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Slime isn't a bad place since none of the enemies can shout, so you can just hang out within seeing distance. They wake up, walk up to you and you can slice them up with a minimum of noise. Your javelins are the answer to problematic eyes too. You can do that with the final level, clear out everything that isn't the center and then breach without worrying about eye support. Abyss is fun and cool even with a stealthless character as long as you mainly stick within areas that have a lot of walls blocking long lines of sight. Enemies will still know where you are once they're aware of you but between the regen amulet and your swoleness you can dispatch them around a corner before you get too dogpiled. And you have plenty of tp scrolls to bail though remember to do it early! Of the two other planes, Hell lets you bail back to the dungeon in exchange for periodic hell effects/suddenly appearing enemies while Pan is more consistent on threat per new area. You would likely be okay in most situations given your build; I've done a 15 rune as a Minotaur worshipping Xom with about the same skillset/resistances/armor that basically rushed in to steal runes from those two areas because I wasn't feeling confident. The only Lord I killed was Dispater..for some reason. The character is capable. =)
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Apr 7, 2019 18:33
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Sage Grimm posted:Abyss is fun and cool even with a stealthless character as long as you mainly stick within areas that have a lot of walls blocking long lines of sight. Enemies will still know where you are once they're aware of you but between the regen amulet and your swoleness you can dispatch them around a corner before you get too dogpiled. And you have plenty of tp scrolls to bail though remember to do it early! One warning: something seems to be up with rune generation in the abyss, possibly related to the changes to make it 27 levels deep? Once you make it to A:3 or deeper it shouldn't take you maybe 500 turns to get a rune generated (it's 10% change per item created at A:3) and find the vault. I dove to A:6 where it should be just about GD instant and couldn't find one so I came back out to A:3 finally. Took me 8k turns. 102076 | Depths:4 | Voluntarily entered the Abyss. 110265 | Abyss:3 | Got an abyssal rune of Zot I think I got one in 1k on one other character, the rest if I went in I didn't come out with a Rune. Haifisch also spent 4k in the abyss and close to 3k turns in A:4 without seeing a rune: 60686 | Depths:2 | Voluntarily entered the Abyss. 61948 | Abyss:4 | Found a blossoming altar of Fedhas. 64729 | Depths:2 | Escaped the Abyss 64944 | Zot:1 | Einwand: did you get the rune at some point 64944 | Zot:1 | Haifisch: no 64944 | Zot:1 | Haifisch: just got sick of abyss Let's be clear, Starcursed Masses are annoying as poo poo and spending 8k turns in the Abyss dealing with them sucks.
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Apr 7, 2019 19:04
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Sage Grimm posted:snip Araganzar posted:snip Edit: Is a +0 Trip Sword of Flaming better or worse than a +3 Lightsaber, assuming I have max Long Blades and a few enchant scrolls? Edit 2:  #minotaur_reasons girl dick energy fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Apr 7, 2019 |
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Apr 7, 2019 19:16
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PMush Perfect posted:Thanks for the advice. Sounds like I'm gonna hit Slime and see if I have the patience for getting the Abyss rune. After that, I'll consider hell. Especially since I also have a +3 For any dark side foes, a lightsaber should be approximately the best weapon in the game. For other foes, it will be competitive. Enchant it up and embrace the large shield.
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Apr 7, 2019 19:32
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Eudemon blades are pretty sweet. A Triple Sword of Flaming would probably be slightly more consistent for damage output for anywhere outside of Asmodeus and Dispater's individual suffering pits, but you absolutely would not go wrong with the eudemon blade and a shield, especially when you're going new places and might take a couple of knocks you don't expect. E: Like, if you really care about strictly optimal play, Exec Axe or Triple Sword with one of Holy, Speed, or Antimagic (all vanishingly rare, speed can't even appear on non-artifacts of those), those would be what you're looking for (outside of Wyrmbane or Finisher), but I've gotten to Zig+4 without finding any of those, so, uh, yeah. Eudemon blades are pretty sweet. Shady Amish Terror fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Apr 7, 2019 |
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Apr 7, 2019 19:38
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also I just went down to dungeon level 3 on my new guy and there was a goddamm hippogriff waiting there. What the hell. Yesterday I had a 2-headed ogre on D3. Is there some new crazy open-ended OOD rolling now? edit also ijyb with a WAND OF ACID and he's wearing chain mail I paralyzed him and hit him with an axe until he woke up and he wasn't even fazed pre:Ijyb zaps a wand. The bolt of acid hits you! Ouch! That really hurt! You are splashed with acid! The acid burns! _* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * * You take 36 damage, and have 9/45 hp. MASSIVE DAMAGE!! Araganzar fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Apr 7, 2019 |
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Apr 7, 2019 19:56
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Re: Permabuffs: maybe combine some ideas: extra MP taken is increased by some amount proportional to failure rate, until you reach some failure % threshold (say, 30%), after which you just get the buff as usual?
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Apr 7, 2019 20:24
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Good loving Christ, there's seven levels of this literally-constantly-respawning enemies poo poo?
