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3 DONG HORSE posted:NASA uses coffee cups in space, my dudes oh neat, i remember seeing the original "prototype" but i had no idea they had actually turned it into a proper thing. i'm so glad cosmonauts can enjoy a proper cup of coffee now 
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Dec 21, 2019 09:24
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I thought this was the weakest season but still pretty good.
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Dec 21, 2019 16:55
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Cactus posted:Yeah make the list. After thinking about it it was pretty short: 1: Don't go to space. 2: If you absolutely have to go to space strap yourself in for every second you can and tie everything down. I think number 2 just solved like 3-4 major plot points lol.
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Dec 21, 2019 18:18
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I kind of wish Ashford going on a mission that was obviously going to kill him hadn't been telegraphed so much
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Dec 21, 2019 18:39
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There's so much great character work in this show that is overshadowed by the protagonist being the drippiest drip who ever dripped. (And I still kinda like Holden.) It's weird that Ashford started out being kind of an undermining rear end in a top hat last season, got better, got worse, and got better again. It's not so much an arc as a weird curve, but I'll be damned if the actor isn't immensely charismatic.
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Dec 21, 2019 18:51
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Also as a non-book reader, it seems like the quality of life on Mars is the highest of anywhere occupied by humans, so Mars is dying doesn't make much sense to me.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:02
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Norton the First posted:Also as a non-book reader, it seems like the quality of life on Mars is the highest of anywhere occupied by humans, so Mars is dying doesn't make much sense to me. Paradise is real, and all you have to do to get there is spend a couple months aboard a colony ship. Ersatz fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Dec 21, 2019 |
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Dec 21, 2019 19:14
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Norton the First posted:Also as a non-book reader, it seems like the quality of life on Mars is the highest of anywhere occupied by humans, so Mars is dying doesn't make much sense to me. That common purpose is now moot. There are hundreds of Earths out there. Maybe Mars can influence the new colonies, but Mars's own history proves you can't really control another planet from afar. So Mars itself is kind of done. This season was a good look at how an otherwise well-to-do society that has lost its collective purpose can kind of fall apart. There's no material reason Mars can't continue on, but if people stop believing that Mars matters, they end up doing things like we saw, and the whole thing begins to rot.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:23
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I haven't read the books either but honestly except for the the 99% who live wherever they want, it seems like it would be a better deal on earth. Everywhere else seems fascist as gently caress or a death sentence. Also we evolved on earth there has to be an deep cellular knowledge that affects more than we understand. I would totally just chill in an Earth flophouse on basic if i had the choice. I mean except for the raining rocks.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:29
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Captain Splendid posted:I kind of wish Ashford going on a mission that was obviously going to kill him hadn't been telegraphed so much It was sort of obvious the second Drummer wasn't going with him that this was a one way mission. Norton the First posted:There's so much great character work in this show that is overshadowed by the protagonist being the drippiest drip who ever dripped. (And I still kinda like Holden.) I wonder if its one of those things that happen because the actor is so good, they change their characters arc? Eiba posted:They were prosperous because they had a lot of resources and a population all focused on a common purpose. Build a new Earth. Yea, the crooked cop says pretty much that. I would not be surprised if season 5 featuers a hot or cold Martian civil war, between those that want to leave and those that want to keep going. Gao seems intent on letting people colonize the ring worlds, though i hope after Illum she's not going to let people go hog wild in case there are more themonuclear islands. Not to mention colonization may either be sped up or slowed down if those asteroids are headed to earth.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:35
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What happened to the green slugs? When Holden opened the door, he didn't seem to worry about them, and all later scenes. (I'm not complaining, I think I just missed something?)
