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"Fear of" is burying the lede. Fire is literally his kryptonite, it causes him to lose control of his shape and well, die.
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Oct 6, 2019 18:27
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The MSJ posted:Loves chocolate and hates fire. MM should have a crossover with Venom. In Martian Manhunter Vol 2 24, J'onn's avarice for Chocos is represented by a symbiote-like residue. It's a pretty great issue. 
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Oct 6, 2019 18:39
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Instead of Doomsday, it’s J’on from that issue where he hulks out after finding out someone took all of his chocos.
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Oct 6, 2019 20:01
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They basically have J'onn lampoon a bunch of Marvel characters. It's great.
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Oct 6, 2019 20:32
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Whose to say J'onn did not nuke Mars in his effort to finish off the white Martians?
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Oct 7, 2019 04:06
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Guy A. Person posted:I mean, to be totally fair, if the general was Martian Manhunter the entire time he had obviously set himself up to be in this position where he was consistently one of <10 guys in the room for discussions about how to deal with alien threats, so it would be pretty hard to buy that he didn't want to have some input into the matter. The abomination 'Doomsday' was as big a threat as the World Machine I think, he's a planet killer. Not familiar with the character but yeah, the Martian Manhunter probably would have been given some reasons for not joining in if it was a thread Warner Bros was interested in exploring. Something along the lines of Wonder Woman's 'is humanity even worth saving' doubts maybe.
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Oct 7, 2019 07:10
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The MSJ posted:Whose to say J'onn did not nuke Mars in his effort to finish off the white Martians? Hoo boy, white genocide in a Zack Snyder movie is not going to go over well.
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Oct 7, 2019 07:34
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Grendels Dad posted:Hoo boy, white genocide in a Zack Snyder movie is not going to go over well. I mean, at the very least it would quell all the moronic "Snyder is a far right fascist" takes. What I find interesting is that amongst his fans there's a pretty big spread among the political spectrum,. My timeline has women praising SP and defending the amazon outfits, PoC talking about seeing MoS as an immigrant perspective of 9/11, and chuds who have hot takes about SJWs (which I then unfollow cause I don't want that poo poo on my timeline), I am a leftist so I have a bias, but it's difficult for me to not see the movies with a distinct leftist theme, but I am wondering what is it that makes people interpret it as having a conservative bent? Is it Pa kent, the seemingly friendly portrayal of the military, the hypermasculine imagery?
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Oct 7, 2019 12:36
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it's because he's the 300 guy and by god 300 must be bad and fashy, just look at all these terrible jock bros who liked it! people who see MoS/BvS and get any kind of right-wing vibes off of it were already coming into it with some preconceived notions on what the director must be like
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Oct 7, 2019 12:57
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I don't know how you can look at Zod and his crew as anything other as authoritarian, pro-eugenics colonizers. Kyrpton was literally destroyed by ecological collapse that was completely ignored by the aging ruling class. But Pa Kent wasn't a font of inoffensive Midwestern wisdom, so MoS was a love letter Ayn Rand.
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Oct 7, 2019 13:39
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I think the MM reveal adds a bit more to this scene. At 2:11 when Clark stands up and casually breaks the hand cuffs everyone, including the squad of armed soldiers, looks shocked and takes several steps back; except for General Swanwick. He doesn't change his expression and doesn't move, even when Clark walks right up to the two way mirror. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CFrwHXYotI Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Oct 7, 2019 |
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Oct 7, 2019 13:49
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Mr. Apollo posted:I think the MM reveal adds a bit more to this scene. At 2:11 when Clark stands up and casually breaks the hand cuffs everyone, including the squad of armed soldiers, looks shocked and takes several steps back; except for General Swanwick. He doesn't change his expression and doesn't move, even when Clark walks right up to the two way mirror. And then you get a shot of Clark staring at himself in the mirror, with Swanwick standing where Clark's reflection is. Niiiiice.
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Oct 7, 2019 14:40
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"Snyder isnt' smart enough for this!" It's hard to bite my tongue when people poo poo on these two movies. I had someone tell me, "I turned BvS off after 30 mins, read the wiki and decided it was poo poo". Like, what the gently caress. I am all for people not liking it if it doesn't do anything for you but to me that is just lazy and sheepish.
