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I actually suggest we get some ASuM capability. Preferably a frigate or maritime suveilance and attack craft like the P-3 Orion. I'll lay out a suggrstion later.
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May 22, 2017 14:27
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SlightlyMad posted:F-18C/D Hornet with all the bells and whistles, like Growler variants. that would be the F-18G Super Hornet for the growler
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May 22, 2017 14:28
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Because some of us care about things besides just money. Then you're in the wrong profession friend.  I also echo what koolkevz666 said. We have a weird group think right now where people salivate over and are trying to get the most modern and advanced weapons possible, but also wanting to keep the game interesting and challenging. If we keep getting insane BVR planes and bombtrucks that can carry gross numbers of cruise missiles, then there wont be much stuff that can challenge us without Yooper throwing lots of gen 5 (insane hard to kill stuff) at us and that has a real risk of killing our whole company. Basically, before asking for Eagles and Growlers, look at older stuff.
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May 22, 2017 14:28
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Yooper posted:Provisional Angola Crazycryodude posted:Although I'm still incredibly pessimistic about Angola's future (western megacorps "assisting" in building the governments of resource-rich African countries never ends well for the locals), at least it's not total anarchy yet. As to wishlists...well, I figure a good source on potential options might be the stuff the USAF has in its Boneyard. Granted, this is a few years out of date, but this does give us some idea of what might be on the market. I'm sure there's still a bunch of the older stuff there if we want to buy in bulk. Certainly, if anyone wants Thunderbolts, there might still be some kicking around there. As for my wishlist in particular, maybe we could look into grabbing some Canadian Hornets as my choice of fighters/multirole. The Canucks are already phasing those out if they haven't already, so they should be cheap, but they come with some nice sensor upgrades compared to their USAF counterparts (albeit less munitions options, but most of those would be the most modern stuff that would be more expensive & harder to procure). Hell, if we ever went and got ourselves a carrier of our own, we should still be able to operate them, since they still have all the arrestor hooks/reinforced landing gear built in. A flight of four would be nice. Some Brazilian Hinds might be nice for extra flexibility. Or just Hinds in general - providing ground attack options, as well as transport utility. Not really sure what in particular we should be aiming for for dedicated support, maybe another AWACS? There was an E-3A at the Boneyard last I checked, (also an E-3G, but that's more expensive and I'm not sure it would offer enough of a benefit for the extra expense).
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May 22, 2017 14:28
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Tythas posted:that would be the F-18G Super Hornet for the growler Right you are. Scrap the Growler then, C/D versions would do.
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May 22, 2017 14:30
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Hey, Yooper, question: if memory serves up until now you've been assuming that anyone who gets shot down survives and gets medevac'd. What about cases like poor Survivor and I where we eat a Guideline to the face? In those scenarios survival seems... unlikely but I'm awful at coming up with callsigns (I've also gotten weirdly attached to my pixelpilot  ) and I like the idea of Survivor living up to his name.
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May 22, 2017 14:32
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Always possible you punched out before the missile turned the cockpit into a cloud of shrapnel.
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May 22, 2017 14:36
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Sweet, Angola's on its way to becoming dystopian cyberpunk Norway. Could have gone worse. Is it possible to upgrade the current Gripens from Cs to Es? Edit: We should buy older fighters and ground attack aircraft but support them with cutting edge EWAR/AWACS/Recon. PenguinSalsa fucked around with this message at 14:46 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 14:37
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Crazycryodude posted:Always possible you punched out before the missile turned the cockpit into a cloud of shrapnel. SK60s can punch out? Maybe if we did the WW2 thing and just dumped ourselves over the side.
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May 22, 2017 14:37
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They don't come with ejectors right out of the factory, but Wikipedia says that they can be easily fitted so let's just assume our version has them.
