|
EponymousMrYar posted:I'm going to try planting them one-by-one to see if that's where the RNG proofing breaks down in my Hawkeye/Riesz/Duran NG++ team. Yes, but also they do draw from a fixed pool. Last night I kept resetting the same 10 seeds over and over and I would get the same items in the same order of seeds. quote:1 gigas lance What was weird was that even after like 30+ resets, the last 3 seeds were surprisingly stubborn in only yielding the same 3 items and never once yielded anything else. After a while I just proceeded to open seeds in pairs of 10s for a couple or rounds till I figured what was in which position, then proceed to open one by one and reset till I got the best result of each pool. Kyrosiris posted:This is completely incorrect. I had six carried over from my first playthrough and they went Paladin, Paladin, Necromancer, Liege, Liege, Nightblade. Yup, this was incorrect, I just tested it. Opened 6 seeds and got 5 new and 1 dupe. Then the 7th seed I opened gave me the last class item I was missing. I did try earlier to openning before switching to class 2 and I got a lot more dupes than after switching, so maybe class switching resets the seed pool tables? lezard_valeth fucked around with this message at 23:06 on May 2, 2020 |
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 00:50 |
|
|
Dumb questions: I am guessing they did by virtue of it being a completely new engine, but they fixed Duran’s shields so that they work, as well as the bigger bugs in the SNES aversion, right? Also, if I play through a beginning chapter of one of my companions, will I need to do so if I choose one of them as a main character in a future play through?
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:12
|
|
|
Unlucky7 posted:Also, if I play through a beginning chapter of one of my companions, will I need to do so if I choose one of them as a main character in a future play through? You will need to play through your primary character's prologue no matter what. The option to play through your companion's prologue is there so you can experience it first hand without having to main them, hence why nothing carries over. It's a nice touch so you don't have to start 6 games just to see everyone's prologue first hand.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:23
|
|
|
If I have two class items for the same character and use one. When I use the second, can I change back and forth between the classes or am I stuck with the second one?
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:41
|
|
|
You can revert everything but it requires a special item that's only available at the end of the game. For all intents and purposes, you pick one class and stick with it.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:45
|
|
|
The class items are consumable, if you know you'll never use them  But you can also save them for NG+ or maybe you wanna class change for the post-story dungeon/boss. Re: seed RNG, the fixed pool of 3 items per seed is something I observed before readibg the above posts - I can reroll all night but for the same seed it's always the same item out of the pool of consumable / serum / gear. I'm getting (class 3) weapons from silver seeds too, right now, but that's with a level 5 pot and cactus bonus. Seeds rerolling on class change would make sense due to class locked items, TBH.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 23:55
|
|
|
iirc in the original you seemed basically meant to be set up for your 3rd class by the time you got to the sanctuary of mana, so this change to the seeds (to both make them available later, and, apparently, more random) seems kinda silly and also annoying.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:08
|
|
|
orcane posted:The class items are consumable, if you know you'll never use them Don't forget the anise "items aren't used" chain ability if you want to go even further into breaking this game.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:20
|
|
|
MShadowy posted:iirc in the original you seemed basically meant to be set up for your 3rd class by the time you got to the sanctuary of mana, so this change to the seeds (to both make them available later, and, apparently, more random) seems kinda silly and also annoying. I actually remember the opposite - I think leveling was a bit slower in the original than in the remake, and I seem to remember farming for ??? seeds in the mirage jungle or equivalent post-godbeast areas. Like, the first SNES God-Beast is level 28 and then each one after that is +2 levels, which means that if you're merely keeping on pace with their levels (which I recall having to grind to do - I'd make a point of gaining two levels in each pre-God-Beast zone) which means you're only even getting 38 like four or five God-Beasts in, and the ??? seeds felt like they only started dropping regularly after that point.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:25
|
|
|
Zenithe posted:Don't forget the anise "items aren't used" chain ability if you want to go even further into breaking this game. yup! my new game plus i have charlotte running around lucent beaming the gently caress out of everything with angelas class change item
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:26
