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anime was right posted:i thought you were a dev from the way you kept referencing animation stuff. or were you the guy that did cinematics? punk rebel ecks posted:I would accept in seeing less of what the effort Arc System Works puts into Guilty Gear and Blazblue models/sprites as an "insane" amount of work and more in seeing that Capcom is just "lazy" with their models. Chev fucked around with this message at 13:10 on Mar 22, 2017 |
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Mar 22, 2017 13:07
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https://twitter.com/tatsushis/status/844437688962961411
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Mar 22, 2017 16:12
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WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD
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Mar 22, 2017 16:19
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Just found out that Miguel is in tekken 7 so they got at least one sale, from me
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Mar 22, 2017 16:28
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lmfao "I SIDESTEPPED THAT"
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Mar 22, 2017 16:37
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Smoking Crow posted:Xrd looks worse than AC and CF, UNIEL is the best looking fighting game out there fight me You have broken eyes, sorry.
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Mar 22, 2017 19:06
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3s is still the best looking fighting game TBH
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Mar 22, 2017 19:14
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Chev posted:I guess my using lazy may be unfair as they do put some effort in some stuff, but I'm astonished by how much has been forgotten in terms of design and animation when transitioning from 2D to 3D/SF3 to SF4. Losing/shelving veterans is one thing (although it's a darn disgrace), but then that presentation says they even left guides behind... Well, it's not just Capcom, one of the more interesting presentations of the past GDC was the one about the excellent animation and character design in Overwatch, which is very advanced for game animation but once you examine it you realize it's the good old 12 principles of animations from that 1981 Disney book, that as a fighting gamer you may instead know from that one Darkstalkers article or Labzero animators, who ironically both use old Capcom games as shining examples. And surprise surprise, the secret ingredient was effort all along!
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Mar 22, 2017 19:59
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So my mother got a new heart valve yesterday (everything went fine and she's doing pretty god) which led to me not really caring about anything expect hoping my mother would survive and how many benzos a human being can take in (the answer is a lot). But now I am back and I will play sooo many hours in so many games in my hori fighting stick mini that you made so much fun of (or was that reddit? my memory is very blurry right now). Don't know what I should do to prove its greatness, cause I suck of cause but we will seel
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Mar 23, 2017 14:28
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capcom should put Jack Baker in MVC4
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Mar 23, 2017 14:52
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MinibarMatchman posted:capcom should put Jack Baker in MVC4 I admit to watching that maximillian video in the crapper last night. Such shame.
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Mar 23, 2017 15:17
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skit herre posted:So my mother got a new heart valve yesterday (everything went fine and she's doing pretty god) which led to me not really caring about anything expect hoping my mother would survive and how many benzos a human being can take in (the answer is a lot). Geniuinely hope your mom is recovering. You probably should get a better controller.
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Mar 23, 2017 16:39
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:post your impressions when you get it pls I like the razer panthera so far. even though it is advertised as customizable, the art is not (glued to plexi...). that's loving stupid but it's less ugly than the sfv te2. apparently they are releasing plexi and art for it at focusattack sometime soon. no templates anywhere yet. comes with an extra bat top for the weirder tekken people. the new firmware update for it makes it less laggy than the te2+ and took only a minute to apply. buttons are slightly higher up than on the te2+ but it's no real functional change in that regard. so far a+ I like it more than the te2+. braided cable and less awful color scheme, seemingly good SO FAR pcb... nice
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Mar 23, 2017 18:51
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As long as it doesn't pull a momochi after extended use
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Mar 23, 2017 18:55
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I thought the response time was faster than TE2 but slower than the TE2+ according to http://www.teyah.net/sticklag/results.html and http://shoryuken.com/2017/03/07/new-razer-panthera-firmware-update-for-playstation-4-reduces-input-delay/ Panthera averages 3ms, TE2 5ms, and TE2+ 1.5ms
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Mar 23, 2017 19:29
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Do differences of 1.5 to 3.5ms even matter
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Mar 23, 2017 19:31
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No
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Mar 23, 2017 19:32
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Mechafunkzilla posted:When 80% of people play Elphelt and Sol, playing Slayer is really super not fun Too be fair, a lot of the elpelts are bad, worse than me if u can believe it
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Mar 23, 2017 19:32
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Zand posted:seemingly good SO FAR pcb any idea if its common ground?
