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Sandman from ECW
Sep 6, 2011

Here’s my question: (this is the big one folks, literally the reason this thread was opened, for me and for you (and by that I mean this is really a demand much more so than it is a request)): Tell me everything I need to know about the modern history (sooo let’s say post-1900) of international pro wrestling. I’m talking Rikidozan. I’m talking El Santo, and Blue Demon and Mil Máscaras. Stu Hart and Stampede. Montreal. Andre The Giant. Bruiser Brody and Peurto Rico.

If there’s anything you can tell this forum about any of the above (or more), my question is, can you tell us? Pretty please, with a cherry on top?

Sandman from ECW fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Mar 24, 2019

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Halloween Jack
Sep 12, 2003
I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!
I mean you can't really lay out the whole history of the wrestling business in Mexico, Japan, Canada, the UK, and Australia under the narrative of "international wrestling."

Shayna Baszler
Oct 24, 2001

i'll always take care of you
Muldoon

Halloween Jack posted:

I mean you can't really lay out the whole history of the wrestling business in Mexico, Japan, Canada, the UK, and Australia under the narrative of "international wrestling."

nothing important ever happened in Australia or the UK so you can just ignore those places

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010
It's a crazy broad question. But there's an excellent book about the Montreal territory by Pat Laprade called Mad Dogs, Midgets and Screwjobs. There's also a good book about Stampede called Pain and Passion: The History of Stampede Wrestling.

Sadly, English language books about lucha and Rikidozan are non-existent. Chris Charlton wrote some books about NJPW I'm told are very good.

Sandman from ECW
Sep 6, 2011

Hey! I wasn’t asking for the entire encyclopedia, I was just asking what do YOU know.

Ok, maybe you do know a lot, smart guy. Maybe this is a broad question. If that’s the case just tell me the things you feel like talking about. Do you know a lot about Johnny Saint? Then talk about him! Tell us the cool things we should know about him!

If not, feel free to answer one of my other questions today, such as how big is Baristas dick?

Shayna Baszler
Oct 24, 2001

i'll always take care of you
Muldoon
something important about the history of wrestling is Chief Jay Strongbow. he was the most popular wrestler on Earth for a time, but the truth is, he wasn't a Native American, he was Italian

Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*

El Gallinero Gros posted:

It's a crazy broad question. But there's an excellent book about the Montreal territory by Pat Laprade called Mad Dogs, Midgets and Screwjobs. There's also a good book about Stampede called Pain and Passion: The History of Stampede Wrestling.

Sadly, English language books about lucha and Rikidozan are non-existent. Chris Charlton wrote some books about NJPW I'm told are very good.

There's a book called Mondo Lucha A Go-Go about lucha history but I haven't read it

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?

Procrastinator posted:

I occasionally see people calling out wrestlers for being very good at the 2.9 (in particular AJ Styles, and I can't remember any other names off the top of my head). Just saw a really great roll-up 2.9 that made me think about the opposite: are there any wrestlers that were or are notably BAD at 2.9s? Like, always too early and/or never actually doing them.

Hogan would have his hands up to throw someone off as soon as he was covered, he always looked ready to kick out.

The Berzerker
Feb 24, 2006

treat me like a dog


I'm not gonna write up a summary of the book for you, guy. But if you want to learn the history of the territories (with bits of Canada and Japan) you should read the Death of the Territories - who bought out who, who double crossed the NWA when, all of the stuff Vince did that broke the unwritten rules, who stole TV slots from who, etc.

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

Pope Corky the IX posted:

Hogan would have his hands up to throw someone off as soon as he was covered, he always looked ready to kick out.

I remember him kicking out very fast after Warrior pinned him...I always wondered if that was supposed to be done, or if it was just Hogan being Hogan.

RealFoxy
May 11, 2011

I'm not making a fucking QCS thread for this but seriously can we take a harder stance on Kiwifarms freaks like this guy, Jesus Christ seriously, you used to be better at knocking these creeps down. I guess ADTRW mods aren't responsible like GBS mods are.

