|
none of that sounds literally anythng like what i would want barkley 2 to be
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:11 |
|
|
# ? Apr 27, 2024 12:19 |
|
This is all so heartbreakingly familiar and has so many of the red flags I've learned to identify in projects: 1) "when everything was implemented according to design it would all come together." I refer to this style of development as building from the outside in. It's what tends to happen when people just work on the things they find fun or interesting and assume loosely stringing them together makes a game. It never works and the result always feels unfinished. 2) "Suggesting we keep things simple was ignored" A common pitfall new developers fall into. Some designers think not breaking new ground on every single feature reflects negatively on their ability, so you end up with a lot of games that needlessly reinvent the wheel and waste resources that could be better used elsewhere. 3) "Everyone had different ideas of what combat should be" this is probably the most damaging one. I've worked on teams where everyone had wildly different perspectives of what they wanted to the point that compromise was impossible. In my experience this is usually due to 1) poor leadership and 2) hiring team members whose personalities don't mix This is mostly conjecture so I'm sure it might not 100% be the case. But either way I super appreciate you giving your perspective and I'm glad you got out.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:11 |
|
quote:For example, one legit funny joke was your Party. You only ever played as Hoopz, but on your equipment menu there were four party members. You could always see them in your menu but never in game. As I recall it, at the literal final second of the game the other 3 party members would appear out of Hoopz like in a Final Fantasy game and say "Wow, we did it!" "Hell yeah!". Kind of funny actually, but, it’s just one small joke. It would make sense, then, from a return on investment standpoint, to not actually implement your party as characters with actual stats and equipment that actually level up alongside you, available with actual status menus. But B2 ideas sometimes made very little sense. There was a serious idea that these characters should do all that so you could see them progressing as if they were with you. Explaining the effort needed to make this particular dream come true was met with That's The Joke. couldn't you have just had their equipment and stats randomly generate every time you open the menu, like just spit out a few random three digit numbers and some generic gun/armor names
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:13 |
|
Bisse posted:For example, one legit funny joke was your Party. You only ever played as Hoopz, but on your equipment menu there were four party members. You could always see them in your menu but never in game. As I recall it, at the literal final second of the game the other 3 party members would appear out of Hoopz like in a Final Fantasy game and say "Wow, we did it!" "Hell yeah!". Kind of funny actually, but, it’s just one small joke. It would make sense, then, from a return on investment standpoint, to not actually implement your party as characters with actual stats and equipment that actually level up alongside you, available with actual status menus. But B2 ideas sometimes made very little sense. There was a serious idea that these characters should do all that so you could see them progressing as if they were with you. Explaining the effort needed to make this particular dream come true was met with That's The Joke. Thankfully this feature was cut before any serious time was spent on it. Not all similar features were cut.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:23 |
|
Bisse posted:That's why the game had at one point eight damage types and a complex elemental resistance system that never really worked well in practice meaning mostly you just considered normal damage and ignored the rest. Some systems were made way too complicated for any player to ever understand This reminds me of when Killing Floor 2 pulled this kind of poo poo where different gun types dealt different damage to each different enemy and there was a collective groan over such a stupid idea. There was a graph for every mob, but you can't really tailor your choice to match which type of enemies you were facing since you faced all of them at once, so you just picked the gun you wanted anyway and never interacted with the system. Presumably in an RPG there's some tailoring available, like all the poison monsters in the sewer zone are weak to psychic attacks, but if I were to get a Jalapeno Shotgun's of the DC Cinematic Universe that I really liked there's a good chance I use it because you can't always know or predict the resistances you're going to face and it's easier to not care as long as things die. Bisse posted:In an attempt to make the game challenging, then, you have limited bullets and when I left in 2017 there was still no way to refill bullets without returning to the save point. So the challenge was resource management. Since there was no way we could ever add weak melee attacks you could use if you run out of bullets because This Is A Game About Guns, meaning if you run out youre actually out of ways to attacks, it made balancing the game really, really awkward. Loads and loads of time was spent on guns balancing to make this work. Attrition is only fun as long as you never run out of resources but always feel like you might, which is a hard rope to balance on and i feel the solution is self evident for a small team that's out of time. If gameplay ever grinds to a complete stop because you're out of the resources that let you play the game the sour taste you get strongly taints any fun you were having. Dark Souls series' attrition is health which at least has the courtesy of killing you.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:58 |
|
Endorph posted:couldn't you have just had their equipment and stats randomly generate every time you open the menu, like just spit out a few random three digit numbers and some generic gun/armor names Bisse fucked around with this message at 10:44 on Jun 3, 2019 |
