Comrade Gorbash posted:

Anyways, the SLAM is pretty much the top of the heap for early Cold War super-science, and came pretty close to getting built.

Nebakenezzer posted:

I never really thought about this before, but how did Pluto 1) shield its electronic innards from all the radiation spewing, and 2) how did it receive instructions? I always thought the radioactivity would preclude receiving radio signals, and the whole SLAM thing was just pre-programmed.

"Some unsourced weblog posted:

Because the SLAM reactor would operate at high radiation levels without shielding, finding suitable electronics that could operate even for the few hours lifetime required was a daunting task. Careful selection and substitution of insulation materials, potting compounds, and semiconductors in a full complement of missile electronics such as guidance and control, telemetry and instrumentation was made with industry assistance. The largest radiation effects test ever conducted took place in 1964 in the Air Force’s NARF facility at General Dynamics under SLAM Program sponsorship. It was demonstrated that suitable system electronics were or could be made available for the SLAM mission.

Comrade Gorbash posted:

The exhaust from this thing was extremely dirty with fission by products.

Comrade Gorbash posted:

The ultimate in Cold War 50s super-science insanity in aerospace is Project Pluto/SLAM, and it's really only rivaled by Project Orion. Even the WS-125 was a lesser example of volcano lair super-villainy.

SLAM stands for Supersonic Low Altitude Missile, and the idea was to build an intercontinental nuclear powered cruise missile. This seemed like a smart way to solve the key problem of nuclear powered aircraft - keeping the crew alive. No crew, no need for bio-shielding. In fact, in the twisted logic of the Cold War, this was a benefit since it made the weapon even more dangerous to the target.

It would have used nuclear ramjets - a pretty simple idea. The motion of the missile pushed air into the intake, where it was heated by a fission reactor, the air would expand due to heat, and get pushed out the back of the engine at high speed for thrust. When I say heat, I mean a lot of heat, because the concept requires pushing the air through the heart of the reactor. The exhaust from this thing was extremely dirty with fission by products. Such an engine would have provided effectively unlimited range and the ability to loiter, waiting for targeting instructions, for months on end.

The mission profile would have looked like this: launch it using conventional rocket boosters in order to get it to cruising speed, when the ramjet actually gets enough air to work (and, incidentally, to get the loving thing as far away from you as possible before you lit up the engine from hell).

Once the reactor was made critical - at which point only a few species of exotic fungus and bacteria could come within a 100m of it and live - the missile went into cruise mode and flew a holding pattern until further instructions came in, or proceeded directly to target. Once the attack run began, it would drop down to treetop level to get under Soviet radar and make a super-sonic dash to its primary targets. And by super-sonic, we're talking at least Mach 2+.

Now, they considered simply packing a single big warhead into it, but where was the fun in that? So instead the SLAM would carry multiple traditional atomic bombs and operate as a unmanned bomber. After hitting its primary six to ten targets with bombing runs, the missile would still be in fine working order. So the designers proposed that it be put into low-altitude circling patterns over populated areas. The shock wave from the thing would have knocked small structures flat on its own.

Eventually, weeks later, it would finally run out of power and crash. Two equally "desirable" options for end-of-life were envisaged. One, it would make a final dash to a target and slam into it at top speed. Two, it would simply loiter over populated areas until it went down, at which point you've got a mini-Chernobyl literally falling out of the sky. And the reactor would stay critical - producing radiation at lethal levels - for months even after it reached a power mode too low for flight operations. Even if you could get near it, there was no mechanism for shutting it off short of disassembling it.

This all sounds pretty ambitious, and the technical challenges were high, but they were a lot less daunting than, say, putting a man on the moon. By 1964, the US had successfully tested a nuclear ramjet operating at full power for five minutes. At which point the Pentagon got cold feet, deemed the weapon "too provocative," and cancelled the project. Considering this was an era where high ranking officers seriously suggested launching first strikes on the Soviet Union, in public, it gives you some idea of the monster they had on their hands.

Anyways, the SLAM is pretty much the top of the heap for early Cold War super-science, and came pretty close to getting built.

Spaced God posted:

Nah, it was in Teterboro, NJ. They got the nose section (cockpit + first class) of an 880 that was rotting in Atlantic City in 2012 and just opened it up to the public (mostly). Turns out that thing was S/N 2 or 3 and was a preproduction model used to demo to airlines before being sold to TWA. We even think Hughes flew it, given how hands-on he was.

Since I'm a tiny baby, I only came on in like 2014 and since I was primarily a tour guide I only did stuff like cleaning the gutted out interior and helping people who knew what they were doing. It got up to like 130 in there in August, so I can't imagine how bad it'd be in the Mojave!

It's got TWA livery, all the original interior redone (though the port seats were removed in favor of display cases) and I think we ended up getting the flight engineer's panel to light up. I can't find any photos of it right now since I'm travelling, but if you give me till the second week of January I'll be in town and I'll snap a few.

Phanatic posted:

I've always seen that claimed, but it doesn't make sense to me.

The engine design was actually prototyped and tested. The fuel elements were HEU in a matrix of individual ceramic fuel elements. The only reason why there'd be fission products in the exhaust is if the fuel elements started to disintegrate. Granted, that was an issue with the solid-core fission rockets we've built, but it wasn't a design strength and if your fuel elements started falling apart and dispersing in the exhaust stream then the missile's not going to be able to keep flying around for very long.

CommieGIR posted:

The fuel rods and cladding were strong enough, its just that an open reactor design like that will spew out radio-isotopes.

Phanatic posted:

Ah, gotcha. Looking further the fuel elements weren't HEU wrapped in ceramic, they were a homogeneous ceramic of uranium oxide, beryllium oxide, and zirconium oxide, so for any fissions that happen at the surface of a fuel element the fission fragments are just going to spit out into the airflow. Neat.

