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Norns posted:They raised the light level so it's still relevant content for max level players... I haven't done the raid yet but I understand you can pick between normal and prestige? Why didn't they just make "Osiris Normal" and "Osiris Prestige" as new options? Even as an expansion haver I don't know if I really like that they scaled it up. I'd like to check it out but I don't have 5 friends to go with, and I don't know if it's something i want to spend a whole day working on even if I can get people together. Plus whats the point of increasing the light level if everything else just gets stronger to compensate?
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Dec 7, 2017 16:47
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The REAL Goobusters posted:There was no way in hell burning crusade was 20 dollars on release You were right it was $40, sorry it was 11 years ago. I think my point still stands though, given how much game Vanilla WoW had compared to Vanilla D2
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Dec 7, 2017 16:48
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Oxyclean posted:I haven't done the raid yet but I understand you can pick between normal and prestige? Why didn't they just make "Osiris Normal" and "Osiris Prestige" as new options? Truthfully because they were lazy and they didn't add any new gear to the raid, but still want the shaders and armor from The Prestige raid to be special would be my guess.
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Dec 7, 2017 16:49
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Bust Rodd posted:You were right it was $40, sorry it was 11 years ago. was burning crusade the first expansion because i'm pretty sure it was a hot and spicy $70 but i may have bought it alongside the vanilla world of warcraft in a bundle i only quibble over this point because my wow-playing friends in college talked me into picking it up for that price american at which point i proceeded to play with them once and never again and it remains one of the worst videogame purchasing decisions i ever made
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Dec 7, 2017 16:51
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Wait I thought Flying mounts was Cataclysm? Or was that not the expansion they had to rebuild everutjing for flying mounts I’m glad I didn’t WoW very much to this day tbh
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Dec 7, 2017 16:51
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Norns posted:Wow deleted an entire continent in one of its expansions What, Cataclysm? They basically deleted old 1-60 and replaced it with shiny revamped stuff and didn't lock any of it behind the expansion. Waffle House posted:Wait I thought Flying mounts was Cataclysm? Or was that not the expansion they had to rebuild everutjing for flying mounts BC added flying mounts but you could only use them in Outland (the BC expansion area) because the rest of the world wasn't built for them. Cata rebuilt the rest of the world for flying mounts.
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Dec 7, 2017 16:52
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Oxyclean posted:What, Cataclysm? They basically deleted old 1-60 and replaced it with shiny revamped stuff and didn't lock any of it behind the expansion. Yes I know but wow is a horrible game to compare this to. Not to mention wow has had many of its own unique issues. But they definitely gated and removed poo poo tons of content and rewards over the years.
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Dec 7, 2017 16:54
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The expansions are the subscription cost for Destiny 2. Buy them when they come out if you want to continue playing the game, otherwise don't.
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Dec 7, 2017 16:54
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Dietrich posted:The expansions are the subscription cost for Destiny 2. Buy them when they come out if you want to continue playing the game, otherwise don't. Console bullshit ruining PC supremacy once again. Thanks fellas.
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Dec 7, 2017 16:59
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Norns posted:Yes I know but wow is a horrible game to compare this to. Not to mention wow has had many of its own unique issues. Umm what exactly? They never took old raids away except Naxx 40 which was broken and hosed. The Gate was just “the Xpac adds an island UP Here!” It literally never took anything away from players as far as I could tell (accept skill trees lol forever) I think WoW is a great game to compare this too because if Destiny 2 had the MMO features of WoW but the combat and gameplay of Destiny 2 we’d have a cultural phenomenon and despite literally handpicking Blizzards best loot based game Devs, they just ignored it and did their own thing. I only played WoW from Vanilla to the end of Ice Crown (2nd + 3rd Xpac) but I posted about on these very forums every day and I can’t remember a single goon saying “Now I can’t do X because of the Xpansion” unless it was “well my guild all upgraded and now if I want to keep raiding I have to upgrade”
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Dec 7, 2017 17:00
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Oxyclean posted:What, Cataclysm? They basically deleted old 1-60 and replaced it with shiny revamped stuff and didn't lock any of it behind the expansion. Ahhh, thanks. I’m seeing Warminds, next Expansion, as Burning Crusade, and then whatever after that as Cataclysm, where everything’s overhauled. Hopefully we get a steadier trickle of new content along the way to keep the community’s mindless lust for developer-death at bay.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:03
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Bust Rodd posted:I think WoW is a great game to compare this too because if Destiny 2 had the MMO features of WoW but the combat and gameplay of Destiny 2 we’d have a cultural phenomenon and despite literally handpicking Blizzards best loot based game Devs, they just ignored it and did their own thing. I agree with the overall sentiment but I think it's worth mentioning that Mosqueira was brought in only as an advisor for TTK and has since left the Activision umbrella. (entirely possible you're referencing other devs)
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Dec 7, 2017 17:03
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Maybe it's just sad that Bungie/Activision aren't used the wealth of knowledge they have sitting around in Blizzard.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:04
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Bust Rodd posted:Umm what exactly? http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Removed_from_World_of_Warcraft
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Dec 7, 2017 17:06
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how'd they handle this issue in density 1 anyway?