El Gallinero Gros posted:

I remember him kicking out very fast after Warrior pinned him...I always wondered if that was supposed to be done, or if it was just Hogan being Hogan.
The ending to Hogan/Sting in the biggest match in WCW was supposed to end in a fast count for the Bret Hart run-on and Hogan convinced Nick Patrick to do a normal 3 count which made everyone but Hogan look bad so what do you think

Nehru the Damaja
May 20, 2005

What's the best pre-NXT stuff with Kyle O'Reilly that I can see for free on the internet?

Super No Vacancy
Jul 26, 2012

his bosj final with kushida

RealFoxy
May 11, 2011

I'm not making a fucking QCS thread for this but seriously can we take a harder stance on Kiwifarms freaks like this guy, Jesus Christ seriously, you used to be better at knocking these creeps down. I guess ADTRW mods aren't responsible like GBS mods are.

Nehru the Damaja posted:

What's the best pre-NXT stuff with Kyle O'Reilly that I can see for free on the internet?
The Threemendous III match between O'Riley/Cole/Young Bucks/Super Smash Bros is so good that if you're really serious I would buy you the DVD just to see it.

STING 64
Oct 20, 2006

davey richards had a really good 2.9

STING 64
Oct 20, 2006

Nehru the Damaja posted:

What's the best pre-NXT stuff with Kyle O'Reilly that I can see for free on the internet?

hybrid fighting match with adam cole in 2011

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

RealFoxy posted:

The ending to Hogan/Sting in the biggest match in WCW was supposed to end in a fast count for the Bret Hart run-on and Hogan convinced Nick Patrick to do a normal 3 count which made everyone but Hogan look bad so what do you think

WWE probably wanted a rematch real bad, so despite his reputation, I'm not sure

Aesop Poprock
Oct 21, 2008


Grimey Drawer
Does anyone have a link to that ancient YouTube video docevil made about Chris Benoit where some dudes dancing on a wolf face and it says Dance on the Bad Mans grave

shiksa
Nov 9, 2009

i went to one of these wrestling shows and it was... honestly? frickin boring. i wanna see ricky! i want to see his gold chains and respect for the ftw lifestyle

RealFoxy posted:

The ending to Hogan/Sting in the biggest match in WCW was supposed to end in a fast count for the Bret Hart run-on and Hogan convinced Nick Patrick to do a normal 3 count which made everyone but Hogan look bad so what do you think

the nwo referee indeed.

god hogan sucks so much. to be so petty to ruin the payoff to a years-long storyline with sting, make him look like a jackass, make bret hart in his first night in the company look like a jackass, because he wanted to "look strong" in the fake sport that everyone knows is fake. doesn't matter, the dude just legit cannot help himself from being himself.

just rust
Oct 23, 2012

Was Val Venis the first famous dick wrestler?

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


just rust posted:

Was Val Venis the first famous dick wrestler?

Does Ric Flair count?

Cavauro
Jan 9, 2008

Dick Beyer or Dick the Bruiser

Sanguinia
Jan 1, 2012

~Everybody wants to be a cat~
~Because a cat's the only cat~
~Who knows where its at~

Dick Togo

Von Linus
Apr 6, 2006
I complete me.
Dick Slender

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004


Rocky Johnson

Cavauro
Jan 9, 2008

none of those are before the ones i mentioned.

Sanguinia
Jan 1, 2012

~Everybody wants to be a cat~
~Because a cat's the only cat~
~Who knows where its at~

Cavauro posted:

none of those are before the ones i mentioned.

He said FAMOUS silly billy.

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004


Cavauro posted:

none of those are before the ones i mentioned.
dont be a posting cop, i just wanted to make a dick joke

Cavauro
Jan 9, 2008

I'll never not post, unless I am banned or put on probation

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?
Dirty Dick Slater

TriffTshngo
Mar 28, 2010

Don't get it twisted who your enemies are.
Dick "The Hammer" Dick

Gavok
Oct 10, 2005

Brock! Oh, man, I'm sorry about your...

...tooth?


Alex Wright.

CombineThresher
Apr 10, 2006

GIT R DONNE

Argentina Rocca, at least according to Bobby Heenan.

TheCool69
Sep 23, 2011

El Gallinero Gros posted:

I don't know if anybody else remembers the segment I'm gonna talk about, but aside from the Eugene/Regal thing, this stands out the most to me the reign of terror period.

