Climate Change: hope for the biggest I told you so of all time is what fuels us

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bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

538 trolling hard with this one

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-28-year-old-from-spokane-who-thinks-having-kids-is-immoral/?ex_cid=538twitter

They found someone who thinks that maybe having kids is immoral due to the climate crisis, but then she rants about uneducated people without jobs having kids, how it hampers a woman's earning potential, and in support of China's one-child policy

edit: on a more productive note, I started The Uninhabitable Earth last night. The first chapter sets a sufficiently intimidating tone in terms of the scale of the problem. Has anyone in this thread read it? Seems right up our alley here.

bawfuls has issued a correction as of 20:05 on Mar 27, 2019

# ? Mar 27, 2019 19:50

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# ? Apr 29, 2024 15:00

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

Capitalism is the great filter lmao

# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:14

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

bawfuls posted:

538 trolling hard with this one

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-28-year-old-from-spokane-who-thinks-having-kids-is-immoral/?ex_cid=538twitter

They found someone who thinks that maybe having kids is immoral due to the climate crisis, but then she rants about uneducated people without jobs having kids, how it hampers a woman's earning potential, and in support of China's one-child policy

edit: on a more productive note, I started The Uninhabitable Earth last night. The first chapter sets a sufficiently intimidating tone in terms of the scale of the problem. Has anyone in this thread read it? Seems right up our alley here.

Yeah it's really good and it's well written but I don't think much of it is going to be new to the people regularly reading this thread

There are a lot of little interesting facts that I hadn't put together too, like concrete being a huge greenhouse gas problem (if concrete was a country it would be the third largest emitter in the world)

# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:16

Argentum: Feb 6, 2011; UGLY LIKE BOWEL CANCER

Socks4Hands posted:

the important thing is that capitalism doesn't escape the planet

joke's on you, capitalism can spontaneously come into existence anywhere in the universe. it's already all over the place. it's like a weed that never goes away.

# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:23

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

We foolishly assumed that our genes are trying to propagate themselves when in reality they exist to invent and propagate capitalism

# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:49

galagazombie: Oct 31, 2011; A silly little mouse!

Grant Morrison created a Supervillian called "Hexus The Living Corporation". Which was just Capitalism that goes from planet to planet ruining them. We thought him a comic writer but in truth he was a prophet.

# ? Mar 27, 2019 21:09

StabbinHobo: Oct 18, 2002; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

ChipNDip posted:

We are already at +1C compared to preindustrial levels. Another degree or 2 is bad, but it's still speculation.

The doom and gloom poo poo is fun, but ultimately it's counterproductive in terms of actually getting people to change behaviors or push for better policy imo. If you moan that the entire world is going to boil to death unless we meet an impossible target like stopping emissions tomorrow and implementing carbon capture, it doesn't convince people to jump into action. It makes them say gently caress it and not even bother.

for the record you're dead wrong and smarmy tone policing piece of poo poo cowards like you are almost 100% of the problem right now. we don't need to convince coal roallers to change their mind, we need to convince lazy slacking dead weight assholes like you to stop riding the loving brakes.

edit: and by "convince" i mean re-education camps where you sandbag riverbanks in bangladesh or something

StabbinHobo has issued a correction as of 23:48 on Mar 27, 2019

# ? Mar 27, 2019 21:13

Wakko: Jun 9, 2002; Faboo!

i would say 100% of the problem right now is that we needed to take radical action back during the Carter administration, and didn't

us not taking radical action right now is more the problem of 80 years from now, for the last humans trying to scrape by in siberia and the canadian shield

# ? Mar 27, 2019 21:27

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

As someone working in the Canadian shield right now: LMfAO.

You dumb fucks don't get it, I didn't even get it. The song goes like this:

We've got rocks and trees and trees and rocks and rocks and trees and trees and rocks.

For a reason.

