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PneumonicBook
Sep 26, 2007

Do you like our owl?



Ultra Carp

bengy81 posted:

I would have gone IA in a heartbeat, deploying as a Spy tech was straight GARBAGE.

Who would I have eaten Vienna sausages with?

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bengy81
May 8, 2010

PneumonicBook posted:

Who would I have eaten Vienna sausages with?

:wink:

Vriess
Apr 30, 2013

Select the items of interest in the scene.

Returned with Honor.

SpaceSDoorGunner posted:

My favorite was when we had two engineers (actual engineers), a programmer, a former OSINT analyst for worked for a well known private intelligence firm, and another guy with an MBA all undes in deck department because for a while there was a policy at San Diego of not giving most A-school drops a second rate, and lol BUD/S is an A-school.

Seen this at Corry. Some gung-ho moto SWCC candidate comes to Pensacola for training for EOD or some poo poo, takes a bad fall, gets medically discharged from the program and gets sent to fuckin' JCAC because of their AQFT. Taps out within two weeks and that's two failed schools, so undes they go.

Two months last RTC and the Navy ripped their heart out Kano style. Now comes the 4 years of chippin' and striking into FSA.

Jimmy4400nav
Apr 1, 2011

Ambassador to Moonlandia
Got my NATOPS checkride Monday, all goes well I'll meet the Navy's bare minimum to be cleared to be responsible in the plane! After that Whidbey!* :rock:

I am gonna miss the aircrew I had in my training crew, they were some solid dudes, though I am happy they got their dream sheet slots here in Jax.


*Though it sounds like we might be getting deployed right when we get there. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Time Crisis Actor
Apr 28, 2002

by Hand Knit
REMEMBER SAILOR :smugdon:

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

c-spam cannot afford



I was browsing through youtube history on an old account for some reason and got a major blast from the past. There are at least 3 goons in this video from 2007.

We were supposed to have a port call in Guam. We had ATG riders on board while we finished some post-drydock qualifications. We got tasked to something else en route. We pulled up to Guam, dropped off ATG (who still got to have a few day stay in Guam), and went off to do what ever the gently caress.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrZfa0YB7HY

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Mr. Nice! posted:

I was browsing through youtube history on an old account for some reason and got a major blast from the past. There are at least 3 goons in this video from 2007.

We were supposed to have a port call in Guam. We had ATG riders on board while we finished some post-drydock qualifications. We got tasked to something else en route. We pulled up to Guam, dropped off ATG (who still got to have a few day stay in Guam), and went off to do what ever the gently caress.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrZfa0YB7HY

This should be shown to everyone who thinks joining the Navy is a good idea. We did much the same thing in at least one port. I think ours was Greece on the way back from over 120 days at sea operating with no port calls. We pulled in to the anchorage and the ship riders hopped in a single boat that came over to get them and then we weighed anchor and proceeded to leave again to do what the gently caress ever for a while again.

FrozenVent
May 1, 2009

The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.
I used to sail on set unloaders, our longest port calls were like 12-14 hours, and obviously we had to do our watches plus two before / two after.

Once in a while we’d go to a slower load port and we’d get to enjoy almost a whole day in like... Sandusky, Ohio, or Thunder Bay, Ontario.

At least we got paid decently I guess.

EBB
Feb 15, 2005

Love the guy at 1:09 who just looks disgusted by the question


e:ahahaha and the little dance at the end

ded
Oct 27, 2005

Kooler than Jesus

Mr. Nice! posted:

I was browsing through youtube history on an old account for some reason and got a major blast from the past. There are at least 3 goons in this video from 2007.

We were supposed to have a port call in Guam. We had ATG riders on board while we finished some post-drydock qualifications. We got tasked to something else en route. We pulled up to Guam, dropped off ATG (who still got to have a few day stay in Guam), and went off to do what ever the gently caress.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrZfa0YB7HY

Reminds me of my trip to Guam in 96.

SquirrelyPSU
May 27, 2003


CMD598 posted:

I know an FC that went IA to Iraq to work with CRAM. Didn't hear much about CRAM from his stories though.

