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evol262 posted:That's binary translation. Didn't ARM have to redesign it's virtualization ISA once because they went all ivory tower on it and it was useless in the real world?
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Feb 22, 2018 15:58
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karoshi posted:Didn't ARM have to redesign it's virtualization ISA once because they went all ivory tower on it and it was useless in the real world? Kind of -- aarch64/arm8.1 is much better, but the initial implementations of the hyp instruction were basically built for a Xen/Hyper-V dom0 use case, where access is directly mediated by the host kernel, instead of KVM (userspace->kernel->guest). ARM calls them execution levels, but we'll just use rings. ARM is particularly strange about memory layout in general. Honestly, Richard Jones (libguestfs maintainer) seems to spend his entire life bringing up RHEL/Fedora on weird hardware, and his blog isn't a horrible place to keep up on it. ARM basically has userspace in ring1, and the kernel in ring0 (EL0 and EL1 in ARM terminology). Early ARM virt) added ring-1 (EL2), but EL2 guests could essentially only flag certain operations. Guest kernels still had to run in EL1, which meant sharing a shitload of registers with the actual system kernel, and context switching all over the place, plus the page table layout was different. And userspace applications which wanted to talk to the guest kernel had to talk to EL1, get trapped to EL2, new instruction, etc. VHE in ARM8.1/aarch64 still has some annoying assumptions about memory layout, but it's essentially cheating by just re-implementing every normal register for EL2 mode also, which required modifying KVM/qemu-kvm to use EL2_* registers. Still an 80% performance increase. Not a redesign per-se, but more of: quote:we didn't actually learn any of the lessons the x86 vendors taught us as they evolved virt, so we started from an extremely naive place and nothing's gonna work with unmodified guests unless you hack the hell out of it. Paravirt, pls. We also won't support the most common configuration on ARM (Linux kernel with mainline modules). Good luck getting vendors to clean up their 300k LoC patchsets to make kernel X.Y.Z and only kernel X.Y.Z run enough to apply Xen to it The real shitshow on ARM is guessing which ARM ISA you actually want to use.
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Feb 22, 2018 18:15
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e ^^^: Saw some discussions on that on the ~riscuuuuu~ lists. They were going head first into the 1st option and had to be talked by some guy who knew wtf he was talking about into not doing an ARM. quote is not edit, gently caress. karoshi fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 18:50
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evol262 posted:Kind of -- aarch64/arm8.1 is much better, but the initial implementations of the hyp instruction were basically built for a Xen/Hyper-V dom0 use case, where access is directly mediated by the host kernel, instead of KVM (userspace->kernel->guest). ARM calls them execution levels, but we'll just use rings. 
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Feb 23, 2018 02:08
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Thank you very much for all that, it's super interesting, I love hearing about poo poo like this. I was at a conference last year where one of the guys behind the early days of lxc gave a talk and it was fascinating. That guys blog looks like a good read too. Maybe one day I can virtualize Android Wear on my phone so I don't have to deal with having a second device.
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Feb 23, 2018 07:24
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Oracle is legitimately trying to sell virtualbox to me, hard 
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Feb 23, 2018 17:43
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Potato Salad posted:Oracle is legitimately trying to sell virtualbox to me, hard Isn't virtualbox free or did I just miss the joke?
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Feb 23, 2018 18:02
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cheese-cube posted:Isn't virtualbox free or did I just miss the joke? I'm half tempted to find out what the hell kind of crazy licensing scheme they're concocting, but Rule 1 is never to engage Oracle about Oracle licensing
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Feb 23, 2018 18:07
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Potato Salad posted:I'm half tempted to find out what the hell kind of crazy licensing scheme they're concocting, but Rule 1 is never to engage Oracle about Oracle licensing Maybe it's some kinda next-level Oracle sales strategy where they rope you in by presenting something that's so ridiculous that you stay engaged out of pure morbid curiosity and next thing you know you've signed off on $500k worth of ODAs? More seriously though they're probably trying to sell you Oracle Enterprise Linux with their customised version of KVM like what they run on their ODAs.
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Feb 23, 2018 18:52
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They can barely support their rdbms. Their erp is an eternally burning heap of fire so outpaced by modern commodity platforms that it's unthinkable that any entity that wasn't married to Oracle by 1998 would have a relationship with them today. Why the gently caress would you use their os, nonetheless whatever the hell kind of tortorous nonsense they've done to kvm?
