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Totally true that "the bar" for kicking has been raised a ton in recent years, though a bit of that is probably in the snap/holding also getting better. Not sure when longsnapper became like a specialist position (been at least 20 years I think... used to just be the backup center), but if you watch a real old game it can be surprising how sloppy and slow that part of things looks.
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Mar 27, 2017 17:53
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Leaguewide FG accuracy over the last 30 years has been increasing pretty consistently for whatever reasons:
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Mar 27, 2017 18:16
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Yeah, that's basically HALVING the miss rate, while simultaneously going for longer field goals. This is a couple years old now but it drills down on the topic https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/kickers-are-forever/ pangstrom fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Mar 27, 2017 |
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Mar 27, 2017 20:16
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Yet the record for longest field goal is like a yard further than it was 40 years ago.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:25
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Volkerball posted:Yet the record for longest field goal is like a yard further than it was 40 years ago. A large part of that is because the risk/reward usually says "just punt it". It's not that they couldn't make 65+ yarders given multiple tries, it's just that it's generally a terrible coaching decision to actually attempt it.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:31
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Yeah, I mean there's a ton of kickers you'd never try it with because they don't have huge legs, but the only time you're really right to do it is when it's the last play before halftime, and their returner sucks or right at the end of the game and you're down 0-3 points. And if it's more then a couple yards over, the team's probably just going to try a Hail mary instead.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:34
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No Safe Word posted:A large part of that is because the risk/reward usually says "just punt it". It's not that they couldn't make 65+ yarders given multiple tries, it's just that it's generally a terrible coaching decision to actually attempt it. At 60+ yards teams will often punt, even if they are desperate for points late in the game, to try and play the field position battle. They like their odds at forcing a 3 and out and playing the field position game more than their odds of kicking a field goal of equal length to one a dude with half a foot kicked 40 years ago.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:35
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No Safe Word posted:A large part of that is because the risk/reward usually says "just punt it". It's not that they couldn't make 65+ yarders given multiple tries, it's just that it's generally a terrible coaching decision to actually attempt it. The rule that on a miss, the opponents get the ball at the spot of the kick has a big impact on this decision.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:37
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Volkerball posted:At 60+ yards teams will often punt, even if they are desperate for points late in the game, to try and play the field position battle. They like their odds at forcing a 3 and out and playing the field position game more than their odds of kicking a field goal of equal length to one a dude with half a foot kicked 40 years ago. Below sea level, no less
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Mar 27, 2017 20:37
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Also the defense is playing soft as hell, so if there's more then a couple of seconds left, they're just gonna give you that 6 yard out pass and suddenly it's no longer a record attempt.
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Mar 27, 2017 20:38
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Deteriorata posted:The rule that on a miss, the opponents get the ball at the spot of the kick has a big impact on this decision. Is it spot of the kick? Not previous line of scrimmage?
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Mar 27, 2017 21:13
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Kalli posted:Yeah, I mean there's a ton of kickers you'd never try it with because they don't have huge legs, but the only time you're really right to do it is when it's the last play before halftime, and their returner sucks or right at the end of the game and you're down 0-3 points. The Akers record-tying field goal a few years ago was the perfect storm - crazy-rear end coach - end of the half - noodle arm qb Even then it literally hit the bottom of the uprights and bounced through.
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Mar 27, 2017 21:15
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Ron Jeremy posted:Is it spot of the kick? Not previous line of scrimmage? Yeah they changed it to the spot of the kick on a missed field goal at some point, maybe at the same time they started using specific kicker balls? Sometime after 1995 or so at the least,. The NFL really has done a few things to try to make kicking harder or a harder decision for a coach and none of it has worked at all unless you're talking 60+ yards. The only thing left is narrowing the goal posts or going to college hash marks.
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Mar 27, 2017 21:25
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Grittybeard posted:Yeah they changed it to the spot of the kick on a missed field goal at some point, maybe at the same time they started using specific kicker balls? Sometime after 1995 or so at the least,. The NFL really has done a few things to try to make kicking harder or a harder decision for a coach and none of it has worked at all unless you're talking 60+ yards. They could make the end zone deeper too.
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Mar 27, 2017 21:34
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Grittybeard posted:Yeah they changed it to the spot of the kick on a missed field goal at some point, maybe at the same time they started using specific kicker balls? Sometime after 1995 or so at the least,. The NFL really has done a few things to try to make kicking harder or a harder decision for a coach and none of it has worked at all unless you're talking 60+ yards. I don't think they would mess with the hash-marks since that also greatly affects the rest of the game.
