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Wolves are quite good at what they do and it's a really good point about leaving them to AI control. Speaking of which, there are noted issues with the AI making very sub-optimal decisions with some loadouts. This is independant of whether they have orders or not. Get the data over to Alex, it looks like he's actively fixing them up
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Apr 26, 2017 21:00
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Is the Carrier Rally Point feature any good? I don't bother with it personally but it's there.
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Apr 26, 2017 21:29
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Psycho Landlord posted:This might be the only time I have ever seen this complaint leveled at the game in my five or six or whatever years of playing it. I don't set waypoints, and they charge into combat and die, when I do set waypoints to keep them completely out of combat they ignore them. They would be fine if they held back, they don't need escorting, they need to stop driving directly into the middle of the enemy and turning off their shields to activate the stupid damage absorber while the enemy shoots half a dozen torpedoes at them. All I need is for carriers, armed with long range missiles and PD weapons, to keep even the slightest bit of distance from the enemy. How hard is it for the AI, normally incapable of engaging a target even if the enemy pulls down its pants and waves its starship dick at them, to not engage a target? This is every carrier I have mind you, the Mora is by far the worst but the Drover does it as well. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 21:34
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OwlFancier posted:I don't set waypoints, and they charge into combat and die, when I do set waypoints to keep them completely out of combat they ignore them. They would be fine if they held back, they don't need escorting, they need to stop driving directly into the middle of the enemy and turning off their shields to activate the stupid damage absorber while the enemy shoots half a dozen torpedoes at them. Which carrier is this, is it a specific one? I haven't really had this problem but I haven't been going for the really hard stuff either (other than like, hegemony system defense fleets and whatnot) e: oh you just answered this. Well, I haven't really had that problem with my Drovers but you might try Herons 
Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 21:55
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A fleet of broken hulls are not that bad at all now, quantity is a really good quality in this version. My fleet of mostly garbage lashers, wolves and the odd mule works perfectly fine for forming a dense line of PD that dilute enemy DPS as good as elite fleets. Due to being more numerous than almost anyone of my targets, my own line will often envelop theirs after I have gotten a few kills too, which gives nice flanking opportunities. Currently the main flaw of this fleet is that it has frigate timers and if I can't kill all big cruisers and capitals fast enough I have to retreat. Otherwise it is superb at allowing the player to stomp way above their weight. In earlier versions of the game I used mostly elite fleets as the constant repurchase and refitting of poo poo tier fodder ships was too cumbersome compared to having elite ships that rarely or never died. Now it rains free poo poo tier hulls and you can just ignore that you lost 5 hulls last fight because you got back 5 other ones instead. I also just found a broken Legion carrier, the only broken thing on it is a 30% decrease in peak performance time. I would classify that as a great trade for the significantly cheaper deployment and maintenance cost. Same as with those -signal strength defects.
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Apr 26, 2017 21:57
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When you fix a D hull it becomes exactly as good as it should be right? No lasting stat damage?
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Apr 26, 2017 22:02
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Flesh Forge posted:Which carrier is this, is it a specific one? I haven't really had this problem but I haven't been going for the really hard stuff either (other than like, hegemony system defense fleets and whatnot) It's literally all of them that I have, it seems to happen more when there's a lot of enemies, I'm perfectly capable of whittling through them piloting a dominator with fighter support but I can tell the carriers to hold position half way across the map and they will just ignore it and drive all the way over to hold position directly in front of my ship making it impossible to shoot and getting themselves instantly owned by the enemy fleet. It's really loving stupid.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:04
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So I am really like the Medusa. Any build recommendations? Not usually a fan of Tachyon stuff.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:08
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Maybe that's why the carriers all have insane armour and HP now, because they love to go to the front line. I don't mind because they make great tanks.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:09
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Sedisp posted:So I am really like the Medusa. Any build recommendations? Not usually a fan of Tachyon stuff. 2 heavy blasters, no missiles, a couple PD lasers, max vents and capacitors and whatever +weapon range mods you can fit. It hits extremely hard, you zip in, fire 4-5 heavy blaster shots off then use your little warp jump thing to get back out of range and vent, repeat. You're fast so use that to work together with your fleet to flank.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:10
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OwlFancier posted:It's literally all of them that I have, it seems to happen more when there's a lot of enemies, I'm perfectly capable of whittling through them piloting a dominator with fighter support but I can tell the carriers to hold position half way across the map and they will just ignore it and drive all the way over to hold position directly in front of my ship making it impossible to shoot and getting themselves instantly owned by the enemy fleet. Recruiting cautious and timid officers for your carriers should help keep them out of the fire. I don't know your fleet setup, but it might be that you have a few too many carriers and not enough direct combat ships, which might cause a Mora or Drover to think "well, looks like it's my job to hold the front line." Sedisp posted:So I am really like the Medusa. Any build recommendations? Not usually a fan of Tachyon stuff. Railguns or light needlers on the universal mounts is a great choice, really helps eat through shields.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:13