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May 22, 2017 14:39
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Crazycryodude posted:Always possible you punched out before the missile turned the cockpit into a cloud of shrapnel. That's my own pet theory if Yooper says that it's kosher. As for Angola, things at least sound like they could get better. You go, guys!  Not sure how to feel about Tesla and Apple providing guidance, though... in the best case scenario it means that no-one's going to mess with Angola because they'll get smacked down hard if they do. In the worst case scenario we're going to get a form of Free State shenanigans despite our best efforts. When it comes to procurement... I'm not any good at that stuff, I'll wait and see what everyone comes up with.
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May 22, 2017 14:43
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Soup Inspector posted:Hey, Yooper, question: if memory serves up until now you've been assuming that anyone who gets shot down survives and gets medevac'd. What about cases like poor Survivor and I where we eat a Guideline to the face? In those scenarios survival seems... unlikely but I'm awful at coming up with callsigns (I've also gotten weirdly attached to my pixelpilot In all cases the pilots survive. The hero never dies. He might pass out, lose limbs, get eaten by a shark, but he never dies.
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May 22, 2017 14:43
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Soup Inspector posted:Hey, Yooper, question: if memory serves up until now you've been assuming that anyone who gets shot down survives and gets medevac'd. What about cases like poor Survivor and I where we eat a Guideline to the face? In those scenarios survival seems... unlikely but I'm awful at coming up with callsigns (I've also gotten weirdly attached to my pixelpilot Could always let the other goons come up with a callsign for your new dude. I feel like on the one hand, if all our pilots can get off scott-free without dying, you kind of lose the impact somewhat. But on the other hand, people are going to get attached to their pilots. Perhaps we could have a 'three strikes' system? Doesn't ejecting usually gently caress up your body quite bad to the point they ground you from flying any ejector-equipped aircraft again? So if you bail out three times, your guy either needs to migrate to a support role or retire. Or, say, maybe goons can tag their pilots with a 'death flag' if they're willing to let their guys bite the big one in the name of dramatic stakes. Does CMANO reflect pilots being able to eject successfully or not?
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May 22, 2017 14:44
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Spitballing new airframe ideas-Paingod556 posted:If we really need some strike craft and more ECM/ELINT... how bout a combo of the EF-111 Sparkvark and RF-111 Pig? Former has the full spectrum of ECM MIJI gear but no weapons, while the latter has a recon package in the fuselage bays plus can still haul regular iron bombs These plus a regular F-111F Aardvark would be the 'shut up and take my money' requests. Beyond that, I'm gonna throw in options that fit with Swedish Supremacy along with the Gripen, and have some parts commonality- Viggens The JA-37 as a standard fighter, and able to handle the early model AIM-120B Slammers The AJ-37 as a strike fighter, specifically the AJS model SlightlyMad recommended The SK-37E for ELINT/EW, could potentially fill a more direct MIJI support role by operating alongside the strike package Viggens
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May 22, 2017 14:46
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Jimmy4400nav posted:Basically, before asking for Eagles and Growlers, look at older stuff. I only ask for Eagles because they happen to be one of my favorite planes.  Anyway my wish list is: Multirole: 2-4 F-15E Strike Eagles or F-15SAs. We could use the variant without AESA radar as well Ground Attack: 4 A-10 Cs 8-10 Turkish F-4 Phantoms Sell the Greek Phantoms if needed? 2-4 Tornado GR.4s or 2 Saudi Tornadoes. Sell German ones in both cases, sell all if taking British Tornadoes 4 A-6E Intruders Support: 1 E-2C Hawkeye 1 S-3B Viking especially if we're in a maritime environment Yeah I know if we get all of these, planning will be even more complicated and things like the A-10 and A-6 are probably redundant, but I wanted these planes thrown in voting for people to vote for. Dreamsicle fucked around with this message at 14:56 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 14:54
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Yvonmukluk posted:Doesn't ejecting usually gently caress up your body quite bad to the point they ground you from flying any ejector-equipped aircraft again? Yeah, if memory serves it compresses (and fucks up) your spine.
