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I'm sure this has been covered before, back when the first Pillars came out, but I feel like I missed something with the conversation with Sîdha and Rîhenwn in Twin Elms. I spoke with Aloth afterward about Awakenings, then he mentions that the delemgans said the gods weren't real. I even went back, reloaded a save prior to speaking with them, and progressed through the dialogue again. They say no such thing. Did I miss an insinuation? Is that covered in a later conversation with them? Is it cut dialogue? I've already spoiled that fact for myself, so I know it's true, but I'm confused because nobody's actually said it yet besides Aloth.
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May 5, 2019 02:11
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They say something about Burial Isle being the place where those who denied the gods were punished or some such. Given that the development of the first game was pretty hurried it's probably either something that got changed to make it less blunt to avoid tipping the final dungeon's hand too much and they forgot to change Aloth's dialogue to match, or it's something they intended to go back and make more blunt but never got around to it
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May 5, 2019 04:50
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I swear when *I* played the first time I got a dialogue line from the Delemgan where they mentioned that the gods weren't real but I never seemed to be able to get it on repeat playthroughs. I wish it was as easy to check the dialogue strings in PoE1 as it was in the sequel so I could see if the line is still there or if I just imagined it.
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May 5, 2019 08:17
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Just finished my first full playthrough with the expansion content. Beast of Winter and the Forgotten Sanctum were pretty good. Seeker Slayer Survivor kinda sucked and I'll probably be skipping it in subsequent playthroughs. I really would have preferred White March style expansion content that ties everything more closely together but meh. Wizard is a power trip at high levels. The stuff you can pull off with power-level stacking, brilliant and wall of draining (to make any temporary buff permanent) is nuts. Casting Meteor Storms with +20 to power level on an empowered cast pretty much melts anything in the game not immune to fire, including Mega-Bosses.
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May 5, 2019 16:35
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I'm planning my companions / sidekicks for a new veteran (or maybe PotD) game in version 4.1/4.2. I'd like full coverage of all single-class options so that I have access to all L8/L9 abilities. Granted, this can be done just through hiring adventurers. But, I plan to use companions/sidekicks almost all of the time, so I want them to be single-class if possible. My MC plans are undetermined. Spreadsheeting things out, I ended up with the following: Barb: Serafen, Chanter (skald): Konstanten, Cipher: Ydwin, Druid: Tekehu, Fighter: Rekke, Monk: Mirke, Paladin: Pallegina, Priest: Vatnir, Ranger: Maia, Rogue: Eder, Wizard: Aloth This leaves Xoti (Pri/Monk) and Fassina (Wiz Conjurer / Chanter) as multiclass. So my main question is, would I be making a big mistake with any of the pure class/character combos listed? Would I be way better off multiclassing them and just hiring a custom adventurer where I can control subclass if I needed L8/9 skills for some reason?
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May 5, 2019 17:53
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One thing I'd say is that Pallegina's paladin subclass is imo the worst subclass for paladin. Her special ability doesn't do enough damage to be worth the increased cost, and it replaces two better upgrades to sworn enemy. Still completely usable though. I'd also dare say that single class fighter sucks(particularly without a subclass), and fighter/rogue is usually stronger than single class of either. Otherwise, Tekehu and Maia have really good unique subclasses, and Konstantin/Aloth have arguably the best subclass respectively. I don't have strong opinions on Monk/Barb/Fighter subclasses so I'm not sure if you're missing out not having one specific subclass there.
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May 5, 2019 18:48
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I think the received wisdom is as follows: - If you're interested in raw spellcasting Wizard, Druid and Priest will generally work best as single classes. These classes can also work well in multis but you should have a specific synergy in mind (e.g. using the Wizard's buffs to give a martial class more survivability). Caster/Caster combos are generally considered to be suboptimal in terms of action economy. - Fighter and Paladin benefit a lot from multis because of extremely sub-par PL 8/9 abilities. - Monk, Barbarian, Cipher and Chanter work great as multis or singles. - Rogue will do great damage as a single class but will be very squishy. Rogue multi-classes very well with any martial class. - I have no idea about Rangers. I think Rogue works very well with them.
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May 5, 2019 18:48
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Entropy238 posted:- Fighter and Paladin benefit a lot from multis because of extremely sub-par PL 8/9 abilities. I'm torn on this for Paladin. Their capstones range from meh to straight up killing yourself. But higher power levels for FoD and Lay on Hands is pretty good, as well as more resources for their defensive abilities.