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Phase lances on the Medusa, Heavy Blasters if you can't get Phase Lances.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:15
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Gobblecoque posted:Recruiting cautious and timid officers for your carriers should help keep them out of the fire. I don't know your fleet setup, but it might be that you have a few too many carriers and not enough direct combat ships, which might cause a Mora or Drover to think "well, looks like it's my job to hold the front line." They're using cautious officers but I don't have any timid ones. I'm using two carriers, one cruiser, and one destroyer, but it still makes no sense that the carriers keep trying to kill themselves from the get go.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:24
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You need a screen of more ships to protect your carriers
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Apr 26, 2017 22:28
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Baronjutter posted:When you fix a D hull it becomes exactly as good as it should be right? No lasting stat damage? Careful here. Sometimes the damaged (D) variant has inherent stat differences, as well as the D hullmods. You can restore the D hullmods away but it will not change a D variant into a base variant Edit: Also the D hullmod Destroyed Weapon Mounts can never be restored away. Which ship are you talking about? I am literally updating the wiki right now and can check TheWetFish fucked around with this message at 22:32 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 22:29
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Put timid officers in your carriers if its such a huge issue, Most of my carriers can hold their own even if they bull rush a fleet so Im wondering what your fleet loadout is like. For the medusa I have been putting those remnant Ion gatling guns because they shred shields,armor and hull and basically stun locks everything up to capitials. It works great on fighters too.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:36
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TheWetFish posted:Careful here. Sometimes the damaged (D) variant has inherent stat differences, as well as the D hullmods. You can restore the D hullmods away but it will not change a D variant into a base variant How do I know if it's the D version or not? Every ship recovered is a D. I restored an eagle that had a bunch of D mods and it seems mint and exactly like my store-bought eagle except it has 50 speed rather than 55, that's the only difference but it doesn't list anything like "fuckled engines" and it displays itself simply as an "eagle" with no "D"
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Apr 26, 2017 22:40
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Baronjutter posted:You need a screen of more ships to protect your carriers I shouldn't need a screen of more ships to stop my carriers literally killing themselves. Again I'm not failing to protect them, the enemy fleet ordinarily concentrates on me and I can hold the fleet off by myself, the issue is when the carriers decide to fly directly into the enemy fleet instead of holding position back behind the line. The enemy isn't outmaneuivering me or anything, they are engaging my front line ship and the carriers kill themselves.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:42
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Baronjutter posted:You need a screen of more ships to protect your carriers Yeah, just something like 3-4 Wolves or Lashers would help out a lot.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:43
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The issue with small ships is that they also like to just kill themselves by overcomitting to the fight. I don't want to be replacing ships every fight, that's what fighters are for.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:47
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Baronjutter posted:How do I know if it's the D version or not? Every ship recovered is a D. I restored an eagle that had a bunch of D mods and it seems mint and exactly like my store-bought eagle except it has 50 speed rather than 55, that's the only difference but it doesn't list anything like "fuckled engines" and it displays itself simply as an "eagle" with no "D" Eagles are fine  Not every ship recovered is a D variant, although it is somewhat rare. You can tell which variant it is by either checking the picture against the wiki, in particular the colouration, or by mousing over the question mark button for the ship in the Fleet screen. All Eagle variants have 50 base speed now, not 55. I just updated the wiki for Eagles maybe half hour ago
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Apr 26, 2017 22:51
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OwlFancier posted:The issue with small ships is that they also like to just kill themselves by overcomitting to the fight. I don't want to be replacing ships every fight, that's what fighters are for. so add in a HVD hammerhead or something
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Apr 26, 2017 22:51
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My fleet is 2 Eagles, 2 medusas, 2 Heron fast carriers, and 3 of the big fat new dumpy carriers (probably same as yours), and a few sunders and hammerheads just for what ever. During a big battle I do find the tanky carriers like to go to the front and tank, but they're ok because the eagles and other ships are all making a line together with them and it's not like anything can get close to them to actually shoot at them because *SPARK STORM* Your carriers are tough ships and they probably think it's their job to get up front and tank since you have no one else to do it. Either they do that, or the enemy comes to them since they are slow. But either way without more support they are going to be the front line because they're the only line. In the old version there was a rally carrier and strike order, I miss those. I'd love to be able to give all carriers a general rally point and also give all fighters a target to focus on. It would also be nice if my anti-armour cruisers were a touch more aggressive and random ships didn't pair off with enemies and dance off together into the far corner of the map for the entire battle too. Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 22:51
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OwlFancier posted:I shouldn't need a screen of more ships to stop my carriers literally killing themselves. You should contact Alex about this. I've been fielding mostly-carrier fleets and it hasn't been a problem for me but that's probably because having a large number of fighters/bombers pretty much wipes out everything before the carriers can actually get near it anyway, which doesn't mean it's not broken.