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Mar 23, 2017 19:37
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AnonSpore posted:I thought the response time was faster than TE2 but slower than the TE2+ according to http://www.teyah.net/sticklag/results.html and http://shoryuken.com/2017/03/07/new-razer-panthera-firmware-update-for-playstation-4-reduces-input-delay/ Panthera not on teyah site and the update firmware srk link shows it as faster than te2... I don't know about the te2+ but I have issues hitting 3p/3k on that stick but not on the Panthera so far
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Mar 23, 2017 19:41
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its a really nice stick but i'm only using it for locals that are run off ps4 i still use my old OG sf4 TE at home
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Mar 23, 2017 19:46
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Ultramega posted:Geniuinely hope your mom is recovering. You probably should get a better controller. Thank you very much. She's feeling pretty good but I was ( and am) scared loving shitless. Though I know the procedure is done daily in hospitals all over the world, but man it's her loving heart your cutting around in there. Yeah, I am waiting for my HORI Fighting Commander. If I then decide I don't actually like gamepads as much as I think, I'll sell both HORIs without any loss and look into a cheap stick with replaceable parts.
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Mar 23, 2017 19:49
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stay depressed posted:its a really nice stick but i'm only using it for locals that are run off ps4 i still use my old OG sf4 TE at home the old te is so good I wish they just rereleased it with all black and better art instead of the te2
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Mar 23, 2017 20:05
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SectumSempra posted:tiers shift drastically as the game ages, match ups more or less don't shift too much You know that tiers are just aggregations of matchup ratings, right? punk rebel ecks posted:People tend to forget that there isn't much "bad"about transferring from 2D to 3D or tradigital to flash based. The issue is that when studios take the easier route they rarely use the time saved to make even more detail, but more so to save even more time and further cheapen up the process. Uhh the way that you get 3D to exhibit classic principles of animation is way less straightforward than the way it's done in 2D animation (not least because "modeling" and "animating" aren't two different things in 2D), and it takes a fair amount of experience and nuance to balance what's possible in a 3D environment against what's needed for it to read well in a 2D presentation. If you're a company like Dimps/Capcom that doesn't know the first thing about good design or asset creation, then yes moving to 3D and doing it well is actually a huge challenge. It's not because they didn't "add enough detail," whatever that means.
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Mar 23, 2017 20:53
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One of the big hurdles of shifting to 3D is how to handle animation smears. Art tends to capture moments rather than instants, so when you have the various stages of a kick your sprite art is reflecting movement that occurs over a short period of time in a single art frame, which is why we have what are called "smears", where the art in the moments between key frames look stretched and smeared out: This is way easier to do in tradiitonal 2D animation because you don't need to account for 3D limitations, you can just draw that next frame as exaggerated as you want- and you can make things look "faster" by reducing the amount of visual detail in parts of them, like Oro's feet in some of those kicks above. 3D games are bound to their animation rigs and their models, which are much harder to wring momentary animation smears out of; you end up with a succession of instants which looks much stiffer and less fluid. Xrd is exceptional because they seem to have actually modelled 3D smears as part of their models so when you have things like May's 63214H super her normal arm models are replaced with the three sets of big spinning fist smear models that change at successive speeds.  It's easy to take animation smears for granted but they're a big reason why old 2D games still hold up to time better than newer games developed at the dawn of 3D gaming, when we didn't know how to animate with polygons yet. You're basically trading one set of limitations in for another and while it could be faster/cheaper to make one 3D model and fill out animations with poses you're rather stuck with squashing and stretching exactly the amount of polygons in roughly the shapes you rig them in. Reiley fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Mar 23, 2017 |
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Mar 23, 2017 22:09
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Brosnan posted:Uhh the way that you get 3D to exhibit classic principles of animation is way less straightforward than the way it's done in 2D animation (not least because "modeling" and "animating" aren't two different things in 2D), and it takes a fair amount of experience and nuance to balance what's possible in a 3D environment against what's needed for it to read well in a 2D presentation. If you're a company like Dimps/Capcom that doesn't know the first thing about good design or asset creation, then yes moving to 3D and doing it well is actually a huge challenge. It's not because they didn't "add enough detail," whatever that means. I don't see how this goes against my post and general point?
