(Thread IKs:
fart simpson)
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Sep 23, 2019 06:07
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Bloodnose posted:I mean I know the answer to why they keep trying to change the subject is there were just 90+ posts of literally genocide apologia and the only way they can handle that "hey look over there" but seriously let me remind the world that Peven Stan, Typo, and Horseshoe Theory looked at Holocaust trains to concentration camps and said "heh yeah but what about ICE." maybe the class content of a socialist concentration camp is obviously different from the class content of a nazi concentration camp even if they have some of the same forms? 
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Sep 23, 2019 06:08
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CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:the hong kong police have let protestors smash shops and burn down subway stations https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/hong-kong-brutal-beatings-and-torture-police-detention-new-evidence CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:the hong kong police have let protestors smash shops https://twitter.com/lhktroot/status/1173246140092837888 CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:hong kong police have let protestors https://twitter.com/kayhk616/status/1175469697346629632 CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:Just because your employer decrees it to be true doesn't mean that it is true. enough about your posting Kill All Cops has issued a correction as of 06:10 on Sep 23, 2019 |
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Sep 23, 2019 06:08
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Lady Galaga posted:https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/hong-kong-brutal-beatings-and-torture-police-detention-new-evidence Whataboutism, we are not discussing the police here but the conduct of the protestors!!!
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Sep 23, 2019 06:11
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The old reactionary pictured, who no doubt misses the time before the liberation, was probably shouting such slogan as "long live the Queen" and "we want to be integrated into the imperialist core" and "long live austerity and we want to go back to being a colony" (it's quite catchy when sounded out in chinese). Which no doubt caused the chekists to fear for their class interests and result in a quick "re-education campaign" applied to his face.
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Sep 23, 2019 06:11
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CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:Just because your employer decrees it to be true doesn't mean that it is true. This isn't the cultural revolution- repeating mantras and aggressively policing the groupthink in the thread just makes western liberals look desperate. Despite all the sturm and drang, why hasn't trump commented on the alleged millions in camps? Surely he could use that as a wedge in trade negotiations? Spergin Morlock posted:he doesn't want to draw attention to his own growing concentration camp system op This is option one but I think a more likely option is he doesn't know about them because he doesn't read intel briefs. America is bad and we have a bad president who is bad at being president. The Trump administration itself is probably the best argument against the theory that any unrest in China has roots in the United States. You really think Trump could pull this off? Hah. But really keep insisting that the Holocaust of the 21st century is a-okay. Speaking as an Ashkenazi Jew, rather than a deep state black hand, go gently caress yourself.
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Sep 23, 2019 06:20
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Bloodnose posted:This is option one but I think a more likely option is he doesn't know about them because he doesn't read intel briefs. America is bad and we have a bad president who is bad at being president. The Trump administration itself is probably the best argument against the theory that any unrest in China has roots in the United States. You really think Trump could pull this off? Hah. Oh please, we both know the permanent civil service (the so-called "deep state") handles these matters the same way no matter which figurehead has their portrait hanging in their office at the moment. Bloodnose posted:But really keep insisting that the Holocaust of the 21st century is a-okay. Speaking as an Ashkenazi Jew, rather than a deep state black hand, go gently caress yourself. Nah, the holocaust of the 21st century is what Israel is doing to Palestine.
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Sep 23, 2019 06:27
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CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:
Israel putting muslims into camps is ok but it's not ok when China does it - a liberal in 2019
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Sep 23, 2019 06:32
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Typo posted:maybe the class content of a socialist concentration camp is obviously different from the class content of a nazi concentration camp even if they have some of the same forms?
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Sep 23, 2019 06:34
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CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:Nah, the holocaust of the 21st century is what Israel is doing to Palestine. Oh wow a whole new tu quoque! And with ethnic flavor once you remembered I'm Jewish! You're a gas. Let me get this one out of the way too: Yes, Israel is Jews acting like Nazis and what they're doing to the Palestinians is indeed a genocide. However, and now let's have the whole crowd say it with me: "things can be bad in two places at once!" Israel doing genocide does not mean China is not doing a genocide. And boy is China doing a big one for which you're working very hard to do apologia. What a guy.
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Sep 23, 2019 06:36
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Bloodnose posted:things can be bad in two places at once!
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Sep 23, 2019 06:40
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but what about yemen but what about west papua but what about kurdistan but what about iran but what about venezuela but what about big pharma but what about climate change but what about gun control but what about
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Sep 23, 2019 06:44
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Bloodnose posted:Now back here in the China thread, a religious minority is being shackled and sent off to camps by the millions. That is bad. yeah uh about that im looking at the tweet thread that set off this entire weird argument and its not actually clear that this video has anything to do with uyghurs at all
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Sep 23, 2019 06:47
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Lady Galaga posted:is ICE destroying places of religious worship in El Paso? https://uk.news.yahoo.com/mosque-demolitions-across-china-raise-111904185.html Religions are stupid though, I will die on this hill.
