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jisforjosh posted:Going to disagree hard here. The last season of GoT hit the notes me and my friends wanted it to hit but goddamn did it stumble over itself getting there in an unearned rush. That's what I said though.... I didn't disagree that the show was a rushed mess. What I said was that half the criticism is people pissy that so and so didn't do something. The actual complaints (of which there are many many valid ones) obscured by sour grapes. I feel like it's partially why Chernobyl became such a hit. Following GOT season 8, people were dying for something that was well-done and made sense.
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Jul 19, 2019 17:37
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I had zero investment in the series from about season 4 onwards so I did not care if a character did a thing or not. But season 7 really was just so badly written it beggars belief.
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Jul 19, 2019 17:49
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Yeah, the final two seasons of GoT are objectively bad writing...
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Jul 19, 2019 19:02
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GoT fans were some of the most loyal and dedicated fans out there during the run of the show and they were always willing to be really forgiving with it. So that tells you just how badly they hosed up with the last two seasons, even the most die hard fans don't attempt to defend that poo poo.
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Jul 19, 2019 19:58
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I don't know what possessed me to look up the Chernobyl tag on tumblr but uhh, enjoy some Dyatlov fanart:
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Jul 20, 2019 05:20
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i assume that text translates as m'graphite
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Jul 20, 2019 08:08
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Lester Shy posted:I don't know what possessed me to look up the Chernobyl tag on tumblr but uhh, enjoy some Dyatlov fanart: not great, but not terrible
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Jul 20, 2019 10:40
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webmeister posted:i assume that text translates as m'graphite It very roughly translates to something along the lines of "I don't give a gently caress."
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Jul 20, 2019 16:43
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Ah, slavs and their use of хуй. The possibilities are endless. Вiчная хуй'ять, if you will.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:32
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Comrade Koba posted:Their counter-trolling was pretty nice: We could totally crush you if NATO weren't around! Your defense minister wears a skirt! Girls can't run armies! Also we beat you in hockey that one time! ... This is some bad conservative standup poo poo.
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Jul 21, 2019 00:58
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I finally got around to watching Chernobyl the other week on VOD. I was too pissed off at Game of Thrones making GBS threads itself to death to watch it live. Ironically though I was getting over a bout of norovirus when I put it on to help pass the time. Suffice to say watching a miniseries where the first episode consists of a lot of people becoming violently ill and vomiting didn't sit well with me for some reason  I came back to it a few days after that when my stomach was more stable and holy poo poo this was a good block of TV. If Game of Thrones steals all its Emmys this year I'm gonna be pissed all over again.
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Jul 21, 2019 08:56
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Lester Shy posted:I don't know what possessed me to look up the Chernobyl tag on tumblr but uhh, enjoy some Dyatlov fanart: This, at last, is the gift of Chernobyl.
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Jul 21, 2019 09:31
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nine-gear crow posted:I came back to it a few days after that when my stomach was more stable and holy poo poo this was a good block of TV. If Game of Thrones steals all its Emmys this year I'm gonna be pissed all over again. It can't, they're in different categories. Instead, Chernobyl will lose every category to *checks notes* Escape from Dannemora
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Jul 21, 2019 13:33
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Pook Good Mook posted:GOT has the same problem as The Last Jedi. I'm convinced that a huge amount of the criticism is that things didn't happen the way I want, and it's poo poo. At the same time, there is a legit criticism to be found, but it's lost in the fanfic salty grapes. In other words, both had problems, but the criticism is hard to take seriously because a lot of the extremely online folks are unhappy about plot points. I have definitely not always online gen Xers at work discussing what went wrong Yeah there's some dumb online criticisms but idk about it being a huge amount of the total. It was just bad. Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Jul 21, 2019 |
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Jul 21, 2019 17:48
