The LP Turnabout: A Documentary on Japanifornian Law with Phoenix Wright

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Araxxor: Oct 20, 2012; My disdain for you all knows no bounds.

When I first played through this game, I couldn't believe that this was actually happening.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 15:57

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# ? Apr 28, 2024 16:00

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
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2014-2018

ProfessorProf posted:

Typo.

There's always one, isn't there.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 15:57

Night10194: Feb 13, 2012; We'll start,
like many good things,
with a bear.

C. Everett Koop posted:

That bird is guilty as a motherfucker and now that we've got it on the stand were gonna get a confession out of it and turn it into a crispy eight-piece.

Hatoful Turnabout!

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:00

Blueberry Pancakes: Aug 18, 2012; Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

This moment should be framed as a testament to everything that Ace Attorney is.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:02

hopeandjoy: Nov 28, 2014

This is the reason Ace Attorney is so good.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:06

Regalingualius: Jan 7, 2012; We gazed into the eyes of madness... And all we found was horny.

This is where we start hitting peak Ace Attorney. :allears:

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:38

legoman727: Mar 13, 2010; by exmarx

Yes, folks, we are cross-examining the parrot. Welcome to Japanifornia.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:49

Shirec: Jul 29, 2009; How to cock it up, Fig. I

I don't know how familiar everyone is with this story, but something like this happened IRL not too long ago.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/06/26/foul-mouthed-parrot-may-be-used-as-evidence-in-murder-trial-prosecutor-says/

quote:

Everyone knows Bud can talk like the parrot that he is.

The question � for one prosecutor, at least � is whether the bird, which may have witnessed a brutal killing, should be allowed to sing like a canary.

Only weeks ago, the idea seemed like an absurd plot twist in a bad Jim Carrey flick from the mid-�90s.

But this week, Newaygo County Prosecuting Attorney Robert Springstead told the Detroit Free Press that authorities are studying the parrot�s words to determine whether the bird�s speech can be considered admissible evidence in a court of law.

�It�s an interesting novelty and it�s been a great opportunity for me to learn about African parrots,� he said. �It is something we are going to be looking at to determine if it�s reliable to use or if it is information we need to prosecute this case.�

Springstead admitted that putting a parrot on the witness stand could get complicated.

He told CBS affiliate WWJ-TV last week that he �highly doubts there is any precedent� for using a bird�s speech as evidence. When a judge asks someone to raise their right hand, he wondered, �to a parrot, are you raising a wing, a foot?�

[Their son was killed. They believe his parrot is telling people who pulled the trigger.]

The prosecutor�s question arrives after Glenna Duram, 48, was charged Thursday with first-degree murder in the May 2015 killing of her husband, Martin Duram, according to NBC affiliate WOOD-TV.

She is being held in Newaygo County Jail without bond, the station reported.

Family members believe Bud, an African gray parrot, may have witnessed the shooting that left Martin Duram dead and his wife severely injured.

They believe this because the bird�s latest phrase � the one he won�t stop shouting at the top of his lungs mimicking his owner�s voice � is a chilling one: �Don�t f�ing shoot!�

Duram�s body was found near his wife, who suffered a gunshot wound to her head but is alive. Although police initially assumed she was a victim of the shooting, police reports obtained by WOOD-TV revealed that she eventually became a suspect in the slaying.

Relatives told the station that they think Martin Duram�s final moments were imprinted in the bird�s memory and that he continues to relive the slaying. They noted that Bud mimicked both the victim and his wife.

�That bird picks up everything and anything, and it�s got the filthiest mouth around,� Duram�s mom, Lillian Duram, told WOOD-TV.

�I personally think he was there, and he remembers it and he was saying it,� Duram�s father, Charles Duram, added.

Bud�s new owner, Duram�s ex-wife, Christina Keller, agrees, telling the station that the bird has a habit of replaying the voices of a man and a woman locked in a fierce disagreement.

