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I still say Link Between Worlds makes more sense if you put it before Link to the Past. It's closer to Ocarina which is why the sages are still a Zora and a pseudo Goron, as opposed to the all human sages of Link to the Past. Plus it gets rid of the "The Master Sword sleeps again forever" issue. I also never liked the idea of Oracle Link being the LttP/LA Link just based solely on artwork, it's like Link is Merlin or Benjamin Button in that he looks close to becoming an adult in LttP but then he's back to a little kid in later games. Not to mention Zelda not having met Link before in the Oracle games. Did the Zelda from LttP die but she had a twin sister all along? Did she just get amnesia? Who knows!
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Oct 3, 2019 16:24
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Zore posted:Also BotW has the most towns and civilization of any game in the series. Yeah, there's nothing bleak about BOTW, poo poo happened in the past but everything is happy and vibrant as gently caress.
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Oct 3, 2019 16:37
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Twelve by Pies posted:I still say Link Between Worlds makes more sense if you put it before Link to the Past. It's closer to Ocarina which is why the sages are still a Zora and a pseudo Goron, as opposed to the all human sages of Link to the Past. Plus it gets rid of the "The Master Sword sleeps again forever" issue. Link Between Worlds directly references Link to the Past multiple times. It being a sequel is completely explicit within the game itself.
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Oct 3, 2019 16:43
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I liked how Adventure of Link put together the southern half of the Eastern continent to make it seem like it was completely ravaged by monsters. You suddenly have to go through these forts with Lizalfos attacking from behind high walls, you have this town that’s been completely destroyed with its people having evacuated and gone into hiding, it really did a good job at giving you a sense of the threat you were up against with its limited resources. Other stuff in the game too like the ambushes in towns and the invisible encounter tiles on otherwise safe roads made it feel like you were never really safe from Ganon’s army. Augus fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Oct 3, 2019 |
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Oct 3, 2019 17:19
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sigher posted:Yeah, there's nothing bleak about BOTW, poo poo happened in the past but everything is happy and vibrant as gently caress. Fine, s/bleak/lonely.
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Oct 3, 2019 17:35
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Augus posted:I liked how Adventure of Link put together the southern half of the Eastern continent to make it seem like it was completely ravaged by monsters. You suddenly have to go through these forts with Lizalfos attacking from behind high walls, you have this town that’s been completely destroyed with its people having evacuated and gone into hiding, it really did a good job at giving you a sense of the threat you were up against with its limited resources. Adventure of Link does some really cool environmental storytelling. It blew my mind a few years ago when I realized that the original Zelda game is actually featured on the Zelda II overworld.
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Oct 3, 2019 19:49
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I tried playing it on the GC and found it extremely obtuse and unfun, are there any ways to make it enjoyable? Any noteworthy mods or romhacks or such, do I just GameGenie through it?
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Oct 4, 2019 03:14
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:I tried playing it on the GC and found it extremely obtuse and unfun, are there any ways to make it enjoyable? Any noteworthy mods or romhacks or such, do I just GameGenie through it? I beat Adventure of Link once when I was a kid, and played through a couple dungeons recently, then quit. Unfortunately, I think there are just too many flaws and frustrating gameplay elements for it to be a satisfying game for most people. I'll give the game a lot of credit for trying new things (side-scrolling combat, RPG elements, more NPCs, a bigger world, continuing the story from the first game, etc.), but at the end of the day, it's just not much fun to play (for me). The main problems are that a lot of enemies are frustrating to fight (there are only so many times a bat can knock you into a pit before you want to stop playing) and it's easy to get stuck, both due to the unclear sub-quests and unsatisfying level system. Regarding the leveling system, I often found myself dying just before leveling up, making me lose all of my XP and completely erasing my recent progress. The game should at least let you keep your XP! I don't know about mods or romhacks, but honestly I feel like Adventure of Link is more interesting as a historical oddity than as a game to play. Maybe play a dungeon or two, but don't hesitate to use a walk-through whenever you're stuck. As soon as you're not having fun anymore, maybe just watch a Let's Play, if there's a good one. I'm not sure how kid-me had the patience to beat the game, but adult-me certainly didn't. Nowadays, if I'm not enjoying a game, I'll more on.
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Oct 4, 2019 03:46
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:I tried playing it on the GC and found it extremely obtuse and unfun, are there any ways to make it enjoyable? Any noteworthy mods or romhacks or such, do I just GameGenie through it? Might just not be for you The music and settings and exploration and challenge are very good to me. For modern sensibilities, there's save states. Did I mention the music is great! Combat is good too. Different, but interesting.
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Oct 4, 2019 03:54
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Twelve by Pies posted:Not to mention Zelda not having met Link before in the Oracle games. Yeah, what IS up with that??
