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Rand Brittain posted:IX is probably a pretty good entry to summarize the franchise as a whole, or VI if you want to go a bit further back into the classic era. A guy with a preference for gameplay would probably not care for slow-as-gently caress IX. You can't go wrong with VII.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:26
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Jack Trades posted:I have never played a Final Fantasy game that wasn't FFT/FFTA or FFXIV and I want to try one of the mainline games. Lightning Returns, 10, 10-2, 5
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Dec 30, 2016 21:28
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Hackan Slash posted:I'm inspired to play Lightening Returns, because I hear it's similar to Valkyrie Profile. Is that true? How much will I miss out in by never playing any of the 13 games? Is just jumping in a bad idea? LR is probably the best standalone game in the trilogy, and ironically probably makes more sense if you haven't played the originals. Honestly, just go for it, and if you enjoy it then consider giving 13 and 13-2 a try at some point.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:28
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DoubleCakes posted:I've probably played through FF4 ten times since first playing it back in 2002 and only now am I getting to TAY. Loving it so far. The story isn't Pulitzer material but as someone who knows FF4 inside-out it's very affecting. Exploring old areas that have had their level design "remixed" is fun. You're such a pure and good person, godspeed. Let me know what you think when you get to the late-game.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:30
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Jack Trades posted:I have never played a Final Fantasy game that wasn't FFT/FFTA or FFXIV and I want to try one of the mainline games. you should play the 10 remaster
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Dec 30, 2016 21:33
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I'm playing through Lightning Returns blind, and it could definitely do with some indicators that say "don't loving go this way, you will get wrecked"
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Dec 30, 2016 21:34
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Jack Trades posted:I have never played a Final Fantasy game that wasn't FFT/FFTA or FFXIV and I want to try one of the mainline games. Any game is pretty much a good starting point, honestly. Gameplay-wise the strongest FF is probably 5, though pretty much every FF since then has at least some aspect of engaging gameplay. I'd just go for whichever game looks most interesting to you, they're all completely different from each other in most aspects which is part of the charm of the series.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:42
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Hackan Slash posted:I'm inspired to play Lightening Returns, because I hear it's similar to Valkyrie Profile. Is that true? How much will I miss out in by never playing any of the 13 games? Is just jumping in a bad idea? It's mostly similar to VP in theme. The end of the world is upon us, and you've been given a mission from God to gather as many souls as possible before the final day. For gameplay, it's almost nothing alike.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:46
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Seconding FFV.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:52
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bloodychill posted:To echo "there are multiple ways to be hard," requiring mastery and in depth analysis and understanding of arcane game systems which depend on understanding of mathematical formulas (albeit simple ones) and understanding job ability synergy and strategic placement of units and making use of the CT system and doing threat management are all forms of difficulty for people to whom these things don't come naturally. Don't assume these things are simple tasks and equivocate the game to tic tac toe or something. It's naive at best and dishonest and disrespectful at worst. You're absolutely right, but telling them that their hack isn't hard is a much better way to annoy 1.3 fans than telling them it isn't fun.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:52
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Actually, you know what I regret most about that post? I forgot to mention the DS Valkyrie Profile. That was a game that knew how to be hard without just overturning enemies.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:53
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I'd say V or VI would be good depending on how much of FF XIV you've played through. Both will have chunks that made their way into XIV. If you like Dragon Age I would give the FF XII remaster a try when it comes out too. It takes place in the same world as FFT a millennia or two in the past, flavored FF XIV heavily and the main gameplay system is Dragon Age's npc programming system kicked up a ton.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:54
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FFT 1.3 is both hard and unfun, it doesn't need to be either/or or even have any causality  It's not unfun because it's hard, it's unfun because the type of gameplay it encourages is tedious and frustrating even if you're doing it right.
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Dec 30, 2016 21:56
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I will stand by the claim that difficulty-by-obscurity is at best a lovely way to add difficulty though. Once you know the magic words "downed units continue to accrue CT at the normal rate" 1.3 presents you with very few interesting decisions, which is what I was trying to get at. You just grind out slow, incremental advantages.
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Dec 30, 2016 22:01
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Fister Roboto posted:Long War is harder than vanilla XCOM, but it also gives you a lot more options and tools to overcome the challenges it presents. 1.3 is just harder by throwing things with better gear and levels at you. It would be like encountering mutons on the first mission of XCOM while you still have rookies with basic rifles. Great post. Can you suggest any strategy RPGs playable on a handheld device that would give a Long War like experience (hard but provides rich content for people to master so they can play better to deal with the difficulty)?
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Dec 30, 2016 22:22
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Cyclomatic posted:Great post. someone said earlier Valkyrie Profile for the DS and it's actually true. That game is designed with the idea that every fight you're in is weighted against you not just because of level design but because you're obligated post-wise to not just win but win big. So you either have to learn how to master the game's mechanics or take advantage of a built-in handicap which makes a stage much easier in exchange for permanently killiing a party member and in turn changing the course of the story. (There are 3 endings total based off how kill-crazy you are and getting all 3 unlocks a bonus dungeon with more content/bosses/character.)