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:I actually remember the opposite - I think leveling was a bit slower in the original than in the remake, and I seem to remember farming for ??? seeds in the mirage jungle or equivalent post-godbeast areas. Like, the first SNES God-Beast is level 28 and then each one after that is +2 levels, which means that if you're merely keeping on pace with their levels (which I recall having to grind to do - I'd make a point of gaining two levels in each pre-God-Beast zone) which means you're only even getting 38 like four or five God-Beasts in, and the ??? seeds felt like they only started dropping regularly after that point. Yeah third class was very much an "endgame" thing.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:36
|
|
|
I definitely remember the original being slower. I got confused about the game warning me to class change before the beast man Forrest since I was far from level 38. I realized they meant the first class change since the original version I always stopped to grind to class change at the undine mana stone, this game I class changed at the wind stone a full zone earlier without even trying for it. I’m near level 40 with only 2 god-beasts in when I remember trying to sync up level 38 with the class change when most were dead. Some of that could be the system, battles feel like something that can be plowed through while the original they were plodding and sorta to be avoided since there was no map so you could burn supplies on being lost.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:40
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:I actually remember the opposite - I think leveling was a bit slower in the original than in the remake, and I seem to remember farming for ??? seeds in the mirage jungle or equivalent post-godbeast areas. Like, the first SNES God-Beast is level 28 and then each one after that is +2 levels, which means that if you're merely keeping on pace with their levels (which I recall having to grind to do - I'd make a point of gaining two levels in each pre-God-Beast zone) which means you're only even getting 38 like four or five God-Beasts in, and the ??? seeds felt like they only started dropping regularly after that point. I'd probably have to look things up to be sure. but I very distinctly recall doing the class change just before getting the sword of mana. hmmm...
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 00:45
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:I actually remember the opposite - I think leveling was a bit slower in the original than in the remake, and I seem to remember farming for ??? seeds in the mirage jungle or equivalent post-godbeast areas. Like, the first SNES God-Beast is level 28 and then each one after that is +2 levels, which means that if you're merely keeping on pace with their levels (which I recall having to grind to do - I'd make a point of gaining two levels in each pre-God-Beast zone) which means you're only even getting 38 like four or five God-Beasts in, and the ??? seeds felt like they only started dropping regularly after that point. Leveling was quite a bit slower in the original, yes. You usually wouldn't hit first class change until whichever of the Fire or Ice Crystals you hit first (without grinding you'd hit 18 somewhere on either the Ghost Ship or the Island) and you likely wouldn't hit level 38 until sometime late in the Benevodon run or even early into the unique penultimate dungeons. In the remake I easily had 18 from beating the boss of Gusthall, and had 38 before ever starting the Benevodon chapter. Which is cool, because it's fun to be able to get to play with your toys and it was almost pointless to build yourself getting 3rd classe since you'd have them for pretty much JUST the last two dungeons. (Mostly a factor for Hawkeye and Angela, since they both had stinkers in their 2nd classes in the original.)
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 01:04
|
|
|
So uuuh, about to finish my 2nd playthrough with Dark Duran, Light Angela and Light Kevin. Planning on moving on to Riesz and Hawkeye next when I noticed that you can kinda set yourself up for a screw up if you pick both of them and Angela on your first playthrough since none of them learn any healing spells and you'd have to rely only on item heal. Would make for an interesting challenge mode.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 02:03
|
|
|
I finally beat the primary game with my team of Duran, Hawkeye and Riesz. I played on Hard and never even really struggled for a second. That may be a combination of how tanky Light Duran is combined with buffs/debuffs from the other two. I'm embarking on the post-game stuff now and I want to farm some seeds for gear. I have like 20 ??? seeds to carry over to the new game + also. All in all I have to say how impressed I am at how faithful this remake is to the original. Almost to a fault but it's also the game I remember and love. The quality of life stuff is great (though they could have taken it further IMO). Combat is really, really fun and even when the camera is bad it's not that bad. I'm really looking forward to my next playthrough and I'll probably platinum it at some point too (which is rare for me).
