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I think this thread shouldn't be for debates in the sense of trying to prove which religion (or lack thereof) is correct on one topic or another. We're not going to magically solve abortions here no matter what. At best, we can tell people what different religions teach about the issue. It doesn't mean there is no place for debate at all, of course. Hey Guns and I have different experiences with different parts of Eastern Orthodoxy, for example, so whenever a question comes up about what Orthodox Churches teach on X, we tend to give different answers, and argue which position is more representative (well, I do anyway, because I like arguing online), and I don't think that ever escalated dangerously even for what people could call hot political issues like ordination of women. I would very much prefer the thread stayed that way. What I would add to OP is a reminder that people in the thread are mostly just ordinary lay people to set correct expectations.
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Dec 26, 2019 11:14
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Paladinus posted:What I would add to OP is a reminder that people in the thread are mostly just ordinary lay people to set correct expectations. THIS. Especially since the Original OP many moons ago....was an ordained Catholic deacon, IE had actual theological education beyond the normal (vaguely atrocious among Catholic laity) level.
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Dec 26, 2019 11:21
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In terms of politics, a lot of Orthodox leaders are probably more focused on Ukraine right now, given the effect that's having on the Church as a whole. But there was this article in Politico from a few days ago about Orthodox laity and priests within Russia turning against Putin.
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Dec 26, 2019 15:25
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Fritz the Horse posted:Hello I'm permabanned poster robelord_1054 and I'm back to enlighten you all with my extremely correct ideas about religion I saw a beer in St. Louis last week named Snicklefritz and I thought of your registered nicklehorse.
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Dec 26, 2019 15:39
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Religion Thread: It didn't go well for Munster...
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Dec 26, 2019 16:20
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I bailed on the thread at the beginning of the Phiz saga so I'm just now catching up. My thoughts: 1) I like Fritz's proposed thread rules. I would suggest a 'No Crusading' rule...i.e. no charging in and hectoring other people to join your pet cause (I need better wording for this). 2) Abortion chat...I don't know if posters from other countries can understand just how divisive this issue is in the US. IMO, there is no such thing in the US as a rational, dispassionate discussion on this subject. It is an intensely polarizing topic, polling data backs this up. If we unlock this topic in this thread we are asking for this thread to detonate.
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Dec 26, 2019 16:39
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:i don't understand why people think i'm asking for that. i've clarified i'm looking for thought leaders in the spheres of public Christendom. again, it's not a personal thing, i don't want testimony as to everyone's personal antifascist activist histories. (also the mennonite regular has weighed in and even provided exactly the kind of reading suggestion i was looking for) Thought leaders I follow include: Sister Theresa Aletheia and her fellow Daughters of St. Paul. They do a good job in their media charism. I have just started reading the Institute for Christian Socialism, it seems promising. More secular but I really like Liz Bruenig on Twitter. Her husband Matt Bruenig does some interesting economic policy work informed by a left Christian perspective. I don't know if it will be productive to discuss in this thread (it may need its own thread like Cyrano seemed to allude to) but I think there is a discussion to be had about what an activist left Christianity looks like. I'm a politically active Catholic on the left and I run into Christians like me all the time... we're all trying to figure out what to do while we're doing it
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Dec 26, 2019 16:56
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Third post in honor of the Most Holy Trinity  Seriously though, can we all work together to keep this very special place alive? This place got me thru cancer, I don't want to lose it.
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Dec 26, 2019 16:59
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HEY GUNS posted:gently caress. are you ok? Generally speaking yes, thanks. This particular employer is a huge international lab corporation so they must have the internet wizardry and manpower to scour for my email address or something. More than likely my core gmail address was on a forums profile with my handle on some tiny forum fifteen years ago I've long forgotten about. They sent me some written interview questions to respond to and one of them was "could you please describe your activities on the Something Awful Forums" and I was like ohcrap ohcrap. I mean I'll just say something about how it's a comedy forum that can get pretty explicit but I was never involved in the offensive and bigoted stuff which is true. Hopefully they're not actually going to read my (long) post history, I'm assuming it was just flagged and if I give them a satisfactory answer nbd. I'm most interested in working for small colleges though, it was just an unwelcome surprise. Worthleast posted:I saw a beer in St. Louis last week named Snicklefritz and I thought of your registered nicklehorse. Hey now, don't shortchange Snicklefritz Kash, he's a registered quarterhorse! That's five whole nicklehorses! Apparently "snicklefritz" is German slang for a bratty child which is pretty appropriate tbh.