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Dec 30, 2016 22:26
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ImpAtom posted:someone said earlier Valkyrie Profile for the DS and it's actually true. That game is designed with the idea that every fight you're in is weighted against you not just because of level design but because you're obligated post-wise to not just win but win big. So you either have to learn how to master the game's mechanics or take advantage of a built-in handicap which makes a stage much easier in exchange for permanently killiing a party member and in turn changing the course of the story. (There are 3 endings total based off how kill-crazy you are and getting all 3 unlocks a bonus dungeon with more content/bosses/character.) I need to go back and finish Covenant of the Plume someday. I've just been so caught up with VLR and FFXV.
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Dec 30, 2016 22:28
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Rand Brittain posted:IX is probably a pretty good entry to summarize the franchise as a whole, or VI if you want to go a bit further back into the classic era. Definitely not IX with those slooooooow battles, unless you're playing the PC version with the speed up buttion. I'd say VI or VII, even if VII's art style might turn some people off.
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Dec 30, 2016 22:28
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That also tires into its narrative: the game represents good and evil not by giving you a Bioware style kill orphans/save orphans choice but by baking the temptation right into the gameplay loop. It's real good.
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Dec 30, 2016 22:33
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Reiterpallasch posted:That also tires into its narrative: the game represents good and evil not by giving you a Bioware style kill orphans/save orphans choice but by baking the temptation right into the gameplay loop. It's real good. Yeah, VP:CotP is one of the extremely few games I can think of where 'moral choices' actually work because they are coherent, make sense within both story and gameplay, and have actual reasonable consequences and change the game enough that you're justified going through multiple times to see every outcome rather than "90% the same, different ending."
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Dec 30, 2016 22:36
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ImpAtom posted:Yeah, VP:CotP is one of the extremely few games I can think of where 'moral choices' actually work because they are coherent, make sense within both story and gameplay, and have actual reasonable consequences and change the game enough that you're justified going through multiple times to see every outcome rather than "90% the same, different ending." Only issue is CotP suffers from the snowball effect pretty bad. If you can get the best sin rewards the items are so good you'll keep getting more and won't need to plume. If you don't get the sin quota the super powerful enemies start showing up and pretty much need to plume especially because you don't get the good items. I think it would have been better if the sin enemies showed up if you got the reward.
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Dec 30, 2016 22:54
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Omega Weapon looks so tiny here, it's the same size as a chocobo   Anyway, what's the recommended level for fighting Almighty Shinra?
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Dec 30, 2016 23:56
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Reiterpallasch posted:I will stand by the claim that difficulty-by-obscurity is at best a lovely way to add difficulty though. That's not obscure, that's a basic gameplay mechanic... Txn posted:Anyway, what's the recommended level for fighting Almighty Shinra? 50+ is good, but the more levels the better, if only to help you outpace his auto-regen. gigglefeimer fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Dec 31, 2016 |
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Dec 31, 2016 01:49
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Jack Trades posted:I have never played a Final Fantasy game that wasn't FFT/FFTA or FFXIV and I want to try one of the mainline games. I'd second V or VI depending on what you want. V is more gameplay over story, and does have the job system you're probably familiar with, but it's also much harder. V is really designed with the intention that by the second half of the game you've really learned what you're doing with the job system, and the endgame is borderline-impossible if you haven't figured out some good combos. GBA version is the best choice for both; the versions on Steam and iOS are the same mechanically but are really ugly ports. For the others... I'm gonna do real quick overviews for how good they are to start with and what version to go for if you do. 1: Really old and basically cut-rate D&D, and the remakes can't cover that, but I started with it and I'm still here so it can't be all bad. All versions since the GBA version are basically good, the NES one is hilariously brokeass. 2: Has a really weird, Elder Scrolls-esque advancement system that didn't entirely work out. GBA onwards again, because they rebalanced the advancement to not suck at that point. 3: Probably the worst on an objective scale, but it's still not bad. DS/Steam version is probably worse balance-wise than the NES original, but does bother to tell an actual story, so there's that. 4: A lot more story-focused than you'd probably want, but uses that to be interesting about encounters at least. All versions are pretty alright, but the 3D one's easier to get these days. 7: Acceptable and a lot of fun if you can accept the sheer 1997-itude of it. The original's still fine, we don't know enough about the remake to judge its quality. 8: Pick again. 9: I haven't played it, but it's apparently pretty solid. Steam version has some good steamlining options. 10: Actually got a pretty good story and enjoyable character advancement. The HD remake is bundled with X-2, which I hear is alright. 12: I wouldn't start here, but it's definitely still a good game. The HD remake's coming sometime early 2017. 13: Don't start here. Or end here, honestly.
