|
Grouchio posted:Would Cuomo be preferrable to Biden? I've heard he might be a casted name at the convention. Why are these rumors about Cuomo instead of Newsom? Not that it would happen, but isn't Newsom doing a better job?
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 06:18 |
|
|
Herstory Begins Now posted:Also idk wtf is up with the 5-10 years. The fastest ever vaccine development time is about 4 years. The average vaccine development time is 10 years.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:18
|
|
|
If we had decided 10 years ago to try to make a vaccine for coronaviruses, with the idea that another SARS might come around, would we have been in a better position now to make a vaccine for SARS-CoV-2? Would those efforts have been a “foundation” that researchers could have built on to speed up a vaccine? I know this is a new strain, but it is the same family and the same species as SARS-CoV.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:21
|
|
|
friendly 2 da void posted:The fastest ever vaccine development time is about 4 years. This is meaningless because the resources of the entire developed world are being poured into making this vaccine, and there are plenty of governments who are willing to sign off on fast tracking human trials. If the record was 4 years, it will surely be broken.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:24
|
|
|
Spacebump posted:Why are these rumors about Cuomo instead of Newsom? Not that it would happen, but isn't Newsom doing a better job? Cuomo is leading New York through the toughest struggle it has had since 9/11, and this one is far worse. He has a very high profile right now, especially because he is a) doing a pretty good job and b) coming across as a human and a unifier, things that are in direct contrast with Trump.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:26
|
|
|
Plus alot of Democrats actually support Cuomo cutting medicaid and leaving thousands of people in jail to suffer and die. The taste for blood is not unique to Republicans.
Dick Trauma fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Apr 13, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:29
|
|
|
Mince Pieface posted:That said, my opinion is there will never be a vaccine. Oh is that how it works Cancel the trials, boys!
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:42
|
|
|
Slowpoke! posted:This is meaningless because the resources of the entire developed world are being poured into making this vaccine, and there are plenty of governments who are willing to sign off on fast tracking human trials. If the record was 4 years, it will surely be broken. I still cant decide if I find it hilarious or depressing that Trump keeps trying to buy off scientists from other countries so he can monopolize any potential vaccine like its going to happen before the election.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 03:53
|
|
|
e.pilot posted:Lol look at this guy that’s never met a Trumper irl It’s not just Trumpers, a succ dem radio host in my metro area is breaking down daily because he can’t handle being with his two preteen kids all day and last week started talking about how experts he was reading were talking about opening the economy up so people can develop herd immunity and antibodies and we can all go back to normal and Fauci is an unelected official in government for 30 years So there is definitely the edge case for lockdown to broke brain a lot more people than just chuds
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:07
|
|
|
enraged_camel posted:Cuomo is leading New York through the toughest struggle it has had since 9/11, and this one is far worse. He has a very high profile right now, especially because he is a) doing a pretty good job and b) coming across as a human and a unifier, things that are in direct contrast with Trump. Newsom seems to be doing everything better
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:38
|
|
|
Steve Yun posted:Newsom seems to be doing everything better Inslee is in the same boat. However they both acted early and actually prevented poo poo but you don’t have the national media folks living in CA or WA so you don’t hear about them as much.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:43
|
|
|
Willo567 posted:Tell me the reason why people still think that Trump has an advantage over Biden at this point He possesses the bully pulpit. He gets all the air time. Biden gets poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:46
|
|
|
Steve Yun posted:Newsom seems to be doing everything better Doing everything better is boring. People love a visceral film script. In a film the coronavirus gets completely solved by sciencing a vaccine or commandeering GM's assembly lines to manufacture 200,000 ventilators per day, so people assume that's how this problem will end, instead of the more likely scenario of carefully managed testing, tracing, and distancing. That's too boring.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:51
|
|
|
Gavin Newsome is also a liberal android that spits out even-keel pragmatism. He's got a lot less character and narrative than a guy like Cuomo, so news outlets aren't as interested.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:52
|
|
|
It’s not too late, Newsom, you can start loving things up to raise your chances at the presidency
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 04:54
|
|
|
Trang province in Thailand decided to close its borders today, manually. You're going to start to see more and more stories like this, I think. This is the soft reaction, as well.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:08
|
|
|
And Ranong Province. Just catching up (it's morning there).
