|
Jerusalem posted:Angela complaining that Elliot and Darlene always thought they were smarter than her made me think that her E-Corp job is basically just a big social-engineering hack, and that all the bridge-burning she's doing with people from her former life is designed to further sell the idea that she's completely onboard with E-Corp till they put her in a position to absolutely gently caress them over. Yeah, but like Death Vomit Wizard said, this could be her establishing that she isn't a hacker. If you were either E-Corp or the FBI, and you wanted to build a case against Angela, you would argue that she has personal motive to hurt them and that her taking a job in the company was part of her social engineering to achieve her goals. And her defense can literally be "you're right, I hate e-corp, look how ineffective I've been at changing them from the inside". No, it's no ironclad, but if a jury's involved, it doesn't make a lot of sense for her to be actively sabotaging herself if she's a hacker. On a separate note, we talked a little bit earlier about the scene where Mr. Robot is taking punches of Elliot. I think this is important. It's helping illustrate that Mr. Robot isn't an alternate personality that takes control of Elliot, but is a defense mechanism for Elliot coping with trauma. One of the revelations this episode is that Elliot, and not Mr. Robot, shot Tyrell (who might not be dead). But I think it's important to realize that it wasn't a case of Mr. Robot "taking over" and shooting Tyrell, but of Elliot shooting Tyrell and Mr. Robot being Elliot's defense mechanism in his memory. Mr. Robot protects Elliot. When something bad happens to Elliot, Mr. Robot takes it. Compartmentalizes it. This includes Elliot doing things that are traumatic to himself. Like throwing himself off the pier. Or shooting Tyrell. I always felt that "There was only Elliot" but I couldn't be sure if the narrative was actually going in the direction of Elliot and Mr. Robot being actual separate personalities/beings. I feel like it's really starting to support the idea of Mr. Robot as really an aspect of Elliot, and not a scapegoat for Elliot's actions.
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 08:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 21:57 |
|
|
Rocksicles posted:No it wasn't, the US is full of scary white dudes. If you didn't immediately think 'yep they in prison' with it, you need to watch more prison movies and Oz.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 09:12
|
|
|
Chess game this episode is same one from Kubrick's 2001. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poole_versus_HAL_9000
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 11:58
|
|
|
Jerusalem posted:Hey I'm sure this was real obvious to everyone else but I'm always a little slow on the uptake - when the angry dudes grab Elliot into the "alley" and start hitting him, there are these rapid cuts between Elliot and Mr. Robot being present. I assume that this was to demonstrate that Mr. Robot was "taking" the punches so Elliot wouldn't have to, like he tried to protect him with the sitcom fantasy when he was in the infirmary after the beating he took over the Blackmarket site? He was also in the alleyway after that, faded in the background before the shanking when Ellie was up against the fence. Like a guard; in more ways than one.. Nice touch.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 12:24
|
|
SoroScrew
|
Jerusalem posted:Hey I'm sure this was real obvious to everyone else but I'm always a little slow on the uptake - when the angry dudes grab Elliot into the "alley" and start hitting him, there are these rapid cuts between Elliot and Mr. Robot being present. I assume that this was to demonstrate that Mr. Robot was "taking" the punches so Elliot wouldn't have to, like he tried to protect him with the sitcom fantasy when he was in the infirmary after the beating he took over the Blackmarket site? This was an amazing detail that I noticed and another point to the people running the show for cramming in all these details.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 12:45
|
|
|
Snak posted:On a separate note, we talked a little bit earlier about the scene where Mr. Robot is taking punches of Elliot. I think this is important. It's helping illustrate that Mr. Robot isn't an alternate personality that takes control of Elliot, but is a defense mechanism for Elliot coping with trauma. One of the revelations this episode is that Elliot, and not Mr. Robot, shot Tyrell (who might not be dead). But I think it's important to realize that it wasn't a case of Mr. Robot "taking over" and shooting Tyrell, but of Elliot shooting Tyrell and Mr. Robot being Elliot's defense mechanism in his memory. Mr. Robot protects Elliot. When something bad happens to Elliot, Mr. Robot takes it. Compartmentalizes it. This includes Elliot doing things that are traumatic to himself. Like throwing himself off the pier. Or shooting Tyrell. I always felt that "There was only Elliot" but I couldn't be sure if the narrative was actually going in the direction of Elliot and Mr. Robot being actual separate personalities/beings. I feel like it's really starting to support the idea of Mr. Robot as really an aspect of Elliot, and not a scapegoat for Elliot's actions. Yeah I'm really digging how their relationship has developed this season, it's still not healthy at all but the idea of the two of them being on the same page is nice. It's also easy to forget sometimes that everything Mr. Robot is telling Elliot is actually just Elliot telling it to himself, which puts that bit about being a natural leader into an odd space where Elliot is simultaneously developing some important self-esteem AND kinda coming across as arrogant.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 13:16
|
|
|
