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NoNotTheMindProbe posted:I tried to get into AoW3 a couple times but always bounced off it, whereas AoW:P as drawn me right in. I think the main factors is that the sector based strategic map is a huge improvement over the more granular pure hex map of the previous game and I find the more ranged and cover focused tactical side is more engaging this time around. This is basically my reaction too. Puzzling over which sectors to colonize and which to exploit is more fun from what I remember the AOW 3 strategic map being. Also, the sector system itself and the rule against colonizing a sector adjacent to another colony keeps city spam from becoming an issue without arbitrary systems like Civ V happiness.
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Aug 13, 2019 17:00
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Synastren posted:If all you care about is yield, zoom out more. Sure but that doesn't actually list the terrain types for planning out society research or buildings. TheDeadlyShoe posted:iirc How about seared? broiled? toasted?
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Aug 13, 2019 17:17
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Seared is -1 cooking time, 2x effect from seasoning. Broiled is +2 to chef cooking skill, but doesn't work on heavy targets. Toasted adds +1 armor but -2 resistance to spreadables.
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Aug 13, 2019 17:28
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Conot posted:If you examine a character whose received that status effect, it should be in the list on the left hand and show you the effect? That works, but it would be nice to be able to know what a status effect does before I get hit with it. A lot of abilities just say 'inflicts x with y strength' or whatever, without telling you what x actually does.
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Aug 13, 2019 17:43
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Boksi posted:That works, but it would be nice to be able to know what a status effect does before I get hit with it. A lot of abilities just say 'inflicts x with y strength' or whatever, without telling you what x actually does. You can search up the status effects in encyclopedia. But yeah I wish the tool tips were better.
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Aug 13, 2019 17:50
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Kanos posted:Silver-colored dungeons tend to be feasible with a midgame stack provided you examine what you're fighting to make sure you're not getting countered by mods/the location gimmick. Gold-colored dungeons are nightmare hellpits that you're probably not going to cut through without a burly endgame stack, which makes them real hard to gain access to. One thing to note is that damage to dungeon stacks persists, so if you have a bunch of questionably useful and cheap units (Xenoplague!), you can just have them suicide the dungeon to soften it up for later.
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Aug 13, 2019 18:12
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So I finished the first Amazon campaign mission and I am not quite getting the thrust of the Celestian secret tech. Do I just want to make every unit count as enlightened by slapping mods on them? It looks like there's a few good healing techs for Celestians but...hmm... On the other hand I like how the territorial hazard they can inflict on a zone is a meteor that makes everyone in a sector tranquil and happy and unproductive, haha.
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Aug 13, 2019 19:25
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I知 only halfway through my first non campaign game, downed 1 AI so far, but the balance of tier 1 and tier 2 units feels flipped compared to AOW3? My tier 1 hunters and shrikes are largely more damaging than tier 2 units, using the mod that lets them melt armor, despite costing less than half as much energy and production. dunno if this is only my faction or I知 missing something but it feels like spamming tier 1 units gets twice the power for the same energy and production as tier 2s. I知 about to get tier 2 flyers and question if I値l even be replacing shrikes with them for the cost. Probably the melee dino rider suddenly becomes much more important against enemies with shield instead of these volus that only use armor I can melt.
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Aug 13, 2019 19:40
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Speedball posted:So I finished the first Amazon campaign mission and I am not quite getting the thrust of the Celestian secret tech. Do I just want to make every unit count as enlightened by slapping mods on them? It looks like there's a few good healing techs for Celestians but...hmm... Celestian is a weird secret tech and one I honestly have a hard time finding a good match for. The Tenets of Tranquility mod that provides stagger resistance is great on Kir'ko Frenzied and Lightbringers, but what Celestian really lacks is offensive firepower. Lightbringers are strong as death early game, especially for Kir'ko, but I find that they have kind of a midgame slump before Ascended Teachers.
