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Scream 4 is the only good Scream sequel.
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Apr 24, 2020 22:14
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Scream 4 has Alison Brie, so you are correct. 
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Apr 24, 2020 22:18
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The caller idea gag, the movie theater murders, the shock of Randy's death, really unpacking the ramifications of Cotton who is not a murderer but still a lovely dude, having the murderer being a parent who blames Sidney's mom as a stand-in for parents blaming the media for their kids's lovely behavior. Scream 2 is great, it's just a sequel to a perfect movie.
Timeless Appeal fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Apr 24, 2020 |
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Apr 24, 2020 22:42
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Currently brainstorming a thesis on how Scream and New Nightmare are both perfect meta horrors that were death knells for the slasher genre, but both spawned two distinct family trees of modern (or post-modern I suppose) horror. I've had a few drinks, so I'll probably forget all about it in the morning.
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Apr 24, 2020 22:55
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To me New nightmare is essentially the student film that gets turned into the feature of Scream
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Apr 24, 2020 23:11
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Friendship ended with Schrecknet
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Apr 24, 2020 23:58
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Shrecknet posted:To me New nightmare is essentially the student film that gets turned into the feature of Scream I agree with this. I remembered liking New Nightmare more but I rewatched it last year and I was pretty let down by it. Meta-commentary alone does no make a great work and that's most of what it has going for it. It's so much less fun and interesting than Scream.
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Apr 25, 2020 02:22
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New Nightmare would be a great movie if the setpieces were better. I like everything about it except most of the "scares". Maybe I'd need to be a parent to get it.
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Apr 25, 2020 02:48
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I think Popcorn is probably my favorite pre-Scream Scream.
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Apr 25, 2020 05:49
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New Nightmare is fine and is a fun meditation on the idea of scary stories and why we tell them. But I think it does bug me that Scream gets pegged as a simply a meta movie, and let's be clear, that's part of it, but it's also not what makes the movie special. Friday the 13th Part 6 also has characters openly discussing horror movie tropes. Scream is something else. If you voted for Blade just on the love for Blade 1, here is why you need to change your vote: 1-- Scream is a fantastic whodunnit. Look at this goddamn piece of artwork. You get the goofy fun of Randy calling out the correct fact that the dad is a red herring and Billy is the killer, but also check Matthew Lillard's performance. First you see him getting anxious as he realizes that Billy is still a suspect, so he transitions to trying to plant hints that the father is the murder, planting the seeds so he can frame Mr. Prescott later. But then he starts to get anxious as Randy is unconvinced and goes on his "Everybody's a suspect" rant. You can see there is both anxiety over being found out and also over the fact that they might have to kill Randy. And it's not even the only scene like that! Watch this scene where Stu openly gloats to Sidney about how he murdered her mother (The only murder Stu was involved in at this point in the film) and Billy subtly tells him to shut the gently caress up. Randy correctly guesses why Stu chose them as victims, and Billy once again subtly tells him to calm the gently caress down. 2-- Scream is a fantastic slasher. The opening scene of Scream is amazing. A great magic trick of recreating and upping the Psycho technique of killing your big name actor, but it also might be the best slasher scene on film? It definitely rivals the Psycho shower scene or the Halloween closet scene. I love and appreciate Blade and even Blade II, but for gently caress's sake. The best scenes of Blade cannot rival the mastery of pacing and tension that is that scene. Or how good a job Drew Barrymore does of getting you invested in her. It's legitimately harrowing and devastating on the first watch to see her die. But the whole thing works like an overture, heightening the sense that no one is safe. The attack on Sidney, the garage scene, and the film's finale are all just amazing. As much as I agree with Scream being the end of slashers, go back to the moment of Stu and Randy bickering and Sidney just legitimately having no idea what to do, who to trust. Halloween and Friday the 13th all have that moment where things are sort of unraveling for the heroine and the bad guy seems unstoppable, but I think Scream does probably the best job at really putting you in the point of view of a heroine who's losing the plot and has no idea what to do. You really have no idea what's going on in that first watch. 