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An early weak-ish scum read that jumped at me is Yami.Yami Fenrir posted:Fairly sure it's the later. It's Anidav. Yami Fenrir posted:At this point I'm fairly sure Anidav is either talking complete bullshit in a way that doesn't feel natural to me at all (insta win cards in a mafia game, seriously?) or he knows something we don't. Yami Fenrir posted:##unvote These are 3 almost-consecutive posts, with not that much happening in the middle. Anidav did write some clarifications, but those were things that a reasonable person could've surmised that he meant from his earlier statements. Wouldn't vote Yami over Anidav, but the read is there.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:04
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Anpu voting for no-lynch I might understand, I can't quite read his behaviour, he always seems weird, but I expect more from B-man. Given the prompt, let's read him. ... Not a lot to read there. In hindsight, I can believe that his vote was a joke; I can assume good faith there. Where it becomes harder to assume good faith is his absence. If you asked me to name one player who lurks a lot more when they're scum than town, Bee would be that player. He also claimed VT, entirely unprompted, unless I'm missing something. Conclusion: scum read
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Jul 16, 2018 19:14
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Sorry for sleeping through the game so far, Octopath Traveler consumed my weekend. I tried to read through and catch up with the thread but shockingly I'm still a bit confused. I'll try to go through stuff and get some actual reads before work is over. First instinct on Anidav is town but I want to re-read. Also Nep I'm not gonna go back and find the post but you played in DBZ mafia you should know better than to speculate on what a competent mod would do with design in a nat20 game
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Jul 16, 2018 19:18
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Yami Fenrir posted:You know what, I just realized: My meta changes with my mood and that's pretty erratic. The only constant is that I'm shitlord skimmer. Also that's the flimsiest reasoning, but I think you're joking. Nep acting like their original case was a test is suspicious and unbelievable. Would vote nep, would vote ani. If nep never backpedaled I'd be ok with them, but the backpedaling makes me feel like they were just trying to make bif look bad at the time and now that it's been called out are trying to frame it in some other light. All these people tossing down suspicion on me lol too cute
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Jul 16, 2018 19:21
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Dancer posted:Anpu voting for no-lynch I might understand, I can't quite read his behaviour, he always seems weird, but I expect more from B-man. Given the prompt, let's read him. All valid points. I’m lurking more than usual as town.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:22
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:All these people tossing down suspicion on me lol too cute
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Jul 16, 2018 19:24
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:If nep never backpedaled I'd be ok with them, but the backpedaling makes me feel like they were just trying to make bif look bad at the time and now that it's been called out are trying to frame it in some other light. Hey now, I didn't backpedal. I still think bif could be scum and I quite clearly stated that what was manufactured in my case was the emphasis, not the case itself. I've liked her posting since, enough that I think it's worth voting someone else today.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:29
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Dancer posted:I'm going to briefly interrupt my reading of the rest of the game to slam down a ##vote AA. Entirely independent of whether you're scum or not, if we as a community develop a meta where that kind of posting gets you insta-lynched, that can only be a good thing. This is an idiotic vote, but I'm used to dying D1 without any logic or effort behind it so please, continue on.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:32
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:My meta changes with my mood and that's pretty erratic. The only constant is that I'm shitlord skimmer. It was. We have been coming to similar enough thoughts and conclusion that voting you further would be pretty dishonest. I'm starting to think I'm just naturally suspicious of you even if you're town. I'll unvote for now. ##unvote Come to think of it, I felt like the timing of Nep's post was weird in some fashion at the time. It came out out of left field for me, but upon review it happened when pressure was mounting on Anidav, but posting momentarily hit a lull. Maybe that timing was intentional?
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Jul 16, 2018 19:33
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Nep-Nep posted:Actually Humalong has the right of it. My case on Bif was manufactured to a degree. I came into the thread, got caught up, saw there was a lot of two-way between Anidav and KK and I wanted to poke Bif to see: You meant to say scum here? Yeah, because I am town and defused what I thought might have been the start of a slapfight knowing how manic Bif gets when she feels attacked and how a newer player might interpret "bifness" to being scum. So OK. Yami, I'm starting to feel petulant, perhaps this should align more with your meta read of me?