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Aug 13, 2019 19:46
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Digirat posted:I知 only halfway through my first non campaign game, downed 1 AI so far, but the balance of tier 1 and tier 2 units feels flipped compared to AOW3? My tier 1 hunters and shrikes are largely more damaging than tier 2 units, using the mod that lets them melt armor, despite costing less than half as much energy and production. dunno if this is only my faction or I知 missing something but it feels like spamming tier 1 units gets twice the power for the same energy and production as tier 2s. I知 about to get tier 2 flyers and question if I値l even be replacing shrikes with them for the cost. The general early game for each faction is tuned around T1s being the general main line troop and damage dealer while the T2s typically are meant to provide strong support and more specialized functions(like sniping). The one major exception to this is Dvar, who rely on Bulwarks(a T2) for their early game punch because their T1 is focused more on survivability. T3s are where you'll start to see units that can theoretically replace bunches of your T1s as main combat units, though it varies heavily from faction to faction and even once you have T3s and T4s, T1s aren't useless or obsolete. The other brake on just carpeting the entire map in T1s is modding; modding a zillion T1s is going to cost a prohibitive amount of cosmite, and as T1s are relatively fragile and you'll tend to lose some in bigger pitched battles, replacements will inflate your cosmite costs even more.
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Aug 13, 2019 19:54
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T1 Amazon units are really strong too. Archers with a blind and a healer with a free -resistance spell that can be cast on the first turn, this along with all their healing operations.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:02
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Captain Oblivious posted:Celestian is a weird secret tech and one I honestly have a hard time finding a good match for. Star Guides aren't cheap but they're strong as heck and help quite a bit in the mid-game because they allow you to proactively apply soulburn (which is where a lot of Celestian's offensive juice is) + other psychic status effects, and I don't really feel like Lightbringers fall off that much for melee units I think the issue with getting it to "match" a race is that as a secret tech it doesn't particularly synergize with that much besides itself (and some psychic mods), and it really wants heavy investment (sort of like Xenoplague but less snowbally) - it's never bad, it's just that its gimmicks don't feel particularly suited/beneficial for one race over the other, and the way you apply soulburn in the early game is much less proactive than other technologies since it requires you to get hit in the face (which I guess does favor tanky racial units, but that's still kind of a sub-par best-case scenario vs. a lot of the other secret techs)
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Aug 13, 2019 20:37
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An important thing to know about the damage over time status effects is that they all come with some addition debuff aside from the damage done. For example, bleeding gives a unit -2 physical resist It should absolutely be easier to find out what status effects do, having to open up the encyclopedia constantly is annoying
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Aug 13, 2019 21:23
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LGD posted:Star Guides aren't cheap but they're strong as heck and help quite a bit in the mid-game because they allow you to proactively apply soulburn (which is where a lot of Celestian's offensive juice is) + other psychic status effects, and I don't really feel like Lightbringers fall off that much for melee units That's fair. I think something I struggle with is probably being proactive about Soulburn, in that light. Shield of Remorse is great for applying it, but there's so many ways for your melee bois to be staggered that I have a real hard time justifying replacing Shield of Tranquility.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:42
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Finally finished my first random map game as Dvar Promethean, hard difficulty, land-only landmass. It was a grueling 90 turns, and while I ran my neighbor Amazon over because she has terrible counters to mass heavy armor Bulwarks with fire bullets, as well as fending off an invasion attempt from AI Jack Gelder and his...PUG spam, the three Syndicate factions were the ones that teamed up against me in the end rush. Predictably, they gave me the most trouble as their main damage types were straight-up counters to my mech armies, but I fended them off in the end due to sheer firepower. The closest I had to a disaster was some operation or whatever that hit two stacks defending a colony of mine with Insanity, but I managed to pull through thanks to health regen and my own defensive operation shielding everyone so the friendly fire only got one Bulwark. Things I learned: 1) The Bulwark's Concussive Shot is probably overpowered, yeah. 2) Overwatch is shorter than most attack ranges (7), so you can't expect the enemy to just walk into your kill zones unless they're short-ranged. 