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Baronjutter posted:Like, what parts did you like??? Worf's poem and Red Squad
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Feb 18, 2017 01:02
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Baronjutter posted:It's weird hearing people be all like "Oh yeah I love DS9 it was the best. But I hated all the ferrengi episodes, and bajor and bajorans were stupid and bothered me how many episodes revolved around them, and I hated Vic, and I hated the few holodeck episodes, and Ezri was terrible, and the dominion war went on too long, and I hated all of Dax's klingon adventures, and I randomly hate half the characters" Like, what parts did you like??? Peter Jurasik, duh.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:05
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Baronjutter posted:It's weird hearing people be all like "Oh yeah I love DS9 it was the best. But I hated all the ferrengi episodes, and bajor and bajorans were stupid and bothered me how many episodes revolved around them, and I hated Vic, and I hated the few holodeck episodes, and Ezri was terrible, and the dominion war went on too long, and I hated all of Dax's klingon adventures, and I randomly hate half the characters" Like, what parts did you like??? I, too am unable to distinguish separate opinions from one another.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:55
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Baronjutter posted:It's weird hearing people be all like "Oh yeah I love DS9 it was the best. But I hated all the ferrengi episodes, and bajor and bajorans were stupid and bothered me how many episodes revolved around them, and I hated Vic, and I hated the few holodeck episodes, and Ezri was terrible, and the dominion war went on too long, and I hated all of Dax's klingon adventures, and I randomly hate half the characters" Like, what parts did you like??? 
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Feb 18, 2017 02:08
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To be fair, that would mean we would be left with a show featuring Sisko, O'Brien, non-genetically engineered Bashir, Odo, Kira (how strict are we being about no Bajorans?), Garak, and Dukat. I'd watch that show too.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:20
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Ezri Dax best Dax. King Hong Kong posted:To be fair, that would mean we would be left with a show featuring Sisko, O'Brien, non-genetically engineered Bashir, Odo, Kira (how strict are we being about no Bajorans?), Garak, and Dukat. gently caress that sounds really good.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:42
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WampaLord posted:He once yelled at a Fallout developer for making New Vegas "wrong" because he hated that the direct path to Vegas was meant to be hard. And it was true. After all, the developer that knows Fallout best didn't put those wrong mechanics when they made the next game in the series. It's interesting how New Vegas is basically the DS9 of modern Fallout, come to think of it. Did a lot of things differently, for good and (overall) ill. Baronjutter posted:It's weird hearing people be all like "Oh yeah I love DS9 it was the best. But I hated all the ferrengi episodes, and bajor and bajorans were stupid and bothered me how many episodes revolved around them, and I hated Vic, and I hated the few holodeck episodes, and Ezri was terrible, and the dominion war went on too long, and I hated all of Dax's klingon adventures, and I randomly hate half the characters" Like, what parts did you like??? I think it's that DS9 has a lot of different handholds for not liking it, many of which you cited. Nobody is saying they hate the entire thing, but there's something to dislike for everyone.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:47
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If you watch just one Ferengi episode make it "The Magnificent Ferengi"
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Feb 18, 2017 02:50
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Kibbles n Shits posted:If you watch just one Ferengi episode make it "The Magnificent Ferengi" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VUxzpz0W2k
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Feb 18, 2017 03:20
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My favorite will always be My Dinner with Moogie
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Feb 18, 2017 03:42
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I like the Ferengi episodes If there's any arc/episode type from DS9 that I don't like, it's mirror universe episodes.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:52
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But... Bashirhole.
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Feb 18, 2017 04:02
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Mirror episodes are cringeworthy because they turned the sexuality up to 11 then broke the knob to make it go even higher. It came off like they were written by 13 year old hormone blobs to jerk off to.
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Feb 18, 2017 04:19
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I'm just starting my first run through DS9 since it aired. I remember being really irritated during first run with all the setup for conflict with the Dominion and it just going nowhere for a long time. It'll be interesting to see how different it is for me this time.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:18
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Baronjutter posted:Also yeah, DS9 was a perfectly successful show and I believe did better than Voyager, it just wasn't TNG successful which was an insane ratings phenomenon.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:54
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I wouldn't say never. Game of Thrones has a similarly ubiquitous cultural presence and it's fuckin R-rated high fantasy. I doubt it will be another Star Trek show that achieves such a height though.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:57
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skasion posted:I wouldn't say never. Game of Thrones has a similarly ubiquitous cultural presence and it's fuckin R-rated high fantasy. I doubt it will be another Star Trek show that achieves such a height though. If an actually competent organization like HBO or Netflix made and marketed it, it might approach TNG or GoT levels of cultural penetration
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Feb 18, 2017 06:26
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Kazinsal posted:Curzodo Dax best Dax.