�I�m hearing two people in an intense argument,� said Keller, who believes �Don�t f�ing shoot!� were Duram�s final words. �Two people that I know, voices that I recognize.�

�It�s intense,� she added. �When it happens, my house turns cold.�

Police reports reveal that investigators have been asked whether the bird could be used as evidence, according to WOOD-TV, but they don�t show how police responded.

Earlier this month, Springstead told the station that he had heard about the talking parrot but hadn�t reviewed any footage of the bird. He said at the time that he was waiting for Michigan State Police to finish the investigation before deciding whether to file charges, noting that �there�s some evidence to support� the idea that Glenna Duram killed her husband.

�Although the law allows charging on probable cause, I don�t like to do that, especially when you have a very serious case,� Springstead told the station. �When the investigation is done, I like to be satisfied there�s proof beyond a reasonable doubt.�

Duram told police that she remembers nothing of the shooting and regained her memory only once she was in the hospital. She left three suicide notes for relatives before the shooting that she claims she doesn�t remember writing, police records reveal.

�I know for a fact I didn�t kill my husband,� police quoted her as saying.

Doreen Plotkowski, owner of Casa La Parrot in Grand Rapids, told WABC that African gray parrots typically vocalize phrases they�ve heard many times, but the birds also are capable of using words they�ve heard on only a few occasions. Presented with video evidence of the bird using the violent language, Plotkowski told the station that she �definitely� heard the bird mimicking an argument between a man and a woman.

She told the station that she also heard the bird say, �Don�t f�ing shoot.�

�In my mind, it�s something that he�s heard, definitely heard before,� she said. �And if it�s fresh in his mind, he might even say it more now.�

Michael Walsh, a Muskegon, Mich., lawyer, told WOOD-TV that the bird is inadmissible because there�s no way to trace his dirty mouth.

�How did it get there?� Walsh said, referring to Bud�s words. �If there�s no reliable way of making that determination, you can�t rule out that the bird witnessed a homicide or that the bird witnessed something on TV.�

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:54

Shady Amish Terror: Oct 11, 2007; I'm not Amish by choice. 8(

Everything I could have hoped for and more.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 16:58

YggiDee: Sep 12, 2007; WASP CREW

I feel like "I cross examined a parrot to get you out of a murder charge!" is the sort of statement that wins a lot of arguments for the next few years.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 17:21

resurgam40: Jul 22, 2007; Battler, the literal stupidest man on earth. Why are you even here, Battler, why did you come back to this place so you could fuck literally everything up?

Dr. Fetus posted:

When I first played through this game, I couldn't believe that this was actually happening.

I certainly can't believe it myself! But as Shirec pointed out, it isn't like this hasn't happened in the real world...

# ? Sep 8, 2016 17:57

Level Seven: Feb 14, 2013; Wubba dubba dubba
that blew.; Megamarm

This scene. THIS scene. No fan of the series can every forget this set of shenanigans. Also,

Mors Rattus posted:

: But you weren't arrested until this morning!
: Why didn't you go back to the caretaker's shack?

I think a portrait got mixed up there?

# ? Sep 8, 2016 19:09

FoolyCharged: Oct 11, 2012; Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

At last we have the true villain of this case on stand! Polly, your time of judgement is at hand! The truth will be found!

# ? Sep 8, 2016 19:38

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

Level Seven posted:

This scene. THIS scene. No fan of the series can every forget this set of shenanigans. Also,

I think a portrait got mixed up there?

Fixed.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 19:45

Blueberry Pancakes: Aug 18, 2012; Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

Shirec posted:

I don't know how familiar everyone is with this story, but something like this happened IRL not too long ago.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/06/26/foul-mouthed-parrot-may-be-used-as-evidence-in-murder-trial-prosecutor-says/

I think I asked the AskAceAttorney blog about that once.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 19:53

Stephen9001: Oct 28, 2013

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

I think I asked the AskAceAttorney blog about that once.

Did you get a response? If so, would it be possible to post it here? Or would it be too much of a monumental pain in the rear end to find it?

