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https://cleantechnica.com/2019/08/17/teslas-service-may-not-be-perfect-but-it-is-still-far-better-than-the-competition/ posted:How does Tesla’s service compare to legacy automakers? It’s far better to the point of making them a joke. It is extremely easy for me to request service from the app I already use regularly, it takes far less time than a phone call, and it requires significantly less effort. The text updates represent another incremental improvement over every other automotive dealership I’ve worked with on previous repairs.  ah, the arcane technomancy of online service appointments. Known only to the select few archCEOs of Silica
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Aug 20, 2019 15:23
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I love the fact that the disposable cell phone car company sells lovely FSD as an app that, just like a cell phone app, disappears and/or had to be constantly repurchased and reinstalled. I can't wait for other car companies to glom onto this pernicious little bit of rent seeking. *fails to reup my ABS subscription when my credit card expires*
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Aug 20, 2019 15:26
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Car as a Service
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Aug 20, 2019 15:30
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:Tesla's stubbornness on making price adjustments whoa. a Tesla buyer who didn't just accept being poo poo on and actually rejected the delivery. pretty clear that the no discounts and no perks is just them playing hardball because they know 99% of Tesla buyers will jut say I Love The Car and drive off with a huge dent.
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Aug 20, 2019 15:41
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Sedisp posted:The absolute stupidity that is required to think EVs will ever be common place is astounding tbh. Infrastructure is expensive and is never ever done unless there is a guaranteed payoff. As gigantic as the dividends are for high speed internet companies they still have put in almost nothing into expanding infrastructure to rural areas and they will never bother under a capitalist system. Gasoline is highly subsidized and if you haven't noticed our planet is burning. And the infrastructure costs are not that high, the most infrastructure most people need to drive an electric car is a 120v outlet.
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Aug 20, 2019 15:41
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Tunicate posted:the energy was introduced millions of years ago when the continent rose, it gets extracted when they bring it closer to sea level Someone tell Elon he can charge vehicles with tectonic plate energy and I'm sure he'll get right on it.
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Aug 20, 2019 15:45
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also looking at replies to the post about it misidentifying a bike on a car as a motorcycle: "I've also driven by a painted mural of a bicyclist on a wall that showed up on my Tesla screen as a actual bicyclist." $10 says you could trick a Tesla with a tunnel painted on a wall.
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Aug 20, 2019 15:50
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Rigged Death Trap posted:Government Tax Credits for EVs. This is why we all drove our hybrids into work today right? A tax subsidy still needs to be approved paid for and lobbied for. Which will still cost a gently caress load of money to let rich idiots not take the bus. Three Olives posted:Gasoline is highly subsidized and if you haven't noticed our planet is burning. Yes gasoline is highly subsidized gas companies have far greater sway than car companies and it's the car companies who would need to lobby to provide charging stations because big Oil sure as gently caress won't. hate to be the bearer of bad news but preventing our planet from burning requires the abandonment of capitalism because swapping a bunch of cars over to an overtaxed coal fired electrical grid is not going to save the planet. Three Olives posted:And the infrastructure costs are not that high, the most infrastructure most people need to drive an electric car is a 120v outlet. Most people don't have access to this in their home or place of work. Unless you're talking about subsidies to get companies to install then in apartments or places of work in which case the only people who will have access to this are well off people who live in cities. Which once again still have a far more efficient method of transportation NOW. The medicine exists it's cost effective and it works but you dip shits don't want to take it because poor people do too. Sedisp has issued a correction as of 15:59 on Aug 20, 2019 |
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Aug 20, 2019 15:57
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Sedisp posted:Most people don't have access to this in their home or place of work. Unless you're talking about subsidies to get companies to install then in apartments or places of work in which case the only people who will have access to this are well off people who live in cities. Which once again still have a far more efficient method of transportation NOW. 10 years ago most people didn't have a smartphone, today homeless people do. Most people don't buy new cars, most people don't even buy 2 year old cars, in fact the average age of a car right now is over 10 years old. Of course electric cars are going to appeal and be available to wealthier urbanites first, they will trickle down though, 6 years from now a Chevy Bolt will cost like 10k and even a lower end apartment complex is subject to competition and can invest the trivial amount of money required to put a couple of 120v outlets in front of a parking spot.