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thatbastardken posted:there's a bunch of maths i don't understand but the layman's answer to that seems to be building small but deep reservoirs - better for storing power because you use the height differential instead of raw mass of water. Dams have a higher death count than Nuclear plants. 200,000 in one failure. Nuclear, even considering Chernobyl, has the lowest death per kwh. Its also worth noting things showed in the series like The Bridge of Death are largely based on hearsay and rumor, even people from Pripyat who experienced Chernobyl are skeptical it happened. We also know of people who were at that bridge who are still alive. Also, the numbers at the end for death toll are largely based on estimations due to increases in cancer, however while thyroid cancer has increased, most of it is largely easily treatable cancers, so it may never be truly known how many will actually die from Chernobyl, or will just suffer cancers and live on, however, the primary candidate for increases in thyroid cancer, iodine-131, has a half-life of about a week, so its victims were mostly breastfeeding children. My favorite part of the series: Surprise survivors. Chernobyl's own Hodor, Aleksandr Yuvchenko, the man who held open the door to the reactor core for the doomed interns, survived. His luck? Being sent to a different hospital. He received multiple full blood transfusions and skin grafts over 1 year, and suffered from blisters related to his exposure from opening and holding the door. He received more than 4.1 sv (439.4 Roentgens). He finally passed away in 2008 at 44. quote:Even as his three colleagues staggered back into the corridor in shock, Yuvchenko wanted to have a look for himself. But Perevozchenko, a veteran of the nuclear submarine fleet, who knew very well what had just happened, shoved the younger man aside. The door slammed shut. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Jul 22, 2019 |
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Jul 22, 2019 11:38
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CommieGIR posted:Dams have a higher death count than Nuclear plants. 200,000 in one failure. Perfect username/post combo. 
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Jul 22, 2019 18:27
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CommieGIR posted:Chernobyl's own Hodor, Aleksandr Yuvchenko, the man who held open the door to the reactor core for the doomed interns, survived.He finally passed away in 2008 at 44. Survived huh
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Jul 23, 2019 09:56
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kaesarsosei posted:Survived huh Everyone else died within the next two weeks that was in the section he was in.
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Jul 23, 2019 12:13
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44?
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Jul 23, 2019 12:23
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I think this, as has been discussed here and elsewhere, is why the true cost of Chernobyl will never be known and why some people estimate that up to 100k people's lives were shortened by it. I strongly suspect Yuvchenko would have been disappointed at only hitting 44 (although he wouldn't have complained too much when comparing to his colleagues) and I wonder what his health was like the whole time? The Soviet headline figures of 36 people dieing within a month of ARS is probably correct but of course they wouldn't release the long-term numbers.
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Jul 23, 2019 13:27
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kaesarsosei posted:I think this, as has been discussed here and elsewhere, is why the true cost of Chernobyl will never be known and why some people estimate that up to 100k people's lives were shortened by it. I strongly suspect Yuvchenko would have been disappointed at only hitting 44 (although he wouldn't have complained too much when comparing to his colleagues) and I wonder what his health was like the whole time? Disappointed, sure. But I suspect he's still happier having lived to 44 than died at 20 something.
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Jul 23, 2019 14:20
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CommieGIR posted:Disappointed, sure. But I suspect he's still happier having lived to 44 than died at 20 something. ....sure. That's not the point. It's calling him a survivor when it very likely killed him in the end is what people are posting about.
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Jul 23, 2019 14:25
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CainFortea posted:....sure. That's not the point. It's calling him a survivor when it very likely killed him in the end is what people are posting about. Okay, what's the word for someone that survives a traumatic disaster and outlives everyone else who also experiences said traumatic disaster? quote:sur·vi·vor Let me know you have a better word I should use.
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Jul 23, 2019 15:37
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CommieGIR posted:Okay, what's the word for someone that survives a traumatic disaster and outlives everyone else who also experiences said traumatic disaster? Well, the word you're looking for is Victim. But that wouldn't fit in the post you made so I guess I just wouldn't have called him a survivor. Since, you know, he didn't. Actually by that definition, everyone survived Chernobyl except Valery Khodemchuk.
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Jul 23, 2019 15:42
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CainFortea posted:Well, the word you're looking for is Victim. There were those firefighters that went onto the roof who died at the scene too.