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Feb 23, 2018 18:59
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Potato Salad posted:They can barely support their rdbms. Their erp is an eternally burning heap of fire so outpaced by modern commodity platforms that it's unthinkable that any entity that wasn't married to Oracle by 1998 would have a relationship with them today. From personal experience, while I was doing some performance analysis on a big java application that was using Oracle backend, Oracle linux had the following advantages over RedHat (7.2 era):
And, oh, they were trying to sell me at the time (once per month) their live-kernel patching mechanism. Which is not even theirs. But hey, they sell it and probably support it.
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Feb 23, 2018 19:10
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Ksplice?
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Feb 23, 2018 19:22
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Potato Salad posted:They can barely support their rdbms. Their erp is an eternally burning heap of fire so outpaced by modern commodity platforms that it's unthinkable that any entity that wasn't married to Oracle by 1998 would have a relationship with them today. One of our customers, without consulting us, spent over $700k procuring eight ODAs with dedicated DAS (SAS-attached disk shelves) deployed in clusters of four nodes across two DCs. The two clusters ran in an active/passive configuration and hosted a total of two DBs. Two DBs running on hundreds of thousands of dollars of hardware. They weren't even particularly busy DBs and could have run perfectly fine in VMs. At the end of the day our customer really just got thoroughly owned by Oracle sales which could have been avoided if they engaged us (Of course we were resourced to deploy the ODAs so at least we made some money out of it). Oracle sales got their foot in the door when our customer went to them to negotiate license renewal for those two Oracle DBs. It just went downhill from there. So yeah to answer your question, someone would use Oracle Linux / OL KVM / ODAs if they'd been conned by Oracle sales.
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Feb 23, 2018 19:48
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Potato Salad posted:Ksplice? Yes. I don't think there's another one.
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Feb 23, 2018 20:38
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cheese-cube posted:Isn't virtualbox free or did I just miss the joke? VirtualBox is open source software, but the Extension Pack is closed source and commercial. You will need to purchase a license unless you are only using it in personal, non-business use. I was helping a coworker to install VBox on his computer, and as a hazing I prompted him to read the license agreement. And that's when we learned that we can't use that poo poo at work.
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Feb 23, 2018 20:46
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In the age of hyper-v, docker, fusion, etc running on business w10 laptops with pretty much any virt feature you could want enabled -- -- in an age where standalone esxi is loving free and runs headless on the laptop Frank in Marketing just broke the screen of -- Oracle wants me to buy virtualbox so I can not have access to avx.
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Feb 23, 2018 20:57
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Feb 25, 2018 11:06
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Can anyone tell me, on a brand new ESX host, what the following script outputs?code:In my environment I see the output below: Host Config.HostAgent.log.level Vpx.Vpxa.config.log.level ---- -------------------------- ------------------------- host1.corp.local info verbose host2.corp.local info verbose
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Feb 27, 2018 19:26
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I would not be running anything in production as verbose unless you are actively troubleshooting. Info at max.
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Feb 27, 2018 20:31
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We're implementing VDI at my company and I've been having a hard time finding any cases involving Microsoft Dynamics/Great Plains. Does anyone have experience or recommendations in that area? Is the Vsphere book on the front page still recommended even if 6.5 is the version out right now? edit: Whoops, the Mastering Vsphere 5 book I meant. As an aside, my Director is trying to get me a trip to Vmworld and perhaps the capability of taking the beginning tests. My only experience has been hands-on in the virtual environment we have here. We had Vsphere 5 on some Dell Equallogics, then upgraded to a HyperFlex system and Vsphere 6. What can I use to begin the literary side? Comfortador fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Feb 27, 2018 |
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Feb 27, 2018 21:17
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Comfortador posted:We're implementing VDI at my company and I've been having a hard time finding any cases involving Microsoft Dynamics/Great Plains. Does anyone have experience or recommendations in that area? True VDI (win 10) or RDSH (win 2016)? Citrix, Horizon, or pure Microsoft? I've done Great Plains on Windows 7/8.1 VDI using Citrix and there really wasn't much to it (because it plays the same as a Windows desktop). I've dealt with it as a Published App before as well but that was ages ago. There was a bunch of tuning recommended by MS to get it to play nice in a TS/RDSH multi-user per machine environment. Can't seem to find it now though so maybe that's changed.
