|
Under the vegetable posted:What the gently caress are you talking about? Metaphorical doesn't mean paranormal. The initial post this post was responding to conflates paranormal and metaphorical. quote:The literal reading is usually nonsensical to some degree, and Twin Peaks is probably the most grounded in its literal layer. It is mostly disrupted by intrusions of the paranormal, which break that literal story because it doesn't fit in with reality Do you just randomly decide which posts to read or what?  crowoutofcontext posted:The dead couch couple are the New Cooper's dead spiritual parents and represent the silent violent birth of the 99% movement. Now this is a proper analogy. 
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 20:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 02:26 |
|
|
I fear that this thread may be veering towards some existential state of chaos, and I must make ready. The fucks are at it again!
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 21:49
|
|
|
gently caress Gene Kelly, you mother fucker!
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 22:02
|
|
|
crowoutofcontext posted:The dead couch couple are the New Cooper's dead spiritual parents and represent the silent violent birth of the 99% movement. But what does Chad represent, besides just being a dick?
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 22:15
|
|
|
Chad represents every human being on this planet named Chad.
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 22:17
|
|
|
CJacobs posted:Chad represents every human being on this planet named Chad. He is definitely loud, and puts his foot in mouth, but he is a nice guy. All other chads I have met are dicks though. He is also 30 and permanently a frat boy.
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 22:47
|
|
|
Twin Peaks is actually a metaphor for working with David Lynch, and Lynch himself. Take note of the amount of actors in Twin Peaks that have worked with Lynch in the past. Kyle MacLachlan is a frequent collaborator of Lynch's, and is thus the main star. It's clear when you consider that Lynch (MacLachlan's director) plays Gordon Cole, Cooper's director. Also, Cole's title of Assistant Director reflects that he wasn't the main person behind the wheel of season 2, where Cole mainly appears. Speaking of Cole, his hearing loss is a representation of Lynch's refusal to listen to suggestions and direction from others. His projects are his own, and thus Cole hears what he wants to hear. In the new episodes, Lynch's early struggles with Showtime play out in the scene outside the prison with Albert. Albert/Showtime tells Cole/Lynch what he wants to hear. Cole presses for more/Lynch asks for more money, but Albert/Showtime drags their feet, causing Cole/Lynch pain. Albert/Showtime apologizes and Cole/Lynch is back on board. Lynch obviously has a weakness for women ("This world of Twin Peaks is filled with beautiful women") and this is characterized by the fact that Shelly is the only one that Cole is able to hear. Catherine Coulson was Lynch's assistant for many years, so Lynch has her role as the Log Lady assist several characters throughout the show. Fan criticism of Joan Chen's wooden acting manifests in Josie literally becomes a piece of wood. One interesting bit of foreshadowing is that MIKE says that he "took the entire arm off." Of course, Lynch cut Michael J. Anderson (the Arm) out of the show after he made disparaging accusations towards Lynch. As for the whole debate on whether or not Lynch is a Phish fan or not, I think he made it clear with the whole "fish in the percolator" scene. Phish's music obviously left a bad taste in his mouth. ___  ___
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 22:55
|
|
|
https://i.imgur.com/ZTBppFh.gifv
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 23:01
|
|
|
This thread in a nutshell.
|
|
#
?
Jun 24, 2017 23:06
|
|
|
I re-watched 5 and 6 today and they were really great and I didn't care a little bit about any symbolisms but they made me feel great because I watched them on a big rear end screen with a pumping sound system.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 00:07
|
|
|
What is she doing here?
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 02:06
|
|
|
snoremac posted:What is she doing here? Laughing in the face of death.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 02:09
|
|
|
snoremac posted:What is she doing here? she's re-enacting the previous scene of Leland Palmer jumping into Laura's grave during her funeral and the coffin raising and lowering
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 02:15
|
|
|
snoremac posted:What is she doing here? Souring my affection toward Shelly's character
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 02:17
|
|
|
Yeah, it's one thing to repeatedly hook up with the most awful scumbags in town and refuse to cooperate with the criminal investigation of your murderer husband in order to sponge up insurance money. But poking fun of ridiculous funeral mishaps? For shame!