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Dec 21, 2019 19:39
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Fragmented posted:I haven't read the books either but honestly except for the the 99% who live wherever they want, it seems like it would be a better deal on earth. Everywhere else seems fascist as gently caress or a death sentence. Also we evolved on earth there has to be an deep cellular knowledge that affects more than we understand. I would totally just chill in an Earth flophouse on basic if i had the choice. I mean except for the raining rocks. Ever had cabin fever? Like, maybe you had a broken leg or contagious disease or something else where you were just stuck at home or elsewhere with nothing to do, nothing on TV, bored as gently caress. Now imagine feeling that for eighty years or so. Basic is... basic. You get food, clothing, shelter and medical care that keeps you alive but that's it. Society on Earth has become just grudgingly obligated enough to keep its people from starving. Mostly. But feeling bored and useless all the time gets really old really quickly.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:42
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Everyone posted:Ever had cabin fever? Like, maybe you had a broken leg or contagious disease or something else where you were just stuck at home or elsewhere with nothing to do, nothing on TV, bored as gently caress. Now imagine feeling that for eighty years or so. But it's not boring and useless, i live with my family and can gently caress around and make music. Correct me because i haven't read the books but isn't an average basic living a better life then an average human on earth now?
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Dec 21, 2019 19:55
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PowerBuilder3 posted:What happened to the green slugs? Maybe they were associated with the sea water, and could only survive for extended time in sea water. Perhaps after being delivered by the tsunami they were on borrowed time. At least that is the only logical explanation I can come up with.
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Dec 21, 2019 19:56
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Fragmented posted:But it's not boring and useless, i live with my family and can gently caress around and make music. Correct me because i haven't read the books but isn't an average basic living a better life then an average human on earth now? You get a tiny apartment to live in, paper clothes, reconstituted protein paste that's described as tasting "gray", a recreational drug dispenser, and internet access. Minimal medical care is also included. That's about it. There are certainly people on Earth today who would gladly take Basic as an upgrade, but it isn't great. It's the best they can do with the massive population.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:13
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Grand Fromage posted:You get a tiny apartment to live in, paper clothes, reconstituted protein paste that's described as tasting "gray", a recreational drug dispenser, and internet access. Minimal medical care is also included. That's about it. There are certainly people on Earth today who would gladly take Basic as an upgrade, but it isn't great. It's the best they can do with the massive population without meaningfully impacting the wealthy.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:36
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Grand Fromage posted:You get a tiny apartment to live in, paper clothes, reconstituted protein paste that's described as tasting "gray", a recreational drug dispenser, and internet access. Minimal medical care is also included. That's about it. There are certainly people on Earth today who would gladly take Basic as an upgrade, but it isn't great. It's the best they can do with the massive population. Furthermore, you have limited options for self-actualization. Basic isn't cash money. Education? Better hope you win the lottery. And even if you do get an education via internet and place well on your application to go do something? You've still got a low chance of actually getting picked. It can take decades for even qualified people to have an opportunity to use their skills. Human beings need some sort of self-actualization. I have severe depression in part due to the overwhelming feeling that I am helpless to do anything to improve the world. Living on Basic in The Expanse, I would have already committed suicide. On basic, you are basically waiting to die. Power to you if you can survive on just being high all the time and making music. I just hope you're satisfied with a home made instrument, never tasting real food, and wearing newspaper.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:36
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Book basic sounds like being a prisoner inside a supermax jail, but the show seems to have it as people are sorta comfortable but outside of basic needs, they're unfufilled. everyone gets a decent level of food, clothing, housing and entertainment.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:37
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The only person we've seen on the show on Basic was the doctor volunteering at the camp of non-registered people, as far as I can remember. Holden's family managed their own weird loophole situation.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:40
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The basic being described sounds like the ultimate end of capitalism. Something must be done about the poors, so keep them away from rich people and don't let them have any money so they can never improve their lives.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:45
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Grand Fromage posted:The only person we've seen on the show on Basic was the doctor volunteering at the camp of non-registered people, as far as I can remember. Holden's family managed their own weird loophole situation. If I remember correctly Holden's family have control of a small farm they maintain, which they got through some bizarre inheritance scheme where its all in Holden's name because he is technically all of the Commune's child.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:45
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Perhaps making music is not quite as interesting when you know there are 50 million other people who have nothing to do but make music all day. Same with every other creative thing.Ersatz posted:(No book spoilers): Mars lost its raison d'etre the moment the gates opened, because it's no longer necessary for an entire society to organize itself around a decades-long terraforming project aimed at making a dead planet habitable. Wasn't there also something about how young people had grown up living in domes, and didn't see a reason to continue the terraforming project?