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Jul 16, 2018 19:34
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:This is an idiotic vote, but I'm used to dying D1 without any logic or effort behind it so please, continue on. Agreed. Wow I need to read Dancer, because his recent posts are scummy AF.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:34
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b-minus1 posted:Agreed. Wow I need to read Dancer, because his recent posts are scummy AF. His recent posts is all of his posts, pretty much. So you have the full picture.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:38
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:You meant to say scum here? Your posts are more in line what I expected now, yeah. I did unvote just now. Would you mind giving me your thoughts on dancers reads just now? I'm worried about being biased because I'm being targeted in them, but they seem... weird.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:39
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:You meant to say scum here? That is a sensible defense. ##unvote
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Jul 16, 2018 19:43
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Yami Fenrir posted:Your posts are more in line what I expected now, yeah. I did unvote just now. I think Dancer made a really bad vote on me. It doesn't actually make sense and is clear indication that they aren't trying to solve the game. Would vote Anidav, Nep, Dancer in that order because that order provides us Most to Least amount of info, IMO.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:43
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Yeah this is AAs town game
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Jul 16, 2018 19:48
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:I think Dancer made a really bad vote on me. It doesn't actually make sense and is clear indication that they aren't trying to solve the game. It is possible for people to multi-task you know. I am reading and reading and trying to figure stuff out, but a game is a fundamentally social endeavour, and when someone says something as anti-socially douchy as that thing you said up there, I don't see why I can't also offer some negative incentives to that behaviour. Yes, in the grand scheme of things, if a significant portion of this community came around to my way of thinking, town win-rate would decrease slightly, but game enjoyment would increase and I'll gladly take that trade.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:49
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b-minus1 posted:Agreed. Wow I need to read Dancer, because his recent posts are scummy AF. really? I thought he was making a very good showing to make up for his earlier absence. and he had a point about you. ##vote B-
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Jul 16, 2018 19:54
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Dancer posted:It is possible for people to multi-task you know. I am reading and reading and trying to figure stuff out, but a game is a fundamentally social endeavour, and when someone says something as anti-socially douchy as that thing you said up there, I don't see why I can't also offer some negative incentives to that behaviour. Yes, in the grand scheme of things, if a significant portion of this community came around to my way of thinking, town win-rate would decrease slightly, but game enjoyment would increase and I'll gladly take that trade. I didn't know being incredulous about suspicion was anti-social and douchy lol I think you're a several games too early to make such a broad-generalization about my play, much less the nature of mafia in this community. If you've distilled the sum of my contributions to one sentence in a post, then you aren't playing a town-oriented game, sorry pal, hope this helps. I've bolded the bits that are facetious and douchy for future reference 
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Jul 16, 2018 19:55
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Before I get in a big ol' stinky slapfight. My conviction most strongly rests on Anidav who may or may not be absent due to obligation/time zones Second up is on Nep who made a weird bif case, came back stating some weird criteria for gauging the responses, and last is Dancer who only at mod provocation has appeared to catch up lest they run the risk of the lurker gun.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:58
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Dancer posted:In the big debate, I find myself holding a firmly anti-Anidav position, primarily because of his (to my eyes) massive backpedal, first claiming he also has an alternative wincon, then reverting to claiming town. I think there's a significant chance that he's 3P, not scum, but even a 3P lynch wouldn't be terrible. If he's scum, that's only a big bonus. Worst case scenario, he's town, and we have actually gained information on the set-up (I'm working here on the assumption that his claims are to be trusted if he's town, and that he didn't speculate that wildly. He claimed to actually have this factual information). Dancer's next post is spent defending Anidav. They then go on to vote AA, one of Anidav's biggest detractors.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:58
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Bifauxnen posted:really? I thought he was making a very good showing to make up for his earlier absence. 
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Jul 16, 2018 19:58
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If you still feel ways about me now that I've said what I have to say... *sticks out a beckoning kung fu hand* Come at me.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:58
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Dancer keeps getting hung up on bizarre things and it's honestly tripping me up. Like his "weak scum read" on me is based on the fact that I correctly called Anidav out on having knowledge we don't or being bullshitting in a unnatural way (which in turn he's trying to avoid giving us knowledge we don't have, aka he'd be scum). He came out with it so I unvoted. His scum read on b-minus may have some merit based on meta, but it's still a lurker vote, aka a crapshoot. I would rate BOTH of these weak. Where are your STRONG scumreads, Dancer? Also out of all of the things I would be voting (and have) voted AA for, a (semi?) policy vote based on saying "Look at all the people throwing suspicion at me" (which is actually a very, very valid suggestion, even if thrown out in frustration. Scum pushes are a thing, so why the hell would you even disincentivize people from defending themselves? This feels like the OMGUS argument all over again...)