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Dec 26, 2019 17:08
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Fritz the Horse posted:Generally speaking yes, thanks. This particular employer is a huge international lab corporation so they must have the internet wizardry and manpower to scour for my email address or something. More than likely my core gmail address was on a forums profile with my handle on some tiny forum fifteen years ago I've long forgotten about.
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Dec 26, 2019 17:45
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I'm just chiming in as a lurker to this thread and someone who has juggled questions of faith that I appreciate the tone and matter of debate that this thread has a majority of the time. I hope that this thread can continue to be a place for substantial discussion.
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Dec 26, 2019 17:53
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thank you to the reading suggestions made in good faith, i am adding them to my list.HEY GUNS posted:because when you come in here asking an Orthodox person to denounce Jerry Fallwell  good thing i've never asked anyone to renounce anything, then! I'm disinclined to take seriously the rest of your criticism of my behaviors given your propensity to exaggerate what i'm actually posting.HEY GUNS posted:i will dial back my hostility to you and say that in the US, Orthodox people usually don't do "public Christianity"--because of how that has worked out in Europe. I keep trying to capture in words my feelings about reading the phrase "americans don't do public Christianity" while living in a town which is 100% Closed because it's Christmas. Like. . . . Dude. Really? How many Christmas commercials were you exposed to, just last week alone? Also, isn't public Christianity on the rise in Europe as well, largely as part of a wider White Identity movement? Christian thought, metaphors, and traditions are baked into American culture, and it's an extremely specific expression of the faith which is offputting to a lot of non-American Christians. Some common themes I've observed, reguardless of specific denomination: (don't read into this personally, if you don't believe these things then i'm obviously not talking about you) - Biblical literalism (has been covered recently ITT) - anti-government, but extremely politically active - pastoral ideation, disdain for urban spaces and populations - anti-intellectualism, preference for snake oil medical "secrets" - considers works salvation apostasy - homophobic and transphobic, emphasis on male domination of household - islamophobia (FREE SPACE, j/k) - the idea that Jesus's parable about the rich man and the eye of a needle refers to some kind of back gate into a walled city - pro corporal punishment, anti jail reform - prepperism, gold buying - conspiracy theories, states rights - understanding of the Rapture sourced largely from the Left Behind series - Jesus is divine only, with no human nature, and hypostatic union theology is apostasy, also white - the persistent belief that prayer is "banned from schools" - this joel olsteen worship of mammon BS right here - eta: neo-calvinism and neo-calvinism 2: zone of the electors I could go on. I'm not listing these because they're specific points of modern Christendom I find problematic, they're ideas I've encountered only in white American Christians of many different denominations and creeds. This is the public understanding of Christianity I'm talking about, if you ask your average American to describe Christianity, this is what they'll tell you. Maybe y'all don't believe any of that, which is fine. Good. I take no issue with you, even if you do happen to believe a few of those things. But you probably know people in your congregation who believe in many more of them. The reason I take issue with this expression of faith is thus: Taken in concert, many of these beliefs serve to center power in exploitable positions while attacking systems of accountability. For example, imagine a system of government where unelected sherrifs are free to arrest and punish anyone, while at the same time the federal sherrif oversight board has been disbanded. That's patriarchy, that's the kind of social order I think we all want to avoid. When I hear Alistair Begg preach, I imagine his ideal society is just a network of small towns where absolute authority in all things is vested in a single male preacher. That's the end result of this ideology, a sort of theocratic authoritarianism where a leader cannot be questioned because they are the human extension of the divine. I don't think any of you, personally, believe or want that. But that is the end result of this particular school of thought. Pershing posted:Thought leaders I follow include: -------- thank you, and i do believe there's a good conversation to be had here. in my town, both the lutherans and the catholics have an extremely active social services program, but the people who are active with this effort aren't the ones who show up for city hall meetings. it's the rich white conservative christians who are active here, and they're the ones who shut down comprehensive sex education, sanctuary city status, affordable housing, and a skatepark for local teens. just by the numbers, they're absolutely the minority in this city, but they're the vocal minority, and they shut down city hall when they don't get their way. one element working in their favor is the overall concept of christianity in america is much, much more conservative than the faith practiced by most active christians, and it's because the christians who control the media are much more conservative than christians in general. PHIZ KALIFA fucked around with this message at 19:02 on Dec 26, 2019 |
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Dec 26, 2019 18:40
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TOOT BOOT posted:I'm perhaps closer to evangelical than I was six months ago. I started attending a church that's evangelical or at least adjacent to evangelical and learned that not all of them are pushy, judgmental people. i hope it works for you, if you ever get into a position where you can influence church position i hope you do so in a way that ennobles all. if you'd like to get into it, i'm curious what it is about your new church that appeals to you?