Loomer posted:If you didn't immediately think 'yep they in prison' with it, you need to watch more prison movies and Oz. Gotta say though, Elliot's headcanon is really OCD for detail.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 13:29
|
|
|
When that man's posterior was violated with the knife I turned to my wife and commented that I hadn't seen anything so brutal on TV since Oz and I was still surprised at the prison reveal. We had both been suspecting that there would be a reveal of some sort of mental health facility but neither of us considered prison, and over the past few episodes we'd actually almost given up on the theory that his reality was being masked and maybe he really is just at his mom's place. Whoa.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 13:59
|
|
|
It was very obvious, in retrospect. Isnitution theory was so close, but a lot of details that didint made much sense on it, made perfect sense replacing mental institution for prision
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 14:07
|
|
|
I want Sam Esmail to make the Silk Road movie I have in my head. The first bit of the movie would be a fairly mundane story of an awkward nerd who comes into some money trying to find love, and then the FBI tackles him in the library. The rest of the movie is a retelling of the first part through the narrative of the trial, filling in all the parts he was hiding from everyone.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 14:41
|
|
|
Snak posted:How did nobody call prison? all the flimsy stuff in the institution theory make perfect sense in a prison. I didnt even call it mid-episode when they were visually referencing the poo poo out of American History X's rape scene. I really wasn't on board the institution theory because I felt like it would undermine the whole show. However, they managed to sell it to me by taking pains to explain how Elliot just hasn't trusted the audience before, but now he does. And of course the asylum thing threw me for a loop because that theory has holes in it that a prison theory wouldn't have had (like the loving dog). Loomer posted:Prison was obvious the second the scary white dudes turned up. Bingo. Everything about that neighborhood and basketball court to me said it was an AA-majority neighborhood where Elliot seemed to stick out like a sore thumb and it seemed preposterous to me that a bunch of white gangbangers would just turn up out of nowhere to rough him up... unless they're prison Nazis. Also explains why Elliot didn't get the gently caress out of dodge after scary white dude showed up to rough him up for money. Honestly I should've figured it out when I saw that the Mr Robot thread had 110 new posts before I fired up the episode.  Skizzzer posted:I have to disagree with the people here who are saying Angela misstepped in the last episode. Don't forget what happened earlier with Dom - Angela, Darlene, and f-society are beginning to realize that they're in over their head without Elliot, and specifically to Angela, that one of them is already under suspicion with the FBI. Why is she under suspicion? She stepped away from Allsafe to E-corp one week before 5/9 - one week before the hack. She then gets noticed on a restricted floor, where she's not supposed to be, right before the FBI is hacked. I agree with this. She's putting her E-Corp moves on hold to send an obvious signal to anyone watching her that she's in E-Corp to gently caress with E-Corp and nothing related to f-society or hacking, definitely not, nope. It's a completely out of character misstep for her otherwise. She saw that Dom had rumbled her. This episode had too little Dom but what we got was great ("I'm gonna find a barbecue to be miserable in").
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 15:28
|
|
|
The big reveal at the end with prison was totally satisfying to watch unfold, despite having seen it coming in a sense. I was in the Institution camp, so it was extremely fun to see that, regardless of how surprising it was. Far from being worse than season 1, I think we are now in an amazing position of fuller understanding for almost all the characters at play - and it's going to make everything else that happens soooo satisfying. I can hardly imagine what they're going to spend the rest of the season doing. It's 12 episodes, right?
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 16:07
|
|
|
The girl who plays Angela is such an amazing actress. I loved how she looked so authentically nervous and trying to hide it while talking to Dom
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:09
|
|
|
Elias_Maluco posted:The girl who plays Angela is such an amazing actress. I loved how she looked so authentically nervous and trying to hide it while talking to Dom Her one on one scenes make me really uncomfortable but in a good way. Like you can tell that she puts so much effort into putting up her strong, successful, confident women front but just underneath it is a mess of emotions struggling to get out. Antti posted:I agree with this. She's putting her E-Corp moves on hold to send an obvious signal to anyone watching her that she's in E-Corp to gently caress with E-Corp and nothing related to f-society or hacking, definitely not, nope. It's a completely out of character misstep for her otherwise. She saw that Dom had rumbled her. I really like this, because I spent most of the episode going, what the hell are you doing Angela, why are you making such obvious mistakes when you've been lowkey climbing the gently caress with e-corp ladder from inside angle all season?
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:18
|
|
|
And personally I dont think she has some kinda of secret masterplan other than just what she said (try to become big and also do some good inside e-corp) otherwise, why she would not tell her father about it?