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Jul 23, 2019 15:43
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CainFortea posted:Well, the word you're looking for is Victim. Okay, this is getting really petty: Victims can be Survivors. These are not exclusive terms here. A Victim of a Disaster can Survive a Disaster, versus a Victim who does not survive (i.e. the Firefighters and other Chernobyl plant workers). He was a Victim who Survived the disaster. Unless your implication is I'm trying to be an apologist for Soviet Era RBMK reactors, which I am not. 20 years after the disaster, while the lingering effects were likely the result of his eventual death, does not suddenly change whether he survived the immediate disaster, which he did, and which is what I was talking about. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 16:03 on Jul 23, 2019 |
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Jul 23, 2019 16:00
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CommieGIR posted:He was a Victim who Survived the disaster. Unless your implication is I'm trying to be an apologist for Soviet Era RBMK reactors, which I am not. He didn't survive it. Also yes that bit in your post was entirely apologistic. CainFortea fucked around with this message at 16:06 on Jul 23, 2019 |
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Jul 23, 2019 16:04
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CommieGIR posted:Okay, this is getting really petty: Victims can be Survivors. These are not exclusive terms here. A Victim of a Disaster can Survive a Disaster, versus a Victim who does not survive (i.e. the Firefighters and other Chernobyl plant workers). The pettiness is where you draw the line at survive. When you're talking about a disaster that can take a decade or two to kill you, how do you measure survival? How do you identify that the disaster caused the death and not something else that occurred since the disaster? The answer is probabilistic past a certain point, and I doubt it would be very satisfying to either side.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:05
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Warmachine posted:The pettiness is where you draw the line at survive. When you're talking about a disaster that can take a decade or two to kill you, how do you measure survival? How do you identify that the disaster caused the death and not something else that occurred since the disaster? You measure it in surviving everyone else who died less than two weeks after the incident. He survived the immediate incident. I never, ever, EVER claimed that Chernobyl wasn't the result of his eventual death. CainFortea posted:He didn't survive it. Also yes that bit in your post was entirely apologistic. No it wasn't, and you really are just being petty.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:08
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CommieGIR posted:You measure it in surviving everyone else who died less than two weeks after the incident. He survived the immediate incident. I never, ever, EVER claimed that Chernobyl wasn't the result of his eventual death. You're the one drawing a line in the sand on some arbitrary time frame for those who survive and those who don't to fit your narrative. Speaking of petty.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:10
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CainFortea posted:You're the one drawing a line in the sand on some arbitrary time frame for those who survive and those who don't to fit your narrative. Speaking of petty. Quote it. Demonstrate that my post was about disconnecting his death from Chernobyl. In fact, I'll do it for you: CommieGIR posted:My favorite part of the series: Surprise survivors. The post was specifically about my surprise that he survived the immediate incident. Nowhere here did I disconnect his eventual death from Chernobyl, nor did I downplay the effects. Nobody else in that area survived more than two weeks. He survived them. He survived longer than anyone expected he should. That was the only point of that post. In fact, I even highlight that it was connect by saying he "Finally" passed away in 2008. That implies it was related to the incident.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:14
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CommieGIR posted:
Yes, he FINALLY passed away in 2008, he's so lucky! Look, a normal person would have just gone "I didn't mean it didn't kill him like my post sounded, I just mean he managed to live a lot longer due to the extra efforts at this other hospital" Instead of trying to arbitrarily redefine the word "survive" to mean only 2 weeks (while also using 2 weeks to define "immediate" for some reason) But carry on, comrade!
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Jul 23, 2019 16:27
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CainFortea posted:Look, a normal person would have just gone "I didn't mean it didn't kill him like my post sounded, I just mean he managed to live a lot longer due to the extra efforts at this other hospital" .....how is that not what it says? Good job reading more into than was actually there I guess.  CainFortea posted:But carry on, comrade!
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Jul 23, 2019 16:29
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CommieGIR posted:Quote it. Demonstrate that my post was about disconnecting his death from Chernobyl. I'm frustrated that I can't find a cause of death via cursory Google search. CainFortea posted:Yes, he FINALLY passed away in 2008, he's so lucky! If you're trying to call him a tankie for claiming that a dude survived getting a megadose of radiation, just say it. I really don't want to type up a post explaining that neither of you can claim he survived or didn't because you don't have a cause of death and don't have the data to calculate the probability that what he "passed away" from was caused by the disaster.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:29
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Warmachine posted:If you're trying to call him a tankie for claiming that a dude survived getting a megadose of radiation, just say it. I don't know what that is. I'm saying duder up there seems to be all in on how it wasn't as bad as it was and is trying to set that as the tone.