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:12
|
|
|
friendly 2 da void posted:The fastest ever vaccine development time is about 4 years. The Ebola vaccine took about 5 years, but there wasn’t the same urgency as with coronavirus. They’ve already bypassed animal trials on a couple of vaccines and there’s something like 60+ individual efforts going on. That doesn’t mean they’ll find a vaccine, but normal timetables don’t really apply here. They’re even pushing for different quicker manufacturing methods, like tobacco plants instead of eggs. Still no guarantee it’ll work, but it’s not for a lack of resources.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:18
|
|
|
Krispy Wafer posted:The Ebola vaccine took about 5 years, but there wasn’t the same urgency as with coronavirus. They’ve already bypassed animal trials on a couple of vaccines and there’s something like 60+ individual efforts going on. That doesn’t mean they’ll find a vaccine, but normal timetables don’t really apply here. Oh poo poo, there's an ebola vaccine? That's great. Also, yeah; if a vaccine is possible, we're going to find it and do it in record time given the resources being poured into it literally worldwide. Of course, maybe a vaccine isn't possible, but I have to believe we'll come up with some kind of treatment at least that helps in a meaningful way. I guess there isn't a 100% chance of that happening but I feel like the odds are extremely high.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:23
|
|
|
Morrow posted:I'm not clear on the details but coronaviruses are apparently very difficult to make vaccines for. Remember this is technically SARS-CoV-2, and we have yet to put together a vaccine for SARS. iirc there are candidate vaccines that never got testing because there were no SARS patients. They're getting evaluated now but it's a long process to make sure it doesn't cause harm (or make the disease worse through some kind of immune modulation akin to the Dengue virus type cross infectivity potentiation). The scandal here is that we didn't put the resources into developing a broad spectrum antiviral effective against coronaviruses after the scares with SARS and MERS.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:24
|
|
|
Platystemon posted:He possesses the bully pulpit. But that airtime is not put to any good use by Trump. His base o'syncophants may eat it up, but he's alienating everyone else.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:27
|
|
|
Krispy Wafer posted:The Ebola vaccine took about 5 years, but there wasn’t the same urgency as with coronavirus. They’ve already bypassed animal trials on a couple of vaccines and there’s something like 60+ individual efforts going on. That doesn’t mean they’ll find a vaccine, but normal timetables don’t really apply here. Also I believe it’s the Gates foundation that is funding the simultaneous manufacturing of seven different candidate vaccines so that if any of them are found to be successful the supply will already be there.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:28
|
|
|
Slowpoke! posted:If we had decided 10 years ago to try to make a vaccine for coronaviruses, with the idea that another SARS might come around, would we have been in a better position now to make a vaccine for SARS-CoV-2? Would those efforts have been a “foundation” that researchers could have built on to speed up a vaccine? It’s hard to say how much time it would have saved. We’re taking a shotgun approach to this. There were, last I heard, forty‐three vaccines for SARS‐CoV‐2 under development right now. The slowest part of the process is the testing. Billions of people are going to be vaccinated, so it’s essential that it’s absolutely safe. If it has a fraction of a percent chance of serious injury, that’s tens of millions harmed. Big trials are necessary to flush out small effects in statistics, but a big trial by definition risks the lives of many volunteers. So we test first in animals, then in increasingly larger groups of humans. This time, we’ve already skipped animal studies and injected humans with candidate vaccines. The critical question is “would ten years experience with coronavirus vaccines have given us enough confidence to fast‐track testing more than we are now, to move forward with larger trials and public deployment earlier?” With flu vaccines, we have that confidence. We produce new vaccines in six months, knowing that we’ve given very similar vaccines to millions of people for decades and that big surprises at this point are unlikely. Had we developed vaccines for each of the four coronaviruses that cause common colds, they shared a similar formula, and we’d made them widely available, we might have had something approaching the same confidence for coronavirus vaccines that we have with flu vaccines. If we’d developed vaccines for MERS and SARS, those may have been niche enough not to save us much time. Of course, if one of those vaccines had provided crossover protection, even partial protection, against 2019‐nCoV, we would have hit the jackpot.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:30
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Also I believe it’s the Gates foundation that is funding the simultaneous manufacturing of seven different candidate vaccines so that if any of them are found to be successful the supply will already be there. I don't think we can compare the race for a vaccine for SARS-CoV-2 to any other vaccine ever made in terms of the enormous global resourced being poured into it. There's just nothing like this because we've never had this kind of global pandemic before. Even the Spanish Flu didn't hit the entire globe like this (and it also took longer to spread because of how technology and travel was a century ago).
