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tbf that's a good animation. in the top 10 bioware animations, easy
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Jan 8, 2018 02:53
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psychoJ posted:tbf that's a good animation. in the top 10 bioware animations, easy that's not saying a lot when Bioware has only made ten animations across all their 3D games
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Jan 8, 2018 02:56
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Is anachronox a wrpg? That was fun
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Jan 8, 2018 02:58
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:The best Western RPGs are Diablo and its various progeny, because they are at least about the gameplay rather than trying to find the least offensive package to stuff a "video game writing"-quality narrative into. Sounds like you’re describing JRPGs 
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Jan 8, 2018 03:07
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Maybe all RPGs are terrible?
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Jan 8, 2018 03:07
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Maybe they're good but not generally your thing
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Jan 8, 2018 03:08
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mass effect 2 is a fun shooter
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Jan 8, 2018 03:13
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The Last of Us > Uncharted: Lost Legacy > UC4 > UC2 > UC3 > UC1 imho
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Jan 8, 2018 03:18
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Jay Rust posted:Maybe all RPGs are terrible? I do think "grinding on too-easy encounters in order to make later encounters easier" is about as close to an inherently bad mechanic as it's possible to get. Which is to say, it's not actually inherently bad, some rare games use it well, make it part of a larger risk-reward and resource-conserving system, but it's a very large risk of creating degenerate gameplay in exchange for a benefit that, if all goes well, you won't even notice.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:19
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precision posted:The Last of Us > Uncharted: Lost Legacy > UC4 > UC2 > UC3 > UC1 Yea, Naughty Dog is basically the Western SquareEnix, they've made great additions to the JRPG world.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:21
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every naughty dog game has intensely bored me
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Jan 8, 2018 03:23
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I've never really felt like grinding was ever necessary in an RPG I played and people treating it as ubiquitous is always odd to me, esp since plenty of them scale xp one way or the other. If anything I've played more that let you rocket past the curve for zero active effort (FFXV, P5). e: Though in P5 after a point they toss out 90% of why xp would matter. Motto fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Jan 8, 2018 |
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Jan 8, 2018 03:25
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Expect My Mom posted:every naughty dog game Jak and Daxter 1 is cool but that was their last good game
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Jan 8, 2018 03:31
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I do think "grinding on too-easy encounters in order to make later encounters easier" is about as close to an inherently bad mechanic as it's possible to get. Which is to say, it's not actually inherently bad, some rare games use it well, make it part of a larger risk-reward and resource-conserving system, but it's a very large risk of creating degenerate gameplay in exchange for a benefit that, if all goes well, you won't even notice. Lisa was neat in that grinding was actively discouraged, since everywhere except for like 2-3 games the encounters were set, with no random battles. Expect My Mom posted:every naughty dog game I really don't like Uncharted/TLOU. Moreso with TLOU but it has the same sort of thing where people fawn over how artistic and deep it is, when it's really not. Lisa (yeah I like that game a lot, okay?) was basically the exact same story as TLOU but was told in an infinitely more interesting way.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:36
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I think random battles are my least favourite thing in games My favourite thing in games is seeing a choice I made in dialogue come up again later
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Jan 8, 2018 03:38
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I do think "grinding on too-easy encounters in order to make later encounters easier" is about as close to an inherently bad mechanic as it's possible to get. Which is to say, it's not actually inherently bad, some rare games use it well, make it part of a larger risk-reward and resource-conserving system, but it's a very large risk of creating degenerate gameplay in exchange for a benefit that, if all goes well, you won't even notice. have you played any notable jrpgs released since the ps1, because jrpgs have been phasing out grinding since the ps2 and lots of old wrpgs don't even make grinding a viable option for gaining experience i'm not even trying to do like, a sarcastic own, i cannot think of any big jrpgs i've played released around the ps3 era where grinding was even valuable enough to be worth doing. it only exists in games that don't know how to balance their difficulty and big jrpgs worked that stuff out a long time ago
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Jan 8, 2018 03:38
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Cuntellectual posted:TLOU but it has the same sort of thing where people fawn over how artistic and deep it is, when it's really not. what if i think it's just an incredibly fun game to play?