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Jul 16, 2018 20:02
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Jeabus Mahogany posted:Dancer's next post is spent defending Anidav. They then go on to vote AA, one of Anidav's biggest detractors. This is actually a really good point. Paired with what I just said... ##vote Dancer
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Jul 16, 2018 20:03
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:and last is Dancer who only at mod provocation has appeared to catch up lest they run the risk of the lurker gun. hmm this smells fishy to me. The game started earlier than expected on a weekend, and once someone knows they're gonna die if they don't potst, what do you expect them to do? Go on not posting? it's not like Dancer just shitposted his way back to safety, he's dropped actual reads. I was especially impressed that he bothered to call out Yami. I'd actually been eyeing him up very quietly in the background cause I couldn't really find the right words for it, and I definitely didn't want to vote him just yet when he was contributing so well, but I could see his contributions being from a scum who wants to stay active. It's hard to put my finger on. He's posting a lot but everything still feels like it's not making waves. If Dancer was a scum trying to catch up, I don't think he'd go out on a limb making an all new case like that on such a tricky target. Starting to feel the AA vote a lot more. ##vote AA
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Jul 16, 2018 20:04
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lol just read the above. More suss on Yami now, that feels pure defensive.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:06
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Bifauxnen posted:hmm this smells fishy to me. The game started earlier than expected on a weekend, and once someone knows they're gonna die if they don't potst, what do you expect them to do? Go on not posting? He made a case and ended up with an empty vote on me, what do you think about that Bif-Chan?
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Jul 16, 2018 20:06
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Bifauxnen posted:lol just read the above. More suss on Yami now, that feels pure defensive. Lol Sure, go on defending the guy who literally contradicts himself immediately.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:08
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Jeabus Mahogany posted:Dancer's next post is spent defending Anidav. They then go on to vote AA, one of Anidav's biggest detractors. Nothing in my following post was in any shape or form pro-Anidav, it was me questioning the behaviour of Yami. And my current vote on AA has nothing to do with his alignment. Like, I hate to be pedantic, but when we're playing a game that is purely about communication and inter-player interaction, pedantic is kinda the way to go. The post you're referring to: Dancer posted:These are 3 almost-consecutive posts, with not that much happening in the middle. Anidav did write some clarifications, but those were things that a reasonable person could've surmised that he meant from his earlier statements. Wouldn't vote Yami over Anidav, but the read is there. Also I explicitly say I still want to vote Anidav over Yami. Saying that this post is spent "defending Anidav" is either a misunderstanding or acting in bad faith.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:09
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:He made a case and ended up with an empty vote on me, what do you think about that Bif-Chan? I think I disagree with his stance on having a bit of a lol being "anti-social", but I like the more thoughtful reads he's been giving. And the pushback he's getting feels like scum frustrated he won't be gunned down as a freebie tomorrow Yami Fenrir posted:Lol point this out for me please?
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Jul 16, 2018 20:11
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Dancer posted:I dunno about other people, but I imagine I won't be the only one who was away from home for the hot weekend. Not easy to be productive when I'm with the gf and without a PC. hmm. this actually seems sincere and something a town player would say.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:11
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Yami Fenrir posted:Dancer keeps getting hung up on bizarre things and it's honestly tripping me up. You're being massively disingenuous. I have not at any point taken issue with AA defending himself. If you look at my specific post, I have specifically cut down AA's post to the following sentence: "All these people tossing down suspicion on me lol too cute" and explicitly specified that I take issue with his tone. If you do not see how his tone in that sentence is something someone might take issue with, then I don't know how to explain it to you.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:12
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yeah just pretend I never voted you B-, I thought you were part of the "wait what, Dancer's gonna engage outta nowhere now, no way we can take him" scum brigade here. but it's prolly just AA and Yami.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:13
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b-minus1 posted:hmm. this actually seems sincere and something a town player would say. Uhhh, what?
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Jul 16, 2018 20:13
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i don't know how you people find so much to post about on day 1 jesus
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Jul 16, 2018 20:14
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Side-note please don't think I'm not aware of Bif being all buddy-buddy. I already had her on my list of "people to keep an extra close eye on" (because of that whole "town superstar" "debate"), and this just reinforces that yes, I should be doing that.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:16
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One more thing about Yami's post:Yami Fenrir posted:I would rate BOTH of these weak. Where are your STRONG scumreads, Dancer? There are none, and I imagine if I play 100 mafia games there will always be none on day 1.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:18
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b-minus1 posted:hmm. this actually seems sincere and something a town player would say. "Don't target me, I don't want you to waste your ability" Sounds like something every player says regardless of alignment, but obviously more so by scum.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:18
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Iron Chef Ramen posted:i don't know how you people find so much to post about on day 1 jesus Just post, man, and everything will be ok.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:18
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