We had a person in Iraq every single year that I was on the ship. And if you got that sweet maintenance shore duty billet? Hope you packed your desert cammies.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


I came across this in the weird stuff ex’s did.


FactsAreUseless posted:

Imagine being so bad at masturbation that you cause severe rear end swelling, and you're so embarrassed about it that you join the Navy.

She definitely posts here.

Dingleberry
Aug 21, 2011

FrozenVent posted:

I used to sail on set unloaders, our longest port calls were like 12-14 hours, and obviously we had to do our watches plus two before / two after.

Once in a while we’d go to a slower load port and we’d get to enjoy almost a whole day in like... Sandusky, Ohio, or Thunder Bay, Ontario.

At least we got paid decently I guess.

That’s why its better when youre on a ship where the unloading equipment breaks down on the regular. Or at a dock with regular breakdowns. Can get 48 hours at SMET in Superior. The Lamplighter was about a 20 minute walk from the front gate. I think its closed now...

shovelbum
Oct 21, 2010

Fun Shoe

Dingleberry posted:

That’s why its better when youre on a ship where the unloading equipment breaks down on the regular. Or at a dock with regular breakdowns. Can get 48 hours at SMET in Superior. The Lamplighter was about a 20 minute walk from the front gate. I think its closed now...

was that the really lovely strip club, we were trying to remember where that was at work the other day

I think we'd all forgotten superior existed and were like... Two harbors??

FrozenVent
May 1, 2009

The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.
Canadian citizen, so not allowed ashore at SMET (no TWIC card...). Anyway they always loaded us as fast as we could pump out, so I don’t think I ever went ashore there.

Wait once at the ore dock, we went to this really sketchy bar... president’s? Or was that Duluth?

Dingleberry
Aug 21, 2011

shovelbum posted:

was that the really lovely strip club, we were trying to remember where that was at work the other day

I think we'd all forgotten superior existed and were like... Two harbors??

Yup. Aka limplifter

I enjoyed it though. Kinda liked the frumpy girls hanging out half naked playing video poker vibe. The was a nicer place down from it but still pretty much frumpy midwestern girls (which back in the day were kinda my jam). I think the limplifter bldg is for sale now.

EBB
Feb 15, 2005

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


You had me at Tricare.

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


Message To The Mess: Earn Back The Sailors’ Trust
By Command Master Chief William Houlihan, U.S. Navy | March 22, 2019

https://blog.usni.org/posts/2019/03/22/message-to-the-mess-earn-back-the-sailors-trust

quote:

What I’m about to say is directed to the Navy’s Chiefs’ Mess and there are a few of you who will take it personally, and to you I say, good. Many more of you will question the medium and the audience and wonder why this discussion has to take place openly.

My answer to that is the way we conduct ourselves as chief petty officers affects our entire Navy.

Many of our sailors don’t trust the Mess. They don’t trust us because we are not doing the jobs we used to do, the jobs the Mess was intended to do.

Our focus seems to have shifted. Too many of us believe the strategic direction of our Navy is where we should be concentrating. Not enough of us are walking berthings, establishing standards, visiting the mess decks, and just listening to our men and women.

Chiefs need to get their drat heads out of their academic and post-Navy aspirations and back into the lives and development of their sailors. Our sailors don’t need chiefs pretending they understand the very complex concept of “strategy.” Our sailors need chiefs whose daily “strategy” revolves around unit mission and sailor development. Their playbooks are PODs and MRCs, profile sheets and evals. Our best chiefs have their sleeves rolled up and their ears open. We’re moving away from that, and our sailors’ faith in us is dwindling.

Wardroom Aspirations
The Decatur Experiment didn’t last long.

In 2004, 19 Chief Petty Officers assigned to USS Decatur (DDG-73) were moved into division officer duties. Formally. Their traditional roles of leading sailors on the deckplates and training junior officers were altered to the point that they were tasked with being those division officers.

The Navy, to its credit, saw the risk and stopped it. Chiefs are chiefs. We are not division officers. We mentor division officers. We train division officers. We support our Div-Os and take pride in their success as we do our junior sailors.