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Apr 7, 2019 20:30
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PMush Perfect posted:Good loving Christ, there's seven levels of this literally-constantly-respawning enemies poo poo? Abyss has up to 27 levels  I had to dive to Abyss 19 to get the rune, on my most recent three runer
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Apr 7, 2019 20:33
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dive dive dive
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Apr 7, 2019 20:33
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GeneX posted:Re: Permabuffs:
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Apr 7, 2019 20:38
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Cardiovorax posted:That might be a bit too low. In my post I suggested 90% as the cutoff point, which I usually consider the point at which a spell is becomes reliably combat-castable, but I'm open to suggestions. It's really more about stopping shenanigans like Mr. D:2 Scissorhands up there than anything. Personally I feel like ~20-30 is where I start just waiting and wasting time until it succeeds, the elimination of which is the best part of permabuffs, though I usually don't combat cast since I dislike the playstyle, and your point there is very much valid
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Apr 7, 2019 20:43
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PMush Perfect posted:Good loving Christ, there's seven levels of this literally-constantly-respawning enemies poo poo? A swap to TSO is probably a no-brainer right now as Heroism is doing nothing for you. TSO's accuracy, negative protection, hp return, pets, massive shield buff, and holy explosions on the other hand would do a whole lot for you. And you could holy brand a second weapon. vvvv Oka's wrath is going to be nothing to you at this point but yeah just don't bother with the Hells then. Extended really is a slog. Araganzar fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Apr 7, 2019 |
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Apr 7, 2019 20:47
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Araganzar posted:A swap to TSO is probably a no-brainer right now as Heroism is doing nothing for you. TSO's accuracy, negative protection, hp return, pets, massive shield buff, and holy explosions on the other hand would do a whole lot for you. And you could holy brand a second weapon.
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Apr 7, 2019 20:59
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GeneX posted:Personally I feel like ~20-30 is where I start just waiting and wasting time until it succeeds, the elimination of which is the best part of permabuffs, though I usually don't combat cast since I dislike the playstyle, and your point there is very much valid
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Apr 7, 2019 21:02
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leave permabuffs how they are but also make permasummons 
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Apr 7, 2019 21:07
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permafireball, casts fireball every turn whether you want it to or not. try to avoid corridors, especially twisty ones.
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Apr 7, 2019 21:12
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Cardiovorax posted:What if spell level factored into it? Let's say instead we make it 20% base cutoff plus SL * 10% (up to a maximum of 90%) instead and leave everything else as suggested. At low levels and for weak buffs, it probably won't affect you much, but once you get in the realm of spells like Blade Hands, a minimum 70% base success chance before MP reduction kicks in seems like a fair compromise to me. I like this! I'm not proficient enough at the game to determine the best possible numbers to use, but this seems like a good way to both allow for out of combat buffs that you'd tediously apply to be permanent, without making it too easy (as it currently seems to be) to help yourself *in* combat
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Apr 7, 2019 21:19
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Permashatter. Hope you didn't like walls existing.
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Apr 7, 2019 21:20
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Moment of truth. I could literally grab the orb now and book it out, I've got Vaults, Spider, Swamp, and Slime. Abyss sounds like a chore right now, and Hell seems even moreso, but IDK if I'm throwing away something spectacular by going for a simple four rune. What do I do?
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Apr 7, 2019 21:28
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PMush Perfect posted:Moment of truth. I could literally grab the orb now and book it out, I've got Vaults, Spider, Swamp, and Slime. Abyss sounds like a chore right now, and Hell seems even moreso, but IDK if I'm throwing away something spectacular by going for a simple four rune. What do I do? I'm spectating should you want advice. I would take the orb, Oka is not really suitable for anything past abyss and abyss isn't tons of fun atm.
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Apr 7, 2019 21:41
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And got it! First non-Barachi Gooncrawl win!  (I mean, it was a MiFi, that's not a huge achievement.)
girl dick energy fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Apr 7, 2019 |
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Apr 7, 2019 21:52
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PMush Perfect posted:And got it! First non-Barachi Gooncrawl win! Still, gratz! As for Abyss...you went down to level seven? Ouch. In hindsight, I should have probably mentioned that there's no reason to dive the Megabyss further than floor four or five at the deepest. Due to apparent quirks of spawning and the fact that you'll waste more time on fighting or running away from fights on deeper floors, you'll find the rune about as quickly on three or four as you will any deeper than that, and the danger level RAPIDLY spirals out of control as you begin to be surrounded by star-cursed masses and hellcritters.
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Apr 7, 2019 22:04
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Shady Amish Terror posted:In hindsight, I should have probably mentioned that there's no reason to dive the Megabyss further than floor four or five at the deepest. Due to apparent quirks of spawning and the fact that you'll waste more time on fighting or running away from fights on deeper floors, you'll find the rune about as quickly on three or four as you will any deeper than that, and the danger level RAPIDLY spirals out of control as you begin to be surrounded by star-cursed masses and hellcritters. Araganzar posted:One warning: something seems to be up with rune generation in the abyss, possibly related to the changes to make it 27 levels deep? Once you make it to A:3 or deeper it shouldn't take you maybe 500 turns to get a rune generated (it's 10% change per item created at A:3) and find the vault. I dove to A:6 where it should be just about GD instant and couldn't find one so I came back out to A:3 finally. Took me 8k turns. 