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Dec 26, 2019 18:44
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HEY GUNS posted:You're posting with a liberal right now, I'm a liberal. This is why people keep coming in here and attacking me. No, I know I'm posting with a classic liberal, who can take a few punches - that is how I view you. I'm referring to modern centrist liberalism, in which any crime, no matter how insane, can be justified as long as we don't criticize people in power. HEY GUNS posted:A long time ago, Tias thought about making a paganism thread and I think I persuaded him not to because it would just become the anti-paganism version of that. Just really cheap "HEY U KNOW THIS IS MADE UP, RIGHT" Yeah, I still do from time to time. You said you'd post in it, which isn't here or there, but I decided it wasn't worth the hassle if I couldn't get mod powers or have mod backup, which I couldn't. Non-christian faiths, particularly those lumped in with the new-age, are just as tempting trolling targets for dumbshit edgelords as, well, christian faiths  ThePopeOfFun posted:Hard choice. I'm glad it went well for you. Thanks man, me too. What is going to SoBap church in christmas even like? I'll admit to harbouring some prejudices here, but I'm honestly interested and have no idea. PHIZ KALIFA posted:Also, isn't public Christianity on the rise in Europe as well, largely as part of a wider White Identity movement? Short answer: No. There's possible happening some untoward things in southern europe and Russia, but I wouldn't really know. Here in Scandinavia, christendom is often touted by politicians as something that made our countries the way it is, specifically to demonize islamic immigrants, but since no one actually believes in anything that much they're laughed off. Tias fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Dec 26, 2019 |
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Dec 26, 2019 18:51
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:I keep trying to capture in words my feelings about reading the phrase "americans don't do public Christianity" while living in a town which is 100% Closed because it's Christmas. Like. . . . Dude. Really? How many Christmas commercials were you exposed to, just last week alone? HEY GUNS was talking specifically about the Orthodox faith, not Christianity as a whole. Saying that the Orthodox, in particular, aren't the ones putting their faith into public spaces (ask yourself how many Christmas advertisements you're exposed to in a week and a half, which is when Christmas falls on their calendar) seems fairly uncontroversial, in much the same way that (to take a much more absurd and probably better known example) there aren't all that many Amish televangelists (and then imagine I just said that and you reacted with WHAT? OBVIOUSLY TELEVANGELISTS EXIST, DUDE). Reading the rest of your post, I think you and I are broadly on the same page as far as identifying the problem goes (though I'd argue, as I have, that it's less a case of right wing Christianity infiltrating government as it is a case of right wing politics co-opting and in some cases creating a very specific (heretical) form of Christianity, but that's kind of splitting hairs in the end). So. What now? I've made, I think, my own open-ended thoughts on this fairly clear, but I'm curious what you believe the way forward is.
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Dec 26, 2019 19:25
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:I keep trying to capture in words my feelings about reading the phrase "americans don't do public Christianity" while living in a town which is 100% Closed because it's Christmas. Like. . . . Dude. Really? How many Christmas commercials were you exposed to, just last week alone? HEY GUNS posted:i in the US, Orthodox people usually don't do "public Christianity"--because of how that has worked out in Europe. Unless you're living in a town that is full of Orthodox Christians, I think you misunderstood their point. EDIT: Pershing posted:1) I like Fritz's proposed thread rules. I would suggest a 'No Crusading' rule...i.e. no charging in and hectoring other people to join your pet cause (I need better wording for this). I like this rule a LOT Slimy Hog fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Dec 26, 2019 |
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Dec 26, 2019 19:40
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docbeard posted:Reading the rest of your post, I think you and I are broadly on the same page as far as identifying the problem goes (though I'd argue, as I have, that it's less a case of right wing Christianity infiltrating government as it is a case of right wing politics co-opting and in some cases creating a very specific (heretical) form of Christianity, but that's kind of splitting hairs in the end). PHIZ I think a lot of people in this thread with agree with docbeard here; we all know there is a problem with right-wing evangelical Christianity being used for political and monetary gain and I'm sure some people here have even left their family church because of that. But I too wonder what you think the next part of this conversation consists of. Is there something you think we should all be doing that you presume we are not? What's the goal of this conversation?