We no longer are emphasizing those core responsibilities the way we used to. That’s not on the chiefs. That’s on the master chiefs and the senior chiefs leading chiefs. That’s on the selection boards who placed value on education and collateral duties instead of where that value should be placed: Sailor success. It’s on every one of us who train chief selectees during initiation.

Our sailors don’t trust our priorities. Through our own actions, they believe our personal interests lie in . . . our personal interests. They see chiefs who spend more time striving for qualifications traditionally held by officers than leading, caring, and teaching. It would appear that the reasons we scrapped the Decatur Experiment have been forgotten, and the reasoning behind its inception has regained validity.

The level of dialog between our Mess and our wardroom has never been higher. The conversations taking place in engineering log rooms, bridge wings, ready rooms, and hangar bays are incredible. Our Mess is becoming more credentialed, more educated, better versed in science, better writers, and more comfortable in joint environments.

The degrees are piling up, but at what expense?

We aren’t as visible, which makes us less relevant. We aren’t as accessible, which makes us less valuable. We aren’t in tune with our sailors, and that leads to a deterioration of trust.

“Exalted . . . and I use that word advisedly.”
It was Navy Times that made the problems public. Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy (MCPON) Steve Giordano, according to Navy Times and anonymous sources, had created a hostile work environment in his Pentagon office and developed an affection for privilege.

That story broke on 15 June.

Our 14th master chief petty officer of the Navy announced his retirement six days later.

I don’t know Giordano well but I do know this: Chiefs have been creating, by design or in some cases through character flaw, hostile work environments since 1893. Chiefs lead hard. Chiefs lead sternly. Chiefs establish standards and hold our sailors to them. And not all of us do it as well as others.

I know for a fact that it took me more than 20 years in the Mess to understand that I had created some toxic environments as I grew into my anchors. How some among us took to our ivory and khaki towers and wondered publicly how he could have created such an environment. Really, chief? How’s the culture in your workcenter? Are your sailors willing to bring you their problems, or do they fear you?

And privilege?

We, the Mess, haven’t exactly avoided privilege over the years. From parking spaces to CPO birthday celebrations that inexplicably last a week, from our own geographic location on ships to eat and live: privilege. Earned and, in most cases, necessary? Yes. But privilege just the same.

How about six weeks every year, a lot of it spent outside the workcenter? Does that sound like privilege? Yes. Our initiation is the greatest “perk” we have and it’s one we wouldn’t have if our commanding officers didn’t allow for it, and see the value in it.

Our sailors see it and when they see us abuse it or grow too tied to it? They begin to wonder. Our sailors wonder if we are more tied to the perks of being a chief or to the greatest privilege of all, and that’s the honor of leading sailors.

Our Sailors Are Harming Themselves
Our sailors don’t trust the Mess.

You won’t see that on too many t-shirts, but there are two clear signs across the fleet pointing to it as fact—specifically suicides and suicidal ideations. Those numbers are on the rise and lead to this: if Sailors are so troubled that suicide is even a fleeting thought, what led them to that place, and who in their chain of command could or should have seen the signs and spoken to them well before those thoughts took form?

Nine Sailors committed suicide in January. The number of ideations I see in a daily destructive behavior report are staggering. If we’re going to discuss trust, and I mean really discuss it, this better be where we anchor. Every time I see a report of an ideation or worse, my first thought is, “Where was their Chief?” I am not naïve or jaded enough to believe every one of those situations could or should have been fixed by the Mess. But I am realistic enough to believe that many of our junior sailors with severe problems are not bringing their issues to the men and women who could help them the most.

Our sailors simply don’t trust us enough to bring us their problems before those problems lead to harmful or reckless thoughts and actions. If you find this hard to believe, ask your divisions. Better yet, ask your second class petty officers. They’re traditionally the real influencers. Ask them if the junior sailors feel comfortable bringing their problems to the chief.

Regaining The Trust And Why
Before we determine how to get that trust back, or establish it initially, we need to ask why.