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Oct 4, 2019 07:03
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Pollyanna posted:Ooh, like what? Supposedly that was going to be the thing in Zelda 1 too. Blind the thief, how the dark world is basically the light world, but decrepit, with landmarks worn down and bridges being broken and impassable. The layout of village of outcast being basically overrun with thieves and ghosts. It's very easy to see how a lot of things are present-future elements. Of course I have no idea when it was dropped for the two worlds concept instead. The game title in Japanese do not have the back to the future implication though. I think the problem they had was how to work the time travel gimmick in, but the way you transport to an equal spot in the other world also seems like a time travel gimmick that was adopted.
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Oct 4, 2019 08:25
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Mordaedil posted:Blind the thief, how the dark world is basically the light world, but decrepit, with landmarks worn down and bridges being broken and impassable. The layout of village of outcast being basically overrun with thieves and ghosts. There's a few places where what you do in the Dark World affects the Light World (draining the water dungeon in the southern area) that stand out as weird outliers on LTTP because they use the idea so sparingly. Those definitely see like hold over ideas that would have made more sense in a narrative like Ocarina, where the past affects the future.
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Oct 4, 2019 12:57
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Wind Waker is pretty post-apocalyptic, it's just that civilisation has developed again.
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Oct 4, 2019 13:57
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Since it was NOA that came up with "a link to the past", I can't imagine time travel was much of a thing in the design of LTTP, unless it was super early in the design process. I think the original idea behind it was that LTTP was supposed to be a prequel to Z1/Z2. But beyond that i dont think it means much.
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Oct 4, 2019 19:11
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Gonna start this tonight. I’ve never played it but have played other Zelda games including Links Awakening so I know the basics of the genre. On Switch if it makes any difference.
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Oct 4, 2019 19:42
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youre gonna read the whole thread?
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Oct 4, 2019 19:46
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Lupus Rufus posted:Yeah, what IS up with that?? I can only assume the game was made with the idea that these were yet another incarnation of Link and Zelda and then for whatever reason Nintendo decided to say "Uh actually it's the LttP Link" which makes no sense and there's no storyline reason to do it. Lechtansi posted:I think the original idea behind it was that LTTP was supposed to be a prequel to Z1/Z2. But beyond that i dont think it means much. I never understood how LttP could take place before Z1, given that at the end of LttP the Essence of the Triforce tells Link that Ganon has been totally destroyed, and Link can make a wish on the unified Triforce, so shouldn't Ganon just be done for good? I guess you could explain it away by Ganon being the rightful bearer of the Triforce of Power, and thus he can't ever truly be defeated, although by that logic the Fallen Hero Timeline shouldn't exist. It's just a game, though. I should really just relax.
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Oct 4, 2019 19:52
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Twelve by Pies posted:I never understood how LttP could take place before Z1, given that at the end of LttP the Essence of the Triforce tells Link that Ganon has been totally destroyed, and Link can make a wish on the unified Triforce, so shouldn't Ganon just be done for good? I guess you could explain it away by Ganon being the rightful bearer of the Triforce of Power, and thus he can't ever truly be defeated, although by that logic the Fallen Hero Timeline shouldn't exist. I'm not saying it makes any sense, plot wise, but its at least the justification they gave for calling it "a link to the past." I'm only pointing it out as a contrast to people saying that LTTP was originally about time time travel. I'm guessing the original devs didn't care at all about the plots matching up, and its only after fans started whining about timeline poo poo that nintendo tried to put something together that mashed 20 years of games into some semblance of timeline. It doesn't matter at all when enjoying the games.
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Oct 4, 2019 20:24
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Ur Getting Fatter posted:Gonna start this tonight. I’ve never played it but have played other Zelda games including Links Awakening so I know the basics of the genre. the basics of the genre were wiped out with breath of the wild.....the only relevant game now is zelda 1
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Oct 4, 2019 20:40
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Twelve by Pies posted:I never understood how LttP could take place before Z1, given that at the end of LttP the Essence of the Triforce tells Link that Ganon has been totally destroyed, and Link can make a wish on the unified Triforce, so shouldn't Ganon just be done for good? I guess you could explain it away by Ganon being the rightful bearer of the Triforce of Power, and thus he can't ever truly be defeated, although by that logic the Fallen Hero Timeline shouldn't exist. But there's no indication that the Triforce was ever restored to the Golden Land after the events of Z1/Z2, and LttP's backstory doesn't mention the Triforce ever having left it in the first place, so LttP can't come after Z1 either. It's almost as if these game devs just made a bunch of games that were related in theme only with no thought as to how they fit together as a continuous narrative, but that's just crazy talk!!
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Oct 4, 2019 20:52
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Straight White Shark posted:
mods? MODS? SHIGGY?!