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Dec 7, 2017 17:07
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geonetix posted:Maybe it's just sad that Bungie/Activision aren't used the wealth of knowledge they have sitting around in Blizzard. “Dear new Blizzard friends, Would u like 2 come over more for tea & devving, I think we can run ourselves 2gether with a little oil and make great things happenl - Bungo”
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Dec 7, 2017 17:07
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Bust Rodd posted:Umm what exactly? And what happens in WoW if you stop paying the subscription cost? This isn't comparable stuff. You pay $15/mo to play WoW, and then on top of that you buy expansions every 1-2 years for $40-60. In Destiny2, you pay $0/mo to play, and then buy expansions every 3-6 months for $20. Annual WoW cost - $180 - $260 Annual Destiny2 cost - $40-60? I mean yes, obviously, WoW has more content. It also costs like 4x as much per year.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:09
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Cowcaster posted:how'd they handle this issue in density 1 anyway? If I remember right the raids just stop being relevant content up until they updated them all in Taken King? I didn't play after I bounced off the launch version so someone will know better.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:10
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Cowcaster posted:how'd they handle this issue in density 1 anyway? They did the same thing in D1.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:10
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Back Hack posted:They did the same thing in D1. 
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Dec 7, 2017 17:13
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I still feel like I paid way to much for a expansion 1 and 2, but I'm dumb and did it anyway. This loving game feels fun to play, and I love relaxing with it.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:14
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geonetix posted:Maybe it's just sad that Bungie/Activision aren't used the wealth of knowledge they have sitting around in Blizzard. *edit: re-reading I sound way too harsh/critical, apologies. I agree with the core of the message. This would be rad and on a macro level it seems wasteful that Bungie is making mistakes that a kindred dev has long resolved. Cross-pollination and sharing information/expertise/experience can be worthwhile (sometimes wondrous, like TTK was a loving revelation), but bear in mind that it has a non-trivial cost. Only so much you can get done thru email and phone calls, and remote meetings (even with current technology) aren't the same as a colleague 20 yards away - especially when it's not even with the same studio. It's also time that the Blizzard devs aren't working on their primary assignments, and that gets tricky with milestones and dependencies. And then there's pride to deal with, like do Bungie execs really want the perception that they need to be saved (again) by a different company. Is the benefit worth the cost? Maybe. I'd need a lot more information and expertise to feel comfortable making that call. isk fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Dec 7, 2017 |
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Dec 7, 2017 17:15
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Uh ok, so literally nothing of value was ever removed. you just linked 600 low level PvP items and some dev tools commands they patched out, if there is a specific "This was a good awesome thing and took it away" example I'll say "Skill Trees"
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Dec 7, 2017 17:15
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For gently caress sakes entire land masses and old versions of dungeons are gone including the gear and a ton of other poo poo You can still do Leviathan you just can't get the prettiest gear from it that you probably we're never going to touch anyway if you haven't already
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Dec 7, 2017 17:17
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God I miss the skill tree. 
