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Samizdata
May 14, 2007

superh posted:

Love this stuff. Deformable terrain sounds really cool - I've got an idea that ties into the junction system where you're going to be swapping "robot" bodies with different capabilities so I see that sort of variety fitting in well.


Yeah! It's a fun system - the two big failings in my mind were having to sit around and grind to draw spells and the fact you never want to use any spells once they're junctioned.

My solution is to 1) ditch "drawing" entirely - you junction items you find instead, one of which counts for what would have been a stack of 100 spells, and 2) You consume an item by junctioning it, so you've got to decide where to spend something not whether you want to spend it.

I'm sure there will be other issues that crop up due to those changes, but I think it might tie in nicely with permadeath.

I really like the body swapping idea. It's one of my favorite parts of NeuroVoider.

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DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Beeme posted:

Which amusingly were already coded in, but a "tiny bug" prevented them from actually spawning.
Hey, those sarcasm quotes might not be justified. Noted Well-Coded-And-Progammed game Binding of Isaac had a "tiny bug" where instead of selecting at random from a list of entities it would just always pick the first one. And another "tiny bug" where like 10% of rooms never got generated at all.

In both cases, the devs never noticed that these things were coming up because why would they test :v:

crab avatar
Mar 15, 2006

iŧ Kë3Ã…Â, cħ gøài- <Ecl8

superh posted:

Been a long-rear end time since I posted about it but I'm still working on this thing, I'm calling it I Won't Die now:



This looks amazing

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
I mean, it's very pretty, but isometric view suuuuuuuuucks.

superh
Oct 10, 2007

Touching every treasure
That's legit. Out of curiosity, what specifically would you say sucks so much about it?

Is it a visual comprehension issue? Or confusing tile-based movement when everything's rotated 45 degrees? Something else entirely?

Verticality can be very unclear, but other than for the visual differences in wall heights I'm restricting the action to a single plane.

superh fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Feb 28, 2017

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
It's just a bunch of little things that add up to a worse experience. Stuff gets hidden behind tiles, directions are unintuitive, verticality and distance can look ambiguous in certain situations, and so on.

LordSloth
Mar 7, 2008

Disgruntled (IT) Employee

DACK FAYDEN posted:

Hey, those sarcasm quotes might not be justified. Noted Well-Coded-And-Progammed game Binding of Isaac had a "tiny bug" where instead of selecting at random from a list of entities it would just always pick the first one. And another "tiny bug" where like 10% of rooms never got generated at all.

In both cases, the devs never noticed that these things were coming up because why would they test :v:

Apparently, these bosses were fine in early access, they only broke it just for final release which is why it didn't come up in testing before then!

The whole cloudbleed thing you might have heard about in the news lately? Entirely the fault of using == instead of >=

Stunt_enby
Feb 6, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

I mean, it's very pretty, but isometric view suuuuuuuuucks.
I'm going to fight you.

DisDisDis
Dec 22, 2013

Dr. Dos posted:

https://twitter.com/UltimaRegum/status/833709734788231169

Who wants to read a 15 page paper about Roguelikes and ASCII graphics

I want to read his book chapter about danmaku but I don't want to pay 30 dollars for it.

Guess I'll use that time to play the first two stages of Ketsui over and over again instead

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

Stuntman posted:

I'm going to fight you.

where's the lie though

Beeme
Oct 7, 2013

DACK FAYDEN posted:

Hey, those sarcasm quotes might not be justified. Noted Well-Coded-And-Progammed game Binding of Isaac had a "tiny bug" where instead of selecting at random from a list of entities it would just always pick the first one. And another "tiny bug" where like 10% of rooms never got generated at all.

In both cases, the devs never noticed that these things were coming up because why would they test :v:

They weren't sarcasm quotes! I was quoting the actual announcement about it, they called it that. I'm a layman, but I understand that it can be tiny in the amount of code involved in the part where it goes bad, and still have a hugely negative effect.

