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DuckDynasty posted:People are missing the most important part of these loan documents... paragraph 24.1 and 24.2. 
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Jun 24, 2017 20:36
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DuckDynasty posted:
Ortwin is playing 4d chess, see when the funding dries up and no game comes out - they can go welp we tried also we don't have anything except the IP how about we start from the beginning with a new kickstarter, star citizen fans!?!?!
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Jun 24, 2017 20:38
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big nipples big life posted:I wonder if the limited edition 911 belongs to Chris or CIG. The company he's leasing it from .
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Jun 24, 2017 20:40
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24. LICENCE 24.1 The Chargee, ( bank ), hereby grants to the Chargor , ( CIG ), an exclusive license, revocable only in accordnance with Clause 24.2, to develop, produce, exploit and otherwise deal with the Game. 24.2 The Chargee, ( bank ), may terminate the license granted pursuant to Clause 24.1 above upon the happening of an Event of Default which remains unremedied on the date failing 60 days after the the Chargee has given written notice to the Chargor of such Event of Default.
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Jun 24, 2017 20:41
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shrach posted:To be fair, I think specifically the IP is not included. It's awkward. It's there under 5.1.2: quote:all that copyright in the game, programmes and any sound recordings made in the course of the production of the Game or pursuant to any right acquired in connection with, or arising from, the production of the Game [...]
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Jun 24, 2017 20:43
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shrach posted:To be fair, I think specifically the IP is not included. It's awkward. It includes the IP. They basically put up everything, including the farm and the kitchen sink, as collateral. By all accounts, this was a very desperate loan. https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08703814/charges/AHMo7d0tVN50wGM-FC6tbyhYlss - p3, section 4.2, paragraph 1 - p4, section 4.2.1.1 - p5, section 5 (all of it)     The best part? p16, section 24 (all of it)  The bank now owns the project, and gives CIG/RSI permission to continue to develop and sell the game. This is revoked if CIG/RSI goes 60 days without paying their loan. This is basically what happened with Freelancer. Microsoft bought Digital Anvil. Chris failed. Microsoft kicked him out and took over the project. D_Smart fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Jun 24, 2017 |
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Jun 24, 2017 20:46
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peter gabriel posted:Hyperbole aside, what could be a legit reason for the loan? I am trying to think of this from a backers perspective and I am coming up with nothing. They borrowed a large chunk of cash against the company to pay for one large project to be paid for upfront and in cash: Bonuses to be paid to upper management to keep them onboard. And after the company defaults, well, you can't take back bonuses so sorry bank, but enjoy the hours of Gary Oldman running around in a spandex onesie.
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Jun 24, 2017 20:49
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And I thought things couldn't get funnier after the engine change Now SC literally belongs to a bank
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Jun 24, 2017 20:50
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Kellanved fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Jun 24, 2017 |
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Jun 24, 2017 20:50
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Latin Pheonix posted:It's there under 5.1.2: D_Smart posted:It includes the IP. They basically put up everything, including the farm and the kitchen sink, as collateral. By all accounts, this was a very desperate loan. I'm not sure how to parse the entire 29 pages to be honest. I think it's awkward when you read the definitions and it gets excluded. I'm not sure how they can do that, but have a read: 
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Jun 24, 2017 20:52
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I really appreciate that you guys always find something entertaining to laugh at eventually I don't even remember when I started following this poo poo with you, must be years now When was the combined Dayz/doobie/SC thread?
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Jun 24, 2017 20:58
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I hope that when F42 fails and the bank acquires all of the assets that they will continue developing Star Citizen until they too are bankrupt and Great Britain is finally destroyed.
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Jun 24, 2017 20:58
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Decrepus posted:I hope that when F42 fails and the bank acquires all of the assets that they will continue developing Star Citizen until they too are bankrupt and Great Britain is finally destroyed. one can only hope
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Jun 24, 2017 20:59
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Soo  uh-huh.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:02
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Nellistos posted:Event of Default  Uncle Derek please make this the title of your next 10 year game hobby project
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Jun 24, 2017 21:04
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shrach posted:I'm not sure how to parse the entire 29 pages to be honest. I think it's awkward when you read the definitions and it gets excluded. I'm not sure how they can do that, but have a read: It's awkward as you say; the problem is we don't know what the definition of 'the Game' is (the document just says it's defined in the loan agreement, which we can't see) as opposed to what 'Star Citizen' is. This definition may be ring-fencing IP rights for Star Citizen while the 'game' may be referring to Squadron 42, thereby meaning that any copyright used in S42 will be held by the bank while the remaining IP rights would be held by CIG('s other creditors). I'm guessing that if, in some bizarro universe, F42 went under but CIG continued to be in business, CIG would be able to use the IPs F42 made for S42/SC to finish SC.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:09
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i don't know what the best part of this is, that CIG has sold star citizen to a bank, that backers are trying to argue that loans don't mean you don't need money and ignoring the bank owning Star Citizen now, or derek somehow taking a never ending victory lap.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:10
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Latin Pheonix posted:It's awkward as you say; the problem is we don't know what the definition of 'the Game' is (the document just says it's defined in the loan agreement, which we can't see) as opposed to what 'Star Citizen' is. This definition may be ring-fencing IP rights for Star Citizen while the 'game' may be referring to Squadron 42, thereby meaning that any copyright used in S42 will be held by the bank while the remaining IP rights would be held by CIG('s other creditors). I'm guessing that if, in some bizarro universe, F42 went under but CIG continued to be in business, CIG would be able to use the IPs F42 made for S42/SC to finish SC. Well whatever the case is, it's bound to be funny
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Jun 24, 2017 21:13
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Space Crabs posted:backers are trying to argue that loans don't mean you don't need money This right here is currently my favourite thing, it's just 
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Jun 24, 2017 21:13