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:31
|
|
|
When most of the relevant medical fields and institutions of all the major medical powers of the world are all told, "gently caress politics, we gotta do that Contact / Deep Impact thing and figure this poo poo out." we'll know how long a vaccine takes. We're basing our projections on what we have done before. If this continues to shut down the borders and economies of many countries, and people continue to die in increasing numbers, and when the wealthy countries of the world figure out that the poorer countries are going to fall into disarray (some with big bombs), either that's going to happen or a schism is going to happen and it'll be a bifurcated effort, but I'm surprised we still haven't at least seen a moonshot attempt on a regional level. It would shock me if we don't have a worldwide science taskforce within 3 months if luck doesn't intervene in the form of a meteor killing all of us or what have you. If we do do what has been done before, then, yeah, the scientists are right. Hope for some kind of anti-viral or whatever, because otherwise it's gonna be a minute.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:42
|
|
|
enraged_camel posted:Cuomo is leading New York through the toughest struggle it has had since 9/11, and this one is far worse. He has a very high profile right now, especially because he is a) doing a pretty good job and b) coming across as a human and a unifier, things that are in direct contrast with Trump. In what way is Cuomo doing a good job? Absolutely? Not a chance. Relatively?
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:43
|
|
|
Slowpoke! posted:This is meaningless because the resources of the entire developed world are being poured into making this vaccine, and there are plenty of governments who are willing to sign off on fast tracking human trials. If the record was 4 years, it will surely be broken. I'm sorry but I don't think this is confirmed to be the case. Maybe it's possible to speed up the development time. Maybe it isn't. Some things just take time. Vaccines specifically have to wait months and years to check for any long term effects. Because a vaccine that causes severe effects down the road could kill hundreds of millions. Personally I am more alarmed by the "gold rush" going on for vaccine development than comforted. Skipping animal trials does not console me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:44
|
|
|
It’s like the saying that “nine women can’t make one baby in a month”.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:46
|
|
|
So what's everyone's plan for how to adapt to all the meat plants shutting down? What's the most popular alternatives for folks ITT? As a meat eater I'm watching the widening scope of plant closures for all kinds of meat processing with growing alarm.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:46
|
|
|
VH4Ever posted:So what's everyone's plan for how to adapt to all the meat plants shutting down? What's the most popular alternatives for folks ITT? As a meat eater I'm watching the widening scope of plant closures for all kinds of meat processing with growing alarm. Legumes are the poo poo. I eat plenty of meat, but I'd easily give that up before I give up legumes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 05:54
|
|
|
Do we have a list of states with major churches that were open today? I’m curious if we’ll be able to see any bumps in cases in the next week or two.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:03
|
|
|
The issue is the giant loving profit whoever succeeds in creating the vaccine will make. It means that most of the efforts are siloed. People talk as if this is a giant international manhatten project and it's not. There is certainly a lot of cooperation, maybe even more than normal, but for the most part these efforts are separate as evidenced by Trump trying to buy off the german effort. More groups does mean more chance one is successful and whichever one is will certainly be rushed to market much faster than normal, but this is a competitive race not a group effort. VH4Ever posted:So what's everyone's plan for how to adapt to all the meat plants shutting down? What's the most popular alternatives for folks ITT? As a meat eater I'm watching the widening scope of plant closures for all kinds of meat processing with growing alarm. We are buying a big rear end deep freezer and half a cow, a pig, and some chickens from a local farmer. We'll be stocked on high quality, free range, hormone and antiobiotic free meat for at least a year at cheaper prices than we could find for the equivalent in the store. We've wanted to do this for years anyway so this just gives us a reason to. Unfortunately, most people are not in a position to be able to do this and I expect meat consumption will drop drastically in the short term.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:08
|
|
|
eXXon posted:In what way is Cuomo doing a good job? Absolutely? Not a chance. Relatively? There's no need to argue about it, just go look at his massive approval ratings compared to before this pandemic.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:17
|
|
|