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Dec 26, 2019 19:50
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Hi thread! I'm not quite sure how I stumbled over here. Maybe that whole "the Lord works in mysterious ways" thing. Anyway, I grew up the step-daughter of a Presbyterian minister. Church and Sunday School every week unless I was, like, dying of the flu or something. Couldn't say "hell" or even "oh my god". When I got to my rebellious teen years, I decided Christianity was bullshit --- a lot of that had to do with finding out my oh-so-pious step-dad was cheating like mad on my beloved mom, with not only the church organist but the secretary. Organized religion (or at least that church) was not for me. I dabbled in pagan/Wicca beliefs. Even made my own religion, with my own pantheon of dieties. And despite my disbelief in an invisible sky wizard, I did a brief stint in NYU's religious studies program for my grad degree. Religion just... interested me. And still does. I still have an ache, a spiritual emptiness, though, which has been getting steadily worse. It tends to peak around this time of year, because drat if I don't miss going to those candleilght Xmas Eve services. I hear "O Holy Night" and tear up. So, enough backstory y'all probably don't care about. I'm only on page 10 of this thread, but it's been fascinating, and I really respect how cool and accepting y'all seem to be about theological differences and such. Maybe I'll get some answers, maybe I'll just get some more questions, but so far this thread has been cool and good and a bit of balm for my soul. The fact that y'all pray for each other is... just really nice to read about. And Cythereal, along with being an awesome poster in my thread about libraries, I love your "gimmick" of posting cute pictures of animals in every post. (I really needed that after reading about those awful orphanage stories). In conclusion: looking forward to reading more, learning more, and I just want to wish y'all a Merry (belated) Xmas, Happy New Year, Festive Yule, Hanukkah, or whatever your holiday/feast day/whatever of choice brings y'all. Crap, I didn't think this was gonna turn into a novella of a post. Sorry. Sincere thanks, everyone. Be good to each other, and yourselves. (and if anyone feels like praying that I get a job soon, that'd be swell. I'm probably on the outs with any powers that be)
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Dec 26, 2019 20:21
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I need to know more about this Libraries thread. Also, welcome!
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Dec 26, 2019 20:48
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JacquelineDempsey posted:So, enough backstory y'all probably don't care about. The thing is, we do care. I do at least. Backstories are the difference between you being you and you being a series of vaguely formed electrons buzzing about. Welcome, I hope you'll stay a while. quote:(and if anyone feels like praying that I get a job soon, that'd be swell. I'm probably on the outs with any powers that be) Done and done. I wouldn't guarantee you're on the outs either, He's forgiven much more. He'd probably enjoy hearing from you, though.
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Dec 26, 2019 21:45
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Thanks for the welcome, y'all.  Pershing, if you like stories about libraries, my thread is just across the street right here in A/T https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3872210 Are there any Unitarians itt? I've kinda considered going to some of their services because it seems like Easy Mode for worship. The one in my neighborhood even has rainbow flags waving outside their pretty church (as someone who identifies as queer, and got chastized by the aforementioned evil step-father for checking out a library book of lesbian fiction when I was 17 (GASP) that's kinda big thing for me).
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Dec 26, 2019 22:08
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JacquelineDempsey posted:Are there any Unitarians itt? I've kinda considered going to some of their services because it seems like Easy Mode for worship. The one in my neighborhood even has rainbow flags waving outside their pretty church (as someone who identifies as queer, and got chastized by the aforementioned evil step-father for checking out a library book of lesbian fiction when I was 17 (GASP) that's kinda big thing for me). If it is a Unitarian Universalist church then you will be welcomed without any need for any professions of faith. The place where I worked, in fact, there were two preachers, one of whom had a "went to seminary, got kicked out for being gay" story arc that is not uncommon... that fellow once had a sermon with a digression on he'd sometimes get people coming up and chiding him for mentioning the G-Word (God) during his sermons. If it is more formally unitarian it will probably be a little more rigorous, but the summation of Unitarian theology is "God rules, Jesus owns, but we don't buy into the Trinity; God is God, and Jesus was his most holy prophet." As a non-Christian this makes more sense to me than the Trinity, but it also isn't really deeply centered. The Universalist summation would be "nobody goes to Hell; every person is saved; maybe you have to do a quick stint in the Lake and maybe Satan's gonna be stuck there, but not any human," which I found appealing as well. After all that positive poo poo here is the balance. They are not going to be saints, even if I can essentially guarantee that you will encounter no deliberate discrimination. I left that UU church because my boss was an rear end in a top hat - he was just an rear end in a top hat for completely conventional rear end in a top hat reasons that had nothing to do with the theological color of the Unitarians. (Had the other preacher been in charge, I might still be there!) They will also DEFINITELY be very politically active - liberal/progressive/etc. - which you may not find desirable if you are looking to step outside of secular affairs for a while. e: There is some interesting history behind the fusion which I know very little about - the Unitarians were very much northeastern "liberal" protestants and the Universalists were both much more southern and a lot more black - but I only know about it from a couple of chats from the cool preacher mentioned above while he was driving me to work sites. Nessus fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Dec 26, 2019 |