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 02:09
|
|
|
lezard_valeth posted:So uuuh, about to finish my 2nd playthrough with Dark Duran, Light Angela and Light Kevin. Planning on moving on to Riesz and Hawkeye next when I noticed that you can kinda set yourself up for a screw up if you pick both of them and Angela on your first playthrough since none of them learn any healing spells and you'd have to rely only on item heal. Would make for an interesting challenge mode. Riesz gets a little bit of healing capability with her light classes. Probably not enough to eliminate the need for healing items, but it should help conserve your Poto Oils.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 02:11
|
|
|
My first playthrough was Reisz/Hawkeye/Angela and Reisz went Starlancer so I had no healing I never ran into a single fight where I even used 9 healing items. Every boss and trash mob exploded immediately. Edit: I take it back there was one fight somewhere against some boss, uhh, Bil & Ben maybe? Where I chewed through 9 chocolates on dumbass NPCs standing in AOEs then let them die and solo'd the boss with a few candies as Reisz I played on normal though deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 02:25 on May 3, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 02:23
|
|
|
lezard_valeth posted:So uuuh, about to finish my 2nd playthrough with Dark Duran, Light Angela and Light Kevin. Planning on moving on to Riesz and Hawkeye next when I noticed that you can kinda set yourself up for a screw up if you pick both of them and Angela on your first playthrough since none of them learn any healing spells and you'd have to rely only on item heal. Would make for an interesting challenge mode. I ran this squad first because they are collectively best girl and healing was a minor annoyance at most. If anything it's a lot easier to item-heal because of the instant animation. A no-item run would be quite interesting though. The main challenge would be tolerating Charlotte.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 02:39
|
|
|
Considering how trivial it is to heal between fights, Riesz’ healing is mostly pointless. I haven’t tried Vanadys’ regen passive, but 1% hp per 10 seconds seems useless. But I think you’ll be fine without a healer. Inventory management and keeping topped up between fights is trivial compared to the original game and with a strong team it’s very unlikely you’ll run out of healing items during fights. For people wanting to get into the 3rd class ASAP, the trick I used was to scum the ??? seed chests near a save point, then magic rope out and sprout the seed. Reset if it’s not what you want and go get the seed from the chest again. There are chests near save points in the snowfields, the shimmering ruins and chartmoon tower, though you have to run through the whole dungeon to get to them in the case of the ruins and the tower. There’s a video on YouTube showing the exact locations of the chests. Am I missing some way to see what buffs are on a character other than the icons over their portrait? It’s frustrating that I have six buffs that all occupy the same space and I can never tell what I need to reapply.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 03:01
|
|
|
Heithinn Grasida posted:Considering how trivial it is to heal between fights, Riesz’ healing is mostly pointless. I haven’t tried Vanadys’ regen passive, but 1% hp per 10 seconds seems useless. But I think you’ll be fine without a healer. Inventory management and keeping topped up between fights is trivial compared to the original game and with a strong team it’s very unlikely you’ll run out of healing items during fights. Ohhh, so you can't scum the seeds after you get them, but you CAN scum the chests that have the seeds if you haven't opened them yet? Makes sense
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 03:20
|
|
|
MShadowy posted:I'd probably have to look things up to be sure. but I very distinctly recall doing the class change just before getting the sword of mana. hmmm... You can’t even get ??? Seeds in either the original or this game until after that point. You probably recall using the statue in the Sanctuary of Mana to class change since you can only do it after all the Benevodons are released.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 03:47
|
|
|
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm misremembering at this point; most likely it's a combo of remembering everything up to getting the Mana Sword (if rather vaguely) and remembering basically nothing after that except doing the class change. I don't recall the plot beats for the part leading up to confronting the Queen of Altena (though the plots not hard to follow or figure out), but I must have gone through it before at some point.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 04:44
|
|
|
So I've been playing with the japanese VA so far because Riesz' english VA when I played the demo scarred me, and I must say I love the direction they went with Kevin's and Angela's voice acting. Kevin really sells the kind introverted shy kid (although he falls a bit short when he has to deliver more dramatic or angry lines) and Angela really comes off as a spoiled kid (and her VA has great line delivery). Charlotte is also a let less insufferable in english than in japanese. Riesz though...