I can have moments of... eccentricity and sometimes be quite curious about things. Please forgive me if I do something foolish or rude.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 22:00

Haifisch: Nov 13, 2010; Objection! I object! That was... objectionable!; Taco Defender

Mors Rattus posted:

: ... The proescution... is ready.

Typo.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 23:10

EponymousMrYar: Jan 4, 2015; The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

No one likes the scene leading up to this because of plot fiat, but that same plot fiat is what leads to this scene.

Should have watched what you said Von Karma!

Also poor Maya, still electrically charged from being tazed. She's a very good conductive medium it seems.

# ? Sep 8, 2016 23:10

Shady Amish Terror: Oct 11, 2007; I'm not Amish by choice. 8(

EponymousMrYar posted:

Also poor Maya, still electrically charged from being tazed. She's a very good conductive medium it seems.

Boo this person. BOO.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 01:52

Orange Fluffy Sheep: Jul 26, 2008; Bad EXP received

Parrot cross-examination makes up for the evidence room thing.

I'll just pretend von Karma flipped the light switch and stole the letter super-fast with his Jedi powers but dropped the bullet in the process

# ? Sep 9, 2016 03:12

TheObserver: Nov 7, 2012

It would have made more sense to have Phoenix and Maya confront von Karma over stealing DL-6 evidence from the police files, him tasing them, and then finding the letter sticking out of Phoenix's coat and taking it.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 03:17

Mraagvpeine: Nov 4, 2014; I won this avatar on a technicality this thick.

Was the anime faithful in adapting this part?

# ? Sep 9, 2016 03:28

Malah: May 18, 2015

The most I knew about Phoenix Wright before this thread is that he objects a lot and cravats = total prick. I now say:

HOLY poo poo. :allears:

C. Everett Koop posted:

That bird is guilty as a motherfucker and now that we've got it on the stand were gonna get a confession out of it and turn it into a crispy eight-piece.

KFC Christmas Special right there.

Malah fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Sep 9, 2016

# ? Sep 9, 2016 06:00

Blueberry Pancakes: Aug 18, 2012; Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

Stephen9001 posted:

Did you get a response? If so, would it be possible to post it here? Or would it be too much of a monumental pain in the rear end to find it?

I just made a joke asking if that was real life DL-6 and they posted an image of Polly from the anime.

Mraagvpeine posted:

Was the anime faithful in adapting this part?

The anime did the parrot cross-examination yes.

The taser scene was dropped in favor of a very stupid scene where they get Larry to disguise himself as Edgeworth while the real deal snuck out of the courthouse and helped Maya break into von Karma's office.

Blueberry Pancakes fucked around with this message at 07:11 on Sep 9, 2016

# ? Sep 9, 2016 07:09

dotchan: Feb 28, 2008; I wanna get a Super Saiyan Mohawk when I grow up!

The Law is a Donkey, a blog about creative liberties taken with (mostly U.S.) law in fiction (with a specific focus on comic books), discusses current U.S. laws for animal witnesses (tl;dr - no, but they may be used as evidence, though you'd better be ready to prove that the evidence is sound enough to stand muster in court and a judge is usually not tolerant to actually bringing an animal into court).

ETA: I believe there are some special exceptions for police dogs, who are considered uniformed officers for the purposes of "testifying" in court, but I am not a lawyer.

dotchan fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Sep 9, 2016

# ? Sep 9, 2016 15:33

inflatablefish: Oct 24, 2010

dotchan posted:

ETA: I believe there are some special exceptions for police dogs, who are considered uniformed officers for the purposes of "testifying" in court, but I am not a lawyer.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 20:34

Reinbach: Jan 28, 2009

I really want cornered to play when you catch the parrot in a contradiction.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 21:51

beru04: May 4, 2013; Stop making me realise things.

This pretty much is the moment where you decide if you're on board with AA from hereon, or not. The other cases have been gearing you up with the court/evidence gathering mechanics and now we see what these games truly are. Batshit bonkers.