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Oct 7, 2019 15:20
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Vintersorg posted:"Snyder isnt' smart enough for this!" I didn't even watch MoS until long it was on Blu-Ray, and the time I realised that Superman in that movie is not a Randian, fascist maniac who murdered millions of people was around about time I realised that people online are disingenuous as gently caress about media when they want to be.
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Oct 7, 2019 16:01
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I think the barometer on BvS is the "Mankind is introduced to the Superman" flashback when Bruce Wayne wanders into the dust cloud, there's several seconds of whiteness and silence, and then out of the dreamscape trots a horse. If you're not pro- that horse you're not going to enjoy the next couple hours.
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Oct 7, 2019 16:03
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Schwarzwald posted:I think the barometer on BvS is the "Mankind is introduced to the Superman" flashback when Bruce Wayne wanders into the dust cloud, there's several seconds of whiteness and silence, and then out of the dreamscape trots a horse. I think that sums it up nicely.
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Oct 7, 2019 16:08
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Thinking about how pre-BvS everyone was hyping out about Bruce "running into danger" and then totally dropped that when they realized he ran in, accomplished almost nothing, and went insane.
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Oct 7, 2019 17:44
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I was annoyed by the dissonance of this billionaire tearing up the streets in a $17,000 Jeep Renegade
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Oct 7, 2019 18:14
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Online movie crit is built on a foundational canon of hokey received wisdom and shibboleth "takes" which have condemned it to produce little of worth.
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Oct 7, 2019 19:47
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McCloud posted:I mean, at the very least it would quell all the moronic "Snyder is a far right fascist" takes. No it wouldn't.
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Oct 7, 2019 20:11
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AdmiralViscen posted:I was annoyed by the dissonance of this billionaire tearing up the streets in a $17,000 Jeep Renegade It's not his jeep; he commandeers it from one of his private security guys (!).
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Oct 7, 2019 20:51
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Space Fish posted:Gen. J'onn: "Nuke that rear end in a top hat from orbit, we don't need a rival for coolest alien superhero on this planet." While this made me chuckle I'm compelled to point out Swanwick didn't order the nuke.
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Oct 7, 2019 20:56
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MacheteZombie posted:While this made me chuckle I'm compelled to point out Swanwick didn't order the nuke. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rH3LptSyXE
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Oct 7, 2019 21:44
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It's not even just Snyder, really, although he gets more than his fair share. The general public has no idea how much work and attention goes into making movies (unsurprisingly, to be fair, because most film is all about preserving the illusion) which leads to constant bad takes about how any trace of meaning, and especially any kind of internal tension in the themes of a story, must be accidental.
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Oct 7, 2019 21:52
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's not even just Snyder, really, although he gets more than his fair share. i think my favourite version of this take was someone who called the multi-layered dream aspect of Inception a last minute change to add depth to the movie. It was such a profound misunderstanding of literally everything about the creative process, film making, narrative structure...I heard it soon after the film came out and I still can't get it out of my head.
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Oct 8, 2019 01:50
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And for me, it doesn't matter if it's accidental. If it's in the movie, it's in the movie and we should talk about what it means, rather than using it as a means to test the directors IQ. You may as well use chicken entrails if that's what you want. I have no idea if Snyder is smart, but I see things to talk about in his movies, I don't care who put them there or why. If intent mattered, Roar would be a very different viewing experience. Mr. Apollo posted:When the Air Force general suggests it Swanwick calls him crazy and then points out to the President that they'll be killing Superman too. When the president orders the strike Swanwick and his assistant Farris are the only ones who are shown to be upset at the decision. And at Superman's funeral, Swanwick is the one given the flag, because they don't know about any family Supes might have who would get it instead. It's like he's given Supermans legacy/mantle.