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Apr 26, 2017 22:52
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OwlFancier posted:The issue with small ships is that they also like to just kill themselves by overcomitting to the fight. I don't want to be replacing ships every fight, that's what fighters are for. Maybe a few Monitors with Cautious officers? They're quite survivable little distractions
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Apr 26, 2017 23:00
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I don't think I've ever seen a monitor but if I do those would be useful.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:01
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OwlFancier posted:I don't think I've ever seen a monitor but if I do those would be useful. They're stupid rare and it kills me inside.  I love my dumb li'l hamster ball.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:23
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I'm not seeing any of the behavior you're talking about among my carrier fleet. I'm not using any Drovers, but I have a Heron, a Condor, and a Mora and I routinely deploy all three into larger fights. None of them have Officers on them, since those are mainly on my cruisers/high end destroyers, and with the sole exception of the Heron chasing down smaller ships I haven't once had a Carrier commit itself to a brawl in progress or charge enemy ships. In fact, if anything, the Mora is a bit too cautious overall, and likes to sit far enough back that it's fighters have too long a travel time to factor into larger engagements. Pretty much the only time my carriers see direct combat outside of the Heron on full assault orders is if the carriers are chased down and attacked directly by enemy ships, so I really dunno what to tell you, Owl. I'd say look at your loadouts, but if they're all packing LRMs and PD like you said then
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Apr 26, 2017 23:30
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If I deploy the single enemy condor in the simulator it happily sits out of my sensor range and launches fighters at me, if my carriers would do that I'd be chuffed.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:32
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OwlFancier posted:If I deploy the single enemy condor in the simulator it happily sits out of my sensor range and launches fighters at me, if my carriers would do that I'd be chuffed. out of curiosity (I don't know if this has already been asked) what kind of weapons are on your carriers? You might make sure that ONLY point defense and long range missiles such as Pilums are equipped so they aren't attempting to engage other ships.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:35
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OwlFancier posted:The issue with small ships is that they also like to just kill themselves by overcomitting to the fight. I don't want to be replacing ships every fight, that's what fighters are for. Wolves don't really do that in my experience. They'll harass and occupy groups of enemies potentially all battle long just by themselves without ever putting themselves in much danger which is really useful, letting your heavy hitters punish isolated groups. And they still have enough firepower to pull their weight in actual fighting. Lashers will rarely go down but that's okay because they're meant to be front line fighters and they're super cheap and common.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:39
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OwlFancier posted:I'm using two carriers, one cruiser, and one destroyer, but it still makes no sense that the carriers keep trying to kill themselves from the get go. As far as frigates go, I find that for bigger fights Unstable Injectors are a must, since their speed and mobility is pretty much the only thing that keeps them alive. My two Tempests have been rocking those and they've been able to survive everything they've faced so far, including Tri-Tach fleets fielding an Astral and multiple Aurora's.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:42
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Kenshin posted:out of curiosity (I don't know if this has already been asked) what kind of weapons are on your carriers? Literally just MGs/vulcans and Pilums. I think if I put a long range ballistic gun on it they actually keep range better, I am not sure if they're trying to use their PD guns to brawl but I feel like they might. Here's some screenshots of them in a fight that they didn't completely gently caress up, you can see they're still way closer than they need to be.   Yes guys when I give you the order to hold position 2000 units away I really mean "try to headbutt the enemy cruiser with your flight deck" The mora has injectors too so it's 75 top speed, it can move, it just moves into the enemy fleet and stays there. On the plus side I am happy to report that devastator cannons are pretty funny on a dominator. You can just hose down the area in front of you with hellflak. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 23:46
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OwlFancier posted:On the plus side I am happy to report that devastator cannons are pretty funny on a dominator. You can just hose down the area in front of you with hellflak. Nothing smaller than a cruiser can get anywhere near it.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:51
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I put hypervelocity drivers in there and use it to headbutt cruisers once they overload when I'm not sweeping for smaller ships. It's got enough small PD weapons that the flak seemed superfluous.
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Apr 26, 2017 23:53
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Is there a way to see how far away a star system is BEFORE you accept a contract? I can't even find a decent search on the map.
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Apr 27, 2017 00:09
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Falcon2001 posted:Is there a way to see how far away a star system is BEFORE you accept a contract? I can't even find a decent search on the map. It says at the right of the contract how far away it is, how long it will take to get there, and how much fuel it will need.
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Apr 27, 2017 00:12
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Falcon2001 posted:Is there a way to see how far away a star system is BEFORE you accept a contract? I can't even find a decent search on the map. Mouse over the mini-map icon (that shows the destination system name) on the comm screen. Also the direction of the yellow arrow that points to the star system on the mini map shows you the general direction that star is from where you are, while the length of the yellow arrow gives you a rough idea how far it is.
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Apr 27, 2017 00:13
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Vietnom nom nom posted:Mouse over the mini-map icon (that shows the destination system name) on the comm screen. Also the direction of the yellow arrow that points to the star system on the mini map shows you the general direction that star is from where you are, while the length of the yellow arrow gives you a rough idea how far it is. Just remember that it shows the time and fuel to get there. Not there and back.
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Apr 27, 2017 00:27
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OwlFancier posted:Yes guys when I give you the order to hold position 2000 units away I really mean "try to headbutt the enemy cruiser with your flight deck"  I normally never even bother with waypoints though, and they do just fine on their own.
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Apr 27, 2017 00:30
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