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Dec 31, 2016 02:17
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Jack Trades posted:I have never played a Final Fantasy game that wasn't FFT/FFTA or FFXIV and I want to try one of the mainline games. I usually recommend the FFX HD remaster for newcomers. The base game is fully featured and the remaster comes with QoL upgrades.
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Dec 31, 2016 02:22
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gigglefeimer posted:That's not obscure, that's a basic gameplay mechanic... Maybe my definition of basic is different from yours.
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Dec 31, 2016 02:40
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1.3's greatest sin is that it's unrelentingly tedious.
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Dec 31, 2016 02:49
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The GBA port of VI completely butchers the music, although if you emulate it you can get a mod that fixes that.
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Dec 31, 2016 03:31
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gigglefeimer posted:50+ is good, but the more levels the better, if only to help you outpace his auto-regen.
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Dec 31, 2016 03:57
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Am I playing WoFF wrong for not really giving a drat about the "gotta catch em all" aspect and just sticking with my same crazy overpowered Mirages while catching whichever others I happen to run across Because this is definitely the kind of game that seems like it'd get miserable for a completionist.
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Dec 31, 2016 04:06
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Oxxidation posted:Am I playing WoFF wrong for not really giving a drat about the "gotta catch em all" aspect and just sticking with my same crazy overpowered Mirages while catching whichever others I happen to run across I'll catch something if it looks cool. But I definitely didn't care if I missed stuff.
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Dec 31, 2016 04:07
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Oxxidation posted:Am I playing WoFF wrong for not really giving a drat about the "gotta catch em all" aspect and just sticking with my same crazy overpowered Mirages while catching whichever others I happen to run across Nah. play it however you want. I only caught monsters I was interested in.
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Dec 31, 2016 04:20
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Grozz Nuy posted:The GBA port of VI completely butchers the music, although if you emulate it you can get a mod that fixes that. So does the FFV version. The GBA versions of 5/6 are the best ones but they definitely need the SNES music patches because the GBA's sound capabilities were pretty bad.
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Dec 31, 2016 04:42
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Oxxidation posted:Am I playing WoFF wrong for not really giving a drat about the "gotta catch em all" aspect and just sticking with my same crazy overpowered Mirages while catching whichever others I happen to run across I will say that it's fun to switch out mirages from time to time. i did it at least three different times from the mirages i started out with, and it's nice that they catch up quick. there's also no real reason to try to catch all of them when you can transfigure different forms anyway.
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Dec 31, 2016 05:14
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DACK FAYDEN posted:And yet the only way to find it out during "basic gameplay" is to actively look at the CT bar on a dead guy, because otherwise you just revive them, maybe they get a turn, and you're like "sweet, it's the now-alive guy's turn" but you don't stop to think why. Probably. Someone casually playing regular FFT can safely ignore 90% of gameplay mechanics, I just don't think that makes the mechanics themselves obscure. Like that Faith affects magic, or that zodiac compatibility is a thing that exists. I wouldn't consider those obscure, arcane minutiae of the game. I mean, dead guys turn into crystals/boxes after enough turns have passed. There's even a helpful counter above them counting down for you to see. You can't miss it. How would you think it's counting down if their CT isn't continuing? Txn posted:That's good to hear, I was worried that level 60+ was too low for it The majority of stat gains take place in the first 50 levels. Even then, the garment grids, accessories, and dresspheres you equip have a much larger impact than levels, not to mention the abilities you use (hello Excellence). For Almighty Shinra, you'll want to have as close to max HP, Defense, and Magic Defense as possible. gigglefeimer fucked around with this message at 06:12 on Dec 31, 2016 |
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Dec 31, 2016 06:03
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the zodiac system is like the definition of arcane minutiae
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Dec 31, 2016 06:11
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Reiterpallasch posted:the zodiac system is like the definition of arcane minutiae It's in your face for the entire game.
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Dec 31, 2016 06:13
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even the ingame tutorial, which was read by like 12 people, calls it "miscellany"
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Dec 31, 2016 06:16
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master archael once said to an acolyte, "you must pay careful attention to the zodiac system, for it is the beginning and end of all damage formulae" "why does zodiac compatibility affect the success rate of magic, but not physical evasion?" asked the acolyte master archael immediately threw a tantrum about how the acolyte couldn't appreciate the battle mechanics guide's genius because he was bad at the game. hearing this, the acolyte was enlightened.
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Dec 31, 2016 06:18
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Reiterpallasch posted:master archael once said to an acolyte, "you must pay careful attention to the zodiac system, for it is the beginning and end of all damage formulae" I didn't say the exact workings of zodiac compatibility, just that it's a thing that exists in the game, where some units have bad compatibility and some units have good.
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Dec 31, 2016 06:22
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