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dont be mean to me posted:The biggest mana wall we can get is like three years. Still means we could toss them all in after a mission, and start the new mission with 700 mana. We'd be a Dark Lady in no time.
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Jun 14, 2018 18:56
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I'm pretty sure A. Manawell/Timeplane shenanagans won't work, they'd be too abuseable otherwise B. If we get get a city of minions... we then have to pay them all, and we just burnt through our money C. we still need to actually build this island. B 100 peons and a overseeer No timewarps!
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Jun 14, 2018 19:40
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How are you going to respond to their prayers for food and guidance every couple of seconds? Don't the mana wells come refilled and with minimal storage?
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Jun 14, 2018 19:44
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Rockopolis posted:How are you going to respond to their prayers for food and guidance every couple of seconds? I can only presume Narnia has some mechanism to deliver food thats included in the 2500 gold fee, otherwise we're hiring them to starve our minions  Optimally we can tailor that to a prayer/ritual.
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Jun 14, 2018 21:07
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Bleh. Getting too complicated. Can't we just make Chryssalids or something?
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Jun 14, 2018 21:32
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Ugh this is getting too complicated. 10 small mana pools. Raise castle through sheer force of will, use beavers for detail work. Raid a few ships passing through the strait and turn them into crabbersons and shrimpmen, make some more of that shark thing that ate the original seaglass. Take stock. e: Please note complete lack of time shenanigans Splicer fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Jun 14, 2018 |
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Jun 14, 2018 21:43
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We don't really know the fecundity of a crabberson or mantispistolshrimpman but we could always boost it before we toss them in, get better returns on just one cycle.
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Jun 14, 2018 22:37
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super sweet best pal posted:We don't really know the fecundity of a crabberson or mantispistolshrimpman but we could always boost it before we toss them in, get better returns on just one cycle. I like the cut of your gib. Right now we're assuming 1.2% growth quote:400 years in box: costs 10000 But at 2%... quote:400 years in box: costs 10000 Let's go deeper. 8% quote:100 years in box: costs 2500 So lets get ten 1kgp mana wells, give our minions some hormone treatments, and throw them in for one cycle. edit: This means that mission drift wont be as big an issue, since it will be 'Grandpa said we would meet his liege in ten years' not 'We are inventing the Enlightenment and leaving the Garden mythos behind' Loel fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Jun 14, 2018 |
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Jun 14, 2018 22:45
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Splicer posted:Ugh this is getting too complicated. Simplicity is good. I'm not convinced that our minion designs are sufficient to be worth mass production yet. We can make them more awesome. Mana pools, assuming they're portable, seem like a good investment. Especially because they mean we can get the castle in place without heroes attacking while the defenses are half built. We can stash them at the mine to recharge once the castle's up, although I'm thinking we definitely need to start considering a more permanent Lair so we have a secure place to store our stuff and our minions between jobs. So I'm mostly with Splicer. 10 Small Pools, Raise the castle of rock and coral by magic, then contract the beaver union to do the woodwork and details while we raid ships for hapless fools to turn into more disposable minions that can be sacrificed. If we get leftovers, more crabbersons could be handy. Make a big deal of that last part of the plan to the rest of our minions, to reinforce that they are too valuable to us to to throw away. Labor relations is the key to a productive workforce, after all. Possibly consider hiring in some mercs to do the raiding for us? I'm sure there are pirates in the area that might be willing to sell us captives for a price and provide plausible deniability.
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Jun 15, 2018 06:28
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I'm mildly concerned that if we don't multiply our minions we're going to get crushed by the first navy ship to come by. Remember they wanted a fortress big enough to hold 500. We're interacting with a pair of massive armies here and our pay is contingent on holding out long enough for the right side to take it from us. If they want 500 to hold this place then trying to hold it with only 13 is reckless.
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Jun 15, 2018 06:46
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Dammit, apparently I never mentioned that you can only use one manapool per spell, so ten small is good for lots of little spells, but no use for a large spell....
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Jun 15, 2018 07:51
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Well, that makes a difference. We're gonna need more crabs.
