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Trin Tragula posted:I have to say it's making my head spin a lot that we started this whole thing with "Support Corbyn for a leader who will actually oppose the Government's evil plans!" and now we're not a million miles away from "Support Corbyn for a leader who recognises that we can't possibly oppose the Government's evil plans!" This is becoming a really annoying comparison. Supporting Article 50, a single issue the British public voted for after Labour voted to give them a referendum, is not the same as supporting welfare cuts or another of the Tories policies.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:37 |
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# ? May 3, 2024 01:32 |
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Support Corbyn as a leader who actually wants the Labour party to give a poo poo about the welfare of the working class, for which domestic government policy is far more important than Brexit, especially as Brexit is a given and thus the way this and future governments spread the cost of it will be very important. The point of the Labour party isn't to just do the polar opposite of whatever the government does, it's to do the best it can for the actual worthwhile people of the UK. Which is to say, not the rich cunts.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:38 |
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I know there's a list of Labour MPs that voted against, but is there a complete list of who voted for and against and whether their constituencies voted leave or remain?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:38 |
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Prince John posted:Did the Tories use a whip?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:38 |
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he even looks coked out in his Wiki photo
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:40 |
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jabby posted:This is becoming a really annoying comparison. Supporting Article 50, a single issue the British public voted for after Labour voted to give them a referendum, is not the same as supporting welfare cuts or another of the Tories policies. Nah fam, totally, Hard Brexit is just a "single issue the British voted for", no big deal, just gonna wreck your economy to all poo poo and back mate, great stuff innit. You guys actually voted for your 2001-scale crisis. I don't have the words.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:42 |
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I miss the happy days of condom cameron and gimpy george
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:41 |
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OwlFancier posted:Support Corbyn as a leader who actually wants the Labour party to give a poo poo about the welfare of the working class, for which domestic government policy is far more important than Brexit, especially as Brexit is a given and thus the way this and future governments spread the cost of it will be very important. Brexit is a given because Labour is not opposing it. Corbyn is a joke. He's hosed the Labour party.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:44 |
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Pissflaps posted:Brexit is a given because Labour is not opposing it. Completely incorrect, and you are well aware of that.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:47 |
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Pissflaps posted:Brexit is a given because Labour is not opposing it. Brexit is a loving catastrophe but how would you propose Corbyn or an alternative Lab leader should have acted in the time between the referendum and today, in order to stop it occurring?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:48 |
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Pissflaps posted:Brexit is a given because Labour is not opposing it. We're all hosed.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:52 |
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OwlFancier posted:Completely incorrect, and you are well aware of that. It's entirely correct. Mister Adequate posted:Brexit is a loving catastrophe but how would you propose Corbyn or an alternative Lab leader should have acted in the time between the referendum and today, in order to stop it occurring? Built up a persuasive case against Brexit using all the evidence and events since - focussing most recently on the need for stability in the face of an increasingly alarming situation in America - then held a three line whip against tonight's bill, bringing rebel Tories on-side to defeat it. And you know what? Even if it had failed it would still have acted as some sort of brake on us careering towards the hardest of possible Brexits. Because there would have been opposition to it.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:54 |
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TinTower posted:Only one Tory rebel: Ken Clarke. Yeah I was going to say, doesn't bode well for Remain-soft-brexit Tories defying the government and voting for the amendments they all want. They could push brexit down a different and more accountable path if they did, so I guess we'll see if any more of them break ranks spectralent posted:Yeah, but a three line whip over a symbolic measure? That's insane. Corbyn's lost a lot of trust I'd had in him over this. Well yeah, it is symbolic - that's sort of the whole point. Labour's choosing to take a strong official line, a decisive consistent stance, to try and position themselves better for what's coming up. A free vote goes against that, it's almost like officially abstaining. When there's a game plan like this (whatever it's worth) I don't really see what's weird about whipping on it All the talk and the responses to the resignations seem to be pretty amiable, like there aren't exactly any bridges being burned - and symbolically, any Labour MP who wants to vote No has to openly rebel against the official line, as an individual.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 22:55 |
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Labour doesn't have leverage. Parliamentary minorities, outside of specific cases of lax cohesion in the ruling party, do not have any power in the UK government. The UK opposition does not function. The only thing it can do is entirely extraparliamentary and threaten to depose the government in subsequent elections. To which its conduct in parliament is entirely a matter of positioning, positioning in favor of things like welfare, employment rights, civil equality, wealth redistribution, positive rights to health, wealth, and happiness, are all entirely sensible and morally imperative. But positioning in opposition to the concept of a thing that is going to happen at the expense of doing their sole possible function of utlility within parliament, which is to say proposing sensible amendments to government policy, does not make sense.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:00 |
