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Will Perez force the dems left? This poll is closed. |
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| Yes |
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33 | 6.38% |
| No |
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343 | 66.34% |
| Keith Ellison |
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54 | 10.44% |
| Pete Buttigieg |
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71 | 13.73% |
| Jehmu Green |
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16 | 3.09% |
| Total: | 416 votes | ||
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So Centrists Thompson, who ran on a progressive Bernie inspired message lost by 6 points in a special election. In a deep red district. Without any support from the DNC until the literal last minute. Going to offer any platitudes for why the Dems should continue to go your way at all?
Crowsbeak fucked around with this message at 04:13 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 04:08
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Sounds like a centrist could have picked up the the extra votes to clinch it 
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Apr 12, 2017 04:12
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Well, he was a white guy running on a populist message, probably also aimed at white people. So according to the Law of the Ultra Wokes gently caress that guy for even trying and the national and state parties were right to abandon him. The Democratic Party doesn't need that kind of person or, in fact, any people at all.
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Apr 12, 2017 04:42
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Not a Step posted:Well, he was a white guy running on a populist message, probably also aimed at white people. So according to the Law of the Ultra Wokes gently caress that guy for even trying and the national and state parties were right to abandon him. The Democratic Party doesn't need that kind of person or, in fact, any people at all. He is pro Obamacare and pro choice, and a civil rights lawyer that's pretty drat woke for Kansas
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Apr 12, 2017 04:46
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The republicans ran ads against Thompson with Nancy Pelosi in them.... I think it would've been better if she had stepped down after the election. She's an easy target for republicans.
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Apr 12, 2017 04:51
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mcmagic posted:The republicans ran ads against Thompson with Nancy Pelosi in them.... I think it would've been better if she had stepped down after the election. She's an easy target for republicans. She held the conference in lockstep on the AHCA, killing the bill. She's a very effective parliamentary leader. I know you hate her because she doesn't pass your insane moral purity test, but you're loving wrong.
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Apr 12, 2017 04:53
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Let me run in Kansas. I feel like if you just give me a Nazi agenda and a smile face that winning would be trivial. After all, we are a center right nation.
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Apr 12, 2017 04:55
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Ogmius815 posted:She held the conference in lockstep on the AHCA, killing the bill. She's a very effective parliamentary leader. I know you hate her because she doesn't pass your insane moral purity test, but you're loving wrong. I can't speak for mcmagic, but I don't hate Pelosi. You're right, she's an effective parliamentary leader. But she has been making a lot of pretty hateable comments like "WE'RE CAPITALIST!  " lately. That's not her failing a moral purity test; that's just a strategic misstep.\/\/\/exactly\/\/\/
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Apr 12, 2017 04:57
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Ogmius815 posted:She held the conference in lockstep on the AHCA, killing the bill. She's a very effective parliamentary leader. I know you hate her because she doesn't pass your insane moral purity test, but you're loving wrong. I don't hate her and she was a good speaker. I'm just not sure if her as the national face of house democrats is all that effective messaging. She's not popular nationally.
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Apr 12, 2017 04:57
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mcmagic posted:I don't hate her and she was a good speaker. I'm just not sure if her as the national face of house democrats is all that effective messaging. She's not popular nationally. Do you think, say, Steny Hoyer would be more popular?
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Apr 12, 2017 04:59
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Ogmius815 posted:Do you think, say, Steny Hoyer would be more popular? No. I don't remember endorcing him for leader...
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Apr 12, 2017 05:04
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Ogmius815 posted:Do you think, say, Steny Hoyer would be more popular? Steny Hoyer would be an even worse choice IMO.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:05
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Majorian posted:Steny Hoyer would be an even worse choice IMO. I agree. That's why I'm glad Pelosi hasn't resigned.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:06
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Ogmius815 posted:I agree. That's why I'm glad Pelosi hasn't resigned. Yeah, but I don't think any of us are calling on her to resign, per se - just to, you know. Not make boneheaded mistakes, especially on camera.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:06
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Ogmius815 posted:She held the conference in lockstep on the AHCA, killing the bill. She's a very effective parliamentary leader. I know you hate her because she doesn't pass your insane moral purity test, but you're loving wrong. I don't have any strong feelings either way about Pelosi, but I really hate it when people frame genuine ideological differences as "YOU'RE JUST MAD THEY DON'T PASS YOUR MORAL PURITY TEST." Do you not realize how dumb and smug that sounds? If you think leftist policy is a bad idea you can explain why, but acting like leftists have no genuine differences with the mainstream Democratic Party and that they're just nitpicking over trivial issues is extremely condescending. How would you feel if a politician was ardently pro-life and anti-gay marriage and someone told you "heh too bad they don't pass your moral purity test"?
