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Tired Moritz posted:Yes, they seem like a gungho town player with, at this point, kinda bad reads. I almost reacted to this until I decided that you must be trying to troll me.
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Dec 14, 2018 22:01
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Kashuno posted:I feel like I missed it Murmur Twin posted:Oooh actually as suss as I am on TM I gotta ##vote FL. She: Click on my name to see quotes from FL.
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Dec 14, 2018 22:04
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After merk's flip I'm going to say I am wrong about Humalong and also MMT. I don't think merk gets nearly as pressured without MMT calling stuff out there, and scum merk hopping on my case only makes sense there if Hum was town, IMO. I'm going to spend some time this evening reviewing what the voting looked like when he swerved and see if I can maybe put my finger on why he swerved, and then reevaluate because I was pretty off base with my D1 reads.Murmur Twin posted:Oooh actually as suss as I am on TM I gotta ##vote FL. She: My only correction here is that I was pushing Humalong well before merk jumped on. Does that make a difference to your conclusion, though, in terms of "who to vote today, given merk's flip, in a vacuum"? Probably not. Going to grab dinner and then get a little more in depth.
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Dec 14, 2018 22:36
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Kashuno posted:Tbh I thibk I could vote merk? He got one over on me before and I feel like the vibe I’m getting is similar but that’s all I got for now. I don’t think it should be pursued today I don't like this. wishy washy as heck, and ultimately steering the focus off of scum merk. Kash do you think jimmy would put pressure on merk when there were other just as viable lunch candidates and merk was at 2 or 3 votes and probably plenty of time to pursue another non-scumbro target?
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Dec 14, 2018 22:50
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merk posted:He also edited my posts to remove critical context that justified what I was doing. did anyone else see how hypocritical this post is and call it out?
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Dec 14, 2018 22:55
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Dick Bastardly posted:did anyone else see how hypocritical this post is and call it out? because if anyone did, that player is town in my book.
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Dec 14, 2018 22:56
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merk posted:Toal, Humalong, Solus scum team. They kept on me when Solus was going down. another 3rd-in-line scumbro bus? I mean the Sol meta thing makes my heart say IP is town, but my brain is having trouble ignoring the scum merk/Sol interactions seriously a masterwork of social engineering and emotional manipulation if Sol (IP) is scum. Scum of the year award worthy imo.
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Dec 14, 2018 23:08
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The pro scumbus move is to put scum in the middle imo
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Dec 14, 2018 23:14
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IcePhoenix posted:The pro scumbus move is to put scum in the middle imo This completely unbiased opinion comes to you from, the last person on the list...
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Dec 14, 2018 23:17
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If Solus was going for like some level above my gambit in Grad School, that would be really cool but morally eh? I’m probably not the person who should be talking about moral actions in Mafia games.
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Dec 14, 2018 23:26
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jimmydalad posted:If Solus was going for like some level above my gambit in Grad School, that would be really cool but morally eh? I’m probably not the person who should be talking about moral actions in Mafia games. Some players are Machiavellian and play only for the crushing victory of their plebeian adversaries. (LOOKING AT YOU LUMPEN AND GASPY) (two of my favorite players in all honesty lol)
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Dec 14, 2018 23:34
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Some players are Machiavellian and play only for the crushing victory of their plebeian adversaries. anyhow... I really don't think that's at all the case. Solus seemed legit bummed.
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Dec 14, 2018 23:35
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STill curious about beet and kash, mostly because like pod, they kind of give me a headpat dismissal... granted Kash pointed out the obvious flaw in my logic undermining my case on him in a big way. It doesn't mean my case on him is wrong, but significantly more likely to be wrong. If he was protecting a scummate unless you're playing the long con, he would have stalled out the day and did not.
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Dec 14, 2018 23:39
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Attaboy!
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Dec 14, 2018 23:42
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Okay I went through the stuff I wanted to go through from yesterday in light of flips. I read over the bit where merk swerved off into a Humalong vote and then bounces back to Toal because I thought there would be something to it, but nope, it's just an attempt to get more momentum on Toal, I think. So maybe alignment neutral on the vote itself, but what really pushes me into "I was wrong" territory is how aggressively merk goes after Hum later in the thread. Hum's defense feels very genuine especially knowing what we know now about merk's alignment. My immediate reaction after reading over the interactions between Solus and merk and Toal as we got closer to deadline was to think Solus was also scum: SolusLunes posted:I feel Merk and Toalpaz' alignments are opposed. They both sound scummy, Toal more than Merk, SolusLunes posted:[merk's] arguments are sound, I just... don't trust them. MMT called these out already, IIRC, but it's what I'm talking about : "yeah I can see the case for merk as scum and don't trust his arguments, but I would still rather vote Toal". It doesn't read as genuine to me. I read SL's frustration over being voted as alignment neutral. Finally, IP came into today with setup spec which doesn't look great and has been pretty light on content thus far (a preliminary read on MMT that was then retracted, and just one read on Humalong). Still going over today's posting, but for now: IP: Who scum? Why are they scum?