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Labour could have generated leverage by effectively opposing Brexit - both inside and outside Parliament. The process is not going well. May is an idiot. This should have been exploited. Instead it's been squandered and leaves Labour literally supporting the Tories on the most important political issue of the last fifty years. It will do to Labour in the UK what the independence referendum did to them in Scotland. Pissflaps fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Feb 1, 2017 |
# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:02 |
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I've been saying for months now that anti-Brexit sentiment has to come from taking the popular mandate from pro-Brexit to anti, i.e. mass and sustained protest or more serious action. Since that hasn't appeared Labour seem to be doing their best given their resources and position as representatives of the British people.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:03 |
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https://twitter.com/NCPoliticsUK/status/826913643023495168
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:10 |
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If only Owen Smith had won. He's the man we need
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:11 |
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Namtab posted:If only Owen Smith had won. He's the man we need Do we know how he voted tonight?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:12 |
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He would have used his sixty foot willy to beat May to death without leaving the labour benches.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:12 |
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Pissflaps posted:Do we know how he voted tonight? against the bill, one of the 47
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:16 |
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I'm a single issue guy and I would never vote for the viagra salesman
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:16 |
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OwlFancier posted:He would have used his sixty foot willy to beat May to death without leaving the labour benches. ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:against the bill, one of the 47 An interesting contrast.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:16 |
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A choice between tories selling the NHS to the US out of stupidity and Smith selling it to whoever will pay him the most out of greed would be an interesting if depressing one.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:18 |
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Pissflaps posted:An interesting contrast. you asked how he voted, I replied. Not really difficult is it?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:19 |
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OwlFancier posted:A choice between tories selling the NHS to the US out of stupidity and Smith selling it to whoever will pay him the most out of greed would be an interesting if depressing one. Owen Smith lost the leadership election i'm not sure why you're still pretending he's some sort of political boogeyman. He's irrelevant. ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:you asked how he voted, I replied. Not really difficult is it? The contrast I found interesting was between the hyperbole and reality.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:21 |
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The idea being if he had not. Use your brain, flaps.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:22 |
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On the other hand I want to worship every inch of his cock before he uses it as a battering ram to decimate the government
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:22 |
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OwlFancier posted:The idea being if he had not. Use your brain, flaps. Sorry my brain is too busy mulling over the majestic nuance of Corbyn supporting the Tories on Brexit and you thinking this is a good idea.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:23 |
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If only borbyn had a 60 meter cock
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:25 |
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OwlFancier posted:I miss the happy days of pigfucker cameron and coked-out titperving gideon
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:29 |
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I hope a Wall is built around the border of Scotland & England so that once Climate Change happens that all the English Refugees drown. That will teach them because we are full and we don't need more White people coming into our country.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:31 |
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Extreme0 posted:I hope a Wall is built around the border of Scotland & England so that once Climate Change happens that all the English Refugees drown. That will teach them because we are full and we don't need more White people coming into our country. I can't visualise how this would work.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:32 |
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Pissflaps posted:I can't visualise how this would work. You wouldn't be able to because we would be all dead by then.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:32 |
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I wish i was dead already!!
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:33 |
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:33 |
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Oberleutnant posted:I wish i was dead already!! How about you cheer up us - and yourself - by transcribing a really long old rear end letter?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:35 |
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Deare Lord Ashlington, It is under sincere destress that I must inform youe of the events that have occurred at this place over the past twelve monthes...
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:40 |
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Pissflaps posted:How about you cheer up us - and yourself - by transcribing a really long old rear end letter?
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:40 |
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# ? May 3, 2024 01:32 |
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Extreme0 posted:I hope a Wall is built around the border of Scotland & England so that once Climate Change happens that all the English Refugees drown. That will teach them because we are full and we don't need more White people coming into our country. Och aye! Make Hadrian's Wall Great Again! I do love Scotland and have seriously considered moving to Aberdeen.
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# ? Feb 1, 2017 23:41 |