The “why” is important here because, and deny this if you want, there are some among us who feel that if a sailor isn’t “happy” or “satisfied” then the Navy simply isn’t for him or her. They haven’t “bought in” and we lead them differently, or we ignore them and focus on those who fit our personal labels of what a “good sailor” is.

We need them all. Every single one. Every sailor is our sailor. We need them because our nation’s enemies, real or potential, relish the thought of a fractured force.

Gaining trust isn’t just about preventing suicide. It’s about mission. Sailors who trust us will follow us. They will question less and act quicker. They will perform because they trust that you have their personal well being and professional success in mind.

Our sailors, if led well, do not feel like they’ve been hired, or gained, or accessed . . . they feel like they’ve been adopted.

It’s how we used to be led. Talk to a retired hief and ask them about their perception of today’s Mess compared to the one that raised them and you’ll get an earful. More likely, an eyeful if it’s on one of the seemingly hundreds of CPO Facebook pages. A lot of it is bluster or disconnection, but some of it rings true. Our Chiefs took a personal interest, an immediate and possessive interest in us as sailors and as people.

We earn a sailor’s trust by doing what they’ve been led to believe chiefs do: lead, nurture, discipline, care, challenge. “Taking care of sailors” is a tired cliché and one, in my opinion, that we should eliminate. Chiefs should be challenging our sailors while we create the conditions for their success and the conditions in which their families can safely thrive.

Plenty of chiefs were taken aback when the Chief of Naval Operations Admiral John Richardson and Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy Russ Smith recently emphasized their expectations of the Mess.

In a virtual all hands call broadcast on Facebook Live on 26 February, the CNO said, “In my vision, if any of our sailors have a problem, they should be able to go to their leader, their LPO, their chief, their division officer, whoever that person is and have 100 percent confidence that leader will take this on, advocate for the sailor and solve that problem.”

To paraphrase: Do your job. Train your Div-Os and your LPOs. Fix your sailors’ problems when those problems become too much for the sailor to handle themselves.

Smith said, “Getting after, finding out why our sailors are distracted—whether it’s personal issues, pay and entitlements issues, housing issues, whatever the case is—this is what chiefs exist to do. Get in there. Solve problems. Remove distractions. And provide our sailors the opportunity to practice their craft.”

It’s how we build trust. It’s why we must build trust. Sailors have issues. Families have challenges. We did. Our chiefs helped us overcome them. We can’t fix them if we don’t know and we won’t know if there isn’t…

Trust. It’s used once in the “Chief’s Creed,” a document I read and believe in more than any other. “Trust is inherent with the donning of the uniform of a Chief.” Got it. I believe it. I need to trust my fellow chiefs and I need them to trust me. But where is the line that guides us to lead in such a way that compels our sailors to trust us implicitly? Where does the Creed tell me to take custody of my sailors and lead them with compassion and character?

Where does the Creed tell me that being a “Good Chief” equals, in many respects, being a good person?

“Get Back to Chiefing.”
In writing this article, I spoke to a fellow CMC told me of a meeting he attended and his almost off-hand comment to a captain, a remark that indicated he was in the process of reminding his Mess what our true responsibilities are. He was in the process of emphasizing the reestablishment of trust among our junior sailors, through character across the Mess.

“Good,” said the captain. “Scrape the pirate stickers off the backs of your trucks and get back to chiefing.”

Get back to chiefing.

We should all pause a second and consider that. Permission, if you need it, to be a chief petty officer. Permission granted to lead. Lead. Lead like we know how. Lead like we’ve been taught. Keep that swagger specific only to a Navy chief petty officer but, at the same time, learn our sailors and gain their trust through integrity. Be tough, but invest ourselves and invest our self-worth in the development of our sailors as people and as warfighters.

There is a tried and true CPO initiation training tool that I won’t go into too deeply here. It revolves around teaching a CPO select how to lead a division. They’re given one dozen theoretical sailors and each of those sailors comes with challenges and the problems we see sailors face every day. For decades we, the Mess, have focused on programs, on knowledge of process, as we guide the selectees toward finding solutions.