3-- Scream is feminist as gently caress-- Scream is the story of a girl who deep down questions if the mean girls in the bathroom were right: Her mother's promiscuity made her deserving of murder. Sidney overcorrects and is wary of sex. This only sets her up to essentially be guilted into sex by a man who reveals to be the actual person who murdered her mother. In the end of the film, Sidney is lectured by the man who killed her mother and essentially raped her by gaslighting her into sex. She sees the game. It doesn't matter if you're a slut or you're a virgin, they'll always be some turd like Billy making you fee like poo poo. So, she takes loving control. She doesn't only emasculate them by robbing them of their costumes and doing their scary voice. She doesn't just completely diminish them by doing the simple act of calling the loving police. She takes control of the film itself. Scream is never from the killer's POV, always the victim. So when Sidney takes control, the film is finally from Billy and Stu's PoV because they're the victims. It even rewrites the Halloween closet scene. Billy the villain is still outside the closet, Sidney is inside, but instead of hiding and cowering, she shoots out and stabs the gently caress out of him. I really don't think that I have such a trained dopamine release from a movie as when Billy and Stu lose Sidney and the phone rings. But of course Sidney doesn't just kill Billy. Gale helps. Gale who is depicted as being a bitch the whole movie and what does the end of the movie reveal? gently caress yes Gale is a bitch and the exact woman needed to shoot a motherfucker. Could Gale Weathers kill Blade? You know the goddamn answer. Scream is not just a meta movie about slashers. It genuinely might be the greatest Slasher ever made, the grand finale of a genre, perfecting and refining it. And on top of that, it just has an amazing batting average. Scream 2 isn't as tight and nowhere nearly as good a whodunit, but it's heads and shoulders above some of the depth of crap that other stuff gets into. Same for Scream 3 and Scream 4. It is a goddamn travesty if the end of this bracket isn't Scream vs Evil Dead. Timeless Appeal fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Apr 26, 2020 |
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Apr 25, 2020 18:27
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Timeless Appeal posted:New Nightmare is fine and is a fun meditation on the idea of scary stories and why we tell them.  to all this. Every time I watch Scream I appreciate it more. New Nightmare is good but it’s not nearly on he same level.
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Apr 25, 2020 19:30
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Timeless Appeal posted:It is a goddamn travesty if the end of this bracket isn't Scream vs Evil Dead. I think something neat would be if people signaled their intent to lens a particular franchise starting in the Sweet Six-Scream, with a focus on not just why its great, but the specific road it took to get here and why it beat the movies it did (speculation welcome, obviously) Also, I wanted to ask about process. Do you guy want to do two matchups and a shortened voting or four matchups (the entire western division) and a longer 6-7 day voting? Also, apropos of nothing, #Scream3 is trending on twitter right now. 
Shrecknet fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Apr 25, 2020 |
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Apr 25, 2020 20:03
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I would say more matchups with longer voting period to allow more time to watch the movies we haven't yet. edit: I may try to go through the Wishmaster series if possible. I've never seen any of them and really just seems like it had probably the easiest path forward of any other film. There's about 10 first round knockouts in other areas of the bracket that I think could be in its place based on reputation, but I'll just have to watch to find out. TrixRabbi fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Apr 25, 2020 |
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Apr 25, 2020 20:51
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TrixRabbi posted:I would say more matchups with longer voting period to allow more time to watch the movies we haven't yet. 
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Apr 25, 2020 20:58
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Shrecknet posted:Also, I wanted to ask about process. Do you guy want to do two matchups and a shortened voting or four matchups (the entire western division) and a longer 6-7 day voting? I would prefer less matchups per vote but with shorter voting periods. I can't tell if this is Courteney Cox mad at the observation, or agreeing with the observation and balking at the sight of her own hair in that movie.