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May 22, 2017 14:57
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Welcome to power crystals' BM the MX procurement proposals, wherein we wind up with a bunch of similar yet different stuff to drive the maintenance guys insane. Nothing but the finest in bizarre and/or decrepit airframes because I want an airforce with character, not a... well, anything that would make sense. Feel free to hit the ? on my posts if you want to review the things I've posted about. I have no idea on costs so let's just hope it's all or mostly cheap. Fighters: MiG-31 x2 - the best thing here, as they have some nice missiles Iranian F-14 x2 - the ultimate fighter comedy option Ground Strike: Israeli F-4 x2 - Delilahs are sweet Iranian F-4 x4 - hey, team warcrimes, this one is for you A-6E x4 - sea mines Romanian MiG-21 x2 - owning Fishbeds is required, and these have laser guided bombs Support: P-3C x1 - we do not have one of these Italian Tornado ECR x1 - AARGMs are good Other: Any mobile ground search radar with a range >= 250nm. The Saudis have probably managed to misplace a Patriot battery by now; I just want the search radar. I'm hoping that part is cheap. power crystals fucked around with this message at 15:16 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 15:10
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Come to think of it, this scenario is actually perfectly in character for all parties. Remember, Tesla's war goals were "lithium not controlled by the Dictator or China." Apple's were "lithium not controlled by the Dictator, China, or Tesla." A free, independent, and stable Angola makes both of them happy, and avoids the ridiculous materiel losses war brings. It's not ideal, but there's room yet for hope.
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May 22, 2017 15:13
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Yooper posted:In all cases the pilots survive. The hero never dies. He might pass out, lose limbs, get eaten by a shark, but he never dies. Man I'm glad our boys safely bailed out over an MSF field hospital.
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May 22, 2017 15:15
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power crystals posted:Welcome to power crystals' BM the MX procurement proposals, wherein we wind up with a bunch of similar yet different stuff to drive the maintenance guys insane. Nothing but the finest in bizarre and/or decrepit airframes because I want an airforce with character, not a... well, anything that would make sense. Feel free to hit the ? on my posts if you want to review the things I've posted about. I endorse this Good List of Fun Planes. I'd double up on the Tornado, though.
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May 22, 2017 15:16
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glynnenstein posted:I endorse this Good List of Fun Planes. Just a reminder : You can suggest planes but the available planes will not likely reflect exactly what you want. It's all about compromises. Sure, you can get some F-15SE's, but now you ain't got poo poo for money for the rest. Quantities will be fixed too.
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May 22, 2017 15:24
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Yooper posted:News out of Cabinda. Transcript: "Angola is different today. Behind me, a statue of a Totoro, the mascot of the Free State, is a burnt husk, with a propane tank welded on for a penis. Gunfire still echoes through the streets as Congolese forces drive out the looters and Randites. A garish anime pillow bounces in the wind while a dog runs by with a flesh light in his mouth. But what of Angola itself? Delvanios Dos Santos is rumored to have been killed, as his helicopter was shot down by the mercenary group Hired Goons as he tried to escape General Mbeke's forces. General Mbeke's vehicle struck a landmine, right at his most triumphant moment. Count Vidas Von Hoff, the aging european, was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot wound. What seemed a certainty yesterday is now foggy. Representatives from both Apple and Tesla have stepped in to assist the Angolan Provisional, now Regular, Government to re-stabilize the country. China has protested strongly to the UN, but is, once again, left out in the cold. The world sighs in relief as the lithium flows. This is Sara Hattie, reporting for CBN news in Cabinda."
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May 22, 2017 15:31
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Yooper posted:Just a reminder : You can suggest planes but the available planes will not likely reflect exactly what you want. It's all about compromises. Sure, you can get some F-15SE's, but now you ain't got poo poo for money for the rest. Quantities will be fixed too. Oh, I misread and I thought this was a list of frames for proposal for a procurment like the one before Angola. I'll edit minr to make it more complete and add more fun stuff where I can How long do I have to edit though? I'll be out for a while.