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Jun 15, 2018 09:09
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1) C. The refill is too slow to matter, let’s make sure we can cast really big spells as we need a huge fortress. 2) We don’t need to hire anyone. 3) Yes for 400 years. We shove all the crabbersons, pistolshrimpmen, and beaverpeople into the time portal. We also offer to let Seaglass and Irwin rule the time portal kingdom and to invest our mana in extending their lives. Try to make the deal sound juicy as we want enough stingrays to lead our army, but they’re too dangerous and useful to coerce. If they say yes empty the mana pool on spells for their longevity, if not empty it on raising the basic fortress, either way stash the mana pool in the time plane bundle for a full refill (multiple times if possible, 2500 for 1000 mana is a nice deal and massively increases our spell output). Also we make our fortress by enlarging a sea turtle. That way it can defend itself and is mobile. That or we enlarge living coral so the reef base is defended by massive stinging tentacles from most directions. malbogio fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 09:56
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Grey Hunter posted:Dammit, apparently I never mentioned that you can only use one manapool per spell, so ten small is good for lots of little spells, but no use for a large spell....   How much mana will it take to raise the island + castle? I still think magic is the way to go. The longer we take building the place the greater the chance of someone raising the alarm before we're ready. Revised suggestion: 1 large mana pool (or a medium if that's big enough) - we can look into time accelerating it later if we do a breeding run 1 small mana pool + sink ships to make more minions and some quick cash - Spend a while making as many minions as we can and raiding fat trade ships. Don't let our minions fight, just have them hole the ships and collect the results. Spend a little cash to get some trade schedules, prioritise water-resistant stuff. There's no time limit on this contract, but at some point the traders are going to catch on. As soon as our contacts start hearing rumours of lost ships: Start channeling mana to raise the castle and island in one night - we want that thing to pop up like a mushroom. Beavers for detail work. Continue raiding via minions during the windup process. Take stock Splicer fucked around with this message at 10:14 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 10:06
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I definitely think magic is the way to go for the bulk construction. We want that fortress in place with no warning, and plenty of time to finish and garrison it before either side can mount an army. We're definitely going to want to move into the area ahead of time. We can scout and build up a sub-foundation first, out of sight of prying eyes under the waves, then grow the above-tide portion of the castle as the last bit once the earthworks below are complete. Is there any way we can get charts of the area that show what is known of the seafloor? Our own scouting will be more accurate, but if we have a good idea where to look it will be faster. Plus, it will give us some bright ideas on where to get... creative with growing a few new shoals and reefs to make the castle much harder to assault by anyone who's not amphibious. Always awkward when rocks you didn't expect tear the bottom out of your boat, and all those armored soldiers discover chain and plate don't float. 
Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 10:44 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 10:41
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I think it'd be better to spend a couple weeks building it up undersea before we raise it. Gotta make sure it's good enough to keep the other guys out. The reefs should be heavily defended on the enemy faction's side but light on our heroes' side.
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Jun 15, 2018 10:45
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1 C Large Mana Pool 2 B No Hired Workers 3 400 years Throw all the minions into the pot and see what rises. Extra notes: Build fortress underwater before raising island above sea level.
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Jun 15, 2018 17:25
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malbogio posted:1) C. The refill is too slow to matter, let’s make sure we can cast really big spells as we need a huge fortress. I like this. This must be the hardest decision we've had to make yet.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:07
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Are we able to fecundize our minions and get 8% growth? That could save us 7500 gp
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Jun 15, 2018 18:54
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Even if we can kick fecundity up that high for all our minions AND their descendents we’re just going to end up with an army of babies, children, and pregnant minions to support. The only way fecundity helps is if we can magically graft it for a limit of maybe 4 generations. This is presupposing we can affect fecundity at all which has not been confirmed.
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Jun 15, 2018 19:10
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malbogio posted:Even if we can kick fecundity up that high for all our minions AND their descendents we’re just going to end up with an army of babies, children, and pregnant minions to support. The only way fecundity helps is if we can magically graft it for a limit of maybe 4 generations. This is presupposing we can affect fecundity at all which has not been confirmed. Crabs lay eggs and hatch capable.
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Jun 15, 2018 21:41
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Not Alex posted:Crabs lay eggs and hatch capable. Good point. I was being mammal-centric. Maybe all of our minions aside from the beaver people are egg layers? It’s unclear because they are chimeras.
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Jun 15, 2018 22:25
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malbogio posted:Good point. I was being mammal-centric. Maybe all of our minions aside from the beaver people are egg layers? It’s unclear because they are chimeras. I don't think they've actually had any children yet. We have no idea if the time colony will even work.
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Jun 15, 2018 22:26
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dont be mean to me posted:I don't think they've actually had any children yet. We have no idea if the time colony will even work. We come and there's just a couple of graves and bleached bones with a sign accusing 'Why? We trusted you!'
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Jun 15, 2018 23:01
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Outrail posted:We come and there's just a couple of graves and bleached bones with a sign accusing 'Why? We trusted you!' Exactly my concern.