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Dec 15, 2018 00:04
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FL, what's your opinion of TM?
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Dec 15, 2018 00:12
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Murmur Twin posted:FL, what's your opinion of TM? Lol I was in the middle of a post on TM and previewed to see this, perfect timing. Give me a few, I'll have this for you
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Dec 15, 2018 00:20
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So, re: TM. I'm skipping D1 because there wasn't any serious engagement there and just going to get right into D2. There's plenty of stuff here that doesn't look good. The AA vote comes out of nowhere and then the justification is weak when pressed. The BK read is lazy and looks weird when coupled with TM's initial read on Solus - like, there are a few posts in which the thread of the conversation is "Solus did stuff that I think is scummy, but BK only posted 10 times and then replaced out, so it's probably BK", and that's just a weird conclusion that doesn't follow from the thought line. On the other hand, pressed for a read on me, it's really easy to go with "yep, that D1 stuff near deadline looks Real Bad (objectively, it did!), sure I'd vote her" and if I were in a position to hop on that train as scum I would find it irresistable. But that doesn't happen here, and I can't see a world where scum doesn't take that opportunity. I should be an easy vote today for scum to make after yesterday's play around deadline. So on balance, I'm leaning town. Despite stuff I don't like around today's posts, the only way TM's alignment call on me today makes any sense whatsoever is if TM and I are both scum, and, um, I know that's not true.
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Dec 15, 2018 00:45
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hambeet posted:This completely unbiased opinion comes to you from, the last person on the list... I'm glad you've demonstrated the ability to follow the conversation, beet. Who do you think is scum? You have zero actual content today.
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Dec 15, 2018 00:58
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Flying Leatherman posted:So, re: TM. I'm skipping D1 because there wasn't any serious engagement there and just going to get right into D2. There's plenty of stuff here that doesn't look good. The AA vote comes out of nowhere and then the justification is weak when pressed. The BK read is lazy and looks weird when coupled with TM's initial read on Solus - like, there are a few posts in which the thread of the conversation is "Solus did stuff that I think is scummy, but BK only posted 10 times and then replaced out, so it's probably BK", and that's just a weird conclusion that doesn't follow from the thought line. I cant tell if this is a scumslip or if I'm just a bad reader (possibly both?  )Your point is you should be an easy point for scum to push, right? And that the fact that TM isn't pushing you makes you lean town on him? If we assume that you're being honest, that means what you're saying is that you believe that you're both town. Why would you follow that up with "the only way that call makes sense is if we're both scum"?
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Dec 15, 2018 01:14
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Murmur Twin posted:I cant tell if this is a scumslip or if I'm just a bad reader (possibly both? I left out the word "other", ughhhhh you definitely got the gist of my argument though! I know I'm town, so a scum TM doesn't make any sense in that context.
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Dec 15, 2018 01:24
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Uhh I feel like everyone is flossing over Podima. Like his actions look suspicious after a flip yesterday but after the case I made everyone seems to have moved on? I must not have gotten the memo. I will probably go to sleep and wake up tomorrow and cast a vote since I’m gonna be going on a 12 hour plane ride
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Dec 15, 2018 01:44
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jimmydalad posted:I’m suspicious of the latter because they were the ones who tried to move the initial vote off of Merk and onto Solus. He was one of the more stubborn votes to swing over onto Merk and I feel like it could have been his hand being forced or his game would’ve blown up. After all, he had said before that Merk was suspicious. It shouldn’t have been so hard for him to jump ship when he realised Solus wasn’t happening. Sorry, I can explain why I have a town read there if it helps. Podima posted:##vote Solus Like ok, he dropped this vote and it caused people to move to Solus. But then he moved it to Merk, even if under protest, and was part of the reason we hammered scum. In my mind that has to give him a little bit more town cred than, say... AA, TM, and FL. But more to the point, this and this read like posts that came about because Pod was searching through the thread looking for leads re: who the scum was. Put simply, I believe that he believed everything he said on d1. Also quote:If you're scum after this we are going to have a talk postgame about this kind of emotional manipulation stuff. I'm like 99% sure that this is not something that scum Pod would say as some sort of strategy. That's town Pod being honest.
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Dec 15, 2018 02:03
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Flying Leatherman posted:So on balance, I'm leaning town. Despite stuff I don't like around today's posts, the only way TM's alignment call on me today makes any sense whatsoever is if TM and I are both scum, and, um, I know that's not true. Where does the word "other" fit into the above?
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Dec 15, 2018 02:08
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Murmur Twin posted:Where does the word "other" fit into the above? "the only other way TM's alignment call..." So, like, the two possibilities: - I am town. TM is not scum because there's no way a scum would pass up an easy case like this on a town player. - TM and I are both scum, and he's not hopping on that train because the scumteam is already one down. I know I'm town so I conclude that the first possibility is the correct one and TM is town.