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Mar 27, 2017 21:50
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Ron Jeremy posted:Is it spot of the kick? Not previous line of scrimmage? Spot of the kick or 20 yard line, whichever is greater.
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Mar 27, 2017 22:26
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Ron Jeremy posted:Is it spot of the kick? Not previous line of scrimmage? College still has it at the previous spot, but yeah, the NFL brings it back to the spot of the kick (watch carefully and you'll see the Referee bean bag the yard line where the holder's kneeling before the play goes off). It's seven yards' difference, you're still giving the ball back somewhere on or around the midfield line. edit: if they really wanted to make field goals harder again, the correct solution would surely be to ban place-kicks and watch Doug Flutie get signed to a multi-million dollar contract at age 60 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3EaLfpZjaw There's actually quite a few punters and kickers who've practiced doing it as a party trick, it's not like nobody would be able to kick a 30-yard field goal for a generation. Volkerball posted:They could make the end zone deeper too. 
Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Mar 27, 2017 |
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Mar 27, 2017 22:31
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Hang on, Kicker Balls? They sub out the football for more kick friendly ball for field goals? I honestly thought it was just the same ball they throw, catch and run with.
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Mar 28, 2017 00:14
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El Seano posted:Hang on, Kicker Balls? Nope, there are special K balls that are only used for kicking. Speaking of, do punters punt normal balls or K balls?
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Mar 28, 2017 00:16
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Punters use K balls. They're a thing to stop people doing incredibly silly things to footballs because supersitition told them it helped, as was detailed in Sports Illustrated when the K balls were first brought in.
Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Mar 29, 2017 |
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Mar 29, 2017 21:10
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Sports Illustrated posted:St. Louis Rams equipment manager Todd Hewitt remembers stopping by the Cleveland Browns' locker room several years ago before a scrimmage game and surprising a veritable Santa's workshop of elves slaving over balls. "It looked like I had just broken up a gambling ring or something," Hewitt remembers. "'Relax,' I told them. 'Everybody does it.'"
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Apr 1, 2017 15:53
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How easy/hard is it to get single-game tickets? My pops and I will be travelling over from the UK to finally see a Broncos home game this season, and ideally we'd like to book our travel as soon as the schedule comes out and we can pick a game - but presumably game tickets won't be on sale for a while. Should we be safe to just book our travel anyway, and pick up tickets (on Stubhub?) closer to the time? Or could that be risky?
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Apr 20, 2017 12:12
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You should be able to find tickets no problem. I bought last minute seahawks tickets a a few years ago, and they weren't that much more on the secondary market.
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Apr 20, 2017 17:16
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Some games will be easier/cheaper than others but yeah it won't be a problem. If you're flying in from the UK I'd say go for the Raiders or Patriots or Cowboys game, though any game can be exciting and any game can turn out a dud.
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Apr 20, 2017 17:42
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Things might be different now since the Broncos suck, but a few years ago I paid twice as much for seats that were half as good as what I've seen at other stadiums for tickets to Raiders/Broncos at mile high. Seats are really in demand, and if you buy last minute, you may end up making the trip just to end up in poo poo seats where you can't see anything. Especially so if you try to go for a primetime or division game. You're safe to book travel, but when tickets go on sale, I'd see what your options are asap. Also keep in mind that if you go later in the season, it's going to be cold. as. gently caress.
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Apr 20, 2017 19:08
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Awesome, thank you. We'll aim to book tickets as far in advance as possible so hopefully should be able to get decent seats!
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Apr 20, 2017 19:55
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Volkerball posted:Things might be different now since the Broncos suck, but a few years ago I paid twice as much for seats that were half as good as what I've seen at other stadiums for tickets to Raiders/Broncos at mile high. Seats are really in demand, and if you buy last minute, you may end up making the trip just to end up in poo poo seats where you can't see anything. Especially so if you try to go for a primetime or division game. You're safe to book travel, but when tickets go on sale, I'd see what your options are asap. Also keep in mind that if you go later in the season, it's going to be cold. as. gently caress. Denver never really SUCKS sucks for an extended period so seats are always going to be expensive. gently caress the Broncos
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Apr 21, 2017 00:48
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Yeah we've been resilient in the socialist NFL but I reluctantly agree with VB that it's not looking great for the Broncos in the nearish term. Broncos fans aren't Packers fans but they're close so there's a lot of latent demand that will fill the stadium even in dry spells. But unless you want really great seats for the very best game on extremely short notice the first line on your trip cost will be the round-trip UK flight.