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Feb 27, 2018 22:38
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TheFace posted:True VDI (win 10) or RDSH (win 2016)? Citrix, Horizon, or pure Microsoft? Most of our boxes will be Windows 10 but unfortunately due to the version of Great Plains we are currently on it's looking like those will need to be Windows 7. Our guy is trying to get it updated to a version that supports Windows 10 but for now it's unknown when that will occur. We're using Horizon 7 on a HyperFlex system. The only thing that's worrying me is we had Great plains on a couple VM machines on our old system and we couldn't just clone them, the machine had to be GP free and we installed them individually on each system that needed it. It's not just Great Plains it's like these 8 other sub applications or plugins that have to go along with it. So I'm sure there will be a few gotchas that I won't even know about and there isn't much I can find online with specifics. I was wishing we could just use AppVols for each app but /shrug I dunno.
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Feb 28, 2018 14:28
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sounds like a great use case for rdsh Hint: Horizon Agent can run 3D RDSH on a physical rds host, even a Win 7 box with a bunch of user cals
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Feb 28, 2018 14:56
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Comfortador posted:It's not just Great Plains it's like these 8 other sub applications or plugins that have to go along with it. So I'm sure there will be a few gotchas that I won't even know about and there isn't much I can find online with specifics. I was wishing we could just use AppVols for each app but /shrug I dunno. I'd suggest looking into what those plugins and apps are looking for specifically that is interfering with them being "clonable" It might be something that you can script in an image prep/seal script on your gold image that is run before you clone from it. I can't speak to your specific programs/plugins but I've had some programs that generate a unique ID for the machine on first run and throw it in the registry and if you clone without wiping that reg entry out their licensing or something else gets screwed up. Look for things like that. You might be able to work with the vendor that creates the apps/plugins to find out because in today's day and age between VDI, and just imaging normal workstations, most have run into this before.
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Feb 28, 2018 20:24
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I got Windows 10 running on a Linux (Fedora) host using the virt-manager GUI to set it all up. Storage is via virtio and I'm using a spice server for the graphics (I hope those are the right way of saying it). Everything works kinda as expected but now I'm wondering what the best way to share some directories between the host and guest are. I've read one post on SO to set up a samba server but I've also seen other posts saying to just use "filesystem passthrough" or something like that. Thoughts? Also, is there a way to get rid of the menu bar and title bar? I'm talking about in the host system itself. The bar that says "vmname on QEMU/KVM" and then the menu bar for this window below it. It's just taking up space.
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Mar 1, 2018 13:03
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Assuming that you didn't pick a networking setup that prevents the guest from communicating directly with the host, the easiest solution for Windows guests in my experience is probably to just install WinSCP on it and use SCP to the host. Slightly more work with a similar effect would be setting up an FTP server on the host like vsftpd. If you want a remote folder that can be used as a filesystem directly like a local folder, you want to set up Samba or NFS (which may be a bit wonky with Windows, but should work). I don't recall ever setting up filesystem passthrough with KVM/QEMU, only with VirtualBox on Windows hosts, so I can't say much about it.
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Mar 1, 2018 15:57
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Boris Galerkin posted:I got Windows 10 running on a Linux (Fedora) host using the virt-manager GUI to set it all up. Storage is via virtio and I'm using a spice server for the graphics (I hope those are the right way of saying it). In my personal opinion, the easiest way to go about is with samba. But, instead of setting up samba server on linux, tell windows to be the server. On windows you can do that easily with network share a folder and on linux you can access it by mounting it using the cifs filesystem. Example mount command: code:About the UI: on my system (using KDE) that "bar" is the title bar of the window. Look your DEs configuration if you can make that go away. The menu is not possible to make it go away, only the toolbar (under the View menu). They would go away though if you go full screen, but really they don't take that much space.
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Mar 1, 2018 16:11
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I’m using gnome but I’ll look into it. I don’t wanna go full screen though, because the only reason I’m doing this is to be able to have Office 2016 look and feel like a “native app”. This current setup is working great because I can snap the entire VM window to the sides and make the window smaller/bigger etc. Inside the actual guest I have eg Excel maximized so I’m just treating the entire VM window like it wee just the Excel app. When I get some more time I’d like to see if I can add “multiple” displays to this so that I can trick Windows into thinking I have a second display that I can throw PowerPoint into.