There's no loving dirt here. It is, in 100% actuality, trees attached directly to rocks and surrounded by an inch of this tough lichen-y humus mixed in acidic pine needles.

Sometimes you find some rare acres where dirt has occurred and agriculture is viable and there are farms. Those spots are rare, what you can grow there is limited, and the lovely soil is largely heavily contaminated by the plume from the Inco stack.

You aren't growing much of anything in the Canadian Shield, no matter how loving hot it gets. I'll take pictures, as the snow melts I become ever more confused as to why anyone lives in this utter hellscape.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:06

ChipNDip: Sep 6, 2010; How many deaths are prevented by an executive order that prevents big box stores from selling seeds, furniture, and paint?

StabbinHobo posted:

for the record you're dead wrong and smarmy tone policing piece of poo poo cowards like you are almost 100% of the problem right now. we don't need to convince coal roallers to change their mind, we need to convince lazy slacking dead weight assholes like you to stop riding the loving brakes.

edit: and by "convince" i mean re-education camps where you sandbag riverbanks in bangladesh or something

I'm on-board with banning fossil fuels today. I'm just saying that if you constantly tell people we're already hosed, the average person is going to slide into nihilism, not be convinced that they have to make a change.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:20

smoke sumthin bitch: Dec 14, 2009; by FactsAreUseless

global warming is faker than russia gate

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:23

IamFuckMan: Mar 26, 2019; by FactsAreUseless

If I was the dictator those types of science deniers would be sequestered away in recreations of medieval villages.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:25

Homocow: Apr 24, 2007; Extremely bad poster!
DO NOT QUOTE!; Pillbug

smoke sumthin bitch posted:

global warming is faker than russia gate

100% fake hoax

scientists are just trying to trick you into giving them grant money

*insufflates ground up coal* mmm gently caress yeah

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:26

StabbinHobo: Oct 18, 2002; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

ChipNDip posted:

I'm on-board with banning fossil fuels today. I'm just saying that if you constantly tell people we're already hosed, the average person is going to slide into nihilism, not be convinced that they have to make a change.

gently caress your "average person" pop psychology meta-argument bullshit. its just a way you phrase your own opinions while being too much of a coward to stand behind them.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:40

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

Rime posted:

As someone working in the Canadian shield right now: LMfAO.

You dumb fucks don't get it, I didn't even get it. The song goes like this:

We've got rocks and trees and trees and rocks and rocks and trees and trees and rocks.

For a reason.

There's no loving dirt here. It is, in 100% actuality, trees attached directly to rocks and surrounded by an inch of this tough lichen-y humus mixed in acidic pine needles.

Sometimes you find some rare acres where dirt has occurred and agriculture is viable and there are farms. Those spots are rare, what you can grow there is limited, and the lovely soil is largely heavily contaminated by the plume from the Inco stack.

You aren't growing much of anything in the Canadian Shield, no matter how loving hot it gets. I'll take pictures, as the snow melts I become ever more confused as to why anyone lives in this utter hellscape.

If you stay for the summer and buy a canoe to throw on top of that garbage van of yours you might get it

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:41

Lastgirl: Sep 7, 1997; Good Morning!
Sunday Morning!

Rime posted:

As someone working in the Canadian shield right now: LMfAO.

You dumb fucks don't get it, I didn't even get it. The song goes like this:

We've got rocks and trees and trees and rocks and rocks and trees and trees and rocks.

For a reason.

There's no loving dirt here. It is, in 100% actuality, trees attached directly to rocks and surrounded by an inch of this tough lichen-y humus mixed in acidic pine needles.

Sometimes you find some rare acres where dirt has occurred and agriculture is viable and there are farms. Those spots are rare, what you can grow there is limited, and the lovely soil is largely heavily contaminated by the plume from the Inco stack.