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Aug 20, 2019 16:08
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As soon as poors can afford EVs there will be some draconian laws about stealing electricity enacted
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Aug 20, 2019 16:09
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i'm curious to see how range degradation factors in to used EV pricing. especially when they start approaching that 10 year mark and have an effective range of like 50 km
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Aug 20, 2019 16:14
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Shifty Pony posted:also looking at replies to the post about it misidentifying a bike on a car as a motorcycle: It really is like Road Runner and Wile E. Coyote 
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Aug 20, 2019 16:19
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Three Olives posted:10 years ago most people didn't have a smartphone, today homeless people do. Most people don't buy new cars, most people don't even buy 2 year old cars, in fact the average age of a car right now is over 10 years old. Lol ten years ago most people didn't have smart phones because people didn't have uses for them, social media became bigger and more mainstream. The cost of the original Iphone was six hundo and there is literally no way you will get a flagship phone for six hundo anymore. People not buying new cars doesn't help EVs considering that ICEs hold up a lot better over five years than EVBs. The price of cars isn't going down until the labor is further automated which will cause one of the biggest uh ohs humanity has ever experienced. A smart phones infrastructure footprint is a power outlet and a 12 dollar cable and battery pack. Poor people tend to have electricity they very rarely have houses or apartments with charging stations. Instead they will continue taking the bus. Comparing a car to a smartphone is the most bazinga thing I've ever read. Three Olives posted:even a lower end apartment complex is subject to competition and can invest the trivial amount of money required to put a couple of 120v outlets in front of a parking spot. No they aren't? Tenants very very rarely have choices in low end apartments and getting a landlord to fix something they are legally required to fix is one of the biggest pain in the asses. I feel like the only experience you have with poverty is watching television.
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Aug 20, 2019 16:25
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three olives please go test the painted tunnel idea finally
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Aug 20, 2019 16:27
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Competition in the slum lord market just lol
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Aug 20, 2019 16:32
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I can't get my slumlord to fix the leaking drain that is ruining structural elements but I'm sure he will get right on installing 120v outlets for my non existant parking spot.
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Aug 20, 2019 16:39
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A lot of people where I live in Seattle, an urban center, street park. Same with when I lived in Chicago - tons of street parking. I really doubt there's an affordable solution to supply power to all those street-parked vehicles outside of dedicated charging structures (i.e. "gas" stations). Building garages for all of them would be a pretty tall order.
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Aug 20, 2019 16:46
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Once u can take an elongtunnel to the middle of Manhattan and then ur car drives to a NJ garage to charge itself it will be no problem Bing bang boop
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Aug 20, 2019 16:56
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Tunicate posted:Meanwhile with a real company:
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Aug 20, 2019 16:58
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It's me, the person thst thinks the same batteries that degrade after less than a year in a smartphone after a couple hundred cycles will magically make it to 10 years of lifetime @20k-30k km per year in incredibly harsher environments and with the occasional fry-me-baby-one-more-time fast charge. The only reason the range counter on an EV doesn't start to degrade on day 2 of usage is because they are modeled after a degradation compensation that increases the end of charge voltage by a few mV every time you start a new cycle. Scientific e: while you can increase the cycle capacity by reducing cycle range to 20-60%, the lifetime energy total for the battery actually decreases when used like that (the part you are interested in when it comes to mileage lifetime) Combat Theory has issued a correction as of 17:08 on Aug 20, 2019 |
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Aug 20, 2019 17:00
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refleks posted:Why in the gently caress are these weirdos taking delivery of damaged goods. I have never owned a car, shopped for one or taken delivery of one, but even I can see that is problematic as gently caress... cause they tell you if you don't take it, they'll give it to someone else so you'll have to wait weeks for another
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Aug 20, 2019 17:00
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Combat Theory posted:It's me, the person thst thinks the same batteries that degrade after less than a year in a smartphone after a couple hundred cycles will magically make it to 10 years of lifetime in incredibly harsher environments and with the occasional fry-me-baby-one-more-time fast charge. I thought the EV batteries were already typically voltage limited to operate in the 80%-20% range (i.e. they do not utilize the "true" battery capacity so the battery does not wear out as quickly and is never in danger of depleting to the point of unchargability).
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Aug 20, 2019 17:08
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The stories of people taking a car that wouldn't make it out of 70's GM plant are still baffling. LOVE CAR. ALL GLORY TO CAR. But what's that? A new luxury EV people actually want? From a real car company? And there are 30,000 preorders? https://jalopnik.com/porsche-says-the-electric-taycan-will-outsell-the-911-1836835500 And an electric van! Also from a real car company! https://jalopnik.com/the-2020-mercedes-benz-eqv-beats-tesla-and-volkswagen-t-1837403191 Sell it in the USA, you cowards! (that said, it looks like it's based on the M-class/Metris, and those kinda suck ergonomically) Hooray for electric vehicles that won't explode!