Some of you may remember that during this period, one of the reasons HHH was allowed to do this was WWE was hurting for babyfaces. Austin was done physcially, Rock was making movies, and I think Angle was either a heel or over on Smackdown. How bad were they hurting? Well their 3 top faces (as I remember, please feel free to correct) were Kane, Rob Van Dam, and Bubba Ray Dudley. All popular. But Kane always made for a weird face, and the Katie Vick thing didn't do him any favors. RVD always had trouble navigating WWE politically. And he had a habit of accidentally stiffing people, in one case he did it so badly Karen Angle (he'd broken Kurt's nose in a 3 way for the WWE title, held by Austin at the time) wrote to Dave Meltzer to complain about it, which was weird.

Which brings us to Bubba Ray.

At one point, it seemed like they wanted to make Bubba a singles star, kind of a poor man's Dusty to HHH's poor man's Ric Flair (I once got called all manner of names for implying Flair was better than HHH in his prime by a mega HHH fan, good times). Bubba even started regularly doing the Bionic Elbow routine.

So, on some RAW during this period, Bubba interrupts one of HHH's self fellatio sessions on the mic. Bubba's a decent promo when he's not resorting to incredibly offensive riot inducing cheap heat (I'm amazed that Heatwave promo didn't get Paul sued somehow), so this is fine. And hey, you gotta make new stars, right?

So Bubba cuts a promo, saying he's so tired of this crap week after week. He points out that RAW has become a show that seems to exist purely to satisfy HHH's ego, and that he's here to put a stop to it. Little on the nose, but it actually followed the only important rule of worked shoot promo: allude to shooty elements, but don't go so inside baseball that you start talking about the worked element of the business. Bubba challenges HHH to a match.

And HHH crushes him like a bug inside 10 minutes.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting Bubba Ray Dudley is the TA Magnum of that period, or anything like that. I don't know that he should have touched the main event anywhere. But the whole segment comes off as HHH personally addressing those who felt he should drop the belt by using Bubba as a proxy for them, then being like "Oh here's my rebuttal". And pedigreeing the proxy back to the stone age.

Or maybe it's just lovely booking. Either way, a total waste of time.

I think Bubbas push was squashed immediately after that horrible RAW main event match against H where he gassed out badly and botched a powerbomb through a table which resulted in Trips injuring himself

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?
Okay, regarding the Kofi Kingston storyline headed into WrestleMania:

I could swear I read that the gauntlet match push was originally supposed to go to Mustafa Ali, and Kofi replaced him due to injury. So I’m wondering how much of this storyline was Ali’s before plans had to change. Make sense?

Dacap
Jul 8, 2008

I've been involved in a number of cults, both as a leader and a follower.

You have more fun as a follower. But you make more money as a leader.



Pope Corky the IX posted:

Okay, regarding the Kofi Kingston storyline headed into WrestleMania:

I could swear I read that the gauntlet match push was originally supposed to go to Mustafa Ali, and Kofi replaced him due to injury. So I’m wondering how much of this storyline was Ali’s before plans had to change. Make sense?

Ali was going to do well in the gauntlet but the Mania match was gonna be Bryan/Owens

Aphrodite
Jun 27, 2006

The earlier pre-EC gauntlet was going to be Ali.

My guess is the plans changed for EC. I doubt Ali was getting that big of a push.

Procrastinator
Aug 16, 2009

what?


I'm tempted to say the booking of the chamber match itself would have been different but I'm not sure what they would have done instead.

CityMidnightJunky
May 11, 2013

by Smythe
So it finally happened.

Today, I realized my roommate, an intelligent adult woman with multiple post-graduate degrees, genuinely 100% believes that wrestling is real.

Is this the first time this has happened since the late 1800's? Or has anyone else met someone who still believes it's real dammit? I feel like I've just found a unicorn in the wild.

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Shayna Baszler
Oct 24, 2001

i'll always take care of you
Muldoon

CityMidnightJunky posted:

So it finally happened.

Today, I realized my roommate, an intelligent adult woman with multiple post-graduate degrees, genuinely 100% believes that wrestling is real.

Is this the first time this has happened since the late 1800's? Or has anyone else met someone who still believes it's real dammit? I feel like I've just found a unicorn in the wild.

what foreign country is she from

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