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Mar 1, 2018 17:01
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Boris Galerkin posted:I’m using gnome but I’ll look into it. I don’t wanna go full screen though, because the only reason I’m doing this is to be able to have Office 2016 look and feel like a “native app”. This current setup is working great because I can snap the entire VM window to the sides and make the window smaller/bigger etc. Inside the actual guest I have eg Excel maximized so I’m just treating the entire VM window like it wee just the Excel app. When I get some more time I’d like to see if I can add “multiple” displays to this so that I can trick Windows into thinking I have a second display that I can throw PowerPoint into. The simplest window that I was able to get was from running qemu by itself: code:
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Mar 1, 2018 17:22
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Volguus posted:The simplest window that I was able to get was from running qemu by itself: Does that command mimic what happens when I start virt-manager and press "run"? Like I already have the VM created, can I just start up the VM with a script like that?
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Mar 1, 2018 20:09
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Boris Galerkin posted:Does that command mimic what happens when I start virt-manager and press "run"? Like I already have the VM created, can I just start up the VM with a script like that? Yes, that's what virt manager does too ( well, maybe a bit more complicated) but qemu is what actually runs your VM.
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Mar 1, 2018 20:45
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Volguus posted:Yes, that's what virt manager does too ( well, maybe a bit more complicated) but qemu is what actually runs your VM. virt-manager is essentially a frontend to libvirt (like virsh). The primary "value add" is that it can handle a bunch of finicky migration stuff, easy device passthrough (including to running VMs), managing block storage, CPU flags, et al. It's a lot more complicated, not a little. qemu can do all of that, if you want to manage iscsi storage pools yourself and memorize 90001 flags, though
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Mar 1, 2018 22:57
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evol262 posted:virt-manager is essentially a frontend to libvirt (like virsh). It's nearly impossible to stress how painful the command line options to qemu are, just open up a system running a VM that was started by qemu and `ps aux | grep qemu`, that running process's flags should all be visable (and painful)
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Mar 2, 2018 00:06
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evol262 posted:virt-manager is essentially a frontend to libvirt (like virsh). Sure, a lot more complicated  . But if all he wants is that border-free VM, nothing more, then a few arguments on a shell script is not that crazy.
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Mar 2, 2018 01:28
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I just did ps aux | grep qemu and the output was a 2809 character long string. Just a little. Thanks guys I'll check this out after I made some snapshots of this so I don't mess anything up 
Boris Galerkin fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Mar 2, 2018 |
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Mar 2, 2018 08:17
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Do you have a step by step guide for how to do this? It's not working for me. On the Windows 10 guest I right click on "Documents" and say I want to share it. It tells me my network path for this folder is code:In the guest still, typing ipconfig tells me my IP address is 192.168.166.247 (gateway = 192.168.166.1). In virt-manager it tells me this network is a "Virtual network vm1: NAT" with device model virtio. On the Linux host, I try code:code:code:code:
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Mar 2, 2018 13:38
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You have two options here: - Configure the guest network in bridge mode (so it will run on the same network as the host): https://wiki.libvirt.org/page/Networking#Bridged_networking_.28aka_.22shared_physical_device.22.29 - Configure port-forwarding for the NAT: https://aboullaite.me/kvm-qemo-forward-ports-with-iptables/ https://wiki.libvirt.org/page/Networking#NAT_forwarding_.28aka_.22virtual_networks.22.29 The windows samba ports are quote:The following ports are associated with file sharing and server message block (SMB) communications: And, I think (not 100% n this one) that you need a password for the user, though it may be possible to convince windows to let you share without one, but is not straightforward. Also, don't forget, an admin user can use the default windows shares of the entire C drive, called: C$ (the name of the share). So, with an admin account you can mount //WINDOWSVM/C$ Oh, and another thing about the qemu parameters that libvirt passes: look at them and you don't need to set quite a few of them. Actually, most of them, for your purposes are useless. Don't need USB, don't need to set the accel=kvm, don't need -S and -object tls crap, monitoring, all kinds of devices. Removing that can shorten the list quite a bit. Or, just start the machine from virt manager like before and don't worry about it. Volguus fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Mar 2, 2018 |
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Mar 2, 2018 15:48
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Boris Galerkin posted:Do you have a step by step guide for how to do this? It's not working for me.
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Mar 2, 2018 18:46
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anthonypants posted:Set a password. Can you access it if is NAT-ed without port forwarding? Edit: Now that I think about it, from the host you should be able to. So, forget about port forwarding if you don't need access from anywhere else Volguus fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Mar 2, 2018 |
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Mar 2, 2018 19:53
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anthonypants posted:Set a password. God drat it, yeah that was it. Problem solved. I just had to also add “uid=xxxx,gid=xxxx” to the options to make it writable.
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Mar 2, 2018 22:42
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