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May 5, 2019 18:56
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Rangers have a few very strong high PL abilities, but I'd still probably multi-class them... except for Arcane Archers. A single classed Arcane Archer is a loving beast. I'd also consider mutli-classing a cipher if you're playing turn-based. One of their capstone skills drains action speed, which is pretty useless in TB mode. On the other hand, if you want one to just spam Disintegrate you'll probably want to be single-classed. Below Path of the Damned difficulty though you should be fine single-classing everybody if that's the kind of party you want!
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May 5, 2019 18:57
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Digital Osmosis posted:Rangers have a few very strong high PL abilities, but I'd still probably multi-class them... except for Arcane Archers. A single classed Arcane Archer is a loving beast. Ranger has absolute garbage high PL abilities ime. I haven't played recently but did they add stuff worth a drat when they added Arcane Archer?
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May 5, 2019 19:17
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Digital Osmosis posted:Rangers have a few very strong high PL abilities, but I'd still probably multi-class them... except for Arcane Archers. A single classed Arcane Archer is a loving beast. Arcane Archer/Paladin is pretty crazy strong. Yes you lose the Death Ring ability which is very good but your accuracy is insane between all the Ranger bonuses plus the accuracy bonus to devotions of flame. And you'll hit like a truck as well. It's a pretty good combo.
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May 5, 2019 19:20
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Nasgate posted:I'm torn on this for Paladin. Their capstones range from meh to straight up killing yourself. But higher power levels for FoD and Lay on Hands is pretty good, as well as more resources for their defensive abilities. IIRC the difference for most of the game will be -2 PL, increasing to -3 PL if the single class option eventually chooses prestige at level 19/20. That's probably an effective 20-30% loss in effectiveness for Paladin abilities compared to a single class when all's said and done. The passives alone from going multi will probably either make up for or surpass that, before taking into account the additional abilities you gain.
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May 5, 2019 19:38
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Nasgate posted:One thing I'd say is that Pallegina's paladin subclass is imo the worst subclass for paladin. Her special ability doesn't do enough damage to be worth the increased cost, and it replaces two better upgrades to sworn enemy. Still completely usable though. So, single-class those due to the subclasses, except for Pallegina? I forgot her paladin subclass sucked (ran her as multiclass in my first game, which contributed to my wanting to pure class her this game). Entropy238 posted:I think the received wisdom is as follows: Hmm, maybe I should multiclass Rekke then, if everyone's saying single class fighter is really bad.
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May 5, 2019 19:41
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pmchem posted:So, single-class those due to the subclasses, except for Pallegina? I forgot her paladin subclass sucked (ran her as multiclass in my first game, which contributed to my wanting to pure class her this game). Idk I I'd say it sucks. Paladin is a strong class regardless. It's just that all the other subclasses have stronger benefits. Which is kinda disappointing because shooting fireballs with divine rage is rad. And yeah, while I don't think single class fighter is really bad, the lack of a subclass makes using single class rikke really boring ime.
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May 5, 2019 21:25
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Also, I forget: if I delay having a companion join my party, like, not asking pallegina or konstantin to join until I'm level 17, what level will they be when they do join? Also level 17? If so, that seems like a way you could essentially get "free xp" for them. Is it possible to "miss out" or "lose" any companions/sidekicks by delaying their joining (apart from very endgame after siding with a faction, of course)?
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May 6, 2019 00:17
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Nasgate posted:I'm torn on this for Paladin. Their capstones range from meh to straight up killing yourself. But higher power levels for FoD and Lay on Hands is pretty good, as well as more resources for their defensive abilities. One of the big things to consider with this is that a character's damage output is also a sort of defensive ability because faster fights require less healing. A paladin/rogue does significantly more damage than a straight paladin, enough so that it probably outweighs the impact of the extra PLs the pure paladin gets on their heals and the extra zeal for defensive abilities. That's why paladins should always be multiclassed, imo. Their capstone abilities are lackluster and the extra power levels just don't contribute enough. They're always going to be better as a multiclass, whether that's through improved damage potential with an aggressive multiclass like rogue or cipher, or through increased healing/utility through a defensive multiclass like chanter. Same is true of fighters.
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May 6, 2019 00:59
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Khizan posted:One of the big things to consider with this is that a character's damage output is also a sort of defensive ability because faster fights require less healing. A paladin/rogue does significantly more damage than a straight paladin, enough so that it probably outweighs the impact of the extra PLs the pure paladin gets on their heals and the extra zeal for defensive abilities. PL gives you a multiplicative bonus to damage, though. How much better is the additive bonus damage from Rogue than another +30% multiplicative damage and healing from +3 PL? In my tests with a mod that allowed me to completely respec characters whenever most multiclass combos ended up being fairly overrated when I played the same encounters with different setups without having to replay the entire campaign. I feel like most theorycrafting is just that, theorycrafting with very little direct comparisons.