Buckle up, or get off at the next station.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 23:15

Leif.: Mar 27, 2005; Son of the Defender
Formerly Diplomaticus/SWATJester

How does the old man remember he used to be a chemical engineer....

# ? Sep 9, 2016 23:38

MightyPretenders: Feb 21, 2014

Leif. posted:

How does the old man remember he used to be a chemical engineer....

It's a lie he came up with on the spur of the moment. He may or may not actually have burned off his fingerprints.

# ? Sep 9, 2016 23:44

Regalingualius: Jan 7, 2012; We gazed into the eyes of madness... And all we found was horny.

I mean, it's the perfect Catch-22.

"I worked in a chemical plant and burned my fingerprints off. Can you prove that didn't happen without knowing who I am?"

# ? Sep 10, 2016 00:35

Glazius: Jul 22, 2007; Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.; Clapping Larry

I'll tell you this much, von Karma sure as hell wasn't planning for a parrot in the courtroom.

He's certainly not going to pull out a bag of saltines from under the prosecutor's bench or anything.

...would he actually kill the parrot to shut it up? I mean, it's not murder.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 13:50

Double Plus Undead: Dec 24, 2010

Karma would. I'd say it's tampering with the evidence but apparently that's legal here.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 14:10

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

Case 4 - Turnabout Goodbyes
Trial (Day 4) - Part 2

: That's... quite a bird. Please tell us your name?

: "..."

: Name!

: "..."

: The witness is ignoring me.

: (It must hurt... to be ignored by a bird.)

: Ahem. Very well, witness...

: Who is your owner? Please, er... testify for us.

: Hmm...

: Certainly the most concise testimony we've had so far.

: Very well, begin your cross-examination.

: Right...

: What are you going to do, Nick?

: ... I... I don't know! What do we do, Maya?

: Hmm...

: Witness! You can't just say "hello" and expect us to get anywhere!

: I want you to testify!

: Maya, you talk to her.

: (Remember... two days ago...)

: *squawk* "Don't forget DL-6!" *squawk*

: (That will prove that the caretaker had something to do with DL-6!)

: Um, Polly? Have we forgotten something?

: "... ... Hello! Hello!" *squawk*

: ...! That's not what you're supposed to say! Forgot! Something we forgot!

: "Hello! Hello!" *squawk*

: Uh oh. It's not working, Nick! She won't say it!

: (This is ridiculous! Why won't she say it!?)

: Tsk tsk tsk... Something the matter, Mr. Wright?

: (Wait... Don't tell me von Karma expected this! He couldn't have retrained the parrot... could he!? Did he train her not to respond when we asked if we'd forgotten anything!?)

: Witness, you're here to speak! You must speak to me!

: "..."

: Frankly, I can't believe that you're speaking to the parrot.

: W-well...

: I guess we should try to get some information out of her!

: We need to show the judge that her owner is Mr. Yogi!

And loop. But what if we tried another tack?

: (Maybe I should get her to say her name?)

: Polly! Polly! What's your name?

: "Pol-ly! Pol-ly!" *squawk*

: Mr. Wright... I think we've established that this parrot is named "Polly."

: Uh, well, I guess it doesn't really have anything to do with that, no.

: Hmm...

: Please only ask questions pertaining to the matter at hand.

: Very well, witness. Continue your testimony.

Obviously, this is not correct.

: Yes it does!

: !!!

: Hah! Fascinating!

: You claim that the parrot's name will prove her owner's identity? Then show us this proof!

: Nick! Don't you think you're taking the bluffing a little too far?

: Listen. We're not here to answer the question of "who is the caretaker." We're here to prove that he is Yanni Yogi! All we have to do is tie the name "Polly" to Yogi!

: Your Honor.

You may want to go back and read the case file from when we found it.

: The DL-6 Case file?

: That's quite a large file you have there! Which page is this "proof" on, then?

: Show us, or stop wasting our time!

: Hmm...

: Very well. Mr. Wright, please show us the page.