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Jan 8, 2018 03:39
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Jay Rust posted:I think random battles are my least favourite thing in games I don't think anyone LIKES random battles. They're just there to pad out the game, and so few JRPGs require any thought or skill to play. Earthbound is easily the best example of random encounters, though. If they're too weak, you win them instantly. Even if they're not, you can try avoiding them.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:40
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Grinding only exists in MMORPGs now, where it takes up roughly 65% of your playtime
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Jan 8, 2018 03:40
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Jay Rust posted:Grinding only exists in MMORPGs now, where it takes up roughly 65% of your playtime The Souls series has plenty of it too.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:42
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Cuntellectual posted:I don't think anyone LIKES random battles. They're just there to pad out the game, and so few JRPGs require any thought or skill to play. earthbound isn't really random encounters, enemy markers on the overworld and in dungeons is kind of just what jrpgs have totally shifted to. the only thing about earthbound that makes its encounters random is that it sometimes makes one of them charge into you at max speed
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Jan 8, 2018 03:42
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precision posted:what if i think it's just an incredibly fun game to play? That's fine, just like it's fine if you only liked it for the story. But I will also disagree with you there, I don't think either game is very fun. (Bioshock infinite is reasonably fun but it didn't blow me away). Jay Rust posted:Grinding only exists in MMORPGs now, where it takes up roughly 65% of your playtime Depends on what you mean. In the MMO sense it referred to Everquest style "Just kill monsters over and over" style of leveling up, where basically every MMO that hasn't died (or at least mostly died) you can do quests and stuff. If you mean repeating trade skills or whatever, yeah, that's true. Also it definitely exists in other things, it's just more a question of how much it's required. I spent hours grinding Fire Emblem Awakening and don't regret it at all, since it was in service of unlocking all the support conversations and making my team as absurdly overpowered as I could.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:43
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Ive done grinding in a lot of JRPGs but its because I generally try to do postgame superbosses where the encounter is solved before it even starts by whether or not youve prepared adequately.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:43
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The Colonel posted:have you played any notable jrpgs released since the ps1, because jrpgs have been phasing out grinding since the ps2 and lots of old wrpgs don't even make grinding a viable option for gaining experience I played Nier: Automata.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:43
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Also honestly I probably got off on the wrong foot talking about "grinding" because that's much too narrow, it's more the concept of XP and potentially encountering the same content at different levels of power at all. Why not cut out the middle-man and either expect your players to rise to the challenge, or if they need the difficulty adjusted, make it available explicitly as adjustable difficulty? There are good answers to this question but there are fewer of them than there are RPGs. Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Jan 8, 2018 |
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Jan 8, 2018 03:44
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I like to grind because I like seeing numbers get bigger and also the very act of random battles has its roots in gambling and that soothes a vice i haven't fully developed yet so i dont buy more lootboxes or whatever and then its a problemIn Training posted:Jak and Daxter 1 is cool but that was their last good game
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Jan 8, 2018 03:45
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I played Nier: Automata. then i dunno what to say cause i haven't played that game cause it would melt my computer i've played every tales game released in the last few years and grinding has not been a thing in those, it hasn't really been a thing in any of the trails games, and it hasn't been a thing in the ps2 jrpgs that stick out to me like shadow hearts 2, is what i'm saying. jrpgs have gotten very lenient about xp curves over time, and it's mainly crappy post-game stuff or snes-era stuff that demands grinding. like tales of berseria has a lot of bosses at the end who are super high level on the higher difficulties and it'll give you achievements for maxing out your levels, but also it gives you new game + stuff to accelerate it and it's not really something you need to bother with at all outside of that The Colonel fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Jan 8, 2018 |
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Jan 8, 2018 03:45
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The Colonel posted:have you played any notable jrpgs released since the ps1, because jrpgs have been phasing out grinding since the ps2 and lots of old wrpgs don't even make grinding a viable option for gaining experience The Nep games are about the only ones I can think of where I've had to actually grind (which is why they just give you a massive experience boost unlock), and I think in that case it's a combination of that being them not really caring and also it kind of being a joke because there is no one on this earth who thinks the scaling in those games makes any kind of sense.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:49
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random encounters only bother me when they take a long time, either because of loading screens or animations or whatever. don't waste my fuckin' time here!