MikeCrotch posted:

My favourite aspect of Project Pluto is that the plan for dealing with contamination of the launch crew and the initial flight over the continental US was "I guess not giving a gently caress"

Phanatic posted:

Ah, gotcha. Looking further the fuel elements weren't HEU wrapped in ceramic, they were a homogeneous ceramic of uranium oxide, beryllium oxide, and zirconium oxide, so for any fissions that happen at the surface of a fuel element the fission fragments are just going to spit out into the airflow. Neat.

Platystemon posted:

I consider Casaba Howitzer more insane.

Let’s put a nuclear shaped charge in orbit. Every orbit, we have the opportunity to strike, with no warning and no countermeasures.

You can’t afford not to nuke a country when they pursue a weapon like that.

ausgezeichnet posted:

I remember seeing those two 880's sitting on the field at ACY while I was flying for a commuter back in the early 90's. I would have given my left nut to go poke around in them. Is this cockpit at the Aviation Hall of Fame by GAMA at TEB? I'm there probably twice a week and I'll have to make the trip over to the museum (and hit the Dassault store).

HookedOnChthonics posted:

Why rain nuclear fire when you can rain men instead?


"Yeah just brace your retro rocket against your chest to deorbit nbd"

Platystemon posted:

I consider Casaba Howitzer more insane.

Let’s put a nuclear shaped charge in orbit. Every orbit, we have the opportunity to strike, with no warning and no countermeasures.

You can’t afford not to nuke a country when they pursue a weapon like that.

Nice piece of fish posted:

Thanks for this, I'd never even heard about that but that just gave me the biggest scifi nerd boner. I loving love this stuff, I'm sad the implications from this hasn't been picked up by sci-fi authors like James Corey (author of the Expanse series).

Platystemon posted:

The Expanse at least has H‐bombs.

They’re absent in a lot of sci‐fi for no discernible reason, even when they would dominate whatever silly tech the authors want to wank over.

Of course, nuclear shaped charges would poo poo all over pretty much everything.

P.S.: You may just being using a liberal definition of the word “author”, but “James S. A. Corey” isn’t a real person, or an alias of one. It’s a pen name used by a two‐man team.

HookedOnChthonics posted:

personally i've always been a cheek man







F-8As also had that most amazingly toyetic of early jet era accoutrements, the pop-out FFAR tray. (The F-102 had them built into the payload bay doors because hey, why not?)


Now I'm on a weird stores kick. Off the top of my head, there's:
*The A-5 stores train which was mentioned recently
*Lightning overwing drop tanks
*Late-model F-101 rotating missile bay which replaced the guns

Any other noteworthy examples?

Platystemon posted:

The Expanse at least has H‐bombs.

They’re absent in a lot of sci‐fi for no discernible reason, even when they would dominate whatever silly tech the authors want to wank over.

Of course, nuclear shaped charges would poo poo all over pretty much everything.

P.S.: You may just being using a liberal definition of the word “author”, but “James S. A. Corey” isn’t a real person, or an alias of one. It’s a pen name used by a two‐man team.

Nice piece of fish posted:

I wasn't actually, I honestly didn't know that. Then again, I read books and don't give a drat about authors lives generally. It'd be great if the one dude was named James and the other one was named Corey.

I don't mind that so much as long as quality books are written. Those two guys are nowhere near Peter F. Hamilton yet anyway. At least his good books.

Edit: Damnit, it isn't. They're called Daniel and Ty. Missed opportunity.

Nice piece of fish posted:

I assume most of the drama with the whole investigation was more than a little overexaggerated.

Wikipedia posted:

Tom Hanks told the Associated Press that Sullenberger had reviewed an early draft of the script, which identified NTSB investigators by their real names, and asked that these be removed.

Cat Mattress posted:

It was completely made-up whole cloth, because 1. a movie requires some conflict and there was no villain in that story, so one had to be created, and 2. the director (Clint Eastwood) is a rabid libertarian.

I especially like this part:

Nice piece of fish posted:

^^^The Neutronium Alchemist? Absolute sci fi bullshit of the highest order and highly entertaining.

hobbesmaster posted:

Commonwealth and void trilogy get even sillier.

Cat Mattress posted:

It was completely made-up whole cloth, because 1. a movie requires some conflict and there was no villain in that story, so one had to be created, and 2. the director (Clint Eastwood) is a rabid libertarian.

I especially like this part:

CommieGIR posted:

Dune had nukes (stone burners).

simplefish posted:

Let's play "Tom Hanks goes flying in this movie"

Sully
Cast Away
Apollo 13
The Terminal

Maybe he should stay on the ground

mlmp08 posted:

Boats not working out great either:
Saving Private Ryan
That movie where he's the Maersk Alabama captain.

joat mon posted:

Joe vs the Volcano

HookedOnChthonics posted:

Now I'm on a weird stores kick. Off the top of my head, there's:
*The A-5 stores train which was mentioned recently
*Lightning overwing drop tanks
*Late-model F-101 rotating missile bay which replaced the guns

Any other noteworthy examples?

joat mon posted:

Dragnet

Syrian Lannister posted:

hobbesmaster posted:

Trains are ok though.

MikeCrotch posted:

Why does the South Dakota Air National Guard need jet planes with rocket pods

Who are they going to shoot, protestors?

Platystemon posted:

The Expanse at least has H‐bombs.

They’re absent in a lot of sci‐fi for no discernible reason, even when they would dominate whatever silly tech the authors want to wank over.

Of course, nuclear shaped charges would poo poo all over pretty much everything.

P.S.: You may just being using a liberal definition of the word “author”, but “James S. A. Corey” isn’t a real person, or an alias of one. It’s a pen name used by a two‐man team.