|
ilkhan posted:13 seems like a lot for an electric. He is counting every little bit that moves, including the bearings in that figure.
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 01:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 16:49 |
|
|
No idea how it affects fuel economy but humans are really bad at maintaining a constant speed unless they're really paying attention (they're not). It's a big contributor to traffic.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 03:27
|
|
|
stevewm posted:He is counting every little bit that moves, including the bearings in that figure. Bearings, reduction gears, differential gears, and rotor.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 07:31
|
|
|
drgitlin posted:Getting a pilot's license is actually difficult and involves some training, unlike your average US driver's license. Any idiot with 3 semi functional brain cells and 15 grand to throw at an instructor at a county airport can get a pilots license in less than 2 weeks. Getting that thing is just as easy as a drivers license. Paying for it is the only hard part.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 08:10
|
|
|
Duck and Cover posted:I don't think this number is right everything I read has been higher, but I suppose you might be able to get that if you change the tires. Motortrend tested it at 6.3, most other articles say 6.5 with stock tires. Could probably get less with better tires.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 15:41
|
|
|
the problem with most L3 autonomous driving systems right now is that they handle all the easy stuff and expect the driver to jump back in, prepared and ready to react, when there is a situation that the the ADS does not understand - and usually those are the most difficult situations for a human driver to handle as well. this is not long-term viable as a safety feature.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:26
|
|
|
Warrior Princess posted:Any idiot with 3 semi functional brain cells and 15 grand to throw at an instructor at a county airport can get a pilots license in less than 2 weeks. Getting that thing is just as easy as a drivers license. Paying for it is the only hard part. Lol Lol ratbert90 posted:Huh, it looks like a driver was on the phone and the Tesla was constantly bugging them to look up, and they didn't. The correct behavior in that situation is for the car to immediately decelerate and pull to the side of the road. Every car manufacturer, including Tesla, very clearly* states that their ADAS cannot be used if the driver is not focused on the road and immediately ready to take over. Failure to respond to "wake up" prompts is an emergency situation and having the car continue barreling happily forwards with a driver that it knows is not paying attention is criminally negligent. TooMuchAbstraction posted:Which is why I was talking about consumer perceptions. When you're writing marketing materials, you absolutely need to be aware of how what you're saying will be received by your intended audience. There's no way that Tesla was surprised when people saw "autopilot" and thought "self-driving car". Yes. Splitting hairs about what an autopilot in a plane actually does is meaningless. People think that autopilot means "press butan go to sleep" so that's what they'll do. you may notice that no other manufacturer uses terms that imply anything other than "this helps you, the driver, drive the car." we do not have self-driving cars, probably won't for decades, and advertising anything otherwise is, again, criminally negligent *Actually, Tesla is not very clear about this and in fact their marketing appears to intentionally obfuscate this fact Sagebrush fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Dec 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:32
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the problem with most L3 autonomous driving systems right now is that they handle all the easy stuff and expect the driver to jump back in, prepared and ready to react, when there is a situation that the the ADS does not understand - and usually those are the most difficult situations for a human driver to handle as well. this is not long-term viable as a safety feature. What L3 system is on the market? AFIAK Audi's Traffic Jam Pilot might not even be active in Germany; it's certainly not coming to the US.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:44
|
|
|
Sagebrush posted:
How would a Tesla even know? Their DMS is a torque sensor on the steering column that people can (and do) defeat with fruit.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:45
|
|
|
I think semi-autonomous cars should deliver a reasonably powerful electric shock to the driver should their attention wane. Enough of this binging and bonging. Make the drivers put some skin in the game.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:46
|
|
|
drgitlin posted:What L3 system is on the market? AFIAK Audi's Traffic Jam Pilot might not even be active in Germany; it's certainly not coming to the US. You know perfectly well that Tesla repeatedly claims their system is L3.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 16:57
|
|
|
Where?
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 17:40
|
|
|
Powershift posted:I think semi-autonomous cars should deliver a reasonably powerful electric shock to the driver should their attention wane. I mean when you barrel into a barrier at 70 you'll have lots of skin in the game. And some on the concrete too.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 17:48
|
|
|
Jiminy Christmas! Shoes! posted:I mean when you barrel into a barrier at 70 you'll have lots of skin in the game. And some on the concrete too. Reminds me of the driver safety device that consists of a sharpened steel spike in the middle of the wheel, to make sure you're paying attention.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 17:51
|
|
|
TooMuchAbstraction posted:Reminds me of the driver safety device that consists of a sharpened steel spike in the middle of the wheel, to make sure you're paying attention. It's called Tullock's Spike. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Tullock#Tullock%27s_spike Thanks for remembering that and not any important poo poo, brain. MrYenko posted:Where? Musk has been saying autopilot driving itself coast to coast is only a few months out for like, 2 years now, if that counts.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 17:56
|
|
|
Powershift posted:Musk has been saying autopilot driving itself coast to coast is only a few months out for like, 2 years now, if that counts. True, and Tesla’s page about autopilot is not exactly clear on what is implemented and what is coming in Tesla time, but I don’t know of anywhere they’ve claimed to be shipping L3 software.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 18:02
|
|
|
MrYenko posted:True, and Tesla’s page about autopilot is not exactly clear on what is implemented and what is coming in Tesla time, but I don’t know of anywhere they’ve claimed to be shipping L3 software. Didn't they already charge a bunch of people 5 grand for it though?
