|
DarkAvenger211 posted:How should I be using Infantry in this game? It seems impossible to actually move into a city that's held by enemy infantry even if I outnumber them. Most of my guys will end up getting pinned on the way there, not to mention the transports seem to move pretty fast up until you want them to turn into a building to drop off, then they crawl over there while being shot at by tanks n stuff. That is AP at max range. You gain 1 AP for every 100m you close in distance. So, for instance a 14AP gun at 900m is 17AP. But AVRE basically unkillable early game barring a huge gently caress up. Infidelicious fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Apr 16, 2017 |
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 14:57 |
|
|
Don't advance into city that's held by the enemy. Cut off road leading up to the city first. Then advance your infantry up while having a whole bunch of support vehicles shoot at anything that shoots your infantry. MG are probably not going to cut it, you'll want stuff under your support tab. Once you are inside, assault troops like flamethrower and pioneer can help flush out enemies faster. Conscript can capture ground and get shot at as good as any other infantry. Anything short of a Panther will have a hard time knocking out AVRE frontally. Flank it or just shoot it a lot to drive it off. I think most of my AVRE kills in phase A are by panicking it then force it to surrender. pedro0930 fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Apr 16, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:11
|
|
|
Deptfordx posted:The one thing that disappoints me about the game. Well the LuftLande get 307mm railroad artillery (up to 12 barrages worth!) So I wouldn't rule it out. DarkAvenger211 posted:How should I be using Infantry in this game? It seems impossible to actually move into a city that's held by enemy infantry even if I outnumber them. Most of my guys will end up getting pinned on the way there, not to mention the transports seem to move pretty fast up until you want them to turn into a building to drop off, then they crawl over there while being shot at by tanks n stuff. Smoke to block LOS of those tanks, smoke to negate the range advantage of the enemy machine guns until you get into buildings, smoke to create isolated little "rooms" inside the town where you outnumber the enemy that you can see. Aside from that, prep artillery to weaken (but more importantly demoralize) the defenders, and ideally support from your own APCs that have dismounted about 300m away. It's understandable that you find this hard - it's one of the toughest things in Eugen games to get right. An infantry assault on an entrenched and covered position is a precisely choreographed ballet of death and white phosphorus (or whatever they used back in the stone ages). DarkAvenger211 posted:Are conscripts worth anything? Their value is not that they can kill many things or repel attacks, but in that they can occupy a large area for cheap require more points from the opponent to reliably repel. They are good for delaying an advance by the enemy until you can retreat/maneuver better units, or for pushing across the entire front to pressure the enemy into covering more area than they can manage with their smaller more expensive force. Human wave won't work particularly well, but they are great for where you need *something* but it doesn't need to be super effective. I find the 2-man scout teams compliment them well. DarkAvenger211 posted:For some reason I thought airborne infantry would actually be airdropped in but they just come in on trucks. The trucks are basically there to simulate them arriving at the front (although having airdropped units in phase A start forward but scattered would be pretty cool). In this context, they are air-deployed units that have landed and reorganized already. Once they get out of the trucks though the trucks disappear, which helps differentiate mechanized infantry (with real APCs) from just regular mobility while also not forcing you to march infantry all the way across the drat map. DarkAvenger211 posted:And one last thing, how do you deal with an AVRE? The tooltips mention that you need to have an AP value equal to the armor to do anything to it. Nothing seems to have 20 AP. AP goes up by 1 every 100m below the weapons max range -- so a 15AP gun with a Max range of 1000m (for example) has an effective AP of 20 at 500m. So you CAN pop it by getting right close to it. That being said, the way you kill an AVRE is by shooting it from the side, because it only has 20AP in the front. If you can lure it forward or pop out with something just as it is turning you've got a chance. Unfortunately as the LL you are really hurting for good AP options (especially in phase A).
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:13
|
|
|
Where do replays go in the file structure (windows 10)?