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Apr 25, 2020 22:00
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I think a longer voting process is fine IF people get involved in the discussion and would consider actually going back to change votes. I enjoy reading the arguments and happily will change a vote - haven't yet though as I am 100% correct so far despite some of my faves losing. If there is a chance of Elm Street losing to Candyman please let me know so I can go in a massive strop as I don't have time to defend it properly right now as I spend most of my days writing my film dissertation (oh how I wish I wrote it on Elm Street).
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Apr 25, 2020 22:00
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I will say that right now there are three blowouts and one literal tossup but I am not saying which one is a toss up
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Apr 25, 2020 22:18
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I have no inside knowledge but I gotta imagine the tossup is From Dusk Till Dawn vs. Hellraiser with Nightmare, Scream and Evil Dead poised for blowouts. That's just my sense from the discussion and strengths of the actual films. Though a Candyman upset would be fascinating, I don't see it happening.
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Apr 25, 2020 22:20
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TrixRabbi posted:I would say more matchups with longer voting period to allow more time to watch the movies we haven't yet. I just watched the first one the other day and I actually really enjoyed it. I have a hard time believing it does anything other then become terrible but I’m fine with you finding out for me!
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Apr 25, 2020 22:44
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Wishmaster more than any other series lives and djes based on the Djinn's performance and Andrew Divoff, sadly, departs after the second film.
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Apr 25, 2020 23:15
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As someone who watched all the Wishmaster movies for this let me say, don't watch all the Wishmaster movies. The last 2 are bad, don't have Divoff, and kind of barely even resemble Wishmaster movies. The last one barely even has wishes and they're like all completely effortless nothings and instead its all about some weird angelic plotline. I'm 90% sure someone just had some bad angel and demon scripts and write in a few "wishes".
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Apr 25, 2020 23:29
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It just strikes me as having the most extraordinarily lucky path forward of all the films in the tournament. Psycho, the Zombieverse, Maniac Cop, Basket Case, Jaws, Prom Night, The Omen, Phantasm, Ju-On, Sleepaway Camp and Poltergeist could all easily be in its spot and they each got knocked out first round by tougher competition. Child's Play didn't exactly have tough competition either, but that one is at least a deserving classic. A-Tier if not high B-Tier franchise.
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Apr 25, 2020 23:54
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TrixRabbi posted:I have no inside knowledge but I gotta imagine the tossup is From Dusk Till Dawn vs. Hellraiser with Nightmare, Scream and Evil Dead poised for blowouts. That's just my sense from the discussion and strengths of the actual films. I'm thinking it might be the Blade/Scream matchup. We've seen a bunch of people talking about their love for Blade so it wouldn't shock me.
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Apr 26, 2020 05:16
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I'm rewatching Candyman 2 to confirm that it's as good as I remember, but it's just really mediocre. Tony Todd and Veronica Cartwright give excellent performances, but it's not enough to cut through all of the time wasted on white anxiety bullshit and boring milquetoast characters. I'm going to keep my vote for Candyman because I'm really not much of a fan of the Freddy films, but I'm not going to be mad when Freddy wins.
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Apr 26, 2020 05:55
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TrixRabbi posted:Wishmaster just strikes me as having the most extraordinarily lucky path forward of all the films in the tournament. Psycho, the Zombieverse, Maniac Cop, Basket Case, Jaws, Prom Night, The Omen, Phantasm, Ju-On, Sleepaway Camp and Poltergeist could all easily be in its spot and they each got knocked out first round by tougher competition  Shrecknet posted:
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Apr 26, 2020 13:37
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Debbie Does Dagon posted:I'm rewatching Candyman 2 to confirm that it's as good as I remember, but it's just really mediocre. Tony Todd and Veronica Cartwright give excellent performances, but it's not enough to cut through all of the time wasted on white anxiety bullshit and boring milquetoast characters. I'm going to keep my vote for Candyman because I'm really not much of a fan of the Freddy films, but I'm not going to be mad when Freddy wins. That one definitely wasn't an objective pick for me. Like, I objectively realize that NOES has more good movies in it than Candyman but I just like Tony Todd's Candyman more. Always have. So I voted for Candyman. Not really based on logic, but that's ok.