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Mar 23, 2017 22:27
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I was flipping through a GDC talk by one of the Overwatch developers and he was explaining about the crazy skeleton setups they have for getting good stretches/smears/distortions in their animations that make things look super natural in motion and the like. It sounded expensive and a lot of effort but Overwatch is one of the best animated games out there right now so I mean they got it working for sure.
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Mar 23, 2017 22:46
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attackmole posted:I was flipping through a GDC talk by one of the Overwatch developers and he was explaining about the crazy skeleton setups they have for getting good stretches/smears/distortions in their animations that make things look super natural in motion and the like. It sounded expensive and a lot of effort but Overwatch is one of the best animated games out there right now so I mean they got it working for sure. supposedly they use different skeletons for each potg anim lol. thats so much loving work, its crazy. even if blizzard loves exploitative capitalism, they at least go the extra mile most of the time when doing it.
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Mar 23, 2017 22:46
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punk rebel ecks posted:I don't see how this goes against my post and general point? You had this weird flaccid half-point suggesting that people think it's bad to move from 2D to 3D, when really it's not because ??? I'm saying actually it is because doing it well is harder, in that there are a bunch of technical and artistic hurdles to get it to emulate traditional animation.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:08
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anime was right posted:supposedly they use different skeletons for each potg anim lol. thats so much loving work, its crazy. even if blizzard loves exploitative capitalism, they at least go the extra mile most of the time when doing it. 
Chev fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Mar 23, 2017 |
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Mar 23, 2017 23:26
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anime was right posted:supposedly they use different skeletons for each potg anim lol. thats so much loving work, its crazy. even if blizzard loves exploitative capitalism, they at least go the extra mile most of the time when doing it. Yeah there's lot's of cool poo poo that Blizzard does that other companies don't and you're like "man I wish these guys put in the kind of effort that Blizzard did" and then you remember that the reason they can do that is because they have infinite money and don't have to bow to a publisher.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:30
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It would be nice if a developer who made good games had access to that level of resources
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Mar 23, 2017 23:32
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Chev posted:It's not actually different skeletons (well, the first person skeleton is only part of the third person skeleton and uses different animations), but they have pretty advanced rigs (for the less technically inclined, if a character is a puppet, the rig's its strings, basically) and ways to automate setting them up and changing them. Regarding smears in particular, they've got what's often called "noodle limbs", which have been pretty common in movie rigs since "cloudy with a chance of meatballs" but are still kinda uncommon in games (xrd uses them in places, like for Sol's sword). Basically it means you can switch the behavior of select limbs between standard and stretch armstrong. you're right, i misremembered that info combining it with the rig info here: https://vimeo.com/204601876 this is mega cool tho imo, making of a potg animation if no one's seen it.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:46
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It's actually an even more manual process than I expected, for some reason.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:05
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In Training posted:It would be nice if a developer who made good games had access to that level of resources They'll publish a fighting game sometime around 2030
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Mar 24, 2017 00:15
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Brosnan posted:You had this weird flaccid half-point suggesting that people think it's bad to move from 2D to 3D, when really it's not because ??? I implied that it isn't necessarily bad as long as the developer is willing to put in the effort.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:24
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Brosnan posted:It's actually an even more manual process than I expected, for some reason. Well, there's a lot of things you can automate in game animation but then you get Mass Effect Andromeda. If you want Overwatch or Xrd, you need to get hands-on. To be fair though, only the PotG animations are that hands-on, in-game animations have real time physics on hair and clothes and are built by combining other animations. It's still a lot of work though. Chev fucked around with this message at 00:39 on Mar 24, 2017 |
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Mar 24, 2017 00:36
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In Training posted:It would be nice if a developer who made good games had access to that level of resources imagine an fg played by people that complain as much as blizzard fans, with a matching company that would bend to their demands
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Mar 24, 2017 00:49
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Zand posted:imagine an fg played by people that complain as much as blizzard fans, with a matching company that would bend to their demands fighting games fans already complain as much as blizzard fans the difference is that blizzard fans want the stupidest loving things
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Mar 24, 2017 00:50
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:fighting games fans already complain as much as blizzard fans blizzard fans would complain that adding throw invuln to helter skelter would ruin the game and usher in 1000000 years of slayer darkness withing 10 seconds of the patch notes coming out
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Mar 24, 2017 01:00
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