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Jan 8, 2018 03:50
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The Colonel posted:then i dunno what to say cause i haven't played that game cause it would melt my computer the flip side of "you have to grind and it's boring to do that" is "by just doing any of the optional content at all you've already flattened the difficulty of stuff that might otherwise have been challenging later on" there's a happy medium of course and most games will only be a little towards either extreme but again, the question is why have it at all? why not just fine-tune the difficulty of each encounter in the game? why not either set a fixed hurdle for people to come at and succeed or fail, or else give the player total agency over their experience?
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Jan 8, 2018 03:51
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Motto posted:I've never really felt like grinding was ever necessary in an RPG I played and people treating it as ubiquitous is always odd to me, esp since plenty of them scale xp one way or the other. If anything I've played more that let you rocket past the curve for zero active effort (FFXV, P5). Stop fighting monsters and try to rush through the games and you'll hit walls and need to grind, i prefer to do all the fighting i have to do at once than deal with the constant interruptions
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Jan 8, 2018 03:54
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Enemy levels scaling to your own in FF8 was kind of a new thing at the time right? Was pretty cool anyways, although you just ended up grinding in a different way by drawing spells.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:55
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Doctor Spaceman posted:The Souls series has plenty of it too. Oh sure. I don’t think I’ve personally ground for souls but I have ground for items, which is pretty anti-fun too. Random drops are weird, because either you don’t know about the specifics and a rare drop is a pleasant surprise, or you know the item you want and where to get it and have to spend an hour or more trying to farm for it.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:56
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Played about an hour of little nightmares. Thought it was gonna be more survival horror that puzzle platformer so im kinda bummed but its so pretty ill hang with it
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Jan 8, 2018 03:56
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Doctor Spaceman posted:The Souls series has plenty of it too. Eh? I’m about 35 hours into DS3 and I’ve never had to grind to get past a boss, it’s always been about playing smarter and better.
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Jan 8, 2018 03:58
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:the flip side of "you have to grind and it's boring to do that" is "by just doing any of the optional content at all you've already flattened the difficulty of stuff that might otherwise have been challenging later on" because levels are an easy way to contextualize your party getting stronger over the course of the game and why you keep gaining new abilities and taking stats in general out would effectively make it a different game??? there are a lot of things a lot of jrpgs could do better but taking out levels and trying to think of an entirely new way to handle progression that no other game is attempting would be an enormous headache saga doesn't have levels, it just contextualizes people getting stronger in a totally different way, and it owns, but it's also loving impenetrable
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Jan 8, 2018 04:00
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I'm glad a les miserables fighting game exists but I wish there was a fiddler on the roof fighting game too
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Jan 8, 2018 04:00
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FirstAidKite posted:I'm glad a les miserables fighting game exists but I wish there was a fiddler on the roof fighting game too
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Jan 8, 2018 04:04
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The Colonel posted:because levels are an easy way to contextualize your party getting stronger over the course of the game and why you keep gaining new abilities and taking stats in general out would effectively make it a different game??? there are a lot of things a lot of jrpgs could do better but taking out levels and trying to think of an entirely new way to handle progression that no other game is attempting would be an enormous headache it's not something that no other game is attempting, though in fact it's the default for everything that isn't an RPG!
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Jan 8, 2018 04:05
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:it's not something that no other game is attempting, though did you skip over the part where i said that would effectively make it a different genre
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Jan 8, 2018 04:07
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