Star Citizen: Death of a Space Thread?

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TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

could you imagine roberts face

"oh yeah crytek is going under, we already have most of their employees anyway, lol let's try and see them enforce their dumb GLA when they don't have a company lol"

~2 weeks later~

"what turkey gave them $500m what the gently caress ORTWIN WE ARE GOOD RIGHT MAN WE ARE GOOD ON THIS YOU SAID, YOU SAID WE WERE GOOD"

*peeks open his coffin* "we're good"

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:18

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# ? Apr 26, 2024 03:49

DapperDon: Sep 7, 2016

AP posted:

Totally and he wouldn't be the first burglar to help a fellowship.

Well played sir.
:golfclap:

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:19

FailureToReport: Nov 25, 2017; Warlord in training

Beer4TheBeerGod posted:

The part that I particularly appreciate is that the entire CS exchange started off as me asking why I was banned. Any competent customer service team would have reviewed the request, responded with a very simple answer, and either corrected the action or affirmed their position. A competent community management team would have never let it get to that point, as there would be no subjectivity in the rules or they would have taken advantage of the situation to make an example of me, refund everything, and simply state "given Beer4TheBeerGod's actions outside of this community we no longer wish to have him as a customer." Boom, done, move on. They can do that, it galvanizes the community and ostracizes me, and we all move on. As usual they're not sufficiently competent to do that and then Sandi made the mistake of expanding the scope of the conversation and allow me an opportunity to air my grievances. So I did, and she made the mistake of responding to them without any consideration of the consequences of doing so. She made her personal feelings known, repeatedly displaying an egregious lack of respect for the customers who are funding her lifestyle and an almost dismissive attitude towards some very real and very serious problems with the development, and did so assuming that I would keep those feelings to myself. This lack of professionalism should come as no surprise to a company that secretly labels their customers as "special snowflakes" or links to external information as part of their internal customer service system.

You're right about this being ground zero; it's a perfect litmus test for how someone views Star Citizen and what side of an increasingly sharp divide they fall on. Either they read that and think that CIG is run by incompetent amateurs, or they read it and get angry that I violated common decency by sharing a private communication. The latter interpretation is particularly interesting because they completely ignore the contents to focus on what they perceive to be a personal attack, which is why having a reasonable conversation is nearly impossible. You saw the same thing with Erris and INN when they accused me of fabricating the whole thing and then completely disappeared when I called them out and offered to provide any reasonable evidence demonstrating its validity. They don't care about the truth, they only care about how to reinforce what they already know. This whole fiasco has actually gone a long way towards helping me understand why politics, religion, and attitudes in general are so entrenched.

The problem starts before you even email them though. Their volunteer mods pick and choose how and when they want to enforce the rules, if they don't like a poster they throw them under one of the "super generic nonspecific" rules as a violation and go from there.

I did some time doing customer service for SoE, the mod team on the RSI forums stood out to me very very early on in the game's lifespan, it's the reason I didn't really use RSI forums. You can tell when a mod team is out of control pretty easily.

That's sort of irrelevant though, my point is, even as a competent CS team, you get a ticket from Beer4TheBeerGod asking why he was banned and then you have to pull up his account and it says "Maul doesn't like this fag, permabanned.", you either try to double down on "Banned for repeated violations of _______" or you can escalate it to someone at a higher pay grade. I mean if I was Failure The CS Guy and I got that ticket and read the context, I don't even know how I would have handled it. Remove the ban? Pass it on to someone higher up to deal with?

That's the problem when you let volunteer mods run rampant without strictly adhering to forum rules, or having forum rules that are so openly generic that you use them as a Catch All for anything you don't want, you leave a giant opening for customers to argue against account actions because you aren't following a set standard of enforcement.

I was shocked your email landed in Sandi's lap though, or maybe she wanted to set your straight. I don't know. That whole exchange from start to finish was crazy though.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:23

Bayonnefrog: Nov 9, 2017

Beer4TheBeerGod posted:

The part that I particularly appreciate is that the entire CS exchange started off as me asking why I was banned. Any competent customer service team would have reviewed the request, responded with a very simple answer, and either corrected the action or affirmed their position. A competent community management team would have never let it get to that point, as there would be no subjectivity in the rules or they would have taken advantage of the situation to make an example of me, refund everything, and simply state "given Beer4TheBeerGod's actions outside of this community we no longer wish to have him as a customer." Boom, done, move on. They can do that, it galvanizes the community and ostracizes me, and we all move on. As usual they're not sufficiently competent to do that and then Sandi made the mistake of expanding the scope of the conversation and allow me an opportunity to air my grievances. So I did, and she made the mistake of responding to them without any consideration of the consequences of doing so. She made her personal feelings known, repeatedly displaying an egregious lack of respect for the customers who are funding her lifestyle and an almost dismissive attitude towards some very real and very serious problems with the development, and did so assuming that I would keep those feelings to myself. This lack of professionalism should come as no surprise to a company that secretly labels their customers as "special snowflakes" or links to external information as part of their internal customer service system.