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Dec 26, 2019 22:32
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First off, I like the way this conversation is going. It's constructive, and educational for me. I'm reading along although I'm refraining from trying to steer or contribute too much because I want this to be about you folks. Second, Phiz, from my readings of what is going on here (and again, I'm not referencing poo poo that's gone on earlier than the day before yesterday or so) it seems like you have some serious and very legitimate grievances, but they're directed against people who aren't exactly represented in this thread. You also seem to make some pretty sweeping generalizations, but I"ll set that aside. This is a problem I've also run into moderating TFR's gun control thread. Frequently you will have someone who wants to talk about how mass shootings and high cap mags, and then someone else will immediately go off on a very passionate post about the historical racist and classiest roots of gun control. The two end up talking past each other, and end up arguing. The person who wants to ditch high-cap mags because they are being called a racist class enemy, and the other poster because they end up thinking the first poster is defending Jim Crow gun laws. My bit of advice would be to take a few steps back and try to be a little less confrontational. You're doing that already, flagging the areas where you're not directing something against any specific posters in this forum, which is a good step. I think half of the issue that we're seeing is posters reacting to your tone and approach as much as anything else.
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Dec 26, 2019 22:51
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Nessus posted:e: There is some interesting history behind the fusion which I know very little about - the Unitarians were very much northeastern "liberal" protestants and the Universalists were both much more southern and a lot more black - but I only know about it from a couple of chats from the cool preacher mentioned above while he was driving me to work sites. Right. A lot of the difference between the two groups was class related. Unitarians tended to be upper class New Englanders and their descendants, while Universalists tended to be a lot more socially and geographically diverse, largely because they engaged in revival and missionary work in the 19th century.
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Dec 26, 2019 22:55
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So I've been traveling for family for the last few days, merry belated Christmas everyone.HEY GUNS posted:it's still more or less Cyth holding down the side for the evangelicals Even then, I think it's important to stress that I'm an Evangelical by background and theological belief, not actual church affiliation - I usually describe myself as 'non-denominational' or 'flexible' when it comes to precisely which flavor of Christianity I adhere to, because describing my theological beliefs as 'Evangelical' or 'Southern Baptist' carries a whole lot of baggage I never want to tangle with because for me, Christianity is a deeply individual religion where the fine details (as I see them, other denominations may hold these differences in far greater import) are largely irrelevant and I don't think God cares. I left the Southern Baptist Convention I grew up in because of its politics, not its theology, and how I believe the SBC was corrupted by the temptation to use theological justifications to rationalize and justify their politics. Hating gays? Not in the original SBC theology. Neither was sexism, racism, prosperity gospel, or a whole host of other issues I'm sure anyone in this thread is familiar with. For me, this thread's fundamentally been two things: a place where I can learn about different ways people approach God and Christianity, especially when so many of them are so alien to my idea of what faith and religion are; and a place where I can talk about faith and spiritual matters without being judged by internet atheists. It's an odd little space on SA, but one I value immensely, and I regret the times I've contributed to sending this thread astray. https://i.imgur.com/MrZNvVq.mp4
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Dec 26, 2019 23:03
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Tias posted:No, I know I'm posting with a classic liberal, who can take a few punches - that is how I view you. quote:There's possible happening some untoward things in southern europe and Russia, but I wouldn't really know. Here in Scandinavia, christendom is often touted by politicians as something that made our countries the way it is, specifically to demonize islamic immigrants, but since no one actually believes in anything that much they're laughed off. just like in scandinavia a few people made fun of them and it was dropped. HEY GUNS fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Dec 26, 2019 |
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Dec 26, 2019 23:29
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Cythereal posted:For me, this thread's fundamentally been two things: a place where I can learn about different ways people approach God and Christianity, especially when so many of them are so alien to my idea of what faith and religion are; and a place where I can talk about faith and spiritual matters without being judged by internet atheists. It's an odd little space on SA, but one I value immensely, and I regret the times I've contributed to sending this thread astray. I've had similar conversations with an old friend of mine who became a Catholic priest, to the effect of "we obviously have deeply different outlooks, but I appreciate profoundly that I don't have to justify my faith to you."