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May 6, 2019 02:27
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KPC_Mammon posted:PL gives you a multiplicative bonus to damage, though. How much better is the additive bonus damage from Rogue than another +30% multiplicative damage and healing from +3 PL? Are you sure PL is multiplicative bonus to damage? It doesn't really feel that way... I would imagine it's the same additive stacking like might so it doesn't really mean much in the end.
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May 6, 2019 03:50
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WarpedLichen posted:Are you sure PL is multiplicative bonus to damage? It doesn't really feel that way... PL is definitely multiplicative with might, weapon bonus, sneak attack and so on. Of course, it also has the same sort of linear returns as any bonus, where each level gives you less relative gain compared to the last. That said, while I do think single class characters are probably a lot more powerful than people think, I don’t see how a single class paladin would out-damage a paladin/rogue with sneak attack, death blows, deep wounds etc. The paladin would get more powerful heals and overall more versatility, though.
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May 6, 2019 04:42
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WarpedLichen posted:Are you sure PL is multiplicative bonus to damage? It doesn't really feel that way... Absolutely, it just doesn't list it. If you look at the damage roll before modifiers it'll end up higher than you can possibly roll as pl increases. My paladin that stacked +fire pl gear ended up the highest dps character on my team and his kind wayfarer heals were completely ridiculous (those also scale with pl). I'd say he worked as my sole source of healing just from spamming flames of devotion while dual wielding but fire bats are a thing. gently caress fire bats. Hardest part of that potd runthrough. KPC_Mammon fucked around with this message at 06:16 on May 6, 2019 |
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May 6, 2019 06:13
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Looking for difficulty level advice. I started up this game last week on normal mode, have gotten quite a bit through Nekataka and have found that combat-wise I'm just letting the AI trounce everything and my eyes glaze over on the level up screen because nothing matters. I'm thinking of starting over at a higher difficulty and wondering what I should pick. I want to have to look through combat logs to see why I'm getting owned and use modals/consumables/buffs to overcome. I want to be crafty with positioning and AOEs instead of just starting every fight with an auto-attack and leaving it at that. I want to limit party AI actions to just those that I design myself to save clicks. Also I don't have much history with CRPGs besides playing PoE1 and DoS 1&2 on easy mode so I'm also probably not looking for the most absolutely hardcore experience that exists. And I want to play with the story companions, so not looking for anything that requires hiring mercs to be able to win. So.. should I play on Veteran with all content level scaled or is that still going to be too easy and I should do PoTD? Also does TB vs RTwP affect difficulty? I'm leaning RTwP just because I assume it meshes with the original system a bit better while TB probably has some weird warts even though I've heard good things.
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May 6, 2019 20:17
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Eggnogium posted:Looking for difficulty level advice. I started up this game last week on normal mode, have gotten quite a bit through Nekataka and have found that combat-wise I'm just letting the AI trounce everything and my eyes glaze over on the level up screen because nothing matters. You’re not locked into any of these choices except RTWP vs TB. I would personally recommend RTWP for a new player if you’re not one of those people that hates it since the game is really designed and balanced around it. TB is surprisingly good but it does create a few trap choices since some things don’t translate well. Plus setting companion AI feels like a mini game and it’s actually pretty fun on higher difficulties imo (though not required if you prefer micro). Also the game takes much longer with TB. I recommend starting over on veteran and just upping the difficulty/turning on scaling if you find things are too easy. You can also turn it down if you find things too difficult though it will only apply to maps you haven’t visited yet.
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May 6, 2019 20:25
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I think Path of the Damned, the highest difficulty, locks you in. On PotD you certainly have to microcontrol all your characters in every fight, at least in the first part of the game. It also rubs some people wrong because the game might throw enemies you can't handle at you. And you'll have to proceed without killing everybody you see, can you imagine that? I think Veteran is a good difficulty choice for your first walkthrough. PotD might feel a little harsh, especially when you don't know what's where.
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May 6, 2019 21:21
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I'd just jump straight into PotD, honestly. There's a few fights on the tutorial island that are complete bastards on PotD, but they're both skippable with stealth and past that it's really not too bad. The ability to address most of the game content in any order you like makes most of PotD fairly easy if you're willing to pick and choose your fights and leave certain others for later.The change that makes it much much harder to splitpull packs does mean that you'll need to run a fairly optimal party, though. It's hard to get away with jank if you're not already real solid on the systems. That aside, I'm thinking of replaying this soon to finally hit up the DLC I've never gotten to, and I'm trying to decide what to make my Watcher. Any particularly interesting Barbarian multiclasses out there?