All the wrong answers for this section are essentially identical, so I'll only show this one.

: It's on the "Case Summary" page!

: ... I'm sorry... But I don't see anything here that relates to the name "Polly."

: At least, not on this page.

: Hmph! A bluff! As I expected!

: I'm afraid I have to deny your claim, Mr. Wright.

: The witness may continue.

: It's on the "Suspect Data" page!

: ...?

: This page has all the information about Yanni Yogi! Right after he was arrested, his fiancee committed suicide, see?

: Hmm... Indeed, it does say that, yes.

: What was his fiancee's name?

: "Polly Jenkins"... "Polly"!

: Exactly, Your Honor! He remembered the name of his fiancee who committed suicide.

: That's why he named his parrot after her!

: I see! I guess that is possible.

: Bah! A mere coincidence, that's all! My granddaughter has a dog she calls "Phoenix."

: Well, Mr. Phoenix Wright? Does this make you my granddaughter's fiancee!?

: Hmm... Indeed.

: Alone, it is a little weak for evidence in a murder trial.

: We would need some other corroborating evidence...

: (Where am I going to find that!?)

: Nick! We're getting closer!

: One more! If we can just get one more piece of evidence...!

: (Right... but what?)

: Hmph!

: Very well, witness. You may continue.

We only have one option left - we're going to have to ask the parrot about that safe code.

: (Maybe I'll get her to say the number of that safe...)

: Huh? The safe? Why?

: Let's just try to get her to say anything, okay?

: Polly! What was the number of the safe in the shack?

: "1228... 1228..."

: ... My, what a reckless parrot.

: Well, Mr. Wright?

: Actually it does! That's why I had her say it!

: Hah! Ridiculous! How can the number to a safe tell us who the caretaker is?

: Show us your proof!

: The DL-6 Case File? What is this obsession you have with that case?

: Mr. Wright.

: It's on the "Case Summary" page!

: The Case... Summary?

: Specifically, the date on which the DL-6 Incident occurred!

: The date of the incident? December 28...?

: Why, that's today's date. Fifteen years ago!

: And the number on that safe is 1228!

: Ah!

: He used the date of the DL-6 Incident as the number for his safe, Your Honor!

: That's how important that date was to him!

: I see... It certainly is an interesting coincidence. People often do set their secret numbers to dates.

: Bah! This is not tangible proof! I set my ATM card's number to "0001" because I'm number one!

: This has nothing to do with a date! Nothing!

: That's enough!

: I think we've reached a conclusion here.

: This is mere coincidence, that's all!

: True, that is a possibility.

: However, two coincidences at the same time seems more like a "pattern" to me.

: Wh... what are you saying!?

: Summon the caretaker of the boat shop. Immediately!

: Witness... Tell us your name.

: Wait! This witness, he doesn't remember...

: ...!

: I've accomplished what I wanted to do. I'm done.

: Nick! He looks totally different!

: This is the real Yogi, I think. Finally. He's been acting feeble to hide his true identity. Acting... for 15 years!

: W-well...! Let me ask you again.

: Please state your name for the court!

: My name... is Yanni Yogi. 15 years ago, I served as a bailiff in this very court.

: Order! Order!

: Yanni Yogi! So was it you who killed Robert Hammond...? And tried to frame Miles Edgeworth for his death?

: ... Yes. It was me. I did it. ...

: They put me on the witness stand 15 years ago... Robert Hammond... he said I was mentally unsound.

: So... I pretended to have brain damage...

: I was innocent, really! But he didn't believe me!

: We won the trial... But I lost everything. I lost my job, my fiancee, my social standing... ... Then, this year, 15 years later...

: The plan was written out in careful detail. It was a plan for me to take my revenge on the people who ruined my life. I didn't care who had sent it. I thought this was my chance, after 15 years, this was it! Finally, a chance to have my revenge on Robert Hammond and Miles Edgeworth... I have no regrets.

: W-wait a moment! Revenge... against Miles Edgeworth? What do you mean?