We should be training our new chiefs the value of establishing trust through listening, through making small promises and following through on every one of them. Promise a sailor you will visit the housing office, then do it. Promise a sailor Thursday afternoon off to attend a well-baby appointment, then make it happen. Small promises. Small investments that build trust.

Get out from behind your desk. Look a sailor in the eye and don’t be distracted by your computer. Take them to the fantail, to a sponson, to an office and genuinely ask them how they are. Look them in the eye and hold it until they realize you’re serious. You genuinely want to know.

Become chiefs like ETCS Brandon House and EMCS Leon Howell. I had the privilege of serving with them on board the USS Milius (DDG-69). To their sailors, they were the embodiment of what a chief should be. There were no secrets in their divisions. If sailors had a problem, the LPO knew and fixed it. If she couldn’t fix it, she took it to Howell or House. You better believe neither slept until they found a solution. If you were a chief in our Mess on the Milius and House or Howell caught wind of lazy leadership? Stand by. They addressed it. Quickly. In the Mess, in front of our fellow chiefs. Peer pressure was and is a tremendous device.

Their divisions simply didn’t fail. Ever. Those sailors refused to fail out of fear of disappointing the chiefs who led them, and the chiefs those sailors had learned to trust.

This is not hard. It’s not eccentric thinking. Most of it is straight out of our Mission, Vision and Guiding Principles. “Chiefs are visible leaders who set the tone . . . we will know our sailors and develop them beyond their own expectations.”

This is not a Jerry Maguire manifesto that will ruin careers if you take it on. This is simply leading from a position of compassion and concern with the intent to build trust. It took me years to see the value of it and, frankly, it’s probably and unfortunately too late for me to leverage what I’ve discovered. But, if you’re a chief leading a division, reading this in the evening, you can put it into play tomorrow at quarters. It isn’t too late to shift your culture. It’s not too late to start building trust.

We must do this. We must create a culture of trust. We don’t “gain” sailors. We adopt them. We take custody of them. Their success is our success.

Start today. If you need to change your way of leading, do it. If you don’t know how, call me. Our Mess must be better because our sailors deserve it.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

c-spam cannot afford



Good message too bad it's decades late.

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


Mr. Nice! posted:

Good message too bad it's decades late.

Takes time to course correct, maybe some good will come of it (probably not)

King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k
I've known Bill for many years and can vouch that he means every word of that straight from his heart. The chief initiation seasons I've been in that he ran were hands down the best I'd ever seen and actually wished he'd have led mine.

maffew buildings
Apr 29, 2009

too dumb to be probated; not too dumb to be autobanned
I am not optimistic my community will take to this call but who knows

PneumonicBook
Sep 26, 2007

Do you like our owl?



Ultra Carp
Lol he alludes to but wont mention giving chief selects a carton of egg sailors.

King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k
I hear ya. *writes a novel about my frustrations, deletes it*

Hope he can get the buy in with the CMCs that aren't too far up their own asses. Dim hope.

King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k
I don't think there's any secret to the egg division. If you can't take care of a dozen eggs (who don't lie, show up late, steal, beat or get beaten by their spouse, get arrested or friggin die on you) and their basic sailor needs like muster reports and evals, in addition to your other tasks that need managed, you are really going to struggle in your new role. Explaining to the mess why you can't take care of eggs is simple compared to explaining to the CO why your division is hosed up and his ship failed an inspection.

lightpole
Jun 4, 2004
I think that MBAs are useful, in case you are looking for an answer to the question of "Is lightpole a total fucking idiot".

King of Bees posted:

I don't think there's any secret to the egg division. If you can't take care of a dozen eggs (who don't lie, show up late, steal, beat or get beaten by their spouse, get arrested or friggin die on you) and their basic sailor needs like muster reports and evals, in addition to your other tasks that need managed, you are really going to struggle in your new role. Explaining to the mess why you can't take care of eggs is simple compared to explaining to the CO why your division is hosed up and his ship failed an inspection.

TLDR; only a poo poo carpenter blames their tools.

PneumonicBook
Sep 26, 2007

Do you like our owl?