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Feb 18, 2017 06:28
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The Bloop posted:If an actually competent organization like HBO or Netflix made and marketed it, it might approach TNG or GoT levels of cultural penetration Probably not, since Rome, Deadwood, and similar HBO shows, while successful where nowhere near what GoT is. Got is a freak of nature that will probably not be duplicated as far as cultural penetration for such a hardcore show. MrJacobs fucked around with this message at 06:54 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 06:51
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Just saw Star Trek Beyond. Not bad. It was a little weird to go from listening to 50 year mission book 1 on audiobook for an hour clawing my way back home through the rain commenting on what TOS was and remembering how sedate that show was to having Kirk and friends pretty much constantly fighting and surfing an exploding wave of drones with the Beastie Boys playing. Of course that doesn't stop me thinking of which song I'd pick to wreck their poo poo with  .I do love that the runt of the ST canon, ENT, got a lot of attention in this one. I'm really not sure why Edison was so pissed about though. He shouldn't have grown up with terror if the ENT pilot is to be believed, since they eliminated most of that by NX-01.Even then, he wants to bring back strife into humanity for...what purpose again? Make humanity great again? His motivation fell a little flat and felt more like grr I'm a bad guy. I guess you can chalk it up to the isolation.
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Feb 18, 2017 06:57
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Zesty Crab Legs posted:Actually, Profit and Lace is good and worth watching. Lmao
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Feb 18, 2017 07:02
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EvilTaytoMan posted:IIRC it was the The thing I never got about that is why they'd need to move in the first place. AFAIK the warp engines don't do anything at impulse, so why not have the nacelles in their warping positions all the time?
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Feb 18, 2017 07:54
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reason why Voyager's nacelles move when they go to warp.
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MisterBibs posted:Someone posted a chart concerning the ratings of all the shows. After TNG there's this one-moment spot with DS9's premier where it pinged higher than even TNG, followed by a massive downward collapse soon after. At that time and place, being the #1 syndicated show wasn't much of a thing. Where are you even getting this info? This is the chart you're talking about and I was actually going to put it in my original post to help back up what I was saying:  Comparing it to TNG is ridiculous because TNG was an absurd ratings juggernaut. It's like Paramount bitching that JJTrek isn't pulling in Avengers money. It might be true, but it doesn't make it unsuccessful. Those ratings are perfectly good for the time it was airing and it was highly successful as a first run syndication show. This is what that downward slope is really showing:  quote:I would advise you to read The Fifty Year Mission, because DS9 was never a ridiculously successful show, and they mention it. None of the post TNG shows were even close to as successful. Worf's addition to the show was a desperate attempt to get the ratings up, for example. I just finished reading The Fifty Year Mission a few weeks ago, dude. DS9 was backburnered (which, of course, was a blessing in disguise so I'm not complaining) literally because Voyager had the ship and so Voyager was going to be the flagship franchise show. Of course they also hoped that Voyager would pull in better ratings, but that was never in the cards because Voyager was stuck on UPN and the definition of successful was rapidly changing. Paradoxish fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 07:59
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I mean, DS9 got 7 seasons, shows that are failures don't get 7 seasons.
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Feb 18, 2017 08:03
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1000 Brown M and Ms posted:The thing I never got about that is why they'd need to move in the first place. AFAIK the warp engines don't do anything at impulse, so why not have the nacelles in their warping positions all the time? Well, Voyager does have the impulse engines on the nacelle pylons. So it sort of makes sense in that context. Plus I always figured it was a budget thing. They said the F-14 was their inspiration, so I always assumed they meant for the angle to vary with warp factor. Same way the Tomcat's wings swept further back at higher speeds.