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 02:55
|
|
|
bobby's a good kid even if he killed Mike
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 03:10
|
|
|
He seems to have ended up okay, which seemed likely given his dad's vision, but he was a coke dealer, killed a guy in a drug deal gone bad, was involved in the aforementioned insurance racket (then ditched on Shelly when he got tired of cleaning up after Leo), and intentionally disrupted Laura Palmer's funeral by screaming and starting a fist fight. He was definitely a big poo poo-heel during the first two seasons. Edit - Not to mention that smoking is a filthy habit. Especially for a varsity athlete. NObodyNOWHERE fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 03:19
|
|
|
Just a basic high schooler
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 03:20
|
|
|
NObodyNOWHERE posted:Yeah, it's one thing to repeatedly hook up with the most awful scumbags in town and refuse to cooperate with the criminal investigation of your murderer husband in order to sponge up insurance money. But poking fun of ridiculous funeral mishaps? For shame! Leland didn't deserve any of this, bub edit: If anything, make fun of James, Shelly, please
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 03:37
|
|
|
I feel like I can understand the desire to want to read Twin Peaks supernatural stuff as somehow being some sort of symbolic representation of what we're not really seeing, but at the same time it feels a little more... paradoxical? Like one the one hand, the impulse to read Cooper's Doppelgänger as actually Cooper having fallen from grace and the life of Cooper as Dougie his dreams/delusions of his better angels makes sense as a desire for us to be able to admit our heroes aren't always perfect but instead just as frail more than capable of letting us down. On the other hand it feels in a way like a rationalized reading, itself our inability to deal with the events on screen as being what they are; that they must be symbolic even within the diegesis of the setting. No Red Room, no Lodges, no BOB or MIKE. Just mortal humanity creating excuses and symbols for itself. That it has to be something that is much more familiar to us than the strange and bizarre thing we have trouble recognizing or understanding. This isn't to say there's not value in constructing a story like that [from what I've read about Lost Highway and Mulholland Drive, which I still have yet to see, seem to lend themselves quite easily to this sort of reading]. But at the same time there's not really the same sort of support within Twin Peaks to be able to handle that sort of thing, even further there are elements we see on screen and related materials that would actively refute it. While things like BOB, the Red Room, the Lodges and so on certainly are symbolic for things in the real world, I'm not sure what's added to the work by structuring it so that the strange and supernatural things that we're seeing are just as equally symbolic within the show/films themselves.* *As well, I feel like that changes the ultimate reading as well; if this is all just a sort of delusion of Cooper as he falls into a life of murder and destruction, we shift the story as to being basically about a man who is haunted by his conscience (and desire to escape back into that world where he is a more innocent, helpful person?)**, instead of what we have now, where it's a man who must eventually reconcile, despite his virtues, with the evils he is more than still able to wreak on the world. **This itself makes it feel like we'd really just be retreading thematic ground with Lost Highway? Lanz fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 03:58
|
|
|
It's all sci-fi to me. We're dealing with energy-based life forms whose science, technology and non-corporeality appear to us as magic, interpreted symbolically by our primitive cerebrums. The White Lodge has a 'nature preserve' attitude. The Black Lodge has a 'hunting preserve' attitude. Consciousness -- our non-corporeality -- is the basis of their interest.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 05:46
|
|
|
Mark Frost spotted
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 06:17
|
|
|
Lanz posted:ifeellikeicanunderstandthedesiretowanttoreadtwinpeakssupernaturalstuffassomehowbeingsomesortofsymbolicrepresentationofwhatwe'renotreally seeingbutatthesametimeitfeelsalittlemoreparadoxical? I agree with your argument, but can't condone your irrational hatred of stops. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 08:20
|
|
|
And More posted:I agree with your argument, but can't condone your irrational hatred of stops. I'm having flashbacks to Picard's "and he kept talking in one long unbroken sentence" quote and now I can't stop laughing. EDIT: Oh god every time I read it again I keep laughing harder. Jeez I gotta work on that; I actually appreciate you pointing that out, so thanks.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 08:33
|
|
|
can we just take another quick second to recognize than Jane E is the best character & how great it was seeing her choke ike the spike
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 09:48
|
|
|
i love how often the "you may not know that but 'horse' is a slang word for heroin which is a drug and leland drugs his wife and it's also a deftones album and means cocaine which also is a drug like the drug leland gives his wife" thing comes up in twin peaks discussions and whenever someone brings up "well, 'behold a pale horse'..." and explains the biblical reference, people still go "🙄 no DRUGS, leland DRUGS his wife and heroin and cocaine are DRUGS" lol i used to follow some twin peaks groups on facebook and i loved those posts, some poor guy mentioned "behold a pale horse" and a bunch of ppl jumped all over him because "umm moron the horse is white not pale!" and when the guy said "what do you think pale means?" multiple people said "pale means green, that's why when you're sick people say your face looks pale" lmfao
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:06
|
|
|