Infidelicious fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Apr 16, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:18
|
|
|
Ah ok. Thanks for the tips. I'll see if I can make use of them
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:24
|
|
|
Have they discussed ever having paratrooper actually arrive by plane? I think phase B paratroopers would be awesome.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:27
|
|
|
wins32767 posted:The mobility vs firepower balance is much more shifted to firepower than it was in wargame. Infantry by itself can't advance against dug in opposition and basically nobody brings more than 2 tanks at start. All the infantry player has to do is prevent a breakthrough and massive territory loss. Since you can pick where you setup (holding 51% of the map in your sector isn't your goal), you end up with a stronger than typical defensive posture for the number of units you have. Unless the opponent is doing the same doubling up in a narrow area, it's possible to hold in the high 40s over your part of the map for the first 10-12 minutes of the game. Yeah this. A force configured for defence can shove AT guns and MGs all over the place and make an enemy (who has had to buy a balanced force because he can't predict what you are doing) fight for every inch. Meanwhile two players who have build decks around an all out offensive can roll over one sector completely, establish an unrecoverable advantage there, then start rolling up the flank.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:28
|
|
|
Infidelicious posted:Where do replays go in the file structure (windows 10)? C:\Users\[user]\Saved Games\EugenSystems\SteelDivision e: You may also have to turn off saving to cloud for things to show up there
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:35
|
|
|
Popete posted:Have they discussed ever having paratrooper actually arrive by plane? I think phase B paratroopers would be awesome. They discussed it, to the effect of 'it's not gonna happen'.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 17:36
|
|
|
Hubis posted:Well the LuftLande get 307mm railroad artillery (up to 12 barrages worth!) So I wouldn't rule it out. Missed that. On looking it's actually 380mm, which probably makes them these.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/38_cm_Siegfried_K_(E) 8 rounds a minute seems a bit much, considering they only ever built 4 of them, they operated independantly and the long reload time of a Railway gun. But i'm glad they put superheavy guns in as there's a fair chance we'll see an Allied unit or two with similar fire support.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:03
|
|
|
John Charity Spring posted:They discussed it, to the effect of 'it's not gonna happen'. Any particular reason? I assume they tested it and it was just too difficult to balance.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:04
|
|
|
it didnt happen historically.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:09
|
|
|
Actual reason: it's hard and takes effort.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:20
|
|
|
Alchenar posted:Yeah this. A force configured for defence can shove AT guns and MGs all over the place and make an enemy (who has had to buy a balanced force because he can't predict what you are doing) fight for every inch. Meanwhile two players who have build decks around an all out offensive can roll over one sector completely, establish an unrecoverable advantage there, then start rolling up the flank. Yes, but Octamurk is saying that having only one player for a wide area is just going go badly unless you are playing bads, but anything works against bads. Against those who now what they're doing will be able to push the defender side no problem. That said, in a 4v4, having two players cover 2/3rds of the map would probably work as they can support each other where they join up. Also, one of the flankers could attack the nearest guy from the side/rear after achieving breakthrough.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:20
|
|
|
Deptfordx posted:Missed that. On looking it's actually 380mm, which probably makes them these.. Since I'm pretty sure this falls into "the NDA no longer matters" territory, the British airborne division may get something similar to what you're looking for.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:22
|
|
|
Popete posted:Any particular reason? I assume they tested it and it was just too difficult to balance. That's not how airborne operations work at all, its not like dropping a squad out of a Blackhawk.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 19:46
|
|
|
OctaMurk posted:It's in 6th Airborne and it's called the Willys OP because it is OP 
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 20:26
|
|
|
Paratroopers on a tactical level are bad and dumb and they don't work that way. Airborne were dropped the Night of the invasion and were already on the ground by the time frame we're in. In terms of gameplay it sounds cool but it really just means people dropping them on your reinforcement point over and over. Same poo poo we saw w/ most helo SF in EE except they have even less purpose since they aren't CV hunting. Dropping them to directly reinforce a town sounds cool till you remember nearly every MG equipped unit can shoot up. Mazz fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Apr 16, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 20:35
|
|
|
John Charity Spring posted:They discussed it, to the effect of 'it's not gonna happen'. To expand, airdropping into an active battle is a great way to lose all your planes and soldiers so paratroopers are never used in that way in real life.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 20:41
|
|
|
Crete aside :P Where it was a disaster.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 20:49
|
|
|
Not to mention the consolidation phase of an airborne operation is longer then these matches last and would take place over a third of the map
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 21:03
|
|
|
In terms of game balance, paratroopers would be hard, too. You risk them being easily seen, which means them basically getting stomped the second they hit the ground, a la RUSE. If you do try to drop them like special forces in Wargame (again, purely talking in gameplay points here), they could be obnoxiously unbalanced. So then you'd have to nerf them and then what's the point of doing it at all? I guess if we could just theorycraft, you have airborne available for drop only at the very start. That way they're forced to fight alone if unsupported, but could also work in a pseudo-historical way where they are dropped to secure points early on. Possibly only let them be dropped in open fields or have them suffer casualties/take longer before they can be controlled if they drop into towns/forests. Again, just having fun doing a what-if.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 21:11
|
|
|