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Dec 7, 2017 17:18
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Norns posted:For gently caress sakes entire land masses and old versions of dungeons are gone including the gear and a ton of other poo poo Updating the main continents and dungeons like 6-7 years after launch isn't even remotely the same sort of thing.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:20
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K
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Dec 7, 2017 17:22
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isk posted:"sitting around" While I realize I hardly speak for the salty-rear end videogaming community, I wouldn’t perceive that as, “being saved,” I’d perceive that as, “two gaming companies who I have liked and respected for over two decades gettin’ down to bidness.” To avoid the “saved” perception, work would have to be impressive, presented cleanly, and earnestly tackled. Hell, Bungie could just BlogPost the words, “We have Taken on <img_Oryx, maniacal laughter> some members of Blizzard’s team for our own. We would like to welcome them on board on their rotation. This is their community liason, <name of person who doesn’t mind being canonized/demonized in dev-sainthood forever alongside DeeJ Cosmo and Luke because they have a one-or two syllable name that’s easy for an angry community to regurgitate cluelessly>“ Waffle House fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Dec 7, 2017 |
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Dec 7, 2017 17:24
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Waffle House posted:While I realize I hardly speak for the salty-rear end videogaming community, I wouldn’t perceive that as, “being saved,” I’d perceive that as, “two gaming companies who I have liked and respected for over two decades gettin’ down to bidness.” 100% agreed. I thought (from what was presented, anyway) bringing in Mosqueira was a humble and inspired idea, and it was ultimately effective. The perception of savior is entirely within the lens of ignorant & reductive gamer culture (which as much as I hate and hope dies soon, is still A Thing), and with having worked with smart & skilled folks. It doesn't happen every time but sometimes pride gets in the way, especially when dealing with smart & skilled folks who have also been successful.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:29
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isk posted:100% agreed. I thought (from what was presented, anyway) bringing in Mosqueira was a humble and inspired idea, and it was ultimately effective. The perception of savior is entirely within the lens of ignorant & reductive gamer culture (which as much as I hate and hope dies soon, is still A Thing), and with having worked with smart & skilled folks. It doesn't happen every time but sometimes pride gets in the way, especially when dealing with smart & skilled folks who have also been successful. I edited my post a bit but  . I absolutely despise what 2016 turned contemporary online culture into. I can’t enjoy things without being put at risk for Kidney Stones because people just need to get their demons out, no matter how stupid.Pride is inherent in all great success. Up to the superego to keep that reigned
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Dec 7, 2017 17:32
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Back Hack posted:God I miss the skill tree. Same here. Definitely a step back in every way except easier to balance on the bungie side
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Dec 7, 2017 17:40
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Only 50 pages to go!
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Dec 7, 2017 17:41
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el B posted:Only 50 pages to go! Nice
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Dec 7, 2017 17:46
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Back Hack posted:They did the same thing in D1. Also comparing this game to WoW is dumb on a number of levels
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Dec 7, 2017 17:51
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Cowcaster posted:how'd they handle this issue in density 1 anyway? Worse actually because if you didn't buy the DLC you couldn't even do Nightfalls anymore.
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Dec 7, 2017 17:51
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It would probably help a lot of things if every article written about everything ever wasn't just some shocking thing to get people upset
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Dec 7, 2017 17:54
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Norns posted:It would probably help a lot of things if every article written about everything ever wasn't just some shocking thing to get people upset I think it's more that people need to learn to scale their response to be proportional to the fault at hand. When everything is an apocalyptic disaster it's hard to sieve out what the real problems are and whether (as a company) it's worth responding to them. IMO moving prestige content out of the game when you paid for it is a bigger problem than the "scaling XP but not so bad that BE's were that hard to get" but everyone sorta blew their load on the first one and now it just sounds like whining. But we're talking about internet nerds here so lol
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Dec 7, 2017 18:02
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JerikTelorian posted:I think it's more that people need to learn to scale their response to be proportional to the fault at hand. When everything is an apocalyptic disaster it's hard to sieve out what the real problems are and whether (as a company) it's worth responding to them. IMO moving prestige content out of the game when you paid for it is a bigger problem than the "scaling XP but not so bad that BE's were that hard to get" but everyone sorta blew their load on the first one and now it just sounds like whining. I think in the very least it should've been communicated upfront (like as the expansion features were discussed) with a fair and detailed explanation. Would've led to some consternation because LOL GAMERS but it wouldn't have been a post-release pitfall.
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Dec 7, 2017 18:07
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JerikTelorian posted:I think it's more that people need to learn to scale their response to be proportional to the fault at hand. When everything is an apocalyptic disaster it's hard to sieve out what the real problems are and whether (as a company) it's worth responding to them. IMO moving prestige content out of the game when you paid for it is a bigger problem than the "scaling XP but not so bad that BE's were that hard to get" but everyone sorta blew their load on the first one and now it just sounds like whining. 
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Dec 7, 2017 18:11
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That might have helped. They did mention it, but a rationale would have helped. I'm actualy kinda excited this happened because it's time to put up or shut up on their transparency promises they made in the State of the Game/Podcast. That said I don't really know why it had to be. In a game with personal loot and enemy scaling, just let people do it at the old level. Hell, let 330s and 300's party up, just give appropriate gear. This isn't like WoW where you can gear trade. Just seems weird to make the base game shittier when it's already shittier in that you don't get access to the new stuff. Like people have said, Bungie doesn't know if they want to be an MMO or a coop ARPG like Diablo and instead they're a weird mishmash of the two and sometimes it results in weird poo poo like this. JerikTelorian fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Dec 7, 2017 |
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Dec 7, 2017 18:11
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