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May 6, 2019 23:48
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Eggnogium posted:Looking for difficulty level advice. I started up this game last week on normal mode, have gotten quite a bit through Nekataka and have found that combat-wise I'm just letting the AI trounce everything and my eyes glaze over on the level up screen because nothing matters. I'm finding RTwP veteran difficulty with upward-only level scaling turned on a pretty fair challenge, while not being the punishing ordeal that seems to attract some people to PoTD. IMO enabling the upward level-scaling is key, as it keeps the game interesting. Even at max level my group can be decisively defeated if I'm not paying attention. It also allows you to run into hugely overpowered enemy if you're not careful, a reminder that as a BG-clone the game is not always fair.
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May 7, 2019 00:46
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As the designated TB stan in this thread I'd say if you find yourself letting your party be controlled by the AI, maybe consider turn based, where you have to actually decide everything and the action economy means each turn is much more meaningful than each individual click in RtWP
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May 7, 2019 01:17
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Thanks for the advice, all. I'm going to try Veteran with upward scaling first and see how that goes. Onward to several hours of character creation waffling!
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May 7, 2019 02:01
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I would just go Path of the Damned and see if you can get off the opening island. It's pretty much the hardest part of the game until you get to the DLCs but if you liked having to look at your combat log, think about tactics, use consumables, have to reload occasionally then go PotD.
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May 7, 2019 02:49
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Nocturtle posted:I'm finding RTwP veteran difficulty with upward-only level scaling turned on a pretty fair challenge, while not being the punishing ordeal that seems to attract some people to PoTD. IMO enabling the upward level-scaling is key, as it keeps the game interesting. Even at max level my group can be decisively defeated if I'm not paying attention. It also allows you to run into hugely overpowered enemy if you're not careful, a reminder that as a BG-clone the game is not always fair.
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May 7, 2019 03:10
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ilitarist posted:I think Path of the Damned, the highest difficulty, locks you in. Nah they changed this in one of the patches, around the same time they allowed Magran’s Fires on lower difficulties. And there’s no achievements tied to difficulty if you’re the type to worry about that.
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May 7, 2019 05:33
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Eggnogium posted:I want to have to look through combat logs to see why I'm getting owned and use modals/consumables/buffs to overcome. I found veteran challenging enough where I wanted to control my party manually and had to care about spell use and positioning, but rarely used modals or consumables or paid attention to armor/penetration values - this makes me think you need to play on potg for that level of challenge.
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May 7, 2019 06:24
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I played through the first island on Veteran last night and am going to try turning it up to PoTD. It was definitely a lot better than normal and I had to reload once on the mini dragon in the excavation pit and gorrechi street fight, but still looking to bash my head against the wall a little harder I think.
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May 7, 2019 16:15
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PoDT is a lot about armor penetration, so read up on that, find all the ways to mitigate or avoid under-penetration (wizard debuffs, weapon modals), grit your teeth through the first island, and have a blast. It sounds like that's what you're looking for... and of course there are the god's challenges if you want to push it harder on a second playthrough.
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May 7, 2019 17:36
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I know I asked a while ago but i still wanted to give a belated thanks to people who suggested op builds for my friend to blitz through the game. She blitzed her way through and is grateful for the advice! She enjoyed it much more without having to think about the efficacy of her build choices.
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May 7, 2019 20:21
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Huh I somehow missed this before but it turns out Obsidian have confirmed there will be a patch out within the next week or so. EDIT: Most people are speculating either Wednesday, because anniversary of launch, or Thursday, because most patches have been released on Thursday. Chairchucker fucked around with this message at 05:13 on May 8, 2019 |
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May 8, 2019 05:07
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Chairchucker posted:Huh I somehow missed this before but it turns out Obsidian have confirmed there will be a patch out within the next week or so. They've said it's this week and yeah, today looks like a good candidate due to the anniversary date and the fact that they recently seem to have filmed a new update video.
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May 8, 2019 08:56
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https://twitter.com/WorldofEternity/status/1126157311049756674
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May 8, 2019 17:15
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whaaaaaaaaaat? 5.0 with no public beta??? Someone link the release notes! Get hype!
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May 8, 2019 17:22
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Any patch-notes out yet? Can someone copy/paste them here; I can't surf too many sites at work because filters.
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May 8, 2019 17:31
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Honestly don't think I've ever been more excited for a patch. Can't wait to see the TBM changes they've made.
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