3) Dvar explosive tech is pretty much useless until you can get Rocket Artillery online, maybe sooner if you can get some rocket launchers or other explosive abilities that are actually reliable and have good range. When you do, however, you will dictate the terms of the engagement or the enemy will get repeatedly hammered by insanely-powerful death rockets from across the map. 4) I imagine a Dvar player acquiring a Vanguard colony would be able to produce Engineers with explosive upgrades for their missile turrets, which sounds like the most bullshit thing ever with the 2x PUG/2x Engineer army composition. The one thing I want is a map option where the map doesn't wrap around. Holy poo poo did it get tiring trying to defend all that land from every side. I'd like the possibility of a proper corner start in this game, because I think the AI is terrible at dealing with naval stuff and building boats is super fussy, TBH.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:48
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toasterwarrior posted:2) Overwatch is shorter than most attack ranges (7), so you can't expect the enemy to just walk into your kill zones unless they're short-ranged. 7 is above average 
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Aug 13, 2019 22:37
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Cynic Jester posted:7 is above average Fair, I suppose in my head the "generic rifle squad" was the average, but the game has plenty of vomiting bugs or whatever that can't shoot that far.
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Aug 13, 2019 22:51
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I think Cynic jester was making a dick joke there. Also, re: the Amazon campaign, is there a way to tell both CORE and the Empress to go gently caress themselves? I thought I was along the freedom path, but apparently my character sided with CORE, which kind of spoiled the whole alliance thing in the final mission. Sure, I could tell them both to sod off if I played the Amazons themselves (and I did), but I wanted to play my Syndicate dude.
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Aug 13, 2019 23:33
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the firearms range booster thing also boosts your overwatch range; mod is good
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Aug 13, 2019 23:33
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Gonna play some AoW multiplayer tonight. Hit me up for future games or if you wanna join http://steamcommunity.com/id/wya I'm also DickBoss on discord
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Aug 13, 2019 23:43
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I officially have no idea how capability works. I apparently can easily kill the number two dude and still be in last capability wise. Prioritizing expansion didn't really help. Game makes me feel like an idiot a lot.
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Aug 14, 2019 00:35
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:iirc Yeah, burned is the normal damage over-time effect for most fire damage mods, it's the most common one. Immolated is what you get from high tier promethean mods to upgrade to a stronger DoT for burned when you need higher damage output for lategame. Charred is the rarer one that reduces their fire resist. Captain Oblivious posted:Celestian is a weird secret tech and one I honestly have a hard time finding a good match for. Celestian Assembly are fell and terrible - lightbringers now have Assimilate lifesteal, including on their meteor dash which lets them aoe lifesteal for a huge heal. They're also compatible with the assembly mod that gives every single cyborg unit 15% hp regen per turn and resurgence - so your giant deathblob will never lose a single unit as long as you win the fight. Then you give the lightbringers the celestian mod that make them immune to overwatch and have damage reflection and it becomes incredibly hard to kill any of them and you might commit suicide in the process and even if you do it doesn't stick. They are probably stagger immune at this point too. Throw in a handful of star guides and or reanimators for support if that's what you feel like. Honestly i feel like the resurgence + regen mod on assembly is the strongest mod in the entire game because jesus christ having resurgence on a couple death stacks means you no longer suffer from attrition at all and it has no upkeep cost just an initial buy in.
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Aug 14, 2019 00:48
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How do armor and shields work? I heard there were diminishing returns for both the higher they go- is that so? And if so, what is the 'optimal' setting for either?