You're right about this being ground zero; it's a perfect litmus test for how someone views Star Citizen and what side of an increasingly sharp divide they fall on. Either they read that and think that CIG is run by incompetent amateurs, or they read it and get angry that I violated common decency by sharing a private communication. The latter interpretation is particularly interesting because they completely ignore the contents to focus on what they perceive to be a personal attack, which is why having a reasonable conversation is nearly impossible. You saw the same thing with Erris and INN when they accused me of fabricating the whole thing and then completely disappeared when I called them out and offered to provide any reasonable evidence demonstrating its validity. They don't care about the truth, they only care about how to reinforce what they already know. This whole fiasco has actually gone a long way towards helping me understand why politics, religion, and attitudes in general are so entrenched.

Yes. You're spot on. And as a much better write than myself or your random internet person you were probably uniquely positioned to be that litmus test case. Because your clear well-reasoned questioning really contrasts against the personal hateful vindictive attacks from their side. No answers no reasoning. Just a "we don't like DS so we don't like you bye." Do they no know how many complaints and junk get thrown around about companies online? It happens on a daily basis and many factors worse. So enlightening that entire exchange.

Yes, this is what is so astounding. 99.9% of companies see your request and follow their policies and respond and it's everyone have a nice day. It kind of shows the mickey mouse level operation they have going on there. Even a simple customer service request gets blown up into something much bigger. Not to get all dramatic but for me it was a Joseph McCarthy-US Army questioning level of a mistake for them and at least for me turned me against the project entirely.

ps: sorry last thing: I could be going overboard again here but I've said in other places: I think CIG and this entire kickstarter, game development saga will have Harvard Business School cases written on it. Mostly on the mismanagement of the whole thing and what not to do.

Bayonnefrog fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Dec 18, 2017

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:23

SoftNum: Mar 31, 2011

Nyast posted:

Where's this "Crytek is broke" storyline coming from anyways ? Honnest question.

I know they've had financial difficulties a few years ago, but then they got a $70M cash inflow from Amazon, so I'd say right now they should be doing fine, aren't they ?

Because if you admit any fault or failing you are a failure and might as well not exist. Unlike their hero Chris and Star Citizen, which never has faults and is always getting bigger and moving forward; and has never made a mistake.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:24

Foo Diddley: Oct 29, 2011; cat

Solarin posted:

credit to Foo Diddley for finding these precious images for me

They were just in the other thread, it was Jobbo Fett who dug 'em up there

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:25

Jobbo_Fett: Mar 7, 2014; Slava Ukrayini; Clapping Larry

tooterfish posted:

Oh gently caress me yes.

Saw it last night. It's not that it's bad, it's perfectly entertaining (it goes on for loving ages though). It just feels a little hollow and contrived.

Or maybe it's me. Maybe I grew up without noticing. That sucks.

No its not you, its that they are trying to be incredibly accessible. They also add in way too much comedy for a series that, initially, had some dark undertones. Then Ep 6 happebed and things got a little goofy but it was okay. Then the prequels happened and they tried to shove comedy into it while also becoming emo and fat fingering drama.

It just could have been better :sigh:

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:28

Incitatus: Dec 16, 2005; The Meat Man was out of wings, Mr. William Ash More!

Chris and Ortwin got this lawsuit. Considering everything in regards to Star Citizen takes 2 weeks, imagine how much their defense will punch above its weight given that they get a whole 3 weeks.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:28

grimcreaper: Jan 7, 2012

Truga posted:

apparently it's disney cuck sjw propaganda, so i'm assuming it's good.

Its going to suck

The actors, minus kylo ren, were sacks of wet garbage. Story was lame. Everything looked like poo poo.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:29

Xaerael: Aug 25, 2010; Marching Powder is objectively the worst poster known. He also needs to learn how a keyboard works.

EminusSleepus posted:

To be considered that your game is epic at least one character should be in Ready Player One.

Let me check...

Wing commander..... Nope
Star citizen.... Nope

The correct word is "classic", not "epic".

Also, RP1 is going to be poo poo. The book is poo poo. Spend your money on a where's wally book if you need to feel clever about spotting things in a made up crowd.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:29

Incitatus: Dec 16, 2005; The Meat Man was out of wings, Mr. William Ash More!

Also that countertop looks like people straight up diarrheaed all over it.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:30

Xaerael: Aug 25, 2010; Marching Powder is objectively the worst poster known. He also needs to learn how a keyboard works.