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Dec 15, 2018 02:31
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IcePhoenix posted:I'm glad you've demonstrated the ability to follow the conversation, beet. Yeah I'm pretty hung over from my work Xmas party unfortunately
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Dec 15, 2018 04:08
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Murmur Twin posted:
Yeah, it's a pet peeve of pod's, but it makes no sense for a scum pod to raise it or use it to drop off the vote.
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Dec 15, 2018 04:12
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IcePhoenix posted:I'm glad you've demonstrated the ability to follow the conversation, beet. I liked the part where solus alluded to having a town pr, but didn't get night killed.
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Dec 15, 2018 04:17
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hambeet posted:I liked the part where solus alluded to having a town pr, but didn't get night killed. Same, but what about other people's posts?
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Dec 15, 2018 04:32
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IcePhoenix posted:Same, but what about other people's posts? I'll get round to them, but I was waiting for you to finish catching up first.
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Dec 15, 2018 04:46
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Sorry for lurking this game day, burned out from overtime and spent pretty much all day today sleeping. I’m like 95% sure FL is town so anyone trying to push her is suspicious. It makes zero sense for two scum to pick the same bad target to go after, especially to have one sit on that same target nearly the entire game day. I’m also suspicious of anyone who tries to color me as the scum in merk’s lists. He basically sank himself the second he started trying to change the vote to me. TM is not looking great but my meta read of TM is always “low content and scummy” so I don’t know that I trust myself enough to vote them just yet. Definitely on my short list, of course. beet is null for me right now. He’s right on the line of “oh this is town beet” and “oh this is scum beet” so I need a little more time to read. Uhhh who else can I give an opinion on while I’m here in between sleeping I need to reread. I think the Solus stuff was genuine, I would feel pretty miffed if that was a genius scum ploy. Same with Pod’s day one, it feels honest and not underhanded.
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Dec 15, 2018 05:03
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I’ll hopefully be back in the morning with some better contributions, just wasn’t feeling great today. Sorry team, I didn’t want to repeat my usual day 1 poo poo post strategy
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Dec 15, 2018 05:03
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hambeet posted:I'll get round to them, but I was waiting for you to finish catching up first. oh I got back up to speed this morning like I said I would
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Dec 15, 2018 05:07
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where's pod?
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Dec 15, 2018 05:52
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Humalong, what is your read of Kash at this point in the game?
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Dec 15, 2018 06:11
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IcePhoenix posted:oh I got back up to speed this morning like I said I would And?
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Dec 15, 2018 06:14
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annnd....read my posts?
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Dec 15, 2018 06:16
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Mr. Humalong posted:I’m like 95% sure FL is town so anyone trying to push her is suspicious. It makes zero sense for two scum to pick the same bad target to go after, especially to have one sit on that same target nearly the entire game day. It makes perfect sense if scum wasn't expecting to get lynched d1. I'm kinda gobsmacked by the 0 other people in the game thinking "hey, maybe we should look at the people who were trying to defend the flipped scum?" but am trying my best not to be a jerk about it.
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Dec 15, 2018 06:37
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I should probably not have signed up for this game with my planned travel but I'll soldier through, not gonna get owned by my own lurker rules! Hello from California by the way. 
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Dec 15, 2018 06:49
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Also solus was at -1, if I was scum I would have hammered solus and have been done with it. I hate "if I was scum I would have x y z" arguments because they're filler that nobody can feasibly refute so this doesn't sit well with me. That being said while I dislike the way he's coming at this I do agree that hammering a scumbro for town cred is totally viable, Kash isn't cleared by virtue of doing that. ~~~ Tired Moritz posted:am I legally allowed to vote IcePhoenix just because they replaced in and because I feel Solus's unhappiness of possibly getting lynched day 1 is from dropping the ball for his scum team? Still reading at this point but I kinda agree with this? I said it yesterday and recognize it's an unpopular opinion but I don't think the emotional appeal is a town tell necessarily. Scum are gonna be madder about being executed than town are, on average. ~~~ Anomalous Amalgam posted:Anyhow, regarding pod. Re: catch up playing I can't actually remember if I addressed this in this thread yet but I play in evenings when I'm done with commitments, I don't have time to play during the workday. Calling my play this far a hot take grab bag is pretty rude! Re: merk vs solus I'd think it was obvious - I got fired up over what I found (my quotes in an earlier post showing a nonsensical shift of opinions from solus) and then got frustrated at what I saw as an emotional appeal that was making people disregard my find as well as his refusal to actually engage when I tried to address it directly, so I was being stubborn. I still don't think I was wrong about solus, but I'm reading ice with an open enough mind. ~~~ Also lol that TM afks on day 1 and then his first and only scum read when pressed is a lurker/ replacement case. That's really bad.
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Dec 15, 2018 07:11
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