You aren't growing much of anything in the Canadian Shield, no matter how loving hot it gets. I'll take pictures, as the snow melts I become ever more confused as to why anyone lives in this utter hellscape.

just breed maggots for a protein farm bing bong so simple

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:43

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

bawfuls posted:

edit: on a more productive note, I started The Uninhabitable Earth last night. The first chapter sets a sufficiently intimidating tone in terms of the scale of the problem. Has anyone in this thread read it? Seems right up our alley here.

a big part of the message of this book btw is that "we're already hosed, might as well not try" is stupid because no matter how bad things get we can always choose to make them better or even worse

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:43

Ill Peripheral: Jun 29, 2008

Rime posted:

As someone working in the Canadian shield right now: LMfAO.

You dumb fucks don't get it, I didn't even get it. The song goes like this:

We've got rocks and trees and trees and rocks and rocks and trees and trees and rocks.

For a reason.

There's no loving dirt here. It is, in 100% actuality, trees attached directly to rocks and surrounded by an inch of this tough lichen-y humus mixed in acidic pine needles.

Sometimes you find some rare acres where dirt has occurred and agriculture is viable and there are farms. Those spots are rare, what you can grow there is limited, and the lovely soil is largely heavily contaminated by the plume from the Inco stack.

You aren't growing much of anything in the Canadian Shield, no matter how loving hot it gets. I'll take pictures, as the snow melts I become ever more confused as to why anyone lives in this utter hellscape.

Guy there's a lot more to the shield than Sudbury. Once you start hitting a couple hrs west of Thunder Bay the north looks a lot like the south.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:45

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

Hes kinda right. For the land area there really isn't a whole lot of farmland to be had. There's a whole lot of rocks and trees and water and way less soil than in the midwest or prairies.

I should know. The land he's slaving away building windmills on is about 20 miles south of where my mom grew up. In one of those rare spots with topsoil enough to do a bit of farming but not nearly enough to feed everyone when the midwest US and prairie provinces go dust bowl again.

But its not a hellscape. It's pretty.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 01:55

Complications: Jun 19, 2014

Rastor posted:

Indoor farming is an existing and rapidly growing industry. The forces of capitalism would not be pursuing that if they didn't see it as feasible and potentially profitable.

So there is a disconnect there somewhere.

It's simple. Taking a hint from the oil industry, they've got plans to externalize more of the costs. If it's not red ink on the business balance sheet it doesn't exist.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 02:33

Turtlicious: Sep 17, 2012; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

This thread hosed me up so good, that when I talked about it with my therapist, she immediately told me how unhealthy this thinking is, and then helped me get pills so now I don't worry about the end of the world so much.

Maybe you guys should consider it as well.

E: She also told me it's super common and some therapists / psychs are calling it "Climate Anxiety" or "Eco Anxiety"

# ? Mar 28, 2019 02:56

Lastgirl: Sep 7, 1997; Good Morning!
Sunday Morning!

Turtlicious posted:

E: She also told me it's super common and some therapists / psychs are calling it "Climate Anxiety" or "Eco Anxiety"

your therapist is gonna feel some real eco anxiety soon

# ? Mar 28, 2019 02:59

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

Turtlicious posted:

This thread hosed me up so good, that when I talked about it with my therapist, she immediately told me how unhealthy this thinking is, and then helped me get pills so now I don't worry about the end of the world so much.

Maybe you guys should consider it as well.

E: She also told me it's super common and some therapists / psychs are calling it "Climate Anxiety" or "Eco Anxiety"

pills can help you cope with the emotional burden of human extinction, but the actual problem isn't going away

regardless, i recommend the sadbrains pills b/c if you sink into depression and despair you can't do anything to make it better ever

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:00

Shipon: Nov 7, 2005

the reality may be grim and perhaps unsaveable but that's all the more reason to fight when you can to at least make things a bit more livable while we're here

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:02

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

Shipon posted:

the reality may be grim and perhaps unsaveable but that's all the more reason to fight when you can to at least make things a bit more livable while we're here

i mean, a .5 chance of survival is worth fighting for, after all people buy lottery tickets at literally incomprehensible odds