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Aug 14, 2019 02:45
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CommissarMega posted:How do armor and shields work? I heard there were diminishing returns for both the higher they go- is that so? And if so, what is the 'optimal' setting for either? Damage Done * 0.9^(Armor + Shields + Resist - Weakness). So, 1 armor or shield or resist is 90%, 2 is 81%, 3 is 72%, 4 is 65%, 5 is 59% 6 is 53%, 7 is 47%, 8 is 43%, 9 is 38%, and 10 is 34%. I think i read somewhere that despite the diminishing returns, the actual value of each point is always equal to 11% increase in effective health over the previous point (NOT the base value), so although the actual amount reduced per point is decreased, you still effectively get more effective health with each point than the last one.
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Aug 14, 2019 02:52
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Huh, that isn't as bad as I was thinking it was. Looks like trying to find some arid mountains for a military production city might just be worth it.
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Aug 14, 2019 03:31
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Holy heck the indentured are baaaad. Gonna annex some amazons and replace them all for bullshit blinding stagger shots.
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Aug 14, 2019 05:39
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I know pioneer bonuses from empire quests aren't exactly a jackpot or anything but I sure do get annoyed when every A.I player all get the Emissary done at the same time around turn 4.
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Aug 14, 2019 05:45
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NoNotTheMindProbe posted:I tried to get into AoW3 a couple times but always bounced off it, whereas AoW:P as drawn me right in. I think the main factors is that the sector based strategic map is a huge improvement over the more granular pure hex map of the previous game and I find the more ranged and cover focused tactical side is more engaging this time around. Same. Sectors are a good addition that works well and idk maybe it's because I tried AoW3 post DLC so it was chock full of things and balance patches but I feel like I'm grasping P a lot more. Go Bugmanz.
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Aug 14, 2019 06:14
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Sedisp posted:Holy heck the indentured are baaaad. Gonna annex some amazons and replace them all for bullshit blinding stagger shots. My friend thinks they're the best tier 1 unit in the game. And having seen him clear the promethean factory with just 4 of them, their support unit, and a tanky hero, I have to agree. The trick to making them reeeeally good is getting them the targeting system mod ASAP. It's probably the single best mod for ranged units until well into the lategame. Bonus to accuracy, bonus to damage, multiplicative bonus to flanking damage, which you'll be using often because you've arranged them in a loose gunline (right?), their damage output is insane. Overlapping overwatch melts melee units. As for ranged, defend with the hero in cover a bit in front of your guys to get the enemy to advance and waste their shots on someone who won't die, then advance your gunline as much as you need for maximum (number of shots x accuracy) and kill them off. Don't be afraid to get out of cover to get a good shot - you don't need cover if there's nobody left alive to shoot back at you. And they're dirt cheap, especially with the 50% discount, and don't actually need any other mod to be a great unit. That having been said, do get the amazons if you can, their defensive equivalent of the above mod is the second best early mod in the game, and actually lets your guys survive if things don't go as planned. Early synthesis mods and tactical ops work great with them, too. He ranks amazon archers as second best tier 1, their main flaw being that a single mistake with them tends to lead to an expensive failure cascade.
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Aug 14, 2019 06:25
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my dad posted:My friend thinks they're the best tier 1 unit in the game. And having seen him clear the promethean factory with just 4 of them, their support unit, and a tanky hero, I have to agree. Don't get me wrong they're very usable but they quite literally require a sort of meh support unit to compete with a trooper. The flanking mod is phenomenal and also works just as well on any races core unit. Having to stick them in gun lines makes them ridiculously susceptible to stagger from nades or those hateful blinding arrows. There's also a whole load of maps where this simply does not work. The arc damage comes in handy against vehicles but soooo many things have early acess to arc resistance that melting things stops happening very fast. Of course I might just be bitter about this hellwar Ive been waging against the amazons across the sea that have evey single unit they could be arc and psionic resistant. Sedisp fucked around with this message at 08:17 on Aug 14, 2019 |
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Aug 14, 2019 08:14
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hi gerblyn, the Psionic Drain trait is not in the in game encyclopedia
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Aug 14, 2019 08:35
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Captain Oblivious posted:Celestian is a weird secret tech and one I honestly have a hard time finding a good match for. I have these high rank Dvar trenchers with the celestial healing mod, I've not lost a single one of them. They do lovely damage but outlive everything and if one of them gets focused they have a healing ability or you can use the 1point tactical operation to heal them to full.