Incitatus posted:

Also that countertop looks like people straight up diarrheaed all over it.

That was just Sandi getting into new fetish clip genres.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:31

Sarsapariller: Aug 14, 2015; Occasional vampire queen

grimcreaper posted:

The actors, minus kylo ren, were sacks of wet garbage. Story was lame. Everything looked like poo poo.

I thought Mark Hammill looked like he was having a ton of fun.

That nipple-milk scene

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:33

Golli: Jan 5, 2013

Incitatus posted:

Also that countertop looks like people straight up diarrheaed all over it.

Covered in Stimperial spooge

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:34

AbstractNapper: Jun 5, 2011; I can help

What are the odds that after this lawsuit, a dozen of others will follow, with a few of them initiated by a desperate CIG towards their own employees or backers for breaching NDAs. I'm thinking this whole Jenga tower of a project might go down raising a sickening fog of lawsuits.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:39

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

AbstractNapper posted:

What are the odds that after this lawsuit, a dozen of others will follow, with a few of them initiated by a desperate CIG towards their own employees or backers for breaching NDAs. I'm thinking this whole Jenga tower of a project might go down raising a sickening fog of lawsuits.

its quite likely. everyone will want their slice before the entire pie is gone

if the turbulent rumor is also correct, that means a huge huge huge loving lawsuit for CIG as well, since turbulent has basically run everything funding and marketing wise

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:41

UNCUT PHILISTINE: Jul 27, 2006

I feel like this is happening too fast. I need to see SQ42 released. The only way I'm going to sleep soundly after this mess finally dies is if I can see 1200 pages of Crobberts' stupid WW2 IN SPACE cliches and tryhard bullshit get torn apart by critics so at least he won't have a way to deke out and save his ego.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:41

DapperDon: Sep 7, 2016

TheAgent posted:

its quite likely. everyone will want their slice before the entire pie is gone

if the turbulent rumor is also correct, that means a huge huge huge loving lawsuit for CIG as well, since turbulent has basically run everything funding and marketing wise

Turbulent rumor?

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:42

Foo Diddley: Oct 29, 2011; cat

Sarsapariller posted:

That nipple-milk scene

What in the gently caress are you people watching

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:44

biglads: Feb 21, 2007; I could've gone to Blatherwycke

UNCUT PHILISTINE posted:

I feel like this is happening too fast. I need to see SQ42 released. The only way I'm going to sleep soundly after this mess finally dies is if I can see 1200 pages of Crobberts' stupid WW2 IN SPACE cliches and tryhard bullshit get torn apart by critics so at least he won't have a way to deke out and save his ego.

Ben has already played through SQ42 (It's great).

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:45

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

DapperDon posted:

Turbulent rumor?

Turbulent was expecting a larger cut because SC/SQ42 was supposed to release this year and have been fighting with CIG about it (supposedly).

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:45

PederP: Nov 20, 2009

DapperDon posted:

Turbulent rumor?

Turbulent doesn't work for free.

Edit: TheAgent beat me to it. I guess a better phrasing would've been "Turbulent didn't expect having to work for free".

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:45

Beet Wagon: Oct 19, 2015

Good God, that "please don't go live" thread on reddit feels like listening to the final Jonestown recording.

This dude has been an ardent defender of SC for years and has a bunch of posts in /refunds to that effect and over the last couple weeks he's shifted so much I had to double check that he wasn't a goon account

Only registered members can see post attachments!

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:47

PederP: Nov 20, 2009

Foo Diddley posted:

What in the gently caress are you people watching

Star Wars: The Last Stimdi (by Axel Braum).

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:49

biglads: Feb 21, 2007; I could've gone to Blatherwycke

Beet Wagon posted:

Good God, that "please don't go live" thread on reddit feels like listening to the final Jonestown recording.

This dude has been an ardent defender of SC for years and has a bunch of posts in /refunds to that effect and over the last couple weeks he's shifted so much I had to double check that he wasn't a goon account

I would say they are abandoning ship, but as they only have pictures of ships they can't really.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:49

Bayonnefrog: Nov 9, 2017

biglads posted:

I would say they are abandoning ship, but as they only have pictures of ships they can't really.

haha I laughed. Good one.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:54

Toops: Nov 5, 2015; -find mood stabilizers
-also,

Lladre posted:

Stating they implemented 64 bit positioning as fact is stupid. There's no evidence of it outside their stupid claim.
Like are you really going to believe they managed this while the 3.0 that just needed some more polish last December you don't?

I hope we�re not in the version of this universe where CIG�s compulsive lies manage to get them off on a technicality.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:56

Amarcarts: Feb 21, 2007; This looks a lot like suffering.