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:06

Xaris: Jul 25, 2006; Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

bawfuls posted:

a big part of the message of this book btw is that "we're already hosed, might as well not try" is stupid because no matter how bad things get we can always choose to make them better or even worse

yeah this. the message is poo poo is a sliding scale and every .1 c saved can translate to hundreds of thousands to millions of lives saved or in less misery.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:19

bawfuls: Oct 28, 2009

Xaris posted:

yeah this. the message is poo poo is a sliding scale and every .1 c saved can translate to hundreds of thousands to millions of lives saved or in less misery.

Exactly. Maybe a thread book club if anyone's interested?

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:31

Marx Headroom: May 10, 2007; AT LAST! A show with nonono ~~commercials~~!; Fallen Rib

galagazombie posted:

Grant Morrison created a Supervillian called "Hexus The Living Corporation". Which was just Capitalism that goes from planet to planet ruining them. We thought him a comic writer but in truth he was a prophet.

here is charlie stross describing corporations as a form of AI

quote:

The problem with corporations is that despite their overt goals�whether they make electric vehicles or beer or sell life insurance policies�they are all subject to instrumental convergence insofar as they all have a common implicit paperclip-maximizer goal: to generate revenue. If they don't make money, they are eaten by a bigger predator or they go bust. Making money is an instrumental goal�it's as vital to them as breathing is for us mammals, and without pursuing it they will fail to achieve their final goal, whatever it may be. Corporations generally pursue their instrumental goals�notably maximizing revenue�as a side-effect of the pursuit of their overt goal.

capitalism and corporatism are literally the paperclip machines loathed and feared by MIRI/x-risk types. very smart people are dumping tons of money and time into researching antagonistic AI yet we're living inside a gigantic hostile superintelligence.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:46

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

it still boggles me that the paperclip poo poo wasnt started as a pop way to explain marxism

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:48

Homocow: Apr 24, 2007; Extremely bad poster!
DO NOT QUOTE!; Pillbug

lol if you talk about climate change with a competent therapist

mine just gave me a weird look and shrugged like "lol you're not wrong but I'm obligated to make you feel better so don't think about it"

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:49

Axetrain: Sep 14, 2007

ChipNDip posted:

We are already at +1C compared to preindustrial levels. Another degree or 2 is bad, but it's still speculation.

The doom and gloom poo poo is fun, but ultimately it's counterproductive in terms of actually getting people to change behaviors or push for better policy imo. If you moan that the entire world is going to boil to death unless we meet an impossible target like stopping emissions tomorrow and implementing carbon capture, it doesn't convince people to jump into action. It makes them say gently caress it and not even bother.

2c is bad enough to make western civilization very difficult to maintain. That's the most optimistic outlook, 3c and warmer is your nice comfortable suburban lifestyle getting obliterated.

we are almost certainly going over 2c :ssh:

Axetrain has issued a correction as of 03:54 on Mar 28, 2019

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:50

Axetrain: Sep 14, 2007

It's really weird to broach climate change as a subject with other people who consider themselves progressives because even they label you an alarmist. Which is true of course, I personally think we should be somewhat alarmed at our impending doom but hey that's just me.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 03:53

EvilJoven: Mar 18, 2005; NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?; Fun Shoe

News flash people who claim to be progressive but balk at giving up basically all their personal possessions save maybe a few changes of clothes a toothbrush a phone and a bicycle if thats what its going to take to save us from climate change arent progressives they're Liberal collaborators.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:04

Homeless Friend: Jul 16, 2007

Turtlicious posted:

This thread hosed me up so good, that when I talked about it with my therapist, she immediately told me how unhealthy this thinking is, and then helped me get pills so now I don't worry about the end of the world so much.

Maybe you guys should consider it as well.