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Apr 12, 2017 05:08
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Majorian posted:Steny Hoyer would be an even worse choice IMO. It's time for a new leadership team in the party as a whole. We're talking about people in their late 70s....
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Apr 12, 2017 05:10
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Ytlaya posted:I don't have any strong feelings either way about Pelosi, but I really hate it when people frame genuine ideological differences as "YOU'RE JUST MAD THEY DON'T PASS YOUR MORAL PURITY TEST." Do you not realize how dumb and smug that sounds? If you think leftist policy is a bad idea you can explain why, but acting like leftists have no genuine differences with the mainstream Democratic Party and that they're just nitpicking over trivial issues is extremely condescending. How would you feel if a politician was ardently pro-life and anti-gay marriage and someone told you "heh too bad they don't pass your moral purity test"? Politics is the art of the possible my friend. Working with compromised, imperfect politicians like Pelosi is just a necessary evil.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:13
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Ogmius815 posted:Politics is the art of the possible my friend. Working with compromised, imperfect politicians like Pelosi is just a necessary evil. The problem is, politicians like Pelosi (who I do believe is well-intentioned, don't get me wrong) sometimes drastically underestimate what is possible. That's become a pretty common problem among establishment Dems.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:15
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Yeah, corporate centrism is very possible election strategy, just ask president Clinton.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:16
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rudatron posted:Yeah, corporate centrism is very possible election strategy, just ask president Clinton. Democrats are going to win a lot of elections in the next 4 years. Most of which won't be because of anything they do... mcmagic fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 05:19
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mcmagic posted:Democratic are going to win a lot of exertions in the next 4 years. Most of which won't be because of anything they do... lol no they won't. they just lost a special election because they sat with their thumbs up their rear end instead of helping the local candidate.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:20
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Condiv posted:lol no they won't. they just lost a special election because they sat with their thumbs up their rear end instead of helping the local candidate. In a R+20 district. They literally have nowhere to go electorally but up and Trump is going to be sitting at 40 or lower. That means winning elections. mcmagic fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 05:27
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mcmagic posted:In a R+20 district. They literally have nowhere to go electorally but up and Trump is going to be sitting at 40 or lower. That means winning elections. no it means losing elections because the DNC will do nothing to help! https://twitter.com/SteveKornacki/status/851989659680989184  this was a winnable election, but the DNC decided they didn't want to win. and they'll decide in the future they don't want to win. cause they're idiots and eternal losers
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Apr 12, 2017 05:32
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Condiv posted:no it means losing elections because the DNC will do nothing to help! They're going to have to start winning, if they want to keep getting donor bux.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:32
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Majorian posted:They're going to have to keep winning, if they want to keep getting donor bux. they've been losing for 8 years straight yet they got billions of donor bux. i mean, eventually those will dry up when corporate donors realize dems couldn't win an election against a rock, but dems aren't gonna pull out of that death spiral until it's far too late
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Apr 12, 2017 05:34
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mcmagic posted:In a R+20 district. They literally have nowhere to go electorally but up and Trump is going to be sitting at 40 or lower. That means winning elections. You keep shifting the blame from yourself, onto the voters. Big surprise, that doesn't win you elections.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:35
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Condiv posted:they've been losing for 8 years straight yet they got billions of donor bux. i mean, eventually those will dry up when corporate donors realize dems couldn't win an election against a rock, but dems aren't gonna pull out of that death spiral until it's far too late Well, first of all, to clarify, I meant "start" winning, not "keep." Bad typo. Secondly, at this point, the economic progressives have the momentum in the party. They haven't taken it over completely yet, but I think things like the closeness of this Kansas race will help. Donors don't like to give money to candidates who lose, and the centrists have gotten way too adept at losing.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:39
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i mean, look at these loving idiots https://twitter.com/chuckschumer/status/851985491264237568 their model for the future is the election the chose to lose! they're gonna just do nothing in 2018 and hope they get some wins
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Apr 12, 2017 05:40
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Majorian posted:Well, first of all, to clarify, I meant "start" winning, not "keep." Bad typo. what momentum? empty suit perez was installed to lock us out completely. and he's doing just that by refusing to support economic progressives in even close races. the DNC is only interested in centrism and centrists. they are also not at all interested in taking back power from the republicans
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Apr 12, 2017 05:42
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Condiv posted:i mean, look at these loving idiots I read that differently. Schumer is the king of unprincipled corporate whores among the Senate Dems, but he can see which way the wind is blowing. He knows he can get more donor bux if he starts backing candidates who have a chance of winning. Right now those candidates are the actual progressives, not the centrists. That's why he's at the very least giving lip service to them. It's not much more than lip service, but if even Schumer can see that he has to do that, the Sanders wing of the party is in a stronger position than you think. Condiv posted:what momentum? empty suit perez was installed to lock us out completely. Empty suit Perez is precisely that - an empty suit. He's in a position that doesn't really have the power to shut out economic progressives. He's a centrist, but he can ( be broken to our will.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:43