# ? Jun 3, 2019 09:58 |
|
its a shame that bhroom guy seems totally deluded he doesnt sound like a bad dude but i totally recognise the "i cannot admit this failed, because that would be failing and i wont fail you" thing long after the project has failed e: i think he might have editted the bit i was talking about in the KS update from "give me a chance" which is hilarious to "Once again. I’m going to work hard to make this right and make this game." which is insane but maybe im confusing it with a different post
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 10:45 |
|
the one thing i do think is genuinely shady from bhroom is how clearly hes hiding how far the game is from completion on twitter, from the sounds of things its not anywhere near completion and when people ask "how far is this from completion" he basically dodges the question and says there has been lots of content added that he can post a KS update of thats the part where he goes from deluded perseverence and optimism to trying to delude others imo he says people should get a demo, when people ask for the PAX demo he says thats not reflective of the game as it is now so we can't have that, but first they need to "clean up" the code. so i.e. there will be no demo. apparently they need money to do this, he's looking at taking out loans. why? frankly nobody wants a broken game made by people who arent funny. it seems obvious he's genuinely trying to finish it but thats just psychotic at this point, its dead and if bhroom and a skeleton crew could finish it it wouldnt be what people want. if it was just GZ saying the game is dead thats one thing, but now all the devs anyone cares about (apart from chef who is still hiding) say its dead, apart from one ideas guy running the twitter. bhroom is constantly posting "if the game dies" "if the game is dead" he'll do x its dead, mate, just stop
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 11:02 |
|
This thread reminds me of when I was moving out of my parents house and found my old tamagotchi ripoff thing from years before. It had died, starved and lonely, in a wretched pile of its own feces
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 11:21 |
|
Convex posted:This thread reminds me of when I was moving out of my parents house and found my old tamagotchi ripoff thing from years before. It had died, starved and lonely, in a wretched pile of its own feces
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 11:55 |
|
Patware posted:hmm... Dark Draker's Booty Shakers make you clap 7 times before you hit the ground
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:13 |
|
I’m trying to compile the greatest game for true doom murderheads but my scripting is dummy thicc and is bloating the code
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:18 |
|
barkley 1: a funny joke about a incoherent rpgmaker game congealed by the collective gestalt of insane early internet fandoms, captures the zeitgeist of the bottom 90% of 2000 era amateur fandom game dev barkley 2: an actual example of a vaporware game kickstarted by the ironic-not-ironic gestalt of a cult fandom of a niche indie title, captures the zeitgeist of the bottom 90% of 2010 era amateur fandom game dev
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:20 |
|
also lmao Tiler Kiwi from 2015 posted:i wanted a story of internal breakdown and financial ruin you dull rear end in a top hat Tiler Kiwi fucked around with this message at 12:34 on Jun 3, 2019 |
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:21 |
|
mycot posted:Times like these I am very glad to have made a Something Awful account.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:25 |
|
Nice lesson for amateur devs: With a Kickstarter you don't want to be the one they catch holding the empty bag. If someone leaves you the bag and falls off the grid, you pass it on to the next guy or drop it and run.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:36 |
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1v6nlIvmr_U
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:41 |
|
Mr. Lobe posted:I hope chef can go back to making cool weirdass internet content more openly now that the beans are spilled I dunno the guy just ghosted his dev team, leaving them with a massive mess to deal with. That's a pretty huge dick move to come back from. At least it seems like he didn't steal any funds from the project when he did so.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:49 |
|
IShallRiseAgain posted:I dunno the guy just ghosted his dev team, leaving them with a massive mess to deal with. That's a pretty huge dick move to come back from. At least it seems like he didn't steal any funds from the project when he did so. I thought he bailed because it was mismanaged and going nowhere and had no money at that point. It's not abundantly clear to what extent him leaving was a cause, and to what extent it was an effect of the project failing. Anyway as a content hog I am prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt unless it becomes clear he was a bad actor here
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 12:55 |
|
mystical greetings semper games
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:03 |
|
FREE THE GAMES
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:04 |
|
Bisse posted:okay loving these save point quotes for barkley 3
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:36 |
|
Hopefully chef comes and let's us know what his side of things is at some point rather than just self imposed exile forever
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:36 |
|
make banksy 2 into an incoherent community chain game
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:38 |
|
@cboyardee: man, we're not even mad we just want funny dev stories
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:44 |
|
MMF Freeway posted:@cboyardee: man, we're not even mad we just want funny dev stories im kinda sad but i knew in my heart this game wasn't gonna happen a few years ago but yea this, more of this
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:47 |
|