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 18:07
|
|
|
Powershift posted:Didn't they already charge a bunch of people 5 grand for it though?
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 18:56
|
|
|
drgitlin posted:What L3 system is on the market? AFIAK Audi's Traffic Jam Pilot might not even be active in Germany; it's certainly not coming to the US. sorry, typo, L2 edit: point holds for future L3 as well though
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 19:06
|
|
|
You think I’m joking I guess, but there’s one of those “PPL fast!” joints here that literally gives it out in two weeks for 15K. I know two people who’ve done it and they’re the sort of person you’re amazed are still alive because you’d think they’d have forgotten how to breathe by now. Like the Phoenix university of flight school. Warrior Princess fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Dec 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 19:11
|
|
|
Warrior Princess posted:Any idiot with 3 semi functional brain cells and 15 grand to throw at an instructor at a county airport can get a pilots license in less than 2 weeks. Getting that thing is just as easy as a drivers license. Paying for it is the only hard part. The private pilot exam is a *lot* harder than any US driving license exam (admittedly a low bar), and requires quite a few hours of actual flight time at the controls (unlike most state's auto driving licenses.) I've done the exam, but not the hours, many years ago.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 19:49
|
|
|
I did the exam for the PPL back in high school. It's been a while.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 20:19
|
|
|
ilkhan posted:I did the exam for the PPL back in high school. It's been a while. I remember doing both the PPL written and my drivers written at around the same time as well when I was in High School. I had to study about the same for both tests. I don't remember the PPL written being any more difficult than the driving written, just a different topic. And the hours I did at a rural non-towered airfield were absolutely laughably trivial. It was the equivalent of going into the DMV and being told by the instructor to drive around the block. Slightly related but not really: http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20180814-norways-plan-for-a-fleet-of-electric-planes Warrior Princess fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Dec 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 20:58
|
|
|
Yes, Norway's aviation infrastructure will soon be proudly electric-ready. We'll do all the difficult stuff, like figuring out how to plug in, and then some manufacturers can do the simple stuff, like building the planes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 21:04
|
|
|
Ola posted:Yes, Norway's aviation infrastructure will soon be proudly electric-ready. We'll do all the difficult stuff, like figuring out how to plug in, and then some manufacturers can do the simple stuff, like building the planes. That was my favorite part.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 21:06
|
|
|
I watched a video of an electric two-seater trainer airplane awhile ago. I seem to recall that once it was in the air and cruising, it used less power per mile than a Model S does. Of course, there's a big difference between a prop trainer that only needs maybe a couple of hours of endurance and, say, a 737. EDIT: duh, should've read the article. I'm almost certainly thinking of the Pipistrel Alpha Electro.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 21:09
|
|
|
Sagebrush posted:You know perfectly well that Tesla repeatedly claims their system is L3. No one from Tesla has said that to me in any interaction I’ve had with them. They always (rightly) stress that the human is always responsible for situational awareness.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 21:38
|
|
|
Warrior Princess posted:I remember doing both the PPL written and my drivers written at around the same time as well when I was in High School. I had to study about the same for both tests. I don't remember the PPL written being any more difficult than the driving written, just a different topic. And the hours I did at a rural non-towered airfield were absolutely laughably trivial. It was the equivalent of going into the DMV and being told by the instructor to drive around the block. My US drivers license written didn't actually have words, it was all pictures and multiple choice. I think you're underselling the PPL process just a little bit.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 21:45
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the problem with most L3 autonomous driving systems right now is that they handle all the easy stuff and expect the driver to jump back in, prepared and ready to react, when there is a situation that the the ADS does not understand - and usually those are the most difficult situations for a human driver to handle as well. this is not long-term viable as a safety feature. Swerve to the left has never failed me.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 22:12
|
|
|
Lol shut the gently caress up about ppl written and dmv tests being anywhere close, or for that matter a drivers test vs a cert checkride by a DPE. Not even on the same planet.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 22:13
|
|
|