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Majorian posted:I read that differently. Schumer is the king of unprincipled corporate whores among the Senate Dems, but he can see which way the wind is blowing. He knows he can get more donor bux if he starts backing candidates who have a chance of winning. Right now those candidates are the actual progressives, not the centrists. That's why he's at the very least giving lip service to them. It's not much more than lip service, but if even Schumer can see that he has to do that, the Sanders wing of the party is in a stronger position than you think. what lip service? the DNC was specifically asked to support this candidate and they ignored him. and that's the model chuck schumer says to look forward to in the future. economic progressives getting 0 support from the state or national parties and losing by 6%. why are we even in this loving party when we see no benefit at all? even if i believed schumer was paying lip service to economic progressives (or actually, lets just call the progressives since you're not for racial justice if you ignore economic justice), perez was paying lip service to rural voters and not abandoning them again and guess what we just did!? https://twitter.com/samknight1/status/851990942718492672/photo/1 gently caress the democrats
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Apr 12, 2017 05:47
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Condiv posted:what momentum? empty suit perez was installed to lock us out completely. and he's doing just that by refusing to support economic progressives in even close races.  Perez is neoliberal scum and didn't spend the money gleaned from horrible rich donors in a deep-red Kansas race I mean, maybe they SHOULD HAVE, but you, Condiv, a poster with strong opinions about Democratic Party donors, are MAYBE not the best choice to complain about it.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:47
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Majorian posted:Empty suit Perez is precisely that - an empty suit. He's in a position that doesn't really have the power to shut out economic progressives. He's a centrist, but he can ( be broken to our will. that's why he put money into this winnable election, cause he bent to the pressure from the left. oh wait no he ignored the left and did the centrist thing and he'll do it over and over again. all we'll get out of him is some nice sounding platitudes every so often. the centrists in the meantime will continue to have an iron grip on the party and will happily continue to lose every seat they possibly can to the republicans
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Apr 12, 2017 05:50
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Condiv posted:what lip service? the DNC was specifically asked to support this candidate and they ignored him. and that's the model chuck schumer says to look forward to in the future. Schumer's Senate Minority Leader, not chair of the DCCC; he doesn't make those decisions.  quote:https://twitter.com/samknight1/status/851990942718492672/photo/1 Seriously, stop being mad and pouting. Get out there, and demand of your local and state party leaders that they don't pass up huge opportunities like this again. You keep acting like there's nothing we can do to change this state of affairs, and I can't think of a less-helpful mindset. Centrist Dems are cowards who are desperate to keep their jobs, and if we put pressure on them, they will move.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:51
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For Condiv, you see, hating democrats is a theological matter. Having rejected the Savior, they deserve damnation.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:52
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GreyjoyBastard posted:
collecting all that money from megadonors and then just sitting on it is even worse. why the gently caress are you idiot centrists collecting all that dirty money if not to win?
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Apr 12, 2017 05:52
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Even Paul Ryan dug into his couch for that guy.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:53
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Condiv posted:collecting all that money from megadonors and then just sitting on it is even worse. why the gently caress are you idiot centrists collecting all that dirty money if not to win? So rake them over the coals for it. Help make sure that they don't make that same idiotic mistake again. I don't see what good throwing up your hands and giving up will do.
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Apr 12, 2017 05:55
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Majorian posted:Schumer's Senate Minority Leader, not chair of the DCCC; he doesn't make those decisions. i don't give a flying gently caress what fractious splinter of the DNC makes these decisions. they're making the absolute worst, most idiotic decisions possible and our leadership is nodding along approvingly. quote:Seriously, stop being mad and pouting. Get out there, and demand of your local and state party leaders that they don't pass up huge opportunities like this again. You keep acting like there's nothing we can do to change this state of affairs, and I can't think of a less-helpful mindset. Centrist Dems are cowards who are desperate to keep their jobs, and if we put pressure on them, they will move. lots of people already did this and they ignored us anyways. how many more times do we have to scream "stop forgetting about us" before the dems actually listen?
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Apr 12, 2017 05:56
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Majorian posted:So rake them over the coals for it. Help make sure that they don't make that same idiotic mistake again. I don't see what good throwing up your hands and giving up will do. how? right now it seems like we should just have a parallel structure to the dems and not actuallly work with the dems at all. the money ks04 got came from people donating directly to the guy, so it's probably better that the left consolidate behind the DSA or form a teaparty like party and only donate to that and ignore the DNC. the DNC is a dead failure of an organization
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Apr 12, 2017 05:58
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