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Sep 23, 2019 06:54
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Bloodnose posted:This is option one but I think a more likely option is he doesn't know about them because he doesn't read intel briefs. America is bad and we have a bad president who is bad at being president. The Trump administration itself is probably the best argument against the theory that any unrest in China has roots in the United States. You really think Trump could pull this off? Hah. I don't know if you are being serious (in this particular thread), but there is no gas chamber at the end of the xinjiang camps. Instead of compare them to nazi camps, you should read up on anti rightists reedcution camps. Actually CCP have done reedcution camps many times throughout its history. I can even point out camps before 49 but they were less documented and more deadly.
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Sep 23, 2019 07:23
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tino posted:I don't know if you are being serious (in this particular thread), but there is no gas chamber at the end of the xinjiang camps. Instead of compare them to nazi camps, you should read up on anti rightists reedcution camps. Actually CCP have done reedcution camps many times throughout its history. I can even point out camps before 49 but they were less documented and more deadly. so as long as they're imprisoning millions of people for the purpose of erasing their language and culture rather than killing them off like the nazis did that makes it ok?
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Sep 23, 2019 07:27
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gently caress China.
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Sep 23, 2019 07:48
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Spergin Morlock posted:so as long as they're imprisoning millions of people for the purpose of erasing their language and culture rather than killing them off like the nazis did that makes it ok? That was not my argument though? As long as you don't call it a nazi dead camp I am not arguing that its "okay".
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Sep 23, 2019 07:51
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FWIW I think the escalation of the rhetoric into genocidaire talk, especially from sources who'd like nothing better than to implement their foreign policy designs on China is pretty suspect These are the same people who lied about Lybia, who lied about Aleppo, who lied about Yemen, who lied about North Korea, who lied about Palestine, and so I can hardly blame anyone who isn't willing the West the benefit of the doubt that THIS TIME there really is some form of ethnic cleansing going on that just happens to coincide with a nation state that the US would just love to take down a peg
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Sep 23, 2019 07:52
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Spergin Morlock posted:erasing their language and culture yeah about that 
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Sep 23, 2019 08:07
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how does china feel about lentils
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Sep 23, 2019 08:09
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I ordered lentils once in this brunch place and they gave me green beans. I think that's how china feels about lentils
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Sep 23, 2019 08:22
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Some Guy TT posted:yeah about that lol  "I love Beijing Tiananmen Square", writes Uighur man, 3,000km from Beijing Kill All Cops has issued a correction as of 08:26 on Sep 23, 2019 |
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Sep 23, 2019 08:24
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Some Guy TT posted:yeah about that Uhhhh have you actually watched that video?
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Sep 23, 2019 08:43
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Lady Galaga posted:lol iwriting positive and patriotic affirmations is now an unwoke practice??
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Sep 23, 2019 08:44
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All empires shall beg for mercy and receive none. 
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Sep 23, 2019 09:00
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Bloodnose posted:Oh wow a whole new tu quoque! And with ethnic flavor once you remembered I'm Jewish! You're a gas. Conflating all Jewish people with Israelis is a common antisemitic trope dude.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:13
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LimburgLimbo posted:Uhhhh have you actually watched that video? look at the picture again and think about whether anything in there seems out of place for a camp dedicated to stamping out ughyur language and culture
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Sep 23, 2019 09:13
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420 Gank Mid posted:Conflating all Jewish people with Israelis is a common antisemitic trope dude. That's probably why he responded with sarcasm and irritation when peven stan did exactly that. Maybe.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:20
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Some Guy TT posted:look at the picture again and think about whether anything in there seems out of place for a camp dedicated to stamping out ughyur language and culture The two mainland officials making sure everything is going as rehearsed to the western journalists?