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Apr 21, 2017 02:55
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With Dorial Beckham-Green being cut from the Eagles after a season I'm seeing a lot of the narrative that he is very talented but just plain lazy, I'm interested to hear of some other players you can name like that. I'm sure there's a lot but just the ones that immediately jump to mind. These are the sort of questions you get bored enough to ask in the middle of the off season...
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Jul 2, 2017 10:42
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The Christine Michael hype train gets going every year, sometimes more than once. Because in shorts and a t shirt the guy seems like he should be a pro bowl RB. Then he has to actually execute in a game situation and just... sucks. He's been on like 5 teams in the last two years and is now probably out of the league.
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Jul 2, 2017 12:23
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El Seano posted:With Dorial Beckham-Green being cut from the Eagles after a season I'm seeing a lot of the narrative that he is very talented but just plain lazy, I'm interested to hear of some other players you can name like that. I'm sure there's a lot but just the ones that immediately jump to mind. JaMarcus Russell is probably the go-to example for that. JaMarcus was a physically amazing talent at QB, but man he just didn't give two shits about the game. He ate and purple drank himself out of even getting another look after 3 years in the league. There's a great Larch post I hope someone will dig up about Russell, but since I don't have that I'll give you a story that may be apocryphal, but if it ain't true it oughtta be. The Raiders would send JaMarcus home each week with a game plan DVD, the DVD would be full of plays and formations and useful stuff to study for the next game. They suspected he wasn't actually studying, so one week they sent him home with a completely blank DVD. JaMarcus never noticed. For a less brazen version of that type of guy Mike Vick admitted he basically never bothered to learn to play quarterback until he got to Philly and worked with Andy Reid. He was still able to do ok early in his career just because he was so amazingly athletic, but he might have been ridiculous if he both had that athleticism and cared as much as he should at the same time. Well that and if the whole dogfighting thing hadn't happened.
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Jul 8, 2017 22:56
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This is from the cheap seats and not addressing anything in particular, BUT: Not all but a lot of the "lazy" stories to me always read like "dude needed therapy" (or, even better, a decent childhood), which doesn't go over great in manly-man football world. The sport is so sensitive to physical talent that all sorts of broken toys who can't deal with any adversity or regulate their emotions are really great at it, until they aren't. Even a lot of industrious guys have hated/escaped classrooms from the start, and in the NFL that can be a killer.
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Jul 9, 2017 02:07
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When discussing defenses being gassed later in the game, why do commentators focus on time of possession instead of snap count?
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Sep 16, 2017 10:51
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It's because it's how it's done in the past / easier to track. Snap count would be better but only other things that come to mind: -Easier to get head around time of possession since "total"of 60 minutes is known -Doubt this is actually a factor but TOP is probably more likely to tell the story they want to tell (since winning teams generally play slower later in the game) Bigger picture, teams actually score a little more in the first half than the second... at least some of that is the winning team killing the clock, but I've never seen good evidence that defenses getting tired more than offenses causes worse defense later in games.
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Sep 16, 2017 13:26
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OperaMouse posted:When discussing defenses being gassed later in the game, why do commentators focus on time of possession instead of snap count? Having not played myself I wondered how the defense was so much more tired for a given amount of play time than the offense.
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Sep 21, 2017 21:32
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pangstrom posted:but I've never seen good evidence that defenses getting tired more than offenses causes worse defense later in games. 
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Sep 21, 2017 21:36
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Ron Jeremy posted:Having not played myself I wondered how the defense was so much more tired for a given amount of play time than the offense. I believe it's just more tiring to play DL than it is OL, and so much of the game starts in the trenches. Only a very few (generally really good) defensive linemen play almost all snaps, and it's a pretty standard thing for offensive linemen to play the entire game unless there's an injury or something. Tempo plays into this too, if offensive teams are going fast and not subbing it means the defense can't safely sub either without risking a 12 men penalty. Which can leave completely gassed guys on the field way longer than anyone (other than the offense) wants them there.
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Sep 21, 2017 21:40
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Sep 21, 2017 21:46
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Larch posted:OK people, I've been watching a lot of football games here taking advantage of NFL Rewind, and I've watched all the Raider games, even those that I'd already seen. I have figured out the problem with Jamarcus Russell, and If you'll give me just a moment to explain it I'm sure you'll see it just as I do.
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Sep 21, 2017 21:51
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Ron Jeremy posted:Having not played myself I wondered how the defense was so much more tired for a given amount of play time than the offense. Chasing people and reacting to their motions is more tiring than running a route or blocking assignment
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Sep 22, 2017 01:12
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