Ultra Carp

King of Bees posted:

I don't think there's any secret to the egg division. If you can't take care of a dozen eggs (who don't lie, show up late, steal, beat or get beaten by their spouse, get arrested or friggin die on you) and their basic sailor needs like muster reports and evals, in addition to your other tasks that need managed, you are really going to struggle in your new role. Explaining to the mess why you can't take care of eggs is simple compared to explaining to the CO why your division is hosed up and his ship failed an inspection.

It just seemed funny that he didn't name it due to the sanctity of initiation.

A SOF Marine
May 29, 2013
The CO that told some guy to scrape the pirate stickers of their trucks has the best idea on how to unfuck, uh, “The Mess”.

King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k

A SOF Marine posted:

The CO that told some guy to scrape the pirate stickers of their trucks has the best idea on how to unfuck, uh, “The Mess”.

That was brilliant. That wank poo poo needs to be secured. The only other people who do that across the services are dependas.

boy are my arms tired
May 10, 2012

Ham Wrangler
greetings i am returned from my first deployment

it was, uh, an experience

PneumonicBook
Sep 26, 2007

Do you like our owl?



Ultra Carp

boy are my arms tired posted:

greetings i am returned from my first deployment

Post/username

Welcome back, you hit any ports that weren't garbage?

maffew buildings
Apr 29, 2009

too dumb to be probated; not too dumb to be autobanned

King of Bees posted:

That was brilliant. That wank poo poo needs to be secured. The only other people who do that across the services are dependas.

I kept thinking while reading it our Chiefs will just cite NCF doesn't go to sea, non-applicable. Maybe this is that lack of trust thing.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


boy are my arms tired posted:

greetings i am returned from my first deployment

it was, uh, an experience

I’d love to hear as a lovely sailor who will probably never go to sea.

boy are my arms tired
May 10, 2012

Ham Wrangler

PneumonicBook posted:

Post/username

Welcome back, you hit any ports that weren't garbage?

i flew into bahrain while my ship was already 2 months into deployment, after that it was bahrain, jebel ali, bahrain, bahrain. then i got flown home for school/baby being born, which apparently is something that The Navy doesn't send people home for normally, but which im thankful my ship was alright with doing

they're getting to hit israel, greece and portugal on the way home

LingcodKilla posted:

I’d love to hear as a lovely sailor who will probably never go to sea.

quarters, clamp down, watch, lunch, study for ESWS/quals, dinner, video games, watch, sleep

repeat for months

oh and GQ drills

GQ drills forever

boy are my arms tired fucked around with this message at 15:47 on Mar 27, 2019

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


King of Bees posted:

That was brilliant. That wank poo poo needs to be secured. The only other people who do that across the services are dependas.

I never understood the whole loving skull things. The only Chief item of civilian wear I have is a fowled anchor polo that I only wear when they do a veteran celebration thing for the hospice patients where I volunteer at. Those old boys have some stories to tell.

Madurai
Jun 26, 2012

boy are my arms tired posted:


quarters, clamp down, watch, lunch, study for ESWS/quals, dinner, video games, watch, sleep

repeat for months

oh and GQ drills

GQ drills forever

Oh good, nothing's changed since 1992.

King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k

Nick Soapdish posted:

I never understood the whole loving skull things. The only Chief item of civilian wear I have is a fowled anchor polo that I only wear when they do a veteran celebration thing for the hospice patients where I volunteer at. Those old boys have some stories to tell.

Gotta love the old timers. Good on you. My seconds used to prank me with those drat stickers knowing how much I rolled my eyes about them. I'd leave for the day and find a huge goat skull on my car. I'd get them back with hidden "Navy Wife toughest job in the Navy" stickers. I still have a stack of them.

ManMythLegend
Aug 18, 2003

I don't believe in anything, I'm just here for the violence.
I am never not talking poo poo to my chiefs about goat skulls and all of that dumb poo poo.

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King of Bees
Dec 28, 2012
Gravy Boat 2k
Check out my new coffee table book Metamorphosis: A Study of Chiefs at the Harley Dealer

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