I did not at all mean to besmirch their capacity as developers, I love their work.

madjackmcmad
May 27, 2008

Look, I'm startin' to believe some of the stuff the cult guy's been saying, it's starting to make a lot of sense.
Hanging out at GDC with Kornel while he's demoing Jupiter Hell for us.

Alehkhs
Oct 6, 2010

The Sorrow of Poets

madjackmcmad posted:

Hanging out at GDC with Kornel while he's demoing Jupiter Hell for us.



:stare:

Aaaaand...?

Samizdata
May 14, 2007

madjackmcmad posted:

Hanging out at GDC with Kornel while he's demoing Jupiter Hell for us.



Somewhat jealous. Would be more so if I could code my way out of a tragically oversatuated rice paper bag. In a monsoon.

crab avatar
Mar 15, 2006

iŧ Kë3Ã…Â, cħ gøài- <Ecl8

madjackmcmad posted:

Hanging out at GDC with Kornel while he's demoing Jupiter Hell for us.



Is that Glenn Wichman?

madjackmcmad
May 27, 2008

Look, I'm startin' to believe some of the stuff the cult guy's been saying, it's starting to make a lot of sense.

crab avatar posted:

Is that Glenn Wichman?
Correct. He hosted the get together at Zynga, it's not far from the conference.

Alehkhs posted:

:stare:

Aaaaand...?
I just wanted to provide more proof that Jupiter Hell is actually a real game since the lack of screenshots has been a running joke here in the thread.

LordSloth
Mar 7, 2008

Disgruntled (IT) Employee
https://www.twitch.tv/epyoncf/videos/all

There's the dev's coding stream. Generally streams regularly (weekly?), but he was sick for two weeks before the last broadcast, and GDC obviously cutting into time for that now.

crab avatar
Mar 15, 2006

iŧ Kë3Ã…Â, cħ gøài- <Ecl8

madjackmcmad posted:

Correct. He hosted the get together at Zynga, it's not far from the conference.
What a cool dude. I watched this panel with all the original Rogue developers recently (really interesting btw) but what got me most was his response to a comment below the video from someone lamenting that he's now working on casual games.

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...




Games › Roguelikes - none of us have ever even played Rogue

Alehkhs
Oct 6, 2010

The Sorrow of Poets

madjackmcmad posted:

I just wanted to provide more proof that Jupiter Hell is actually a real game since the lack of screenshots has been a running joke here in the thread.

Oh, I didn't mean that in a "so what?" manner- I was fishing for details :ninja:

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
I've played Rogue. It's not very appealing when you have access to even the second or third generation roguelikes, let alone some of the stuff with really impressive design chops that's come out more recently (the DoomRL / Brogue / Caves of Qud / Cogmind generation, if you will.)

It was obviously a great and transformative idea but as a game it's got horrific variance and a food clock that feels like it was designed for a quarter-munching arcade game.

madjackmcmad
May 27, 2008

Look, I'm startin' to believe some of the stuff the cult guy's been saying, it's starting to make a lot of sense.

crab avatar posted:

What a cool dude. I watched this panel with all the original Rogue developers recently (really interesting btw) but what got me most was his response to a comment below the video from someone lamenting that he's now working on casual games.



Glenn told us at RogueCel last year that WWF is a roguelike. Turn based, tile based, permadeath, and (if I recall correctly) all the game pieces are letters.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
Words With Friends has a predefined board layout, arguably a multi-action turn structure, and no PC.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
Also I would like to think that making a good game is the goal and that it being played by millions of people is a fortuitous but secondary effect, but then again, I'm an obnoxious critic on a good day. :v:

baram.
Oct 23, 2007

smooth.


i think we finally found someone who you can't argue with about what is/isn't a roguelike.

goon does it anyway.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?

baram. posted:

i think we finally found someone who you can't argue with about what is/isn't a roguelike.

goon does it anyway.
Please Google "tongue-in-cheek".

Artificer
Apr 8, 2010

You're going to try ponies and you're. Going. To. LOVE. ME!!