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Sep 23, 2019 09:25
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Lady Galaga posted:
what about gout patrol
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Sep 23, 2019 09:29
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Spergin Morlock posted:That's probably why he responded with sarcasm and irritation when peven stan did exactly that. Maybe. Capslock may literally be a CCP press release given human form but bloodnose is the one actually doing the conflating.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:29
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Some degree of cultural and even straight genocide are fairly common approaches to dealing with national minorities that are considered to be risks for splitting a country in some politically important way, like even by being able to provide a fertile ground for agents of some external enemy to work within. Things go the same way as with large protest movements: they happen in small and large forms all around the world, but the reporting we get on them takes the form of propaganda. What happens in countries that we don't like is reported on immediately and in a large scale, interpreted in the worst possible way, the non-state actors are reprented as heroes of justice and the state actors as monsters. What happens in countries that we like is ignored as much as possible, people who bring it up are painted as unreliable voices, and when it's talked about it's always in the past and we can't interrupt the process of healing or the real heroism was learning from these "mistakes". Uyghurs are a large minority in terms of absolute numbers, produce movements with separatist ideas and international connections and may be quite culturally isolated from the rest of Chinese people so that it's difficult to keep them in check through the usual channels, so the usual motivation is there. Comparisons to nazis are extremely disingenuous and politically loaded though, obviously if people are being systematically exterminated in camps the logical answer would be to support Anyone But CCP™️. Probably the second worst case would be that Uyghurs would be subjected to systematic terror and deprivation with the aim of controlling their numbers by forcing them to emigrate or die earlier of illnesses and so on, which is also horrible but it requires more than prison camps, imprisoning lots of people would be necessary to eliminate resistance but the main effect would be sought in regular civilian life. China isn't a closed enough country to prevent news of that from getting out and read at least without cordoning the minority off so that "regular people" wouldn't see it, only "dissidents with an axe to grind" would. What I consider us to be most likely looking at is China not even trying to eliminate Uyghur culture out of some alleged sudden ethnonationalist sentiment, but forcibly embedding Uyghurs within a Han network, out of Uyghur-specific social relations and into forced cultural interchanges that expand the layer of integrated Uyghurs who would go to Uyghur-specific gatherings, perceive Uyghur dissidents as dangeous and report them to Han officials. Of course it's kinda lovely in principle and done using methods that make it outright heinous, but the difference between it and the kind of genocide outlined in the last paragraph must be made clear. Xinjiang is not Occupied Poland or Occupied Palestine. We may have Libya or Syria, with China engaging in national unification methods heinous enough that a critical amount of people would begin to support rebellion at any cost, but not necessarily representing an improvement in humanitarian terms. Or maybe China has learned from history and manages to produce stability. Basically any kind of resistance movement has to be put in perspective, while our own propaganda about the situation tries to paint a picture where it does not, preparing the ground for accusing critics of genocide apologia if leadership of the resistance turns out to have been taken by jihadist loons.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:33
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420 Gank Mid posted:Capslock may literally be a CCP press release given human form but bloodnose is the one actually doing the conflating. Peven Stan knew exactly what he was doing when he replied that way to bloodnose's post which mentioned that he is Jewish.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:34
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Lady Galaga posted:The two mainland officials making sure everything is going as rehearsed to the western journalists? the wall painting in the upper left corner is written in the uyghur script and theyre standing in front of a portrait of traditional uyghur dancers
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Sep 23, 2019 09:40
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420 Gank Mid posted:Capslock may literally be a CCP press release given human form but bloodnose is the one actually doing the conflating. "Bloodnose is the problem", I mutter, as pevan stan whataboutisms Israel Palestine into this thread one post after Bloodnose mentions he is an Ashkenazi Jew
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Sep 23, 2019 09:40
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sincx has issued a correction as of 05:29 on Mar 23, 2021 |
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Sep 23, 2019 09:43
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Lady Galaga posted:"Bloodnose is the problem", I mutter, as pevan stan whataboutisms Israel Palestine into this thread one post after Bloodnose mentions he is an Ashkenazi Jew "Pretending its OK to slander all Jews as Israelis is OK when my side does it"
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Sep 23, 2019 09:44
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uncop posted:Basically any kind of resistance movement has to be put in perspective, while our own propaganda about the situation tries to paint a picture where it does not, preparing the ground for accusing critics of genocide apologia if leadership of the resistance turns out to have been taken by jihadist loons. speaking of jihadist loons, your post did remind me of this reporting by Seymour Hersh on the links between the Syrian conflict and Xinjiang: quote:China, too, is worried about Islamic State. “China regards the Syrian crisis from three perspectives,” he said: international law and legitimacy; global strategic positioning; and the activities of jihadist Uighurs, from Xinjiang province in China’s far west. Xinjiang borders eight nations— Mongolia, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Afghanistan, Pakistan and India—and, in China’s view, serves as a funnel for terrorism around the world and within China. Many Uighur fighters now in Syria are known to be members of the East Turkestan Islamic Movement—an often violent separatist organization that seeks to establish an Islamist Uighur state in Xinjiang. “The fact that they have been aided by Turkish intelligence to move from China into Syria through Turkey has caused a tremendous amount of tension between the Chinese and Turkish intelligence,” [Syrian Ambassador to China Imad] Moustapha said. “China is concerned that the Turkish role of supporting the Uighur fighters in Syria may be extended in the future to support Turkey’s agenda in Xinjiang. We are already providing the Chinese intelligence service with information regarding these terrorists and the routes they crossed from on traveling into Syria.”
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Sep 23, 2019 09:53
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420 Gank Mid posted:"Pretending its OK to slander all Jews as Israelis is OK when my side does it" You seem confused.
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Sep 23, 2019 09:58
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