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Dec 26, 2019 23:31
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JacquelineDempsey posted:I'm probably on the outs with any powers that be lord have mercy!
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Dec 26, 2019 23:32
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Slimy Hog posted:Just a heads up that capital "O" Orthodox means a particular group of Christians ...
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Dec 26, 2019 23:36
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HEY GUNS posted:phiz, have you seriously never heard of the orthodox church before Be careful though PHIZ, I didn't know what they were and when I found out I became one.
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Dec 26, 2019 23:42
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Slimy Hog posted:Be careful though PHIZ, I didn't know what they were and when I found out I became one.
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Dec 26, 2019 23:48
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HEY GUNS posted:nessus, we may not evangelize but this is how we get you
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Dec 27, 2019 00:00
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Nessus posted:People read the description and go "THAT'S ME" at which point they show up in your open plan sanctuaries? When does the beard happen?
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Dec 27, 2019 00:02
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I can't recall if I posted about this before but I have discovered that Prinknash incense, the Basilica blend, smells exactly like I remember church smelling when I was young. Puts me in a peaceful headspace.
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Dec 27, 2019 00:15
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Just chiming in on thread identity talk as a nonreligious lurker and occasional poster: Things I like in this thread: seeing people being nice and supportive of each other, general religion chat, discussions of doctrine, weird obscure jokes about religious things, anecdotes about wholesome church people, historical stuff, and (belive it or not) discussions of problems in modern religious polity. Things I dislike in this thread: egoistic slapfights that sometimes happen. This thread absolutely needs space for people to discuss stuff like "the intersection between American Evangelical Christianity and ..." but those discussions should remain in the abstract so that it doesn't devolve into attacks on other posters.
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Dec 27, 2019 00:17
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HEY GUNS posted:phiz, have you seriously never heard of the orthodox church before If you'd asked this of me around the time of my first posts on these shores, I'd have had to say that I'd heard of you, but only vaguely and wasn't really aware of the Orthodox Church as a going thing (certainly not in the US), I certainly couldn't have told you a tenth of the things I've picked up just hanging out in this thread. And judging by the number of times I've had this exact same conversation about Mennonites and no not the sort with the buggies and no the Amish are different and yes I had electricity in my house growing up and we were basically just a slightly weird flavor of Protestant, I begin to think that maybe our insular faith communities have done a very good job of being insular faith communities!
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Dec 27, 2019 00:29
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Oh, and welcome, Jacqueline!
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Dec 27, 2019 00:31
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CommonShore posted:Just chiming in on thread identity talk as a nonreligious lurker and occasional poster: If another thread lurker (and very-occasional poster) might surface for a moment, I agree with pretty much everything CommonShore just said. I too am nonreligious (I sometimes describe myself as a Sagan-flavored atheist) but I still think religion is a fascinating topic and I totally understand its emotional draw. And this thread is just about the only place on the entire Internet where intelligent and inclusive conversations on the topic are to be found. Yes, slapflights do happen sometimes, but the overall friendly vibe to be found here always survives them. Of course it'd be better if the slapfights didn't happen at all, but I'd hate to lose this entire thread just for the sake of shutting them down.
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Dec 27, 2019 00:33
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PHIZ, how do you feel about silence? And how do you feel about pacifism? Do you like very simple, plain meeting houses with egalitarian rules and bugger all ceremony? If you have positive feelings about those things, especially silent worship and pacifism, you might come join Society of Friends (Quakers). We welcome everyone. We are politically left leaning. We are very pro LBGT+, since LOVE is almost as important as Faith. In fact, we have had same sex marriages for centuries already. We have believed in equality of all genders since the 1700s. We welcome outsiders who want to join us for prayers, whatever their religion. However, we are NOT activists. Goes against the pacifism rule. Blessed are the peacemakers. Also not compatible with the ideal of simplicity and meekness. But we do perform social works, taking the "I was hungry, you gave me food, I was thirsty, you gave me water, I was in prison, you visited me, etc" very seriously. Just don't ask us to take direct part in any kind of demonstration that might involve violence or showing off. So while I will not be joining Antifa, I will happily nurse anyone injured by fascists, be it a physical, mental, or spiritual injury.
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Dec 27, 2019 00:37
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docbeard posted:ask yourself how many Christmas advertisements you're exposed to in a week and a half, which is when Christmas falls on their calendar
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Dec 27, 2019 00:48
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