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:17
|
|
|
I like boring old woman Riesz! I haven’t finished my third play through but I’m worried that the last achievement will require me to beat the game with all 6 characters through 6 separate playthroughs. Which is fine but that’s gonna take a long time, even though you can beat the game in like 6 hours in NG+ but that’s still like 30 hours of one-shotting dudes.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:23
|
|
|
jokes posted:I like boring old woman Riesz! Not only don't you need to do this (it's only 3 playthroughs, because the "pairs" have the same story), but the last achievement for all achievements is kinda buggy, i got mine before I got my dark lich story one.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:39
|
|
|
Dackel posted:Not only don't you need to do this (it's only 3 playthroughs, because the "pairs" have the same story), but the last achievement for all achievements is kinda buggy, i got mine before I got my dark lich story one. I just got mine getting the Ferry Flute on my first NG+.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:54
|
|
|
Does anyone know if the chain ability "cheat" works on bosses? (damage to monster of level lower than the character's increased by 20%)
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:56
|
|
|
So I'm at Anise with a Light Angela Light Duran Dark Riesz party, what is the Hot Strat for the speedrun besides spamming Lucent Beam+
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 05:58
|
|
|
Alxprit posted:So I'm at Anise with a Light Angela Light Duran Dark Riesz party, what is the Hot Strat for the speedrun besides spamming Lucent Beam+ You pretty much got it. Debuff and blast away. Duran should be able to handle any healing solo.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 06:05
|
|
|
Making sure you single phase her first form is the best time saver I think. I'd CS lock her before she gets another round of crystals up. The body itself becomes moot after dodging for 2 attacks or so (unless you have no interrupt on I guess)
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 06:08
|
|
|
I finished Anise at like 1:20 on hard by Angela spamming Lucent Beam+ the entire time with Riesz buffs and Duran; I got lucky and Duran locked her twice in Phase 1, too. My party was like 72. By 99 it would only be easier, especially since I didn’t optimize abilities and was carrying unnecessary things like “heal 5% hp/mp after battle”. Angela is no joke. Definitely the strongest character in this easy game for children. Using her felt like a cheat.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 07:19
|
|
|
Yeah, I can't imagine it's too dissimilar from running it with Dark Angela/Light Duran/Dark Hawkeye like my first playthrough, just replacing Lucent Beam+ for Dark Force for Phase 1 and Ancient Curse for Phase 2. Blow up the crystals with four quick casts (3 if your AI buddies behave and tackle a crystal together) then turn on Anise and start chunking, and once phase 2 starts just throw out some casts after dodging her waves of attacks while having Hawk get the Defense Debuff out. If you can coax Duran into locking Anise into place for the end of Phase 1 with Magic Rend, great, but it's hardly necessary depending on your damage. I dunno if the spread of damage on Lucent Beam + is enough to keep up with the extra damage Dark/Dark/Dark Angela gets with Wound Magic All/II (I got about a minute even on my last run with a party in the mid 70s with Angela and Hawkeye having their class 4 weapons) but two minutes should be easily doable.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 07:33
|
|
|
Speaking of story, I'm getting the impression after doing Charlotte's story that Charlotte/Kevin is the 'true' route? Mirage Palace just seems... better fleshed out than Riesz' when it comes to plot, and while Duran appears a lot if you don't use him, Angela just doesn't appear at all. Also yeah, final achievement is definitely bugged. Also got it when I got the Ferry Flute on NG+.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 08:09
|
|
|
lezard_valeth posted:So uuuh, about to finish my 2nd playthrough with Dark Duran, Light Angela and Light Kevin. Planning on moving on to Riesz and Hawkeye next when I noticed that you can kinda set yourself up for a screw up if you pick both of them and Angela on your first playthrough since none of them learn any healing spells and you'd have to rely only on item heal. Would make for an interesting challenge mode. My first run was Riesz/Hawkeye/Angela and the lack of healing spells was not even remotely an issue.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 08:12
|
|
|
I just made it to the credits for the first time. Secret of Mana was one of my favorite SNES games growing up. Both times I attempted to play a translated version of the SNES version of Trials of Mana, it froze on me losing a few hours of progress. It's good to finally beat this game. Even if it was a 3d remake on a portable Nintendo. If you're on the fence about this game and are a fan of the series, you should get it.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 08:19
|
|
|
Dark/Light/Dark Hawkeye puts out an absolutely comical amount of damage if he hits weaknesses, especially with Dark/Dark/Dark Charlotte bringing another 12% damage for hitting weakness. I wonder who's gonna be my world-ending damage dealer in playthrough three?