have we discussed the problem of toxic masculinity and how dougie is just the latest in a long line of extremely privileged men who fail upwards, an adam sandler being rewarded for loving up? Let's Discuss Twin Peaks' Dougie Jones and the Enduring Power of Toxic Masculinity quote:MEGAN: Dougie can't say more than two words at a time, he can't go to the bathroom by himself, and he scribbles on his work papers. And there are no consequences at all! I think you pointed out that he's even rewarded for it by ladies taking him to the bathroom and offering to kiss him? quote:SUZETTE: It's hard, being someone who has worked so hard for so much stuff in my life to watch a white guy flail around and repeatedly mess up everything around him and people just help him out. quote:MEGAN: You know who I think the ultimate Dougie Jones is? DONALD TRUMP. Does everything wrong, dumb as a post, becomes president. there's a nice part at the end where they almost have a moment of clarity and start to wonder if maybe they're projecting a little bit here and then this happens: quote:SUZETTE: So he writes this very traditional character: gentle idiot that needs to be led around, and I'm furious because everyone liked that guy better than me at my last job. lmfao jeez i wonder why
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:33
|
|
|
toxic wokeness
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:35
|
|
|
They're not exactly wrong though And I can't really find the heart to laugh at them even if I disagree with their analysis because there really are so many dumb loving louts who practically get away with murder because they're upper-middle-class, white, male, and inherently privileged as gently caress. I don't know if Lynch is necessarily intending to make this point with Dougie, but it's absolutely contextually accurate to do so and I don't see anything laughable about the article other than cynicism about what a hosed world we live in. Their discussion leads to making some legitimately great points. And they fully admit their own personal biases regarding the material in their analyses. kaworu fucked around with this message at 10:54 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:46
|
|
|
kaworu posted:They're not exactly wrong though Helping people with cognitive impairment is not a good example of toxic masculinity, imo.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:51
|
|
|
And More posted:Helping people with cognitive impairment is not a good example of toxic masculinity, imo. reducing the entire 'Dougie' plotline as consisting of "helping people with cognitive impairment" sounds a bit absurd to me, but you're more than welcome to view his story in that context if you want. I just don't see what's ridiculous about their analysis if you actually read through their discussion. Yeah, it seems silly if you pull out 3 comments out-of-context, but so would this thread if you did the same thing. Not saying I agree with everything or even some of what their saying. But it's absolutely valid and interesting and their arguments aren't worthy of outright ridicule at all. kaworu fucked around with this message at 11:00 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 10:56
|
|
|
kaworu posted:reducing the entire 'Dougie' plotline as consisting of "helping people with cognitive impairment" sounds a bit absurd to me, but you're more than welcome to view his story in that context if you want. The analysis is extremely shallow, and reeks of "I really wanted to read it this way" to me. Let's start from the beginning then. No way to miss context there. quote:SUZETTE: Groundhog Day is a great example of this. Withnail and I another. Harold and Maude, The Pink Panther. I’m sure lots of examples come to mind. The entire element of Dougie being unable to go to the bathroom on his own screams dementia to me. They argue that he's behaving terribly, but he is clearly severely handicapped. This is not subtext. We know Cooper wasn't like this before he left the Lodge, and he's sure as hell not doing it on purpose. "He is even rewarded for it by ladies taking him to the bathroom" is just a ridiculous statement, and the woman trying to kiss Dougie is clearly overstepping some sort of boundary. She herself is weirded out by it only moments afterwards. And More fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:13
|
|
|
If you (royal you, people in the article, not anyone here) think Dougie is being interacted with by people around him in a realistic fashion then you are the one with the mental impairment because you can't tell the difference between a television show and reality.
DaveKap fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Jun 25, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:15
|
|
|
DaveKap posted:If you think Dougie is being interacted with by people around him in a realistic fashion then you are the one with the mental impairment because you can't tell the difference between a television show and reality. Do you mean me? I don't think that? Why would you think that I think that?
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:16
|
|
|
dougie jones
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:16
|
|
|
jade gives two rides
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:17
|
|
|
And More posted:Do you mean me? I don't think that? Why would you think that I think that?
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:17
|
|
|
new shoes
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:18
|
|
|
For the record, my original reason for being annoyed by Dougie plotline was because nobody was reacting to him in a realistic manner and it always bothers me when any sort of media involves people acting irrationally or stupidly. I've only recently come around to it because, what the gently caress, this is Twin Peaks, since when did anyone act normally on this fuckin' show?
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 02:26 |
|
|
My read is:
I don't remember enough to say, but do his actions/reactions coincide with when his sleepwalking's about to be discovered? Lodge entities are outside time. They could do spot-fixes to the timeline to keep him on track.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2017 11:42
|
|