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Space Crabs posted:i don't know what the best part of this is, that CIG has sold star citizen to a bank, that backers are trying to argue that loans don't mean you don't need money and ignoring the bank owning Star Citizen now, or derek somehow taking a never ending victory lap. It's how the second is happening in an attempt to stop the third from happening because of the first. It's the interconnectedness of it all that makes it glorious.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:13
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Space Crabs posted:i don't know what the best part of this is, that CIG has sold star citizen to a bank, that backers are trying to argue that loans don't mean you don't need money and ignoring the bank owning Star Citizen now, or derek somehow taking a never ending victory lap. You seem to forget that time Apple mortgaged all their iPhone rights for a loan until next payday
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Jun 24, 2017 21:14
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Tijuana Bibliophile posted:Soo Sooooo, if CIG defaults then its no longer CIGs fault its the banks. You can blame the bank because all the goodwill (and badwill) now belongs to the bank
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Jun 24, 2017 21:15
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So what I can gather, in about 6 months the bank is gonna tell CIG to go gently caress themselves, and then take their new toy to a competent developer and actually get the game finished to recoup their investment. Awesome. Can't wait to play this fucker in 2019.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:15
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Needs tens of millions to make a game Raises hundreds of millions Gets a huge loan
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Jun 24, 2017 21:15
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Alright, which one of you is this? You played the long game well. Too well.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:18
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So, I've fine tooth combed it, and due to previous experiences through a third party loving up buying rights, nearly going bankrupt through over manufacture and under performing sales, and having to get a bailout loan, I can say with 100% certainty... This is a bailout loan. Abandon ship anyone with any skin left in the project. The collateral is solid. The bank is insured to a point on business loans, so they can take a reasonable hit and offset the losses by repo-ing everything and auctioning it all off. Music can be sold pretty easily to stock music companies who resell as trailer music, abandoned art assets can be auctioned off to F2P mobile games, and I'm sure some tasteless banker would LOVE a dumb impractical airplane wing desk.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:19
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Guys stop saying this is a goon, because as we all know Star Citizen has it's white knight Maybe what it needs now ...... Is a Dark Knight 
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Jun 24, 2017 21:20
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Cao Ni Ma posted:Sooooo, if CIG defaults then its no longer CIGs fault its the banks. You can blame the bank because all the goodwill (and badwill) now belongs to the bank Well companies buy other companies to profit off their debts all the time, I guess Coats and co have got a big scandal coming up that they need to offset someway.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:20
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So when can we expect Chris/Sandi/Erin to fake their own deaths/move to a country with no extradition laws? Before or after citcon?
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Jun 24, 2017 21:21
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 love it.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:21
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Just when you think brexit was the stupidiest thing the brits have ever done they lend chris Roberts money.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:21
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Latin Pheonix posted:It's awkward as you say; the problem is we don't know what the definition of 'the Game' is (the document just says it's defined in the loan agreement, which we can't see) as opposed to what 'Star Citizen' is. This definition may be ring-fencing IP rights for Star Citizen while the 'game' may be referring to Squadron 42, thereby meaning that any copyright used in S42 will be held by the bank while the remaining IP rights would be held by CIG('s other creditors). I'm guessing that if, in some bizarro universe, F42 went under but CIG continued to be in business, CIG would be able to use the IPs F42 made for S42/SC to finish SC. It's pretty contradictory but either way, it's like worrying about the deckchairs on the Titanic. 
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Jun 24, 2017 21:25
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crisp roberts posted:Just when you think brexit was the stupidiest thing the brits have ever done they lend chris Roberts money. They've already given him tax credit money, now they're just protecting their investment.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:25
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Would this also not insulate them from having to provide refunds in the end? In the (very unlikely) event that CIG can't pay this loan, the bank takes all their assets and IP to sell off and recoup their losses. The bank wouldn't have to pay any refunds to aggravated backers, as they just own the license now and are first on the list to get their cash out, and anyone dealing with CIG would be told to gently caress themselves as obviously there would be no money left. Either way, I think we can all agree that this is a good move and is very conducive to finishing the game as promised. It's certainly not a bad sign to have to take a loan to limp along to the next patch in your *pre-alpha*.
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Jun 24, 2017 21:30
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shrach posted:It's pretty contradictory but either way, it's like worrying about the deckchairs on the Titanic. It makes more sense if the ringfenced IP assets are promised to, say, a different bank that's granted a loan to CIG in the US.  [Edit] ^^^^^ This is beyond my legal knowledge (and a pretty new field given the law on preordering digital goods in the UK is nebulous at best), but by my guess, they might fall under the category of 'unsecured creditors' i.e. last in line for getting their money back once the company has been wound down. Nanako the Narc fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Jun 24, 2017 |
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Jun 24, 2017 21:30
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Xaerael posted:So, I've fine tooth combed it, and due to previous experiences through a third party loving up buying rights, nearly going bankrupt through over manufacture and under performing sales, and having to get a bailout loan, I can say with 100% certainty... So you tell me to buy a nox now?
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Jun 24, 2017 21:31
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just lol at a bank being stuck with tons of in-progress cafeteria animation assets and a nightly build of Door 2.0 technology
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Jun 24, 2017 21:32
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crisp roberts posted:So you tell me to buy a nox now? drat right buy an idris!
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Jun 24, 2017 21:33
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Jun 24, 2017 21:33
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This is a good game. I have enjoyed it a lot. Ending is a bit contrived, but I think it might be a metaphor or something? Has news of this loan increased the greymarket values? I can only see it as good news. CIG must be really ramping up the money dumpster fire. I can only see good news. So good. Excited for 6.0 here. Sillybones fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Jun 24, 2017 |
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Jun 24, 2017 21:33
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