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Best producer/showrunner? This poll is closed. |
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| Verity Lambert |
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30 | 15.31% |
| Barry Letts |
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7 | 3.57% |
| Phillip Hinchcliffe |
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32 | 16.33% |
| John Nathan-Turner |
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6 | 3.06% |
| Russell T Davies |
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33 | 16.84% |
| Steven Moffat |
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50 | 25.51% |
| Chris Chibnall (I am from the future) |
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38 | 19.39% |
| Total: | 196 votes | ||
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Grouchio posted:I haven't regularly watched Doctor Who since Series 8's end, how has the show held up since then and how was this episode? The most recent season was one of the best of the revival. Two naff episodes in the middle but overall it was really good.
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Dec 26, 2017 21:25
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Dabir posted:There's a decent TV series set there called All Creatures Great and Small that's probably worth watching. It's all on YouTube. Ah poo poo I loved James Herriot books growing up, I'll check that out. Thanks. Failing that I'll just drip weak acid in my ears slowly over the course of the next year until everything sounds equally garbled and terrible Barry Foster posted:
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Dec 26, 2017 21:29
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WHAT DO YOU MEAN THE DOCTOR IS 4 BILLION YEARS OLD NOW!? 
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Dec 26, 2017 21:31
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Grouchio posted:WHAT DO YOU MEAN THE DOCTOR IS 4 BILLION YEARS OLD NOW!? He's not, and don't read spoilers for those two episodes, they are some of the best Doctor Who I've ever seen
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Dec 26, 2017 21:34
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Grouchio posted:WHAT DO YOU MEAN THE DOCTOR IS 4 BILLION YEARS OLD NOW!? Just in his mind, physically he's much younger.
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Dec 26, 2017 21:50
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I didn’t like One’s casual sexism, and the whole thing was a lot more low key than I was hoping for...but once I realized that they were at the Christmas Armistice I started ugly crying and I didn’t stop until “Oh, brilliant!”. I’m going to miss the hell out of Capaldi, but I think Whittaker is going to be a tremendous Doctor.
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Dec 26, 2017 21:53
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Grouchio posted:I haven't regularly watched Doctor Who since Series 8's end, how has the show held up since then and how was this episode? It's never been as good as series 8 but was on decent form this year. Series 9 was mostly naff but you should definitely watch Face The Raven/Heaven Sent/Hell Bent
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Dec 26, 2017 22:12
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2house2fly posted:It's never been as good as series 8 but was on decent form this year. Series 9 was mostly naff but you should definitely watch Face The Raven/Heaven Sent/Hell Bent I'd say 10 was far more consistently good than 8. 8 has about 3-4 good eps, but by and large, it's mostly 'eh'.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:16
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AndyElusive posted:Just in his mind, physically he's much younger. Not even in his mind, he only spent about a day Doing That Thing from his perspective
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Dec 26, 2017 22:30
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TL posted:I didn’t like One’s casual sexism, and the whole thing was a lot more low key than I was hoping for...but once I realized that they were at the Christmas Armistice I started ugly crying and I didn’t stop until “Oh, brilliant!”. "Here we go... the long way 'round" got me a little more than I thought it would.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:45
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Soothing Vapors posted:Not even in his mind, he only spent about a day Doing That Thing from his perspective Although I did like at the beginning of Hell Bent with Clara calling the perpetrators out: "How long were you in there?" "It doesn't matter..." "How. LONG?" *turns to other time lords* "How long was he in there?" "6 billion years..." "  " She looked ready to kill them herself.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:50
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My recent obsession with the idea of personal identity made me a little unhappy with parts of this. Real Bill and Nardole did NOT get to say goodbye to CapDoc, they never knew what happened to him. These glass versions are just illusions who think they're the same as the originals. So it was all for his benefit and for the theme of memories, but no more real than if he just interacted with pre-programmed artificial intelligences who mimicked them well enough, IMO. I feel bad for the real Bill and Nardole (and I guess Clara too). They specified they take the person at the very last moment, so ~maybe~ you could argue it's a proper perfect transfer, and the body returned is a lifeless husk where nobody would notice, that feels slightly better but still doesn't answer all the personal identity questions (of course there aren't any complete answers, or else it wouldn't be debated any longer - and a copy might still require a form of dualism/"soul"). But, I cannot remember for sure but think they were called copies, not transfers. It's similar to the Star Trek transporter problem, I lean towards that's actually a death->cloning. And now I want to go read "The City of the Saved" which has been sitting on my shelf for years unread, to look for any similarities/lifting of ideas.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:58