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Oct 8, 2019 02:50
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garycoleisgod posted:And for me, it doesn't matter if it's accidental. If it's in the movie, it's in the movie and we should talk about what it means, rather than using it as a means to test the directors IQ. You may as well use chicken entrails if that's what you want. I have no idea if Snyder is smart, but I see things to talk about in his movies, I don't care who put them there or why. I mean I agree with this too but you kind of have to pick your battles and this one is even harder
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Oct 8, 2019 02:53
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garycoleisgod posted:And for me, it doesn't matter if it'
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Oct 8, 2019 02:58
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MacheteZombie posted:While this made me chuckle I'm compelled to point out Swanwick didn't order the nuke. Fair. Move the early jealousy to MoS. "I can break handcuffs, too. Someone cuff me now!"
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Oct 8, 2019 06:10
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The nerd projection on to Snyder is the funniest thing in the world. I wonder what portion of the criticism would disappear if he looked like Joss Whedon. MOS is pretty clearly environmentalist and anti colonial. You probably can’t get Russel Crowe to be in a pro fascist movie. But because Snyder said he appreciated Rand it MUST BE an objectivist story. I hope he makes the Rand adaptations and it’s forty minutes of Galt pissing himself in slow motion.
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Oct 8, 2019 22:12
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's not even just Snyder, really, although he gets more than his fair share. Bay's transformers has to be peak "You're overthinking it, he's just an idiot" when the dude very clearly made Optimus a savage sociopath and the villain of the story, and not by accident. Schwarzwald posted:I think the barometer on BvS is the "Mankind is introduced to the Superman" flashback when Bruce Wayne wanders into the dust cloud, there's several seconds of whiteness and silence, and then out of the dreamscape trots a horse. I still don't know what the deal was with the horses  well why not posted:The nerd projection on to Snyder is the funniest thing in the world. I wonder what portion of the criticism would disappear if he looked like Joss Whedon. If he did most people would accuse Snyder of having a piss fetish or something. It's so aggrivating that it's just accepted knowledge that Snyder is a randian far right objectivist. Last time I pushed someone on that they gave this weird reasoning that the Pa Kent discussion in MoS was "Ayn Rand's main jam" because letting people die now to save people later is super objectivist, instead of, you know, basic loving utilitarianism 101. Like Equeen said, Pa wasn't a font of innoffensive platitudes, so people lost their god damned minds. I think like Brother Entropy says, that Zack coming of 300 made the audience look at him as a right wing meathead, and then he took on the watchmen, which inevitably pissed people off even moore (heh) because there's no way to do the watchmen without pissing off someone, has a lot to do with it. But the most damning thing of all is that he doesn't coddle the viewer, he doesn't sugarcoat the violence inherent in the genre, and he doesn't offer stupid platitudes, and the viewers hate that and call it dark and edgy. It's maddening. But also, and this is slightly tinfoily, but I'm pretty convinced that there's a bias amongst the youtuber/reviewer circles against movies that go up against Disneys markets.
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Oct 8, 2019 22:46
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People don't like something and they look for ways to make liking it immoral. This happens all over the Internet all the time. One of the basic ones is "did you know that this person is friends with <someone who did a bad thing>?" or an even weaker version of that which is "did you know this person never condemned the actions of <someone who did a bad thing who is in their industry or whatever>?" People will literally make up fake bad things about stuff they don't like/fake good things about the stuff they do like and deliberately misconstrue what you're saying in order to keep their hate-boner raging/their fan-stan going. You just have to accept that. What actually brought this into sharp focus for me was people who defended Obama, which is something that actually matters and not a cape movie, but they did the exact same stuff as the Snyder haters. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Oct 8, 2019 |
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Oct 8, 2019 22:55
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McCloud posted:Bay's transformers has to be peak "You're overthinking it, he's just an idiot" when the dude very clearly made Optimus a savage sociopath and the villain of the story, and not by accident. i love how the third film blurs the lines of 'autobots = automatically good, decepticons = automatically bad' a little by having nimoy's autobot character be the main antagonist and that old as gently caress decepticon bomber who's willing to kill himself so optimus can get a power boost or whatever and then in the end after megatron kills nimoybot as he's about to kill optimus and goes 'y'know what? i'm sick of this fighting, let's find some kind of compromise my brother'? optimus just loving murders him, having learned nothing at all
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Oct 8, 2019 23:07
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McCloud posted:Bay's transformers has to be peak "You're overthinking it, he's just an idiot" when the dude very clearly made Optimus a savage sociopath and the villain of the story, and not by accident. I have a low opinion of Michael Bay due to his casual racism (those robots in Revenge of the Fallen), his sexism (the way he films women, Megan Fox's car washing audition, etc.), and his poor humor (like the statutory rape jokes in Age of Extinction). I just have a hard time squaring all of these negatives with the idea that he's a master subversive filmmaker coyly playing with satire but I'll completely admit I may be blinding myself to his positives.