Why does my favorite thread that gets 3-5 posts per week have 385 posts in 3 days? My first conclusion wasn't that the game was done. I figured it was some weird thread invasion or a mod probating people for shitposting about barkley.Hentai Jihadist posted:Hopefully chef comes and let's us know what his side of things is at some point rather than just self imposed exile forever I'm sure no one who worked on b2 is happy about the state of things, because everyone put in tons of time and it was a project that would have had, at a minimum, mild success upon completion. Khorne fucked around with this message at 13:52 on Jun 3, 2019 |
# ? Jun 3, 2019 13:50 |
|
In honor of this dead game:
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 14:10 |
|
Khorne posted:
yeah, but thats cause it was the only sign of ANY of the devs for years at that point, now he may as well come get his say or he's just gonna have to keep up the nothing for the rest of his life lol im sad that B2 is dead in this way, but I'm not mad at anybody. and since i've been starved of barkley content for 7 years its nice to finally have something
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 14:33 |
|
that would be kind of amazing if someone made barkley 3 in rpgmaker and its all just quotes from the dev of barkley 2
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 14:38 |
|
also sorry to all the devs who lost literal years of their lives to a failed project, but the Content is amazing
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 14:38 |
|
Yeah, you know how Leisure Suit Larry 4 never existed, but the series treats it like it did? That's gonna be Barkley 2. Barkley 3 is gonna be made using some of the scrapped content and, God willing, the sprites, but it needs to have callbacks and flashbacks to the never-created Chapter 2 of the Hoopz Barkley SaGa.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 14:44 |
|
Mad Wack posted:that would be kind of amazing if someone made barkley 3 in rpgmaker and its all just quotes from the dev of barkley 2 How does the rights for something like this work? Could the original devs just make a gamemaker Barkley 3 without any middlemen without getting sued?
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:02 |
|
im going to hire all the barkley 2 devs to smash out a game in a month and claim its a spiritual successor despite being just a basketball themed chrono cross remake full of stolen assets they'll be paid in exposure and percentages
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:03 |
|
apparently CBoyardee hasn't completely disappeared - he had a writing credit on Katana Zero
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:04 |
|
The Save Station Menu Lazrool had Dark Drakers to sour his B2 dev life, I had the Save Station Menu. The Save Station Menu is just a menu. It allows you to save but also is where you check equipment, refresh stats, level up, fuse gun's, etc. Nothing really extraordinary about it. What is extraordinary is that it was trash binned and recreated from scratch five times. The first version was an incomplete prototype. Then it was time to add remaining functionality. When we looked at it there was fierce team discussions about its design. Some including me saw potential to make it more user friendly, others wanted to just stick to the original design since it worked and was there. To be honest if you asked me today I would definitely just have kept what was there. Anyway we came up with new ideas and someone made a second version. This one was a bit buggy and also never quite made it past the prototype stage. But it felt like an improvement. We tackled other more important things and left it to be continued later. Then one day we open the project and suddenly there is a new Save Station Menu in there, looking similar to the original design but obviously a third new version. Some quite reasonable questions were asked: Who made this and why? Why in the original design? Who took the decision to remove the previous one? Why wasn't the team told? The answer was someone in ToG inner circle had asked someone, I think GZ but am not sure, to remake it according to the original design without informing anyone. The whole thing was just strange. Aaanyway years passed and the game changed and the menu needed a do-over again, we had the same user interface discussions again, and landed on something which I hunkered down in my code cave and built. There are two screenshots of Version 4 in this update: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/talesofgames/barkley-2-an-rpg-sequel-to-barkley-shut-up-and-jam/posts/1335376 To be honest I quite loved this. Also I made this during a time I was out of country with just a macbook and GM:S needs windows, so I bought a new Windows laptop specifically for building this during a time I could otherwise have enjoyed seeing the country. Then came a personal hiatus due to stress, few months later I shaped up and decided to get back in gear, I open the project, check out the menu and. Lo and behold. There is a new menu again, a version 5. In the original design. Of course no one had bothered to inform me. And that moment soured me on B2. Bisse fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Jun 3, 2019 |
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:21 |
|
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:37 |
|
RPG with guns is a sound concept but it’s kind of weird that it would have been a Barkley game. When I think of Barkley gameplay, I think “poo poo.” And then I think b-ball based combat.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:38 |
|
Khorne posted:Why does my favorite thread that gets 3-5 posts per week have 385 posts in 3 days? My first conclusion wasn't that the game was done. I figured it was some weird thread invasion or a mod probating people for shitposting about barkley. Same, my assumption was "maybe it has been months since I clicked on this. Time functions differently in that thread."
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:40 |
|
|
# ? Apr 27, 2024 12:19 |
|
Butt Ghost posted:RPG with guns is a sound concept but it’s kind of weird that it would have been a Barkley game. When I think of Barkley gameplay, I think “poo poo.” And then I think b-ball based combat. hoopz used gun's.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2019 15:42 |