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Mokinokaro posted:Hartnell's run has a LITTLE sexism due to the time it takes place in, but Hartnell's Doctor was never, ever close to that. He treated his companions with respect overall regardless of gender (though he acted, of course, as a parental figure to Susan.) Of course, the simple fact he played the character as pretty asexual (or at least not interested in humans/companions) helped. Hartnell was the kind grandfather to his companions most of the time and if he was upset or angry towards a female character it was about their actions and had nothing to do with gender. Who has always been a pretty progressive show (though of course within the constraints of the time periods it was filmed in) and the Doctor himself was always pretty core to that. Sometimes early doctor stuff was too progressive for the viewers, like when people didn't like having a smart scientist woman in pertwee's run and they replaced her
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Dec 26, 2017 23:04
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Jeffe posted:My recent obsession with the idea of personal identity made me a little unhappy with parts of this. Real Bill and Nardole did NOT get to say goodbye to CapDoc, they never knew what happened to him. These glass versions are just illusions who think they're the same as the originals. So it was all for his benefit and for the theme of memories, but no more real than if he just interacted with pre-programmed artificial intelligences who mimicked them well enough, IMO. I feel bad for the real Bill and Nardole (and I guess Clara too). They specified they take the person at the very last moment, so ~maybe~ you could argue it's a proper perfect transfer, and the body returned is a lifeless husk where nobody would notice, that feels slightly better but still doesn't answer all the personal identity questions (of course there aren't any complete answers, or else it wouldn't be debated any longer - and a copy might still require a form of dualism/"soul"). But, I cannot remember for sure but think they were called copies, not transfers. Yeah, but I think that's kind of neat about it really. The Doctor gets to see Bill and Clara again, except it's not the real Bill and Clara but it's clones who act exactly like they would. It lets the Doctor interact with them one last time without treading on their open endings, which was something I was concerned about with Bill.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:05
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What I didn't like about the whole Testimony thing is that it's a macro-scale time engineering project which seems to be able to override Time Lord technology, but the Time Lords had no idea that such a thing existed, and the Daleks knew about it but hadn't obliterated it. I get that lots of this show involves swallowing a maguffin and suspending disbelief to get a story (and that's really what I like about it), but this one was particularly distracting for me.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:14
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I'll have to rewatch it but the impression I got was that they never claimed these were the ACTUAL person, just a complete recording of their memories/personalities so that you could still have access to the "person" and their memories, thoughts, feelings etc. That was nobody would ever truly be "gone" from the Universe, but the actual person themselves was/is dead. That's why I really like the suggestion that the Doctor is NOT inside the Testimony, because of course he/she never dies because it will always be a case of,"One more life can't hurt..." no matter how tired he/she gets  And yeah the "real" Bill left, but she left the Doctor in the TARDIS and she knows he'll be alright, and I suspect Nardole does too.... because it's the Doctor, that's just what the Doctor does 
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Dec 26, 2017 23:16
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I'm super spoiled, because everybody keeps telling me that when new Doctors arrive, everybody gets weird on them for awhile until by the end, they're beloved in the role and the cycle starts anew, but Eccleston to Tennant to Smith to Capaldi to Whittaker has just been "Ooh! Neat!" for me the whole time, pretty much. I'm super pumped about new Doctor and I'm glad most of us in here seem to be as well.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:36
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loving lol at how after months of simpering fuckwits on twitter shouting "IF DOCTOR IS WOMAN THEN WE CALL HER NURSE?"  , this episode actually did feature the Doctor being called The Nurse, but it was Capaldi being called that by his older self.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:43
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Jerusalem posted:I'll have to rewatch it but the impression I got was that they never claimed these were the ACTUAL person, just a complete recording of their memories/personalities so that you could still have access to the "person" and their memories, thoughts, feelings etc. That was nobody would ever truly be "gone" from the Universe, but the actual person themselves was/is dead. That's why I really like the suggestion that the Doctor is NOT inside the Testimony, because of course he/she never dies because it will always be a case of,"One more life can't hurt..." no matter how tired he/she gets I thought of them as being similar to Rimmer from Red Dwarf. You smeghead.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:43