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Aug 20, 2019 17:11
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In their delivery configuration, yes. But those top 20 percent of overhead are what the range equalizer taps in to make sure you won't notice the battery degradation at first. Compared to mechanical engine wear modeling which involves hundreds of exotic parameters and hard to measure values, it is really quite simple to tell how a battery ages. And they all do, there's no magic sauce, exotic anti wear coating or old timer trick (like actually changing the friggin engine oil regularly) to deal around it. Combine that with the incredible cost for a BEV traction battery replacement and Battery power becomes the holy grail of planned obsolescence. Combat Theory has issued a correction as of 17:15 on Aug 20, 2019 |
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Aug 20, 2019 17:11
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Not a Children posted:I thought the EV batteries were already typically voltage limited to operate in the 80%-20% range (i.e. they do not utilize the "true" battery capacity so the battery does not wear out as quickly and is never in danger of depleting to the point of unchargability). they still degrade, that just helps them degrade in a predictable fashion over a long enough time span that the manufacturer feels they don't have to be concerned about the loss of range resulting in lawsuits. there is no way, with present technology, to prevent lithium batteries from degrading over time. temperature and load extremes will exacerbate this, but it will happen regardless, and over the time frame of most ICE used vehicles, it will have a very significant effect on their range.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:14
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Buying a brand new Tesla is already a poo poo show imagine even thinking about buying a used one lmao.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:14
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Raldikuk posted:I can't get my slumlord to fix the leaking drain that is ruining structural elements but I'm sure he will get right on installing 120v outlets for my non existant parking spot. I'm sure he'll also pay for the thousands of bucks to install new/jury rig to existing meters.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:15
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Buying a brand new Tesla is already a poo poo show imagine even thinking about buying a used one lmao. Are there any other accounts about what happens when you buy a used tesla, account/software -wise? All I've seen was the guy who bought one with the IOU-1-FSD phantom coupon attached and they invalidated it.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:22
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Basically, if you want EVs to be a thing we have to have a method of doing periodic battery exchanges and have those exchanges warrantied for some long period, like 10 years. And after 10 years, have the exchanges cheap enough to be affordable as regular maintenance.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:23
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have people compiled good stats on max range vs car age on lithium EVs yet?
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Aug 20, 2019 17:26
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As an aside, I've wondered if a theoretical pack with a mix of batteries and super capacitors could improve the degradation story without too much range loss. I don't think there's any super capacitors suitable for cars at the moment though?
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Aug 20, 2019 17:27
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Are there any other accounts about what happens when you buy a used tesla, account/software -wise? All I've seen was the guy who bought one with the IOU-1-FSD phantom coupon attached and they invalidated it. odds are pretty good it's like everything else at tesla and there's no formal policy or process and it just happens whenever
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Aug 20, 2019 17:28
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ryde posted:Basically, if you want EVs to be a thing we have to have a method of doing periodic battery exchanges and have those exchanges warrantied for some long period, like 10 years. And after 10 years, have the exchanges cheap enough to be affordable as regular maintenance. That will never be a thing at the required battery sizes. You can pull that off with ladder frame designs but not if the battery has to be an integral part of the chassis like it is in any personal vehicle sized BEV that's supposed to survive a mild accident without incarceration I mean that's not saying EVs won't be a thing (they already are) it just means what everyone in the automotive world has been saying behind closed doors for half a decade now: There won't a single universal powertrain solution for automotive mobility. They all have pros and cons and should be optimized for specific roles and cases that play into their strengths.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:29
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SweetWillyRollbar posted:In the Elon death tunnel thread some dude freaked out when people talked about actual subways and mass transit in general. He went off about crackheads and "gangbangers" then darkly alluded that he knew all about what went on in the subways in Tokyo. poo poo was wild Link please?
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Aug 20, 2019 17:30
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Three Olives posted:10 years ago most people didn't have a smartphone, today homeless people do. Most people don't buy new cars, most people don't even buy 2 year old cars, in fact the average age of a car right now is over 10 years old. You've literally never lived outside your bubble and you should be thrown in jail for being a dumb bougie gently caress.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:31
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Are there any other accounts about what happens when you buy a used tesla, account/software -wise? All I've seen was the guy who bought one with the IOU-1-FSD phantom coupon attached and they invalidated it. There's the guy who still pays the supercharger for the person who bought the Tesla off him.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:33
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Bip Roberts posted:have people compiled good stats on max range vs car age on lithium EVs yet? I found an article about a Tesla S that quoted 1.2 mile to 4.7 mile loss per 10k miles driven, but it went through three batteries due to "battery chemistry" and "battery assembly" issues. I'm sure the issues are completely unrelated to the usage of the battery.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:33
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Buying a brand new Tesla is already a poo poo show imagine even thinking about buying a used one lmao. Tesla already has been caught stripping software features from used models to force people to buy them again. would be funny if they did that to a range upgrade.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:35
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Combat Theory posted:There won't a single universal powertrain solution for automotive mobility. They all have pros and cons and should be optimized for specific roles and cases that play into their strengths. That's a better take than what I wrote. I can see there being a mix of EV, hydrogen, and biofuel solutions. The primary driver to tackle climate change really should be more public transit and better city layout over the long term.
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Aug 20, 2019 17:36
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SweetWillyRollbar posted:In the Elon death tunnel thread some dude freaked out when people talked about actual subways and mass transit in general. He went off about crackheads and "gangbangers" then darkly alluded that he knew all about what went on in the subways in Tokyo. poo poo was wild I'm sure he watched plenty of "documentaries" about what happens in tokyo subways Same reason I don't take the bang bus to work anymore
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Aug 20, 2019 17:38
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