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 08:26
|
|
|
Recommend giving Angela a go. There’s a reason that Angela’s class 4 battle is against herself. No one else can stand toe to toe.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 09:13
|
|
|
Arkeus posted:Speaking of story, I'm getting the impression after doing Charlotte's story that Charlotte/Kevin is the 'true' route? Mirage Palace just seems... better fleshed out than Riesz' when it comes to plot, and while Duran appears a lot if you don't use him, Angela just doesn't appear at all. Each of the antagonists are interesting in how they connect to earlier and later entries in the Mana series, and later stuff tried to enforce how each of the games are parallel or reflections of each other (though I think Heroes just explicitly makes it a multiverse and Anise is just implied to echo everywhere now). So Duran/Angela's route introduces the Dragon lord, which you don't really get that much detail about, but you get a whole Dragon story arc in Legend of Mana. Charlotte/Kevin's route's villain is essentially Thanatos again from Secret of Mana. Hawkeye/Riesz's antagonist gets used again in Dawn of Mana and Sword of Mana, which just retroactively added Isabella and Dark Lord into FFA (also Goremand for some reason).
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 09:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 00:50 |
|
|
I can't quite get under a minute on the time trial with Dark/Dark Duran, Light/Dark Angela and Light/Dark Kevin even with all of them at 99. Best time so far is 1:16:29. It's mostly the first phase again, losing time thanks to the boss teleporting and getting hit by the crystal spells (which debuff) and being hitstunned by her melee 'explosion' attack. Both Duran and Angela handle the first phase about the same. The second phase Duran does a little bit better simply because I have more Chain Skills to buff him up to absurd levels with than I do Angela. His CS skills are mostly a wash though, Gust Slash is too weak and Quakebringer/Hellion Slash only hit the boss's body, so it's simply faster for him to normally attack. Angela's kind of gimped too, not only because of lack of chain skills and reliable debuffing, she didn't get her class 4 staff despite me having 30 rainbow seeds at the end of the stockade. Duran/Angela's story kind of suck for doom sword spawns to farm those. It takes Duran a few 4x combos to take down the second phase while my Angela did it in about a dozen Lucent Beam+'s. I'm not entirely sure the skills that buff incrementally on attack stack (Duran's Rage and Angela's Elemental Overflow,) I had better results with Duran using Judge (20% damage to boss's) and even after the 20 or so Lucent Beam+'s it took Angela to spam down the encounter they weren't doing more than 30% more damage, if that. D/D Duran can't quite match the 'rip things in half' ferocity that D/L Kevin can do. Duran needs to hit an elemental weakness to get up to Kevin's level and Kevin is just way more self sufficient (D/L's locked skill invulnerability and his special Stat Down Resistance that 100% nullifies all stat downs.) Spacebump posted:Does anyone know if the chain ability "cheat" works on bosses? (damage to monster of level lower than the character's increased by 20%) jokes posted:Recommend giving Angela a go. There’s a reason that Angela’s class 4 battle is against herself. No one else can stand toe to toe. That fight is harder than Black Rabite  Game-overed me 3 times to Black Rabite's 1.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 10:00
|
|