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Feb 18, 2017 08:10
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People complained about the villain's apparent lack of motive beyond "REVENGE" in Beyond and found to be the movie's weak link. I disagree. I felt like his motivations were more compelling than most people would give credit for. Edison fought in the Romulan War. For the purpose of Beyond, it's kind of like World War II if we imagine the Federation being like Western democracies. Edison's anger at the Federation was not really from being "abandoned" by it, but seeing the Federation (which he ironically helped create by being a war hero) as an ideological monstrosity. Yorktown is a mini avatar of the Federation: Prosperous, diverse, cosmopolitan, and filled with technological wonder. Edison is like a proxy for all those who feel left behind by all the changes they lived through. Old people don't like how the world is changing. They don't like the aliens moving in next door. They'll use technology, but they'll complain about it anyway. Tying Beyond's villain to the real life political climate of 2016 would be trite, but not necessarily wrong, to say the least. Echo Chamber fucked around with this message at 08:18 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 08:12
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Q_res posted:Well, Voyager does have the impulse engines on the nacelle pylons. So it sort of makes sense in that context. Plus I always figured it was a budget thing. They said the F-14 was their inspiration, so I always assumed they meant for the angle to vary with warp factor. Same way the Tomcat's wings swept further back at higher speeds. Good point about the impulse engines, but I think that's kind of a weak excuse. Sure, on present-day spacecraft the engines have to be in a certain place (behind the centre of mass) in order to propel the craft forward without spinning, but I don't think that holds with Trek ships with their magic technology. I had considered that the engine angle would vary with warp factor, but it was never shown so I wasn't sure why they bothered. I didn't know that a swing-wing fighter was a cited inspiration for Voyager, so it makes sense from that angle.
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Feb 18, 2017 08:19
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WampaLord posted:I mean, DS9 got 7 seasons, shows that are failures don't get 7 seasons. [obligatory Walking Dead joke]
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Feb 18, 2017 08:29
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Man, even Nemesis' opening title, done in 2002-style Diablo font, sucks.
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Feb 18, 2017 08:41
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Really difficult to define all the ways that Nemesis sucks. If ever a franchise deserved to be put out of its misery by a movie, it's this one. The Fifty-Year Mission spends a lot of time with people complaining about the director, who rubbed everyone on set the wrong way because he didn't give a poo poo about Star Trek. It didn't matter who the director was, the writing was basement-tier. Rick Berman is quoted a lot as thinking highly of the director, but frankly if you read between the lines, Berman is still doing PR work for Star Trek. Face it, bozo, you hired a director on the cheap (a guy with two directing credits on also-ran movies, who never directed again). Rick heaps even more praise on the writer, who between himself and the rewrites by Brent Spiner and Patrick Stewart wrote one hell of a stinker. - It blows me away that they cut 50 minutes out of the theatrical cut of this thing, because the third act is already twice as long as it should be. All this effort to re-do the Wrath of Khan nebula battle and they clearly had no idea how to do the pacing or the emotional beats on it. - If they had cut all the Romulan characters, they would have saved themselves some embarrassingly bad plot resolutions and a lot of time. Conservatives in the Romulan Empire have assassinated the entire government and decided to attack the Federation, and then get upset that the new boss wants to use a superweapon to do it, so they turn babyface. - The buggy sequence makes Gene Roddenberry spin in his grave so hard you could use him as an internal combustion engine. Gene was actually on record from the beginning as trying to prevent Star Trek from being used this way. - Utter waste of Ron Pearlman, who usually livens up even really bad movies. Four TNG movies, all of which they insisted on having black hats in, and they never brought back Sela or Lore (and let's face it, if they can bring back Denise Crosby they can bring back Evil Data).