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Aug 14, 2019 08:39
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Sedisp posted:Having to stick them in gun lines makes them ridiculously susceptible to stagger from nades or those hateful blinding arrows. There's also a whole load of maps where this simply does not work. Loose gunline.  Maybe I phrased it poorly - A formation, linear or slightly concave, such that the enemy gets in their range in roughly the same moment, but your guys are also spread out to make it easier to flank around the enemy and also to not get AOE-d to death.
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Aug 14, 2019 08:55
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my dad posted:Loose gunline. I get that. Having them spread out means less units can flank. You can mitigate this by abusing how much the ai weights knocking out a hero and then shutting the door behind them but that's not something that I'm a big fan of. Troopers can have the exact same strategy and thanks to their grenade can even have a non flanker break their cover without the accuracy penalty of overcharge shot through cover. My primary problem with them is that their gimmick is "cheap" but the only way to make them comprable to the other factions is by a mandatory mod giving them a cosmite cost reduced mod slots and attaching them to a kind of meh specialist. Sedisp fucked around with this message at 11:25 on Aug 14, 2019 |
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Aug 14, 2019 11:20
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man i'm always at the bottom of the capability rankings, idk what i'm doing wrong. I guess I don't spam enough colonisers?
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Aug 14, 2019 11:38
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juggalo baby coffin posted:man i'm always at the bottom of the capability rankings, idk what i'm doing wrong. I guess I don't spam enough colonisers? Likewise man, I'm sure the AI gets resource bonuses, which is the main factor. It doesn't matter a drat thing (unless for the Superweapon victory) if they use all that production to make 4 haphazardly modded stacks that you can beat with 2 of yours that you mod and use well, though.
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Aug 14, 2019 12:13
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While AoW:P removes the infinite city thing that AoW3 had, it's worth bearing in mind that cities can only have 5 sectors at max and that there's no real penalty to making more cities, so as soon as you find a semi-nice area with stuff you'd like you should definitely be thinking about colonizing. Also worth noting that Colony sectors only require you reach the landmark population, not that you sustain it. If you get to 12 pop on a city it will always have 4 sectors, even if you dip the population down to 9 with colonizers.
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Aug 14, 2019 13:40
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It also takes some serious effort to get to 16 pop. I imagine most people should aim for a 3-sector build when planning their colonies at best, while aggressive/pro players might even settle for 2-sector builds and instead use feeder colonies to sustain them.
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Aug 14, 2019 13:53
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toasterwarrior posted:It also takes some serious effort to get to 16 pop. I imagine most people should aim for a 3-sector build when planning their colonies at best, while aggressive/pro players might even settle for 2-sector builds and instead use feeder colonies to sustain them. A single food exploitation will get you to 16 pretty quickly. Two will do that, then get all your other cities to 16 pretty quickly. Playing ICS seems like a waste, considering how many turns you'll spend on infrastructure in each new city. Sure, you no longer pay upkeep but there's an opportunity cost to building colonizers(cosmite  ). If they didn't cost cosmite I'd be all for ICS being the bomb, but 30 cosmite is a lot of mods and mods win you combat. A single modded out unit is usually way more effective than two unmodded ones.
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Aug 14, 2019 14:14
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Cynic Jester posted:A single food exploitation will get you to 16 pretty quickly. Two will do that, then get all your other cities to 16 pretty quickly. Playing ICS seems like a waste, considering how many turns you'll spend on infrastructure in each new city. Sure, you no longer pay upkeep but there's an opportunity cost to building colonizers(cosmite 2 food exploitation. And 2 coast food exploitation which give benefits for each matching exploitation. 
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Aug 14, 2019 14:17
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