VH4Ever posted:So what's everyone's plan for how to adapt to all the meat plants shutting down? What's the most popular alternatives for folks ITT? As a meat eater I'm watching the widening scope of plant closures for all kinds of meat processing with growing alarm. Most animals we eat are relatively young, basically raised just enough to maximize yield. So if for whatever reason the processing and packaging have to shut down for some time you could just, not kill the animals for another week/month/year. A temporary shortage could easily be a thing but it doesn’t feel like it’ll be a long term issue? I’ve never been a “I need meat at every meal” kinda person though so It just strikes me as an odd thing among all of this to worry about.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:31
|
|
|
kittenmittons posted:Legumes are the poo poo. Ironically beans ran out way faster around here so it’s not really that good of a substitute option right now.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:33
|
|
|
Platystemon posted:It’s like the saying that “nine women can’t make one baby in a month”. Yeah, there are some time tables that can't be sped up. One vaccine using a completely new process is already in human testing, but they're testing by giving subjects the vaccine and then spending the rest of this year checking their blood for antibodies. It's easily a full year from start to finish before they'll know if it works or not and there's a significant chance it won't. And that's the quickest possible option. Another method uses tobacco plants to grow the vaccine instead of eggs and that's faster, but even if it halves the manufacturing time you're still looking at a year to develop the treatment and 3 more months to grow it. So the absolute best case scenario is 15 to 18 months.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:46
|
|
|
Tobacco plants are angling hard for redemption. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCW6qeJt-JA
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:53
|
|
|
I feel like some group or country is going to bypass the long testing period on vaccines and it might be a disaster and it might be a “no! You can’t simply vaccinate people with this vaccine that has not been tested for years”/“haha, vaccine machine goes brrrr” comic
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 06:54
|
|
|
Owlofcreamcheese posted:I feel like some group or country is going to bypass the long testing period on vaccines and it might be a disaster and it might be a “no! You can’t simply vaccinate people with this vaccine that has not been tested for years”/“haha, vaccine machine goes brrrr” comic Nooooo you can't just amplify my own immune response and turn my organs into soup noooooooo haha cytokine machine goes brrrrr
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 07:13
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 06:18 |
|
|
Platystemon posted:Billions of people are going to be vaccinated, so it’s essential that it’s absolutely safe. If it has a fraction of a percent chance of serious injury, that’s tens of millions harmed. Getting it out early saves the stock market, the economy and the ability for capitalists to steal through wage. Our system is broken enough that they'll push anything on us that they think will work to get the grift back on track. They won't sell us outright poison (at least most of them won't) but they'll shove shakily tested, dubiously understood cures on us with little regard to long term problems so long as the short term problems as well as mid-term problems aren't overwhelming. If people get sick or die, so what? It gets the grift back on track and all of the focus goes towards getting capitalism chugging along and concentrating capital in the hands of the few once again. They're going to do long term cost-benefit analyses with the cost of the average human life versus how much that human life costs to keep fed, watered and sheltered on the government dime. If they've got a good, cheap vaccine or treatment, they'll give it to us. If they've got a lovely, cheap vaccine or treatment, they'll give it to us. Expensive and good? Wellllll...Whatever gets the economy back on track. Let's see what gets us in the black and what gets us in the red. Remember that what we're seeing right now are the contradictions of capitalism writ large. Do you look at the medical system and see a system that is designed to provide care first and foremost? No, it's there to harvest money from ordinary people. So why should the vaccine be any different? Both our leaders and ordinary people won't tolerate ten years of this. So it's not just pressure from capitalists, but the pressure from capitalists wins out first, foremost and always. The people are to be managed. That's all. I will not be getting a vaccine until at least six months in no matter the carrots they dangle in front of me nor the sticks they threaten me with. The speed at which they operate is going to be dangerous and the pressure to drop the vaccine early is going to based in the rationality or the market, not in the rationality of care. Even long term, maybe even medium term concerns will be outright ignored. The important part is the grift. That's all. There is very little thought past the quarterly numbers.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2020 07:14
|
|