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May 22, 2017 15:37
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No matter what we do can we please please pleaaaaaase sell off the last Sk60s? Their novelty value has long since faded and I'd like to actually be able to contribute to operations in ways that don't get summed up as "missile magnet."
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May 22, 2017 15:39
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Yeah that's why I skipped all the stuff everybody else already covered (like EWAR). If we get even a few of the things in my list I will be thrilled. e: that's not true! You're a AAA magnet too!  but yeah we need to lose those one way or the other. And those guys need first dibs on any new airframes
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May 22, 2017 15:39
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So if I'm understanding this right, what we do is list out what we want for the various roles of Fighter/Multirole, Attack, and Support, and then based on whichever is the most popular Yooper comes up with our final shopping list? How much money do we have? EDIT: And what are we selling off, and how much are we getting for it? Beer4TheBeerGod fucked around with this message at 15:44 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 15:40
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Because some of us care about things besides just money. Branding is very important to future revenue.
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May 22, 2017 15:41
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Ok, I have a package that is realistic and grant us some modern capabilities from a single source. This is all equipment that is set to be put out of service in the near future so should be realistic and ideal for us. THE NORWEGIAN SOLUTION.  Wishlist: Fighters 6x F-16AM Fighting falcon MLU 2007 Price: 180 million USD (estimated price is around 30 million USD) AMRAAM and IRIS-T, plenty of guided munitions, ASM capability, you standard modern F-16 Perfect to take the load of the gripens. http://cmano-db.com/aircraft/730/ Attack: 1x P-3C Orion P-3C Orion Update III - 2001, UIP Upgrade Price 35 million http://cmano-db.com/aircraft/362/ wanna drop sonar buoys and torpedoes from our radar surveilance aircraft? Yes! Yes we do. Utility: 16x Bell 412SP - 1988, Augusta-Bell utility helicopters http://cmano-db.com/aircraft/2887/ providing vertical transport for insertion of cargo and infantry. Price: 80 million USD Now all this stuff either grant us new capabilities that makes us more flexible and able to take on a variety of missions or take a load of the gripens by buying modern F-16s. The centerpiece here is the P-3C Orion. This gives us genuine long range maritime surveilance and radar far outstripping our current capabilities as well as the ability to go submarine hunting, all in the same package. orcbuster fucked around with this message at 16:45 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 15:42
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We're just making suggestions of things we want and I think Yooper is going to semi-arbitrarily pick from that broad collection to make interesting sub-lists for voting. We had problems finding capable F-111 frames still in use, but I think some of these Fencers might not be too hard to come by.
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May 22, 2017 15:42
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I agree that it's time for the Dragon Slayers to retire, but for the whatever-th time I think they should become a display squadron/get put on a plinth outside company HQ, not get sold for scrap.
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May 22, 2017 15:50
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Alright, I'm rationalising my list of proposals. Fighters: 4 x Canadian CF-18A Hornets (CF-18Bs are also acceptable) 4 x Moroccan Mirages Attack: 4 x Brazilian Mi-35M4 Hind Alternatively: 4 x Venzulan Mi-35M2 Alternatively: 4 x Cypriot/Myanmaran Mi-35P (Cyprus doesn't have an entry in the database, by they do have Hinds they're looking to sell - might alternatively use the Indonesian entry to represent them). Utility: 1 x Australian E-737 Wedgetail Yvonmukluk fucked around with this message at 16:05 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 15:51
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Crazycryodude posted:I agree that it's time for the Dragon Slayers to retire, but for the whatever-th time I think they should become a display squadron/get put on a plinth outside company HQ, not get sold for scrap. Repeating this while I figure out what I want from the shopping list...