PMush Perfect posted:

Please Google "tongue-in-cheek".

Is google a roguelike

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off
i was going to suggest googling 'death of the author roland barthes', but god drat it, they finally fixed it!

never 4get

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Artificer posted:

Is google a roguelike
procedurally generated (for any site with no robots.txt)
permadeath (usually results from searching something like "bloody panniculus")

checks out!

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off
for people who liked Imbroglio, Tom Francis (Gunpoint) just released a new game inspired by it. $5, Windows. Videos make it look reasonably interesting.

for people who haven't played Imbroglio: you should really get on that!

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA

Morphblade feels a lot like Hoplite, which is incredibly cool. It's sleek, it tells you all of the rules, and it all comes down to positioning and using your hexes wisely.

doctorfrog
Mar 14, 2007

Great.

A "what I'm playing post," worth half a nickel in postbucks.

Spelunky: The Great Game: for years I'd played with a decent but generic six-button digital controller, using JoyToKey to map the keys because Spelunky HD doesn't give a crap about non-Xbox controllers. Picture the usual XY/AB setup, I always bound run to A, and fat-thumbed X and B for whip and jump, respectively. I knew it was sub-optimal, plus Spelunky would occasionally wig out and the menu would pop up and ruin my concentration. This week, I died in the snow caves thanks to a rogue menu popup and finally got mad enough to figure out the confusing dialog of x360ce and apply it to my controller and Spelunky.

Kittens, what a difference. I mapped the buttons the way they would have been on the 360 controller, set run to always-on, and the way the whole drat game plays has changed. I'm runnin' everywhere like a parkour loon instead of a careful Indy type, and though I still suck at the game, I'm much better at it now. Spelunky: still the best action roguelike of all time.

Invisible, Inc.: Had this for a year, trying it out now, and it's good, even great, but something about it still isn't pulling me in. On the positive side, what I really like is the combination of the fiction of me being some sort of deck-punching operator, and the interface having so many keyboard hotkeys. Feels good. If I could control the whole game with a keyboard, that'd be even better, but decisively slapping keys for most non-movement actions goes a long way. The game shines when it feels like a smooth operator kinda infiltration thing, and just fills me with angst and indecision when it becomes an agonizing tactical puzzle.

Nosferatu: The Wrath of Malachi: Tonight I just have this need to explore a haunted house. This is not a very good game. But it is a haunted house.

doctorfrog fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Mar 4, 2017

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?

doctorfrog posted:

Spelunky: still the best action roguelike of all time.
:agreed:

Samizdata
May 14, 2007

PleasingFungus posted:

for people who liked Imbroglio, Tom Francis (Gunpoint) just released a new game inspired by it. $5, Windows. Videos make it look reasonably interesting.

for people who haven't played Imbroglio: you should really get on that!

Can I have your iPad then? My tablets are Android and FireOS respectively.

Burning Rain
Jul 17, 2006

What's happening?!?!
Morphblade seems like a very well polished 7DRL that's lacking some content. Not as good as Hoplite or 868-HACK, imo, but still a decent game, and the price is right.

Jordan7hm
Feb 17, 2011




Lipstick Apathy

It's not even close.

I get that people might like BoI or Nuclear Throne or whatever more, but those people are wrong. Very wrong.

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
imo nuclear throne is at least tied

binding of isaac is a bad game in many senses but nuclear throne 100% does what it shows up to do in every sense

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe
Spelunky is a Good Game, but I have 145 hours in Nuclear Throne and nowhere near as many in Spelunky. Cave diving just doesn't appeal to me as much as shooting monsters and grabbing radiation.

(I have even more hours in BoI when you count the original and the remake, but I agree with Tollymain that Isaac is a good-but-flawed game)

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off

Samizdata posted:

Can I have your iPad then? My tablets are Android and FireOS respectively.

i don't own a tablet :(

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Samizdata
May 14, 2007

PleasingFungus posted:

i don't own a tablet :(

Well, I just wanted to try Imbroglio and the only thing I could find was on the App Store.

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