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Dec 21, 2019 20:46
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AnEdgelord posted:If I remember correctly Holden's family have control of a small farm they maintain, which they got through some bizarre inheritance scheme where its all in Holden's name because he is technically all of the Commune's child. Not even technically, his DNA is a mix of all eight of them.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:48
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How many Belters are there? Surely a few million at most?
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Dec 21, 2019 20:49
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Oasx posted:Perhaps making music is not quite as interesting when you know there are 50 million other people who have nothing to do but make music all day. Same with every other creative thing. Lol we already have that now. For every breakout internet star, there are probably thousands of content creators on SoundCloud, YouTube, Twitch, hell even Twitter who are trying to turn it into a career while living off their parents or working minimum wage.
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Dec 21, 2019 20:56
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AnEdgelord posted:If I remember correctly Holden's family have control of a small farm they maintain, which they got through some bizarre inheritance scheme where its all in Holden's name because he is technically all of the Commune's child. I think they get a big cash credit for not having more children.
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Dec 21, 2019 21:32
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Norton the First posted:How many Belters are there? Surely a few million at most? According to the wiki there are an estimated 50 million people living in the Belt and beyond, though the OPA claims over twice that number.
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Dec 21, 2019 21:34
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Norton the First posted:How many Belters are there? Surely a few million at most? I seem to remember the number 150 million mentioned, but (even if wrong) that actually isn't that many when you consider the vastness of the solar system*. 150 million spread around dozens of clans who are spread around the entire outer solar system, from the asteroid belt to the moons of the gas giants. That's nothing compared to the tens of billions on Earth and Mars, they'd be a nuisance who the Inners even pay attention to at all because they need the raw resources of the outer system and because the isolated nature of space travel makes piracy and terrorism a continuing issue. *The Solar System, to scale: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zR3Igc3Rhfg It's a video because no one picture that can remotely do the concept justice is small enough to fit on most people's screens. Space, even just our local interplanetary space, is FREAKIN HUGE LIKE OMG 
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Dec 21, 2019 21:47
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This was the weakest season of The Expanse, but it's still great that it's back, and it's better than 99% of any other season of TV that's ever been made. Re: Murtry--Kinda wish they didn't have him take a total Snidely Whiplash "I'm a bad guy" attitude in the second half of the season. The show has been good so far about making the motivations of the antagonists understandable if not sympathetic, but he just came off as unnecessarily cruel, even though *he was actually right about the landing sabotage and attempted murders*. I guess there's no shortage of people like that in real life, and it made the "thank you" scene really gratifying, so maybe it was worth it.
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Dec 21, 2019 21:47
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I don’t understand why Mars would be abandoned just because other planets exist. Europe didn’t get abandoned because America was discovered. We built and continue to build cities in inhospitable hellholes like Las Vegas and Dubai. I see no reason why they wouldn’t keep terraforming Mars.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:27
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Fister Roboto posted:According to the wiki there are an estimated 50 million people living in the Belt and beyond, though the OPA claims over twice that number. That's just the belt actually. The moons of Saturn, Jupiter, and Uranus house more people.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:38
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Boris Galerkin posted:I don’t understand why Mars would be abandoned just because other planets exist. Europe didn’t get abandoned because America was discovered. We built and continue to build cities in inhospitable hellholes like Las Vegas and Dubai. I see no reason why they wouldn’t keep terraforming Mars. The only reason to keep it up would be cultural pride. If there are 1300+ habitable planets, and your children's children will be old by the time the terraforming is complete, why stick around? In real life we have a hard time doing any big project that lasts longer than an election cycle.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:39
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They'll keep terraforming. But overnight Mars has gone from the second most habitable planet after Earth to the 1,302nd. Big loss of motivation.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:44
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I mean, no offence to Canadians or nothing, but Ilus hardly looked like a paradise. Even if Martians continue to live in domes, their standard of living (and existing capital stock) seems pretty ridiculous compared to everybody else. e: Also living in 0.4g would be fuckin' sweet.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:45
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Nail Rat posted:The only reason to keep it up would be cultural pride. If there are 1300+ habitable planets, and your children's children will be old by the time the terraforming is complete, why stick around? In real life we have a hard time doing any big project that lasts longer than an election cycle. Why do people still live in places like Venice or like half of the Netherlands where clearly we weren’t meant to live because it’s all underwater? Places like Phoenix that have no natural water sources? Parts of Russia that average below freezing temperatures? Why do we have people living in Antarctica where they can’t even grow food? Or hell, why did we build a space station where we can’t even survive long term? The fact that Mars is there means that it’s never going to be abandoned. The government may change (ie Ancient Rome) but we are just going to keep building (modern Rome).