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Jul 23, 2019 16:31
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Warmachine posted:If you're trying to call him a tankie for claiming that a dude survived getting a megadose of radiation, just say it. I really don't want to type up a post explaining that neither of you can claim he survived or didn't because you don't have a cause of death and don't have the data to calculate the probability that what he "passed away" from was caused by the disaster. He had to get multiple skin grafts, yearly if I recall, due to the exposure, so its highly likely his passing away was a direct effect of the radiation dosage. Yeah, I can't find an official cause of death either, but it seems incredibly unlikely that a man suffering from radiation related blisters every year of his life didn't die of a related symptom of the dosage. CainFortea posted:I don't know what that is. I'm saying duder up there seems to be all in on how it wasn't as bad as it was and is trying to set that as the tone. That isn't even remotely what I claimed, I even specified the dosage which is a massive dose. Its why I was highlighting that I was surprised at his outcome, because he should've died for all intents and purposes. I did find a quote from Midnight in Chernobyl that supposedly mentions Alexander's death quote:Per Adam Higginbotham in Midnight in Chernobyl Can't find a cause of death, but its safe to say "Radiation Exposure Related Issues" is pretty high on the list of possibilities. Leukemia maybe? CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jul 23, 2019 |
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Jul 23, 2019 16:32
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It's not the coal mine that kills you: it's the black lung. Check. Mate. 
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Jul 24, 2019 00:22
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:It's not the coal mine that kills you: it's the black lung. Check. Mate. Nah, that's just a long illness.
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Jul 24, 2019 00:34
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Just catching up now with the show, just finished episode 4. Read through some but not all of the thread at this point, so surely these topics have been discussed to death but whatever.SlowBloke posted:I concour that going native accent is best, having a forced russian accent would have make a serious subject farsical. My whole family lived through Chernobyl, though I too was less then 20 days old at the time. As soon as the news got out, my grandfather went to camp out for plane tickets out of Kiev and managed to snag some just before the ticket desk closed at like 2 am or something. It was pretty nuts. Most people couldn't and didn't go anywhere, and in retrospect there was probably no real danger, but at the time, who the gently caress knows. I'll ask my parents more the next time I see them. Shimrra Jamaane posted:400 Rubles wow big spenders. I'm too young to remember the prices off the top of my head, but based on a quick search, a car would cost 5-10k in the mid 80s, so you'd need to survive for at least 10 years to buy this beauty with your bonus:  bobfather posted:Loved the "show, don’t tell" with the announcement during the evacuation. Other HBO shows could take advantage of this device! Unless this is addressed in the finale, it seemed off to my layman rear end too, like there's no way a steam explosion with, what, 7 tons of water will clear out 30 km. In general it seems that a lot of possible effects were also exaggerated by her and Legasov, like that tens of thousands would die in the cleanup, etc. As has been said, they really did a great job recreating 80s USSR. The village at the beginning of E4 looks like any shithole village would back then (and now lol), and even this map bag that's on screen for like 3 seconds is exactly what they'd have at the time. It instantly stood out because I still have my father's bag, though a slightly different, DDR-made one.   Granted, you can easily buy most of that crap because there's a ton of it around https://www.ebay.com/itm/Soviet-Russian-Army-Military-Officer-Leather-Map-Bag-Case-Tablet-Planshet-USSR-/302133199460 The rest of the episode... yeah. Apparently vets (as in animal doctors, not Afghanistan veterans, though it surely applies to them too) have significantly above-average suicide rates. I can see these poor fucks not doing any better. E: precision posted:Noooooo not the kitties NOOOOOOOO 
mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Jul 27, 2019 |
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Jul 27, 2019 00:10
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) so I'm curious to see her reaction to the miniseries.
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Speaking of eBay, you can buy a supposedly authentic liquidator badge for about $20 shipped. There were hundreds of thousands of liquidators, so I guess they're not too rare, but I was surprised a genuine historical artifact can be had for so little.
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Jul 27, 2019 00:22
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