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Oct 8, 2019 23:14
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I want a Zack Snyder Transformers movie and lean into the Christ imagery as much as he did in MoS and BvS, if only to see the response. But I can get people not giving Michael Bay the benefit of the doubt because he's a creep but every time someone talks about working with Zack Snyder it's nothing but how fun, chill and professional he is. Also, here's a hot take you only get on CineD, the worst subforum on this site: I think 300 is an extremely important film in a post-9/11 world. It shows you how seductive and efficient propaganda can be. How you can easily root for the baby-killing, child-abusing, fascists: the Spartans. It tickles the "this is wrong" in the back of your brain but the slick action and sculpted man-meat on display tickles the "hells yiss, fight in the shade motherfuckers!" part of your brain. It's powerful, it's patriotic, it's nationalistic. Turn on the news and that's all you see. CIA-driven narratives demonizing Venezuela (or any other central america and middle eastern country) as we choke the country with disgusting sanctions leading to its population not getting the food it needs. CIA-approved Amazon series (The Jack Ryan show is most overt in this), ect. ect. See how many uncritical "patriots" gobble that poo poo up while the party in charge export their jobs and take away their already sparse social safety nets and having them foot the bill for billionaire and corporation tax cuts. Art is interpretive and I'm not going to pass the buck on to the director because a whole group of morally bankrupt shitheads latched on to it by not seeing, in my opinion, a very important framing device but instead gobbled up the propaganda. Like Zack said, had Verhoeven directed the film it'd be some celebrated masterpiece.
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Oct 8, 2019 23:26
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Violator posted:I have a low opinion of Michael Bay due to his casual racism (those robots in Revenge of the Fallen), his sexism (the way he films women, Megan Fox's car washing audition, etc.), and his poor humor (like the statutory rape jokes in Age of Extinction). I just have a hard time squaring all of these negatives with the idea that he's a master subversive filmmaker coyly playing with satire but I'll completely admit I may be blinding myself to his positives. A self aware rear end in a top hat can still be a huge rear end in a top hat and realize they're a huge rear end in a top hat and use that realization to make fun of other huge assholes. Schwarzenegger is also like this: he is a cocky SOB who has just enough humility to delight in railing other cocky SOBs, he's well-known for it. Snyder throws people because he seems to sincerely believe that violence is loving horrible and also awesome, that sacrifice is both noble and also really hard on a person. He seems to delight in getting you to agree to the latter and then slide in the former, that moment of transgression is clearly what he's going for and his most personal movie, Sucker Punch, is basically built around that as a core premise. The idea that Snyder can't think that dressing up like a bat and beating the piss out of criminals is simultaneously completely awesome and completely psychotic and wants the audience to to feel both those thing at various times has escaped a bunch of casual critics or alternatively made them extremely uncomfortable.
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Oct 8, 2019 23:31
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I want Snyder to do a deep dive into anime and give me my Guyver, Gantz, or Fist of the North Star big budget blockbuster adaptation.
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Oct 8, 2019 23:34
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teagone posted:I want Snyder to do a deep dive into anime and give me my Guyver, Gantz, or Fist of the North Star big budget blockbuster adaptation. i've been saying it for ages: Zak Snyder's Mobile Suit Gundam
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Oct 8, 2019 23:36
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I think Guillermo del Toro would be better suited for a Gundam adaptation.
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Oct 8, 2019 23:37
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del toro already failed to impress me once with giant robots
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Oct 8, 2019 23:38
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