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Dec 21, 2019 23:55
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Seems like the solution to Earth's problems is a condom gigafactory, not colonizing distant world's through some weird alien wormhole. Do condoms exists in the Expanse universe?
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Dec 21, 2019 23:56
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GABA ghoul posted:Seems like the solution to Earth's problems is a condom gigafactory, not colonizing distant world's through some weird alien wormhole. Do condoms exists in the Expanse universe? This has been inconsistent. Everyone on Basic is required to be on contraception and having kids requires application and approval, but Ty has also said part of why Earth's population got so big was people without jobs had nothing else to do so they created projects for themselves by having kids. Maybe that happened before Basic was implemented, idk. This is why Holden's family has the whole collective situation. Eight people together could get enough tax credits and loophole whatnots to have a small farm and one child.
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Dec 21, 2019 23:59
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Everyone posted:Ever had cabin fever? Like, maybe you had a broken leg or contagious disease or something else where you were just stuck at home or elsewhere with nothing to do, nothing on TV, bored as gently caress. Now imagine feeling that for eighty years or so. You apparently get at least a terminal on basic. Read. Study public resources. Write. Form connections with people who have similar interests online. Learn how to code and make videogames. Play the games that other people who don't have to work made for free. Do what you like. Watch porn and do drugs. The only thing you're missing is economic influence. And who can say they really have much of that today? We've got economic obligations, but not a heck of a lot in terms of privileges. Everyone we've seen in this story- politicians and adventurers- find basic to be demeaning. But that's because they want status or a feeling of agency. Give up on that bullshit and there's not a whole lot wrong with Basic*. *Depending on the details. Some people are convinced the paper clothes are poo poo (as opposed to customizable comfortable future-paper clothes), and the protein food is disgusting (as opposed to flavored with cheap but effective artificial future spices or whatever). The show and books are both ambiguous on the subject, with the level of horror about basic varying significantly depending on what's being emphasized at any given time. Basically, who cares about feeling "useless." You already are "useless" today, with opportunity largely being an illusion, but with the added burden of needing to work your whole life for no greater purpose than survival. Boris Galerkin posted:Why do people still live in places like Venice or like half of the Netherlands where clearly we weren’t meant to live because it’s all underwater? Places like Phoenix that have no natural water sources? Parts of Russia that average below freezing temperatures? Why do we have people living in Antarctica where they can’t even grow food? Or hell, why did we build a space station where we can’t even survive long term? The thing is, that's a huge step down from being one of two superpowers dominating humanity. There's a lot about their attitude that will have to change in the coming generations, and that's wrecking their culture in the current moment of the show.
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Dec 22, 2019 00:02
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Boris Galerkin posted:Why do people still live in places like Venice or like half of the Netherlands where clearly we weren’t meant to live because it’s all underwater? Places like Phoenix that have no natural water sources? Parts of Russia that average below freezing temperatures? Why do we have people living in Antarctica where they can’t even grow food? Or hell, why did we build a space station where we can’t even survive long term? Because none of the original human settlers of those places had anywhere better to go
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Dec 22, 2019 00:38
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Mars has nine billion people. There will always be Martians, even if they wanted to abandon the planet the logistics are prohibitive. But nobody's going to be immigrating there anymore and tons of people are going to leave Earth and Mars for the new worlds. It would take hundreds of years to move billions of people out to the colonies and even that wouldn't make much of a dent on the populations of those planets.
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Dec 22, 2019 00:43
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