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:24
|
|
|
Man, in my first viewing I didn't realize that Leon shoved the knife in that guy's rear end AND then stomped it in 
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:44
|
|
|
IRC the prison theory came up before the institution theory itt, but it made much less sense overall, so it was dismissed. For example, there is this one pyromaniac, insane looking woman hanging around in the courtyard, Elliot is allowed to have a journal and carry it around with him wherever he goes, Leon is binge watching Seinfeld, Elliot has therapy sessions with his own private therapists, etc. I really like that they are showing the real consequences of crashing the world economy this season. S1 portrayed the hack as something noble that would set the world free, while this season they are showing how it mostly hosed over normal people and didn't achieve jackshit otherwise. Everyone seems to still have their loans, but now they are also unemployment and homelessness in addition to that. That's how revolutions generally work out, stuff gets much worse for a long time before it starts getting better.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:45
|
|
|
waitwhatno posted:IRC the prison theory came up before the institution theory itt, but it made much less sense overall, so it was dismissed. For example, there is this one pyromaniac, insane looking woman hanging around in the courtyard, Elliot is allowed to have a journal and carry it around with him wherever he goes, Leon is binge watching Seinfeld, Elliot has therapy sessions with his own private therapists, etc. The pyro girl is a transsexual, that I realized from the beginning. As for the journal, I guess people are allowed to keep one in prision? And maybe there's some kind of TV room where Leon watches his Seinfield. And the "therapy sessions" were actually visits. I think everything fell into place very well
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 17:49
|
|
|
Elias_Maluco posted:The pyro girl is a transsexual, that I realized from the beginning. As for the journal, I guess people are allowed to keep one in prision? And maybe there's some kind of TV room where Leon watches his Seinfield. And the "therapy sessions" were actually visits. I think everything fell into place very well I agree with this interpretation. I wish they'd shown what the old admin of dark web was? Presumably a guard otherwise the family scene makes little sense? Unless I'm missing something!
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 19:18
|
|
|
I would watch a whole show about The Seinfeld Shanker. Dude was incredible.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 19:31
|
|
|
Elias_Maluco posted:The pyro girl is a transsexual, that I realized from the beginning. As for the journal, I guess people are allowed to keep one in prision? And maybe there's some kind of TV room where Leon watches his Seinfield. And the "therapy sessions" were actually visits. I think everything fell into place very well Plenty of prisons have catalogs where prisoners can order things like TVs. I'm not sure what the prison by prison rules because in some places TVs are banned, but prisoners will have them anyway. Most do have TV rooms. So Eliot keeping a journal and bringing it places wouldn't be out of reason.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 19:32
|
|
|
waitwhatno posted:I really like that they are showing the real consequences of crashing the world economy this season. S1 portrayed the hack as something noble that would set the world free, while this season they are showing how it mostly hosed over normal people and didn't achieve jackshit otherwise. Everyone seems to still have their loans, but now they are also unemployment and homelessness in addition to that. That's how revolutions generally work out, stuff gets much worse for a long time before it starts getting better. Also E-Coin is being rolled out, if it replaces credit cards Evil Corp is going to be even more powerful than before. And they're selling doomsday prep kits to everyone, which is darkly hilarious. Did anyone stop and screencap what's in the E Kit? The taxi ride scene where that came up and the cottage industry of burning trash was mentioned was pretty harrowing in how post-apocalyptic it was. And remember that Joanna got blood thrown at her in the opening sequence. Her screaming silently over the title card was incredible - and yet the scream seemed very much like something she decided to do because she's supposed to scream - and that scene got kind of buried by the rest of the episode being so great. The music sounded like it might be from some movie. Elias_Maluco posted:The pyro girl is a transsexual, that I realized from the beginning. As for the journal, I guess people are allowed to keep one in prision? And maybe there's some kind of TV room where Leon watches his Seinfield. And the "therapy sessions" were actually visits. I think everything fell into place very well Wait wait, I hadn't even stopped to think about this. She's trans and she's being held in a men's prison because, well, America. That's hosed up. Sulphagnist fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Aug 19, 2016 |
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 19:47
|
|
|
The notion of Elliot being a "leader" - I wonder if people will start to see him as a hero figure in the post-E-Corp world(if he's revealed as the mastemind behind the hack, which I'm sure will happen at some point). Or maybe he's just developing a messiah complex.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 20:05
|
|
|
waitwhatno posted:IRC the prison theory came up before the institution theory itt, but it made much less sense overall, so it was dismissed. For example, there is this one pyromaniac, insane looking woman hanging around in the courtyard, Elliot is allowed to have a journal and carry it around with him wherever he goes, Leon is binge watching Seinfeld, Elliot has therapy sessions with his own private therapists, etc.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 20:09
|
|
|
Antti posted:Wait wait, I hadn't even stopped to think about this. She's trans and she's being held in a men's prison because, well, America. That's hosed up. Im not familiar with the american prison laws, but maybe it depends on the state or something? In OITNB we have a trans woman in a womens prision Elias_Maluco fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Aug 19, 2016 |
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 20:12
|
|
|
I figured she was a guard who was for some reason letting Elliot burn his journal. Just because of the standing silently way she was observing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 20:38
|
|
|
Antti posted:Wait wait, I hadn't even stopped to think about this. She's trans and she's being held in a men's prison because, well, America. That's hosed up. waitwhatno posted:I really like that they are showing the real consequences of crashing the world economy this season. S1 portrayed the hack as something noble that would set the world free, while this season they are showing how it mostly hosed over normal people and didn't achieve jackshit otherwise. Everyone seems to still have their loans, but now they are also unemployment and homelessness in addition to that. That's how revolutions generally work out, stuff gets much worse for a long time before it starts getting better. Next season Elliot changes his name to Zero Cool and hACkS tHe PLaNeT~!