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Apr 26, 2020 16:23
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Basebf555 posted:That one definitely wasn't an objective pick for me. Like, I objectively realize that NOES has more good movies in it than Candyman but I just like Tony Todd's Candyman more. Always have. So I voted for Candyman. Not really based on logic, but that's ok.  It's just a shame we don't have Jordan Peele's Candyman yet, maybe that could have tipped the scales? If it ever comes out.
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Apr 26, 2020 17:32
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TrixRabbi posted:Child's Play didn't exactly have tough competition either, but that one is at least a deserving classic. A-Tier if not high B-Tier franchise. If I had to choose, I think I would rather watch all the Child's Play movies over all the Halloween, Nightmare, or Friday movies. I think it's not going to hang with what look like the the big dogs (Universal, Evil Dead, Romero). But I think it really rides on a pretty strong baseline of quality while never being great outside of like 25 minutes in 2.
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Apr 26, 2020 18:39
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feedmyleg posted:Man, I love that bright red goo. It perfectly typifies the gothic romantic fantasy of horror over a grim realism. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwoSQpsNg3E
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Apr 27, 2020 03:47
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I literally had no idea this even existed. Guys the NIT tournament for this is gonna be insane.
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Apr 27, 2020 04:19
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Shrecknet posted:I literally had no idea this even existed. Guys the NIT tournament for this is gonna be insane. Lake Placid was a perfectly adequate but extremely forgettable creature movie in the 2000s and the fact it became a franchise is insane.
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Apr 27, 2020 05:08
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Lake Placid is a great subversion of so many creature feature conventions. It's really good and catches you completely off guard with how wholesome it is.
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Apr 27, 2020 13:49
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Having rewatched Scream and watched Blade for the first time this weekend, I'm still solidly in the Scream camp. Scream 2, despite it's flaws, is still great. And Scream is basically perfect. Blade is a wonderful action horror movie, but like Predator and Predator 2, it's more of an action movie than a horror movie, and therefore doesn't deserve title of best HORROR franchise. There is literally never a set-up for a scare in Blade. Scream manages to be scary and tense for 45 minutes without anyone dying. It's so impressive.
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Apr 27, 2020 14:14
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 This is a bit last minute, but I'm changing my vote from Hellraiser to From Dusk Till Dawn. I just watched both FDTD sequels back to back and they're very fun b-movies. They're flawed of course, but at least they're consistently entertaining. Now more cynical people might say that I'm just reeling from the trauma of watching Hellraiser 4, 5, 9, and 10 yesterday, and to them I say yes, absolutely, but still...
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Apr 28, 2020 05:30
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Even with Blade technically being a higher seed I feel like if it wins over Scream that's gonna be a massive upset.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:44
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Scream falling (a) in the Sweet 16 and (b) to Blade would shock the hell out of me and forever alter my understanding of spookadoodle lovers tastes and recommendations.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:52
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STAC Goat posted:Scream falling (a) in the Sweet 16 and (b) to Blade would shock the hell out of me and forever alter my understanding of spookadoodle lovers tastes and recommendations. I agree. Scream's too good, and Blade isn't really a horror movie. Predator is more of a horror movie than Blade.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:54
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Fine. Y'all convinced me to switch my answer to Scream.
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Apr 28, 2020 17:55
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Counterpoint: Blade has this shot
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Apr 28, 2020 17:56
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I love Blade. I'm not badmouthing Blade. My posting history includes arguments FOR Sticky Fingaz, Trinity, and bad CGI. Hell I think somewhere in my posting history is a favorable comparison of Blade to The Strain. I love Blade. But we're talking about Scream.
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Apr 28, 2020 18:06
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