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Soothing Vapors posted:Ah poo poo I loved James Herriot books growing up, I'll check that out. Thanks. Let us know when you've watched episode 2.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:48
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Davros1 posted:I thought of them as being similar to Rimmer from Red Dwarf. Not nearly enough self loathing and swimming certificates.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:16
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The thing that really bothered me about this special and last year's special is that they felt like they had far less to do with Christmas than previous specials. The whole Christmas in the trenches thing and everything to do with that soldier just seemed kinda tacked on. Watch the Christmas specials from a few years ago and you'll see a noticeable difference. It's like they're filming the episode with the rest of the season and holding that final season episode back to air on Christmas and just throwing in a tiny amount of Christmas-related stuff to justify it. They could have aired this episode months ago as this past's season's finale and it would have felt far more "in place." I don't think I'm coming up with the proper words to express my dissatisfaction very well. Hopefully this makes sense to someone.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:21
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...! posted:The thing that really bothered me about this special and last year's special is that they felt like they had far less to do with Christmas than previous specials. The whole Christmas in the trenches thing and everything to do with that soldier just seemed kinda tacked on. Watch the Christmas specials from a few years ago and you'll see a noticeable difference. I understand it, although I personally don't think it's necessarily a bad thing. Especially with something like this episode, you want it to be able to stand outside of the specific day it was aired; they're going to be watched for a lot of reasons, and on a lot of days, that aren't Christmas. So it's probably better to have the idea of Christmas be downplayed and just a part of the overall story, rather than something like Time of the Doctor where it's distractingly center-stage. The way they've been approaching Christmas specials is less to have them be explicitly Christmas-y, and more to have that specific mood and environment inform the tone of the actual story. Who Christmas stories are light-hearted, they have happy endings, because they're the thing you watch with the whole family after Christmas dinner when all the kids are tired but happy and all the adults are slightly drunk. That doesn't always make them saccharine (Twice Upon a Time was pretty serious, and Last Christmas was an outright horror with Santa on the sidelines), but it does make them lighter and happier than similar stories. Also: The Runaway Bride, Voyage of the Damned, The End of Time Part 1 (I think that was a Christmas episode, right?), possibly The Doctor The Widow and The Wardrobe I haven't seen it in a while. Christmas episodes that aren't very Christmas-centric aren't new to the Capaldi tenure.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:45
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...! posted:The thing that really bothered me about this special and last year's special is that they felt like they had far less to do with Christmas than previous specials. The whole Christmas in the trenches thing and everything to do with that soldier just seemed kinda tacked on. Watch the Christmas specials from a few years ago and you'll see a noticeable difference. It varies. It's not like the most successful Christmas specials - the RTD ones - had much to do with Christmas.
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Dec 27, 2017 01:04
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Rewatching Capaldi. Wow he came out of regeneration as a hardass the first few episodes. Also: Robots of Sherwood is loving awful wow
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Dec 27, 2017 01:40
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Jeffe posted:It's similar to the Star Trek transporter problem, I lean towards that's actually a death->cloning. Yeah, I've always shared the same intuition about personal identity. (I remember writing my first undergrad paper on the teleporter problem, that's beginning to be a while ago now...) I'm not even sure if Puddle-Bill is the 'real' Bill but I can just imagine there's some measure of physical continuity in the definitely realistic scenario of becoming a Puddle Person (and all on-screen teleports).  I think trying to put all of Doctor Who into a coherent metaphysical system would drive a person mad though so you just have to roll with it.  (I feel that the DW universe is usually some kind of dualist with regard to it's idea of mind though...)I looked up that City of the Saved stuff, the Wikipedia page makes it sound a big influence for Moffat's Testimony. I wonder how Lawrence Miles would feel about it if he still watched the show. Also I agree with 2house2fly in it allowing The Doctor closure without tacking more poo poo onto the end of the others' stories, which makes Testimony a pretty convenient plot device for all future regenerations (which will probably never be referenced again).