E: She also told me it's super common and some therapists / psychs are calling it "Climate Anxiety" or "Eco Anxiety"

It's no problem, I'm in the donald trump tier brain category and am impervious to existential harm, it's truly a blessing

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:06

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

Axetrain posted:

It's really weird to broach climate change as a subject with other people who consider themselves progressives because even they label you an alarmist. Which is true of course, I personally think we should be somewhat alarmed at our impending doom but hey that's just me.

Specifics are where you bridge that gap. If you talk about the collapse of global civilization people cant understand that.

but if you say "that river will be dry by 2045" or "itll be 105˚F most of the days in may" people can understand that as loving up their lives

EvilJoven posted:

News flash people who claim to be progressive but balk at giving up basically all their personal possessions save maybe a few changes of clothes a toothbrush a phone and a bicycle if thats what its going to take to save us from climate change arent progressives they're Liberal collaborators.

i mean we both know that if i did all that today it would mean jack loving poo poo. hard to get people to believe in sacrifices when the solutions arent real

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:07

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

Axetrain posted:

It's really weird to broach climate change as a subject with other people who consider themselves progressives because even they label you an alarmist. Which is true of course, I personally think we should be somewhat alarmed at our impending doom but hey that's just me.

true, i tried to bring up even babby tier apocalypse news at a group gathering a few months ago and everyone looked at me like i was insane, one person even said there's no way that's true (talking about topsoil loss)

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:10

Bilirubin: Feb 16, 2014; The sanctioned action is to CHUG

Rime posted:

As someone working in the Canadian shield right now: LMfAO.

You dumb fucks don't get it, I didn't even get it. The song goes like this:

We've got rocks and trees and trees and rocks and rocks and trees and trees and rocks.

For a reason.

There's no loving dirt here. It is, in 100% actuality, trees attached directly to rocks and surrounded by an inch of this tough lichen-y humus mixed in acidic pine needles.

Sometimes you find some rare acres where dirt has occurred and agriculture is viable and there are farms. Those spots are rare, what you can grow there is limited, and the lovely soil is largely heavily contaminated by the plume from the Inco stack.

You aren't growing much of anything in the Canadian Shield, no matter how loving hot it gets. I'll take pictures, as the snow melts I become ever more confused as to why anyone lives in this utter hellscape.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fqEY1qpfr8

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:21

Homeless Friend: Jul 16, 2007

Mayor Dave posted:

true, i tried to bring up even babby tier apocalypse news at a group gathering a few months ago and everyone looked at me like i was insane, one person even said there's no way that's true (talking about topsoil loss)

https://twitter.com/chrislhayes/status/1021759145425489920

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:26

Shima Honnou: Dec 1, 2010; The Once And Future King Of Dicetroit; College Slice

Axetrain posted:

It's really weird to broach climate change as a subject with other people who consider themselves progressives because even they label you an alarmist. Which is true of course, I personally think we should be somewhat alarmed at our impending doom but hey that's just me.

One of my best friends is a doctor and her response to the ever-increasing bullshit going on in the world has been "wow that's weird huh"

Anyway my plan to cope with climate change is to start hitting the gym with one of her sisters because I'm pretty sure that if I survive the initial blast of hellishness then I'll either need to subsistence farm a plot of mostly dead scrubland, or I'll be enslaved by whatever ultracorporations as a farmer, or maybe just maybe I can join a group of muscly raiders and we can find some gasoline out there.

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:35

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# ? Apr 29, 2024 15:00

1994 Toyota Celica: Sep 11, 2008; by Nyc_Tattoo

Mayor Dave posted:

true, i tried to bring up even babby tier apocalypse news at a group gathering a few months ago and everyone looked at me like i was insane, one person even said there's no way that's true (talking about topsoil loss)

when i explained the topsoil loss thing to a friend who's more accepting of these ideas than most and gave him the ~50 years figure, his response was 'i expected that number to be a lot higher'

# ? Mar 28, 2019 04:37

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > Climate Change: hope for the biggest I told you so of all time is what fuels us

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