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 22:44
|
|
|
Snak posted:I figured she was a guard who was for some reason letting Elliot burn his journal. Just because of the standing silently way she was observing. She didn't burn it, you can order it online now.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 23:30
|
|
|
Chadzok posted:Chess game this episode is same one from Kubrick's 2001. Seeing that apparently every single fictional chess game ever is recorded in full on Wikipedia gives me flashbacks to the old edit wars where women writing articles about articles of clothing in fiction and the real world were finding them deleted for being non-noteworthy while geeky male interests had even higher levels of cruft without issue.
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2016 23:57
|
|
|
Somberbrero posted:I would watch a whole show about The Seinfeld Shanker. Dude was incredible. Hahaha god, I don't know what I love better; that or The Missing Seinfeld character: Ninja Shank 'Cuz. Snak posted:I figured she was a guard who was for some reason letting Elliot burn his journal. Just because of the standing silently way she was observing. That was my interpretation, her stance, silence, lack of interaction with the entire group and Elliot; everything.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 01:42
|
|
|
Paradox Personified posted:That was my interpretation, her stance, silence, lack of interaction with the entire group and Elliot; everything. And it could either be a favor for the Warden (Ray) or Whiterose, who obviously has some interest/influence.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 01:47
|
|
|
Antti posted:Did anyone stop and screencap what's in the E Kit? Here ya go. It is always half-blurred; I could run a sharpen filter if you want. This is the release version. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 01:57
|
|
|
Oh, also it was brought up in this episode, but rewatching the previous episode, I saw that Ahmed's show had signs up for both bitcoin and Ecoin.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 01:59
|
|
|
Antti posted:ait wait, I hadn't even stopped to think about this. She's trans and she's being held in a men's prison because, well, America. That's hosed up.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 02:18
|
|
|
sticklefifer posted:Some people do also transition in prison as a means of survival though. I've read and seen some really disturbing stuff about perceived 'weaker' (or gay) inmates who have been on the receiving end of all kinds of abuse from everyone, so dressing/acting feminine or being someone's girlfriend gets them protection from certain groups they align with, as long as they cooperate for sexual favors. It saves them from worse abuse. Man, I wouldn't call prison 'wives' dressing femme transitioning. It isn't a matter of gender identity.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 04:19
|
|
|
I do have to say that I love the way Season 2 is handling the crisis of the outside world. Less the what and more the how, by not explicitly stating up front "here's everything that's changed" and more dribbling little bits and pieces out into the narrative through background noise and TV news. You can never really say "but what about" because they just never fully explained everything that's going on yet they still show just enough that you're fully invested in the idea that it all could happen and can't really ask for much more. It's just so solid, it's like a character in and of itself. I talk with a particularly critical couple of friends about this show a lot (there is no way I'm repeating some of the poo poo they say in here because it's nit-picky as gently caress) yet I still can't let go of how damned good this show is.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 05:34
|
|
|
There's all sorts of tangents I could go into on American prisons and male-dominated Wikipedia but I think I'll table those in the Mr Robot thread.Paradox Personified posted:Here ya go. It is always half-blurred; I could run a sharpen filter if you want. This is the release version. Thank you. Looks like pretty generic survival stuff like masks, food, water and a stove, but what the hell is the dynamo [undecipherable]? Maybe a crank-powered radio? Oh and 1 Roll of Duct Tape, of course.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 07:37
|
|
|
Looks like Dynamo Flashlight/Radio.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 07:43
|
|
|
Zurui posted:Looks like Dynamo Flashlight/Radio. Yeah, that makes sense. One of these. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 07:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 21:57 |
|
|
Antti posted:Wait wait, I hadn't even stopped to think about this. She's trans and she's being held in a men's prison because, well, America. That's hosed up. She's going to be very popular.
|
|
#
?
Aug 20, 2016 08:33
|
|
