.

There's also a ouple of proving grounds projects that give those soldiers better arms / armor as your current level of tech allows, but you can change that so they're just set to 0 cost, which I did because I could. :colbert:


e: let me go way overboard and list all of the mods i'm running.

Overwatch All/Others
Quiet Bradford
Stop Wasting My Time (these two might be redundant but eh, they work!)
Hack Plus
Evac All
Instant Avenger Menus
Cost Based Ability Colors
Stabilize Me
More Maps Pack
True Retroactive AWC
Ink and Paint
Quick Start
SMG Pack
Capnbubs Accessories Pack
Drimakus War Gear
Extended Callsigns and Nicknames
Wet Work Fix (has this been fixed?)
Restrict Rulers
XCOM EU/Ew Ports: Tier 2 Armour / Tier 3 Armour / Helmets / Extras
Even More Maps
Mapes by Vozati
Save Games Delete All Option
Additional Icons
Perfect Information
Additional Mission Types
After Action -- Days Wounded
Black Market Usage
Mod Config Menu
Scaling Protect Device
Expanded Mission Names
Spart's Kitbashes
Guerilla Class
Rogue Class Mod
Trooper - Custom Class Mod
Specops Combat Knives
Better Laboratory
Elerium Core Crafting
Patrol Training
Mission Award Variety
Advent Psi Operative

(i don't really like the Grimy suite of mods. something about random weapons and armor is pretty anti-XCOM to me, and you'll get nooo elerium cores from drops. give me the option to get six better-than-average guns for one guy, or the opportunity to get better guns for everyone, and i'll pick better guns. their class mods run from overpowered (bruiser) to worse versions of existing classes (fury), and their class rebalance is just real questionable to me.)

Bogart fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Jun 24, 2016

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