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Feb 18, 2017 11:02
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twistedmentat posted:
Wesley. "Imma breed a sentient nanite civilization, oops I left the cap off" "Mom look what I can do with a warp bubble, hey where'd you go?" "Hey you want to try an astrobatic stunt that was banned for killing people?" "Did those Edosians just tell me not to cross this barrier, gently caress it I want to catch the ball!" "Ferrying a mysterious alien diplomat on a mission to end millennia of war, it's the perfect time to derail that to try and get my dick wet!" E: Or Pulaski. "Double your risk, double your winnings! Haven't you figured it out yet, Doctor, the pieces are your friends and crewmates, the risks are theirs!" "I knew that an hour ago. gently caress 'em, I aim to clean you out, sucker." VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 11:15 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 11:03
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dont even fink about it posted:[obligatory Walking Dead joke] Inexplicably, poo poo-tons of people still watch TWD, despite it being terrible. This proves that success =/= quality, but we already have plenty of examples. Baronjutter posted:It's weird hearing people be all like "Oh yeah I love DS9 it was the best. But I hated all the ferrengi episodes, and bajor and bajorans were stupid and bothered me how many episodes revolved around them, and I hated Vic, and I hated the few holodeck episodes, and Ezri was terrible, and the dominion war went on too long, and I hated all of Dax's klingon adventures, and I randomly hate half the characters" Like, what parts did you like??? Ferengi eps: good (except "Profit and Lace") Bajor: alright Vic: rad Holodeck: I like fun, yes Ezri: yes please Dominion War: yes always and forever VICTORY IS LIFE Dax n' Klingons: sure, I still like fun Characters: Dax is usually boring, I guess? I literally can't think of another major character I consistently dislike If I may add, Mirror Universe eps: ok, these are lame  I'm not saying DS9 is perfect, but I'm also not one to categorically complain about any of the above things (except for the MU). I think all of the examples you picked out aren't shared by the DS9 fans here at the same time. It's like you rolled a dozen different people's single complaints into one self-flagellating, fictitious DS9 fan. MisterBibs posted:And it was true. After all, the developer that knows Fallout best didn't put those wrong mechanics when they made the next game in the series. It's interesting how New Vegas is basically the DS9 of modern Fallout, come to think of it. Did a lot of things differently, for good and (overall) ill. I'm going to start a new game in New Vegas now just to spite the wrongness of this opinion. Vault 11 (a short, optional, independent quest) by itself is funnier and better written than anything in Fallout 4. 3 and 4 both don't capture the quality or tone of the writing of the original Fallout games, and they too loving easy. It's New Vegas or nothing if I want to play a modern Fallout game.
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Feb 18, 2017 12:17
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dont even fink about it posted:Rick Berman is quoted a lot as thinking highly of the director, but frankly if you read between the lines, Berman is still doing PR work for Star Trek. Face it, bozo, you hired a director on the cheap (a guy with two directing credits on also-ran movies, who never directed again). The director was picked by the studio; he saved Mission Impossible... 2 (I think?) with a post-production re-cut and he was promised a directing gig as a reward. They gave him Nemesis. That was it for his directorial career.
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Feb 18, 2017 12:46
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MikeJF posted:The director was picked by the studio; he saved Mission Impossible... 2 (I think?) with a post-production re-cut and he was promised a directing gig as a reward. They gave him Nemesis. That was it for his directorial career. Baird is actually a really good (academy award nominated) editor. He did The Omen, Die Hard 2, Demolition Man, more recently some of the Daniel Craig Bond movies. The directing gig was the reward for work he did on MI2 and the first Tomb Raider movie.
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Feb 18, 2017 13:04
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1000 Brown M and Ms posted:Good point about the impulse engines, but I think that's kind of a weak excuse. Sure, on present-day spacecraft the engines have to be in a certain place (behind the centre of mass) in order to propel the craft forward without spinning, but I don't think that holds with Trek ships with their magic technology. The idea came up in the TNG technical manual, so it was one of those ideas like saucer separation that had been knocking around.
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Feb 18, 2017 15:13
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The Voyager nacelles might also move to help with atmosphere since it can land. Also as a science vessel aerodynamics might matter slightly in nebulae or the Badlands or whatever.
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Feb 18, 2017 15:34
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Frionnel's list of what's bad in DS9: Profit and Lace Everything to do with Pah-Wraiths Ezri (She just needed more seasons) Ezri and Bashir romance (or "if Worf hadn't shown up it would have been you"  )Sisko's mom and Sisko being Space Jesus out of nowhere Frionnel fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 16:40
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Frionnel posted:Frionnel's list of what's bad in DS9: Out of nowhere? It was literally the plot of the first episode.
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Feb 18, 2017 16:49
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Those who had been reading 50 year journey, did you get any info why Nemesis was such a poo poo show? I feel at its core was a fundamental misunderstanding of what people like about trek.
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Feb 18, 2017 16:54
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twistedmentat posted:Those who had been reading 50 year journey, did you get any info why Nemesis was such a poo poo show? I feel at its core was a fundamental misunderstanding of what people like about trek. The director didn't know poo poo about Trek and constantly ignored people trying to nudge him in the right direction. That's probably not the only reason, but a fairly big one.
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Feb 18, 2017 17:01
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