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Jun 15, 2018 23:02
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quote:He other option was to use manpower. Her current pool of minions was not large enough to complete the job. She could hire more but there was an option - a Temporal plane. She could place some minions into an alternate plane of existence where time ran much quicker than this and dimension. They could then breed and multiply and she would have a good number loyal minions at the end. Loel fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Jun 15, 2018 |
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Jun 15, 2018 23:15
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Splicer posted:Ugh this is getting too complicated. This
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Jun 15, 2018 23:32
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Splicer posted:Ugh this is getting too complicated.
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Jun 16, 2018 00:08
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Could we scry to get a sense of the hostile military presence in the area? The winning plan right now seems to be going in with 13 minions and trying to make more by raiding small vessels. I am concerned that we’re going to a location with active naval hostilities in which case our options may be limited to guarded convoys. We’re used to fighting small groups of commoners or avoiding combat, to wrecking flimsy row boats. If we only find hard targets then we may not have the chimerapower to successfully execute a raid.
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Jun 16, 2018 01:23
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Consult the Monstrous Manual and the Dungeon Master Guide. Purchase the latest edition upgrades, and since you just KNOW our student editions are out of date AND not complete, buy the Professor Edition. Gotta be some tips there.
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Jun 16, 2018 03:29
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malbogio posted:Could we scry to get a sense of the hostile military presence in the area? The winning plan right now seems to be going in with 13 minions and trying to make more by raiding small vessels. This is precisely why the people who are saying NOT to do time-shenanigans in order to drastically increase our minion numbers are in the wrong. It is not only possible to exponentially increase our minion populations, it is essential that we do so.
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Jun 16, 2018 07:57
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Anyone else think we should dump the stingrays in for just one cyclel? The more of them we have, the better.
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Jun 16, 2018 09:10
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super sweet best pal posted:Anyone else think we should dump the stingrays in for just one cyclel? The more of them we have, the better. Those two are pretty strong-willed, and I'm not sure how their loyalty will hold if they're out from under our thumbs. I mean, Seaglass would probably go for it if we pitched it as 'I didn't want you to be lonely, so I'm starting a whole race based on you', but Irwin's new and hasn't yet had time to see how we treat our valued associates long-term.
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Jun 16, 2018 11:06
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Prince of Space posted:This is precisely why the people who are saying NOT to do time-shenanigans in order to drastically increase our minion numbers are in the wrong. Splicer fucked around with this message at 11:26 on Jun 16, 2018 |
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Jun 16, 2018 11:23
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Splicer posted:We don't have an our side timescale for the speedyverse. If it's relatively short term then we can build some more minions and then shove them in, if needed. Because it's exponential if we double our input we double our output. A delay of a week of clandestine minioning could turn into several hundred bonus minions and less chance of opening our time portal to find a world of aquatic Hapsburgs. Also, we need to feed and home them. If we get hundreds of minions now with no castle and no-one to fight that's a hell of a logistics problem over getting hundreds of minions in a fully finished castle just before the good guys show up. Just store them in a slow time plane until we need them. No logistics just more gold.
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Jun 16, 2018 13:21
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Being a race of aquatic assholes makes hard naval targets just more... Targety. That's a nice ship, pity half the hull just just got torn off and your sailors are performing a reenactment of how Titanic should have ended.
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Jun 16, 2018 18:15
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Speaking of which, note for later: consider what we can do to make the fortress not -look- ocean themed. Really gently caress with the heroes by making sure they aren't prepared for it. Besides, how nice is it if we can 'lose' the fort without interfering with our undersea operations?
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Jun 17, 2018 13:06
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Liquid Communism posted:Speaking of which, note for later: consider what we can do to make the fortress not -look- ocean themed. Really gently caress with the heroes by making sure they aren't prepared for it. Besides, how nice is it if we can 'lose' the fort without interfering with our undersea operations? So, I just had a thought. Could we sneak in a totally unconnected secret lair into the base of this fortress? We need a place to call home, it's already in a shipping lane, and we are already doing some pretty massive construction...
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Jun 17, 2018 21:02
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Relentless posted:So, I just had a thought. Could we sneak in a totally unconnected secret lair into the base of this fortress? We could always repurpose the mines into our HQ once they're depleted. Go in, capture the surfacers, turn the sapphire isles into Crabberson town.
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Jun 17, 2018 21:12
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Everyone keeps forgetting that the isles are part of some weird confederacy/reach we know nothing about, not necessarily safe place. At this point I think we've gone in circles a few times and need to just move on.
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Jun 17, 2018 22:25
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