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Oct 4, 2019 20:56
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 Also where does TV Link fit into the timeline? Obviously at some point where not only was Ganon resurrected, but things were otherwise peaceful enough that he had time to dye his hair and sit around pestering the princess much of the time.
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Oct 4, 2019 21:04
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Most if it makes a lot of sense really. SS > OOT > MM > TP works, as does most of the Wind Waker timeline. It's basically just the timeline full of 2D games made before they gave a poo poo about writing any story at all that fucks it.
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Oct 4, 2019 21:05
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KTvjRe5vyA
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Oct 4, 2019 21:17
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Straight White Shark posted:But there's no indication that the Triforce was ever restored to the Golden Land after the events of Z1/Z2, and LttP's backstory doesn't mention the Triforce ever having left it in the first place, so LttP can't come after Z1 either. You mean kinda like... a legend?
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Oct 4, 2019 21:29
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Oct 4, 2019 22:13
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lol cool
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Oct 4, 2019 22:30
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Twelve by Pies posted:I never understood how LttP could take place before Z1, given that at the end of LttP the Essence of the Triforce tells Link that Ganon has been totally destroyed, and Link can make a wish on the unified Triforce, so shouldn't Ganon just be done for good? I guess you could explain it away by Ganon being the rightful bearer of the Triforce of Power, and thus he can't ever truly be defeated, although by that logic the Fallen Hero Timeline shouldn't exist. I think the logic here actually makes sense? in the games that the timeline says come after LttP AND feature Ganon (notably: Oracles and Link Between World), different characters are trying to *revive* Ganon. In Zelda 1, i believe the plot is that Ganon's followers successfully revived him before the start of the game. Zelda 2, you are once again trying to prevent the resurrection of Ganon. For how many times Ganon's been disturbed from his endless slumber in the Downfall timeline, it's little wonder he's an enraged beast of pure malice by the time of BotW 
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Oct 4, 2019 22:56
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When you put it like that, now I want to see Link go up against Dracula and a Belmont take on Gannon.
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Oct 4, 2019 23:07
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Any two or three given Zelda games can have a clean, logical continuous connection between them. More than that and they start to require you to work around mutually contradictory explanations. I like to think of Zelda canon as that the games are very liberal adaptations of a long tradition of legends that dramatize and moralize the "actual events" for different purposes. Like you basically have to treat it as a fictional historiography.
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Oct 4, 2019 23:09
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ItBreathes posted:When you put it like that, now I want to see Link go up against Dracula and a Belmont take on Gannon. Smash Bros delivers.
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Oct 4, 2019 23:18
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ImpAtom posted:Smash Bros delivers. I can't believe I forgot that this is now extremely possible. Praise Smash.
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Oct 4, 2019 23:59
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Zelda holding the Master Sword to defend Link is a nice touch.
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Oct 5, 2019 22:51
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Beat Link's Awakening with 35 seashells and 17 hearts. gently caress you Damphe I ain't doing that poo poo, get the gently caress outta here. I wonder why they never used the Windfish in any other games. It's such a cool design and concept and most Zelda characters/ideas at least get nods in other games. He'd have fit into Wind Waker really well (say at a certain point in the game you're hit by a huge storm and wake up in a dungeon borne of the Fish's dreams). Also love the animation style for the two cutscenes. Way more of that in future please Grezzo. Going to dive into LttP now which I haven't played fully since the GBA port. Already feels a lot clunkier and less intuitive. 
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Oct 6, 2019 10:44
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Levias from Skyward Sword?
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Oct 6, 2019 10:53
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Steve2911 posted:
I just finished it too and I realized that they used the Windfish in DQ XI. I guess we can now talk about how these two games take place in the same universe and figure out how all the DQ games fit in the timeline
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Oct 6, 2019 12:48
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Bongo Bill posted:Levias from Skyward Sword? That's just a boring colourless sky whale. 
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Oct 6, 2019 13:14
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I’m at 42 shells and the 7th dungeon. gently caress this dungeon. I knocked down three of the pillars, and have no idea how to get to the fourth. I’ve gotten pretty lucky that this is the first time that I’ve felt stonewalled.
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Oct 6, 2019 14:28
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Open Marriage Night posted:I’m at 42 shells and the 7th dungeon. gently caress this dungeon. I knocked down three of the pillars, and have no idea how to get to the fourth. I’ve gotten pretty lucky that this is the first time that I’ve felt stonewalled. Yeah that's the one dungeon that frustrated me. You just have to play around with the orange/blue crystals endlessly until it all clicks into place.
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Oct 6, 2019 14:30
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Coulda done without the extra poo poo at the end. Otherwise great.
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Oct 6, 2019 14:52
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