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Apr 7, 2019 22:05
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Or you could be my lava orc fighter and just descend because you keep killing things and want an exit when things get hairy, and it appears under you each time And then spawn 5 spaces from the rune inside the runevault
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Apr 7, 2019 22:17
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I had the greatest hubris and went to abyss:12 to get the rune on my FoFi the other day after getting banished there in the middle of Vaults:5  Didn't actually die there though! Died to my own hubris LATER, in a Zig.
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Apr 7, 2019 22:48
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"I'll play a Barachi of Chei next, I need to prove that I'm not crazy and they're actually good!" Die to Menkaure and four mummies in a D4 ossuary. "Well, that's just a fluke. Let's try again. Die to a kobold with a whip of electrocution on D1.
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Apr 7, 2019 22:56
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Barachi tip: free blinking beats god wrath.
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Apr 7, 2019 23:18
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PMush Perfect posted:Die to a kobold with a whip of electrocution on D1. That whip of electrocution death, when it occurs for me, is %100 of the time because I instantly coveted that whip for my early-to-midgame weapon and expended every meager resource I had on killing that loving kobold, up to and including all of my meatpoints.
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Apr 7, 2019 23:26
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this is how the game is played
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Apr 8, 2019 04:27
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Would it be to broken just to give Tengus permaflight at start at this point. Yes, it would come with the speed and dodge boost but it's not like I I'm engaging every battle with it off as soon as its available
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Apr 8, 2019 06:39
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Just in case anyone was curious, Lear's Hauberk (and by extension any item that fails brand_ok check) will CTD if randomly generated on the level; hit that going down the stairs just now. I'm pretty "lucky" to run into it twice! Except I was playing a FD so it wouldn't really have helped.
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Apr 8, 2019 07:07
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Panic! at Nabisco posted:FDCj is I think the easiest start I've ever had in this video game?? Battlesphere with free magic darts is completely nutty, and fulminant prism remains an unbelievably strong spell What race is FD?
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Apr 8, 2019 12:20
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Faerie Dragon. Additional race proposed and coded up by someone from the Tavern, proficient caster with additional ability for -1 MP for casting spells, makes up for it by being fragile for end-game (no body slots I think?).
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Apr 8, 2019 14:25
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No body slot because of wings, yeah. They have multiple innate advantages including some built-in defenses and permanent flight, but the biggest one by far is that they cast spells for -1mp and no hunger. This means that level one spells like magical dart are free. Late-game they can start to run into trouble thanks to being small, stealth-, and having no body armor slot, but they're still one of the easiest and most powerful caster archetypes for the base run, and are by far one of the easiest races to start with. As other people have pointed out, conjurators can get a cheap hungerless battle-orb relatively early and then get it to proc over and over forever with free magic darts, which can technically carry you through an entire run nearly on its own. Faerie Dragons are...poor choices for extended, but Extended still really isn't balanced for anything but high-end blasters and blenders who can hybridize. Faerie Dragons are a pretty cool choice, and an easy way to try casting, but you'll probably feel incredibly spoiled after playing one. Shady Amish Terror fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Apr 8, 2019 |
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Apr 8, 2019 15:06
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Scaramouche posted:Just in case anyone was curious, Lear's Hauberk (and by extension any item that fails brand_ok check) will CTD if randomly generated on the level; hit that going down the stairs just now. I'm pretty "lucky" to run into it twice! Except I was playing a FD so it wouldn't really have helped. Was this the same save, or a different one (or is the version not caught up)? That should be fixed now that it doesn't have a brand that was incompatible.
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Apr 8, 2019 16:32
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Wow struggled through 8 XL levels raising Armor as a Spriggan Archaelogist and this is my prize:quote:crown of eternal torment[1/1]: +3 hat (sInv, rN+++, Curse, torment immunity). Gives -20% mhp while worn. Suggestion: don't. Existed during 0.17 development, but never made it into a release. Fixedart with -20% max hit points. This would be such a cool artefact otherwise. Major cool. But no one in their right mind is ever going to use it, even on a high HP race. edit: Actually, it takes my hits from 37 to 29. I guess they decided to make it additive just to screw -HP races even harder?
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Apr 8, 2019 17:35
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is there a way to make more text lines in the log so you don't constantly have to mash spacebar?
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Apr 8, 2019 17:48
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Floodkiller posted:Was this the same save, or a different one (or is the version not caught up)? That should be fixed now that it doesn't have a brand that was incompatible. Different save, same old version, I don't have the tool chain set up to build (I eyeballed that other debug). Sorry for the confusion, you had speculated it would crash on floorgen and was just confirming that.
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Apr 8, 2019 17:54
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Araganzar posted:But no one in their right mind is ever going to use it, even on a high HP race. I would throw that on in a heartbeat if I was doing extended on a Vine Stalker of Gozag. Torment is one of the few things that can actually threaten a well geared character and removing that makes Pan/Hell/Tomb/Zigs much more tolerable. Being able to clear Tomb 3 without spending upwards of 30000 gold in potions would be nice.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:04
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