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May 22, 2017 15:52
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Okay, here's some preliminary things I'd like to do: Beer's Wishlist To Do No Matter What 1. Sell/license/franchise/whatever the following aircraft: 2 AMX A.11, 2 Mirage F1.CR, 3 Saab SK60B, 1 SU-25 Frogfoot 2. Refit the German Tornado's to the Saudi configuration. Basically I'd like to consolidate out the airframes that have limited utility and use those funds and logistical capacity focusing on other platforms. The AMX, Mirage, and SU-25 all have limited standoff strike capability or can only perform in limited conditions (like daylight with clear weather). I have other plans, but this is the starting point and I'm curious as to what people think.
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May 22, 2017 15:58
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Sonic Assassin's list for Santa Dear santa I've kinda decent so I thought you should consider te followingen: SU-25T: Those scallions man are pretty cool. They can role up armour pretty wel and enough war crime weapons for those of that inclination. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=2513 SU-24M2 Fencer D: Bombtruck-a-Palooza. Cheap and cheerfull. Just like my mom. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=600 Tornado's: Either GR 4+ or those Saudi ones. Brimstones, Storm Shadows, lions and tiger. Also many other decent options depending on frame. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=3893 MQ-9 Reaper: The one with the Gorgon stare pod. I don't think i have to explain this one. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=4536 MiG-31 B/BM: This is one mean long range interceptor. Especialy the BM version with the AA-13 Arrow (160 miles range) Active radar. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=3963 JAS Gripen E: Like the C's we have just bigger, better, stronger, etc. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=3367 MH-60 Blackhawk: The series don't matter much to me but we can use these for SAR and all sorts of operations. I mean com'on we all have seen Apocalypse Now! Link:https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=1606 ECH-130H: This is a pretty big EW platform, good endurance and range, no self Compass Call defence though. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=3718 P-3C Orion: ASW and maritime patrol craft. i don't know about you but I have the feeling we might need a plane like this. Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=306 AN-12 or 26 EW: Cheaper alternative for an EW plane? Link: https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=2293 Comedy option: Boeing 747-CMCA: Check this link, it will tell you everything you need to know!: Click here
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May 22, 2017 15:58
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Right now we're leaning heavily on the Grippens for CAP and SEAD roles. From our experiences in Angola it's clear that modern air defense networks require saturation to get through reliably, which means that hurling a bunch of SDBs is a great option to run them out of ready missiles. I think we can most improve the quality of our operation (and the entertainment value) if we put the Grippens into primarily a CAP role and augment our strike craft with either Russian/Soviet planes with high velocity missiles or something else to carry SDBs/other medium range bombs in quantity. Cruise missiles seem like they're not working very well against layered AA defenses, since the AAA has been pretty good at knocking them down.
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May 22, 2017 15:58
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Loel posted:Sorted by price, using http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/air-force-aviation/aircraft-prices-952/ and wiki Have a blast from the past. Our wishlist from the beginning of the campaign.
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May 22, 2017 16:02
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glynnenstein posted:We're just making suggestions of things we want and I think Yooper is going to semi-arbitrarily pick from that broad collection to make interesting sub-lists for voting. I've dug a bit into the Fencer, I'm just a sucker for the F-111. Maybe we could pinch a few of these on the way out. Also the Fencer-F for EW work to go with it.
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May 22, 2017 16:04
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Don't forget we could also get some attack helicopters. AH-64Es might be fun to have flying around, and they can use up to 16 Hellfires apiece. Velius fucked around with this message at 17:32 on May 22, 2017 |
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May 22, 2017 16:18
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Velius posted:Don't forget we could also get some attack helicopters. AH-64Es might be fun to have flying around, and they can use up to 16 Hellfires apiece. I've been pushing for Hinds this whole
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May 22, 2017 16:20
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Hey out of curiosity, DB nerds, are there any decent/viable F-104 variants? Not necessarily for our use, I'm thinking an eccentric billionaire wanted a plane, paid for the production line, and then the opportunity was seized on by a record label trying to push an indie label by creating the Seattle Starfighters.
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May 22, 2017 16:21
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