I think CGI is partially responsible for how hollow movies are now. Before CGI there was a lot more effort frontloaded on pre-production and production and people were probably challenged to be at the top of their craft. You also had to have better acting and writing to make up for the limited amount you could do with effects.

I have no doubt people still work hard but I'd imagine there's a predominance of trying to rush through everything at the beginning so they can have all the material ready for the SFX studios. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a kind of toxic "we'll fix it in post" mediocrity that has taken over.

Also when you have puppets and physical creature effects you can do many different takes to try and get interesting performances out of them where improvisation is cheap because the expensive part was building the prop.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:58

Chalks: Sep 30, 2009

Foo Diddley posted:

What in the gently caress are you people watching

It's a pretty normal place for milk to come from tbf

# ? Dec 18, 2017 17:58

Phi230: Feb 2, 2016; by Fluffdaddy

The concept design of the layout begins with a steep-angled lift to the 510-metre (1,670 ft) (0.317 mile) top, which would take two minutes for the 24-passenger train to reach.[1] From there, a 500-metre (1,600 ft) drop would take the train to 360 kilometres per hour (220 mph), close to its terminal velocity, before flattening out and speeding into the first of its seven slightly clothoid inversions.[3] Each inversion would have a smaller diameter than the one before in order to maintain the lethal 10 g to passengers while the train loses speed. After a sharp right-hand turn the train would enter a straight, where unloading of corpses and loading of new passengers could take place.[3]

we are now entering the first loop

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:00

nnnotime: Sep 30, 2001; Hesitate, and you will be lost.

What are the chances that once the legal pre-battle gets underway that this thread starts pulling in most of the Legal-goons? Will the mod-team need to add a Lawyer goon to keep them in check?

This thread also might become the most educational ever from a civil-case perspective, regarding international law around contracts.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:00

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

I thought kayak was the resident legal goon

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:01

biglads: Feb 21, 2007; I could've gone to Blatherwycke

nnnotime posted:

What are the chances that once the legal pre-battle gets underway that this thread starts pulling in most of the Legal-goons? Will the mod-team need to add a Lawyer goon to keep them in check?

This thread also might become the most educational ever from a civil-case perspective, regarding international law around contracts.

As long as I can post "THAT'S HIM IN THE COURTROOM" at some point, I'll be happy.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:02

Abuminable: Mar 30, 2017; Now, aside from the Abuminable, business goes on as usual.

Beet Wagon posted:

Good God, that "please don't go live" thread on reddit feels like listening to the final Jonestown recording.

This dude has been an ardent defender of SC for years and has a bunch of posts in /refunds to that effect and over the last couple weeks he's shifted so much I had to double check that he wasn't a goon account

Same. I read a comment that I agreed with and did a double-take when I saw he was the author.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:03

Dooguk: Oct 11, 2016; Pillbug

biglads posted:

As long as I can post "THAT'S HIM IN THE COURTROOM" at some point, I'll be happy.

"It's Crobbler wot dun it"

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:05

Foo Diddley: Oct 29, 2011; cat

Beet Wagon posted:

Good God, that "please don't go live" thread on reddit feels like listening to the final Jonestown recording.

This dude has been an ardent defender of SC for years and has a bunch of posts in /refunds to that effect and over the last couple weeks he's shifted so much I had to double check that he wasn't a goon account

I wonder how long he's going to give CIG to get their poo poo together before he stops telling people about the game. Two weeks?

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:11

Dusty Lens: Jul 1, 2015; All Glory unto the Stimpire. Give up your arms and legs and embrace the beautiful agony of electricity that doubles in pain every second.

D_Smart posted:

Then you have Jared Huckaby, who will also have to answer questions as to how a convicted burgler who did time & parole, ended up being the face of what has turned out to be the most toxic community in gaming.

Go gently caress yourself.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:11

Dusty Lens: Jul 1, 2015; All Glory unto the Stimpire. Give up your arms and legs and embrace the beautiful agony of electricity that doubles in pain every second.

TheAgent posted:

I thought kayak was the resident legal goon

Kayak is almost certainly the best of us regardless of profession.

# ? Dec 18, 2017 18:13

Beet Wagon: Oct 19, 2015

reddit posted:

Anyone know if its possible to replenish your PTU account funds without having to rely on getting it from missions?

I made a slight math error when loading cargo into my ship at Levski, accidentally buying 900,000aUEC in medical supplies just before my game crashed and my ship was lost. I never even got to see the ship all loaded up Now, after buying armor and weapons, recalling ships, and repairing/refueling I am down to less than 80k in my account. Im sure I could make that last as long as needed but it would be nice to test some heavy cargo runs too!

Can I recopy my account and get the starting million back or is aUEC permanent? Worth asking about in a support ticket?