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Dec 27, 2017 02:04
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navyjack posted:Rewatching Capaldi. Wow he came out of regeneration as a hardass the first few episodes. That episode originally aired just after an ISIS beheading had occurred, so they cut some crucial scenes regarding the Sheriff. Were they ever added back in?
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Dec 27, 2017 02:05
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What are y'alls thoughts about the missy subplot this season? I thought it was refreshing that the season didn't lead to a universal crisis. All of capaldi's seasons have been smaller scale and I have appreciated it. I'll miss that wonderful man and can't wait to see what the show becomes under the new boss and doctor. Merry Christmas y'all.
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Dec 27, 2017 02:58
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Spikeguy posted:What are y'alls thoughts about the missy subplot this season? I thought it was refreshing that the season didn't lead to a universal crisis. All of capaldi's seasons have been smaller scale and I have appreciated it. I'll miss that wonderful man and can't wait to see what the show becomes under the new boss and doctor. Michelle Gomez is a delight. I hope she reprises the role. Her sorta-kinda-redemption arc was pretty cool, and I thought it was v. poignant that the Doctor will probably never know that he actually got through to her
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Dec 27, 2017 03:02
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Chiming in to say Whittaker's first moment as the Doctor was excellent; that moment of complete confusion followed by the excitement was very good. Matt Smith's last speech is my favorite scene of the Doctor on their way out but Whittaker has the best entrance of a Doctor.
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Dec 27, 2017 03:03
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Soothing Vapors posted:Michelle Gomez is a delight. I hope she reprises the role. I'm sorry, the Master is now dead forever and always and will definitely never be brought back to life by the vaguest of explanations 
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Dec 27, 2017 03:46
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side_burned posted:Chiming in to say Whittaker's first moment as the Doctor was excellent; that moment of complete confusion followed by the excitement was very good. Matt Smith's last speech is my favorite scene of the Doctor on their way out but Whittaker has the best entrance of a Doctor. The best part was the "Huh, that's neat!  " followed by immediately going into ACTION DOCTOR mode when the TARDIS blows up as usual. She barely got a chance to see her new face before she's hanging on for dear life.Eleven had issues getting his TARDIS under control, but Thirteen just inherited a flat out death trap from Twelve.
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Dec 27, 2017 03:49
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I like the notion of Thirteen thinking "For gently caress's sake, I'd just gotten the hang of driving this piece of crap after 900/2000/6 billion/googolplex years" right as she slips off the console.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:02
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Soothing Vapors posted:Michelle Gomez is a delight. I hope she reprises the role. She's said she won't, and it's looking like they're trying for as clean a break as possible, but goddamn I hope so too. A Big Finish spinoff where she and Matt Lucas have ill-tempered adventures through time and space would also be acceptable.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:05
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Chokes McGee posted:I'm sorry, the Master is now dead forever and always and will definitely never be brought back to life by the vaguest of explanations  docbeard posted:She's said she won't, and it's looking like they're trying for as clean a break as possible, but goddamn I hope so too. But yeah I need the adventures of nardole and missy right now
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Dec 27, 2017 04:08
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Meh give them a season to get their feet underneath them. Callbacks and crossovers will happen, but they can't happen right out of the gate.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:12
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One little callback I thought was nicely underplayed was glassBill echoing the Doctor's own plea to Clara from Deep Breath, about standing right there and not being seen.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:15
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Soothing Vapors posted:
Moffat said he asked RTD for permission to bring the Simm Master back. Seems like a clean slate is now tradition.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:23
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I'm pretty sure that's why he got the Clara memories back, so that Chibnall can refer to her without worrying about messing up continuity.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:26
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The_Doctor posted:I'm sure we got a 'Polly, put the kettle on' gag at some point. Yeah, Ben made it in one of their early episodes - I think it was The Smugglers.
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Dec 27, 2017 04:53
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