The only realistic way to do airborne would basically be to allow airborne troops an extended initial deployment zone that goes almost to half map (there should be a 600m buffer to keep opposing airborne from starting in contact). Deploying in the forward zone halves your ammo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 21:37
|
|
|
You can choose to spawn an M22 but it has like an 80% of starting upside down or mechanically broken.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 21:57
|
|
|
You can buy a Pershing but it spawns in England and just sends you encouraging telegrams.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2017 22:12
|
|
|
You can deploy a Maus but it moves so slowly that continental drift carries its target in the other direction faster than the tank itself can actually advance towards it
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 01:31
|
|
|
You can deploy a Me262 but Hitler insist that it should be used as a ground attack plane, so the American mustangs just rofl while shooting it to pieces.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 01:40
|
|
|
You can deploy a V2 but Hitler insists it must be aimed at London, so it doesn't do anything.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 01:49
|
|
|
I understand paratroopers don't work by dropping into the middle of a fight but this is a game that lets you direct aircraft too attack specific tanks/ground targets so there is some concessions too fun and play ability. Paratroopers dropping in would be a cool cinematic if not very realistic. My guess is it was a pain in the butt to balance infantry being able to drop in behind the enemy and so Eugen just went with "It's not realistic" to end the conversation.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 02:39
|
|
|
For some reason I had two games today where I ran into Luftlande as 3rd Armored while playing with Goons. First time was in hedgerow hell in the middle of Columbelle where the pubbie brought three foot mortars for some reason. I kinda overran his front line with Stuarts, halftracks, and rifles. The second game, the pubbie facing me conceded the entire factory complex and occasionally ran French tanks into my Stuart and Sherman. In Phase B and C, he ran Stugs and Marders into my Shermans. Pubbies make weird decisions. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:00
|
|
|
Paratroopers from the 82nd Airborne dropped directly onto Sainte-Mère-Église during a firefight, but that was, to put it lightly, A Bit of A Fuckup. A more realistic option could be Glider insertions, but I'm not sure the game engine could support modeling the gliders having to land in a perfectly flat field or otherwise die horribly.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:05
|
|
|
Popete posted:I understand paratroopers don't work by dropping into the middle of a fight but this is a game that lets you direct aircraft too attack specific tanks/ground targets so there is some concessions too fun and play ability. Paratroopers dropping in would be a cool cinematic if not very realistic. Forward air controllers saw their first use (in the US army) in the Normandy invasion. Paratroopers tactical dropping into a fight in single sticks like that aren't unrealistic in the sense of including weapons or vehicles that weren't fully fielded. They're unrealistic in the sense that it's cartoonish and jarring in any game that takes itself more seriously then command and conquer.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:06
|
|
|
Digging through some of the tank stats, I think something big is being overlooked by people: Side Armor. Front AV goes up with higher-end tanks -- although it generally seems to lag behind gun AP, meaning that engagements become progressively deadlier at longer ranges. However, the AV on side armor starts at around 3-4 and generally only goes up to 6 even for top-tier tanks (the exception being the Jumbo, with a whopping 12 side AV to go with the 21 AV in the front). What does this mean? A Stuart can pen a Panther (which I believe is 6 side AV) from 600m on the first shot about 60% of the time if it gets a side shot lined up (accounting for both hit and penetration odds). Obviously this can be hard to do especially if the opponent is making good use of the increased accuracy and AP at range to keep his big tanks back behind screening forces; however, even in late game ambushes and maneuver are still very viable with low-end units if you are able to create/recognize/exploit the opportunities.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:13
|
|
|
How am I supposed to do Phase B with only the Jumbo, Command M4, and Sherman 76? That's like three tanks to call in for 1en minutes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:28
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:How am I supposed to do Phase B with only the Jumbo, Command M4, and Sherman 76? That's like three tanks to call in for 1en minutes. Your Phase-B should have both cards of Jumbo and 76 for a total of four.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 03:48
|
|
|
What do you cut elsewhere to fill the tank section?
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 04:48
|
|
|
Historically paratroopers were all sent from a single airfield to capture berlin in a conga line of c-47s and germany lost because they didn't build enough AA and let their barracks be captured
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 06:50
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:What do you cut elsewhere to fill the tank section? Xerxes17 posted:After doing some thinking and reflecting on how I'm using my tanks, I must agree that the M4A3(75)W is kinda poo poo. If you want something to be a distraction/poo poo brick then you take the Jumbo. If you want something to actually shoot and kill things, then you go for a M4A3(76)W. If you want to stomp infantry and ATGs then you should take the M4A3(105)W from the support tab.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 07:07
|
|
|
How would yall describe the learning curve of this game? Easy to pick up and be competent? Difficult to learn? Im assuming its pretty hard to master. E: Are there dumb bullshit strats too? A big turn off of the mp in total war for me was in Shogun 2. Not many people could defeat my trained katana samurai backed up by spear weilding peasants on my flanks to protect against cavalry. It felt pretty op. Pretty much the only thing thing you couldnt beat on the reg were actual good players or gimmicks that were just really annoyingly poo poo to fight. underage at the vape shop fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Apr 17, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 07:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 14:57 |
|
|
I've been cutting AA because gently caress it. Hubis posted:Digging through some of the tank stats, I think something big is being overlooked by people: Side Armor. I've definitely been overlooking this, that's pretty interesting.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2017 07:41
|
|