: I'm not at liberty to speak on that matter. Why don't you ask Mr. Edgeworth yourself?

: von Karma... Where is Mr. Yogi?

: Under arrest, Your Honor. I saw no room for error in his confession.

: Then... the defendant, Miles Edgeworth is...

: Innocent. In this case, at least.

: Hmm.

: Very well. Will the defendant please take the stand?

: There are a few mysteries left unsolved.

: Still, you are cleared of suspicion for this particular case. So I would like to pass judgment on the murder of Mr. Robert Hammond.

: Any objections?

: ...

: (I don't believe it! Why isn't von Karma saying anything?)

: Very well. This court finds the defendant, Mr. Miles Edgeworth...

: That is all. The court is adjourned!

: D-did someone just say "objection"?

: (It wasn't von Karma...! Wait, but that means...) No...

: Your Honor.

: Wh-what do you mean?

: As we have heard, Yanni Yogi killed Robert Hammond in revenge. But, revenge for what?

: Nick! Edgeworth is going to confess! He's going to say he's guilty! He's going to tell them he was the murderer in the DL-6 Incident! He's going to tell them he killed his own dad!

: The judgment has already been passed! I object to Edgeworth's outburst...

: Didn't something like this happen yesterday, too? I believe a certain witness raised an objection after a guilty verdict was passed.

: (That would be Larry...)

: We must hear this new argument!

: We must hear Miles Edgeworth!

: He's right. We have a duty to hear Mr. Edgeworth out.

Or...

: (No... I'm sure Edgeworth thought about this one long and hard. This isn't my place to interfere!)

: Nick, are you sure!?

: There's nothing we can do about it. This is his problem, now.

Next time: Convergence.

Mors Rattus fucked around with this message at 04:10 on Sep 11, 2016

# ? Sep 10, 2016 14:51

FoolyCharged: Oct 11, 2012; Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Glazius posted:

I'll tell you this much, von Karma sure as hell wasn't planning for a parrot in the courtroom.

quote:

(Wait... Don't tell me von Karma expected this! He couldn't have retrained the parrot... could he!? Did he train her not to respond when we asked if we'd forgotten anything!?)

Surprise!
The number one rule for this series is that nothing is ever so insane that it can't be true.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 15:01

Stephen9001: Oct 28, 2013

FoolyCharged posted:

Surprise!
The number one rule for this series is that nothing is ever so insane that it can't be true.

Yup, and it is glorious. Except for the times it's just straight up dumb.

I can have moments of... eccentricity and sometimes be quite curious about things. Please forgive me if I do something foolish or rude.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 16:05

Araxxor: Oct 20, 2012; My disdain for you all knows no bounds.

The thing that made me realize what Ace Attorney truly is wasn't the fact that the parrot was brought in for cross examination. It was that von Karma actually expected that to happen and retrained the parrot.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 16:11

NikkolasKing: Apr 3, 2010

Mors Rattus posted:

: Bah! This is not tangible proof! I set my ATM card's number to "0001" because I'm number one!

Von Karma will pretty much always be the Best Character in this series to me.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 16:22

HenryEx: Mar 25, 2009; ...your cybernetic implants, the only beauty in that meat you call "a body"...; Grimey Drawer

von Karma is usually extremely thorough. There's a reason for his famed perfect record. Dude doesn't take any chances.

Look at this. He knew this would happen. He's been training Edgeworth for a long time, and knows exactly how he ticks.

# ? Sep 10, 2016 16:37

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# ? Apr 28, 2024 16:00

Blueberry Pancakes: Aug 18, 2012; Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

Mors Rattus posted:

: Bah! A mere coincidence, that's all! My granddaughter has a dog she calls "Phoenix."
: Well, Mr. Phoenix Wright? Does this make you my granddaughter's fiancee!?

This exchange always makes me laugh. Every time. :allears:

# ? Sep 10, 2016 17:06

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Let's Play! > The LP Turnabout: A Documentary on Japanifornian Law with Phoenix Wright

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