Warrior Princess posted:I remember doing both the PPL written and my drivers written at around the same time as well when I was in High School. I had to study about the same for both tests. I don't remember the PPL written being any more difficult than the driving written, just a different topic. And the hours I did at a rural non-towered airfield were absolutely laughably trivial. It was the equivalent of going into the DMV and being told by the instructor to drive around the block. Did you actually complete the license, though? You're not describing the entire process. A US PPL certificate requires: - acceptance as a student by an accredited FAA flight school or flight instructor - a medical examination and certification by a flight surgeon - a minimum of 40 hours of flight time, 20 hours dual instruction, 10 solo, 10 either, 3 hours night, 3 hours simulated instrument conditions (tne national average is something like 70-80hr though) - three cross-country flights, including one of more than 50 nautical miles radius (150nm total distance) that lands at three separate airports (these must be planned by the student) - in-seat training in a long list of specific topics, including basic flight, takeoffs and landings, combination maneuvers, ground-reference maneuvers, emergency procedures, navigation, airspace regulations, radio operation, etc. - passing of a written test that includes all of the above topics as well as aerodynamic theory, aircraft mechanics, engine operation, instrument operation, weather theory, flight planning, aeromedical concerns, legal and regulatory frameworks, etc. - demonstration of your skillset in both an oral exam and a practical flight exam, which may test you on any topic covered in training When you have completed that, you have an VFR ASEL PPL, which lets you fly a single-piston-engined aircraft for personal recreation or transport in visual flight conditions only. Instrument training is comparable in time, cost and effort to doing the whole thing again. A commercial license is additional training. Type-ratings for complex aircraft are additional training. It goes on and on. There are certainly schools that advertise getting a pilot's license in two weeks and I don't doubt that some people have done it. There are technically enough hours to do it. I think the vast majority of people cannot actually pull that off, and even if they do, they absolutely won't be as safe and competent as someone who learned at a more relaxed pace. But most importantly: you are a loving lunatic if you think that getting a US driver's license is anything like what I've described above. In most jurisdictions it's going to be a multiple-choice test with 40 questions along the lines of "what do you do at a red octagonal sign," followed by a 20 minute long drive around the block where you demonstrate that you know what to do at a red octagonal sign. It's not even in the same galaxy of complexity. Sagebrush fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Dec 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 22:17
|
|
|
drgitlin posted:No one from Tesla has said that to me in any interaction I’ve had with them. They always (rightly) stress that the human is always responsible for situational awareness. And they tell you every time you activate Autopilot as well.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2018 22:41
|
|
|
Subjunctive posted:And they tell you every time you activate Autopilot as well. is that before or after you stuff an orange into the steering wheel
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2018 00:21
|
|
|
I passed the PPL written when I was 12 but didn't pass the DL until I was 16. Tbf I am super brain geniuous though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2018 00:36
|
|
|
Sagebrush posted:The correct behavior in that situation is for the car to immediately decelerate and pull to the side of the road. I'm pretty sure at least one manufacturer (possibly either Audi or Volvo) has looked into implementing that. Though the problem there is that you're crossing a line from "driver assistance" to "full-on autonomous driving" - opening the same legal can of worms as Audi's Traffic Jam Pilot.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2018 05:14
|
|
|
You guys weren't kidding when you said the Volt is a gateway drug to a full EV. I want to always be in electric mode. Luckily unless I'm visiting my mom or extended family I'll pretty much always have battery
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2018 01:17
|
|
|
Yes... Yes it most certainly is. I long for warmer months when I get my full 50-60 miles back. Have you tried Sport mode yet?  My next car will definitely be full EV. Not sure I could go back to ICE full time. When I have to use our ICE company car... it just feels so.... primitive.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2018 02:04
|
|
|
Sagebrush posted:Yes. Splitting hairs about what an autopilot in a plane actually does is meaningless. People think that autopilot means "press butan go to sleep" so that's what they'll do. you may notice that no other manufacturer uses terms that imply anything other than "this helps you, the driver, drive the car." Ford Co-Pilot, named after a person who sits in the seat next to you with an identical set of controls, is clearly just something that helps you, the driver, drive the car. This is obvious to any normal person, while an autopilot, literally a device which just keeps the plane level at a particular speed and heading, is obviously a self-aware robot butler who will drive the car for you.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2018 03:09
|
|
|
They really called it “co-pilot”? Holy poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2018 03:17
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 16:49 |
|
|
Tyrgle posted:Ford Co-Pilot, named after a person who sits in the seat next to you with an identical set of controls, is clearly just something that helps you, the driver, drive the car. This is obvious to any normal person, while an autopilot, literally a device which just keeps the plane level at a particular speed and heading, is obviously a self-aware robot butler who will drive the car for you. Lol, I didn't know that Ford had done that. That's also pretty dumb. However, again, you're splitting hairs about what the machines actually do versus what people think they do. People hear "co-pilot" and think "right, like he sits beside the pilot and they work together" but they hear "autopilot" and think "ah, the machine that flies the plane by itself." Co-pilot is psychologically less misleading than autopilot.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2018 03:42
|
|