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Fast Luck posted:I like Nat and have no problem with people pulling for her to win, but I do think saying "it's part of the game," while obviously true, avoids how completely ridiculous it is as a concept. Yeah, for me at least it's kind of a concession. It feels bizarre and un-survivorlike. But at the same time, I get 30 hours of this show a year and I'm gonna rationalize whatever I have to in order to enjoy it. I would absolutely love it if we never saw edge again
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May 8, 2020 17:57
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Parity warning posted:wait why wasn't there an auction lol Max posted:I honestly think if it hadn't been Chris that returned and won, and maybe Reem or someone who's story was better than "I just wish I had played a perfect game" and then stupidly getting booted 3rd, people may have been more sympathetic to EoE. He's just completely bland as a character. Yeah, I kind of low key hated Chris all along so that made him coming back and winning way more of a flop to me.
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May 8, 2020 18:02
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I'll not butthurt about EoE but I agree it shouldn't come back I understand why Jeff thinks they need to constantly innovate EoE is basically exile island and redemption island concepts combined I think it would be better as some sort of in game punishment Really the thing EoE gets the most hosed up is the jury, it's really unbalanced
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May 8, 2020 18:11
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That's maybe the most frustrating point, there is a seed of a good idea there and I can see it working with some retooling, but as it stands now it works mostly to just keep personalities in the game that have been voted out, and how the jury gets affected, as you said.
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May 8, 2020 18:16
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I'm generally not a fan of it, but I think I'd be a lot more interested in it as a concept if everyone was stuck on their own mini EoE island and couldn't interact with anyone else other than monitored contact during the jury trips to/from tribal council. It'd be a ton of work since everyone would have to have access to the same advantages/hidden tokens/puzzles If they really want to get back to the idea of surviving, see what a month of isolation where you're fully responsible for your own food would probably result in a lot more flag raises.
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May 8, 2020 18:28
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Aerox posted:I'm generally not a fan of it, but I think I'd be a lot more interested in it as a concept if everyone was stuck on their own mini EoE island and couldn't interact with anyone else other than monitored contact during the jury trips to/from tribal council. It'd be a ton of work since everyone would have to have access to the same advantages/hidden tokens/puzzles Yeah it's gotta be waaaay easier to stay strong when you have other people around. Really I think the easiest way to make it work would be to just have a single challenge to get back in the game at the merge, or if you have to have two then have the other one be no later than final 7 (to make it 8 in the tribe)
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May 8, 2020 20:12
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Maybe if Nat makes it back and wins they can finally realize how bad of a twist EOE is and they can send it the way of redemption island. Or they can just go all in and do a EOE Redemption Exile Island and spend the entire episode on people that have been voted out.
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May 8, 2020 20:16
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I've always disliked EoE, but that feeling is especially strong this season. The combination of EoE with fire tokens means that players who have been on EoE longer (ie have been voted out earlier / played a worse game) have more time to gather fire tokens and get more likely advantages in challenges for battling back than the contestants voted out late in the game.
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May 8, 2020 20:22
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Whatever you think of EoE I don't think its fair to discount Nat's token reserve as "she's been there longer." Amber and Danni's pockets aren't exactly overflowing. Nat's balled out all season and done so despite probably having the least food and comfort of most anyone on the cast. You might not like EoE or the idea of Nat having a good chance to get back in, but I think she at least deserves the credit that she busted her rear end and earned it within the rules of the game they set.
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May 8, 2020 20:25
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Nat has done very well at the stupid sideshow everyone hates. There is no doubt about that.
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May 8, 2020 20:34
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i give nat a 50% winning at this entire thing. she has 3 advantages at the EoE challenge and she's very good at challenges already. she would have to severely drop the ball to lose. then she has an idol for when she makes it back in. if she makes it to the end she wins. i think tony is the only one who would give her competition. i'd be very underwhelmed if she did. it doesn't matter how much i like the person. if you get voted out first, then spend 90% of the game somewhere where you can't be eliminated while bonding with the jury, it really just makes everything else we watched irrelevant.
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May 8, 2020 20:40
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In retrospect, it is really impressive what Tony and Sarah talked about this week: they've both played twice, worked together, one of them won each time, and it really looks like they're going to notch a third W between them in S40. There's a lot of question marks about EoE returnee and the growing number of idols and the crazy pacing of the finale, but I'm more excited than I have been for a finale in a long, long time.
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May 8, 2020 21:14
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I think its kind of a toss up if Nat's advantages give her a huge edge or not. Like obviously they could be a huge advantage but we've seen plenty of comps that are like multi stage or different stuff that negates leads and advantages that are kinda meh. I assume she'll have some kind of edge but how much I feel like we have to wait and see.
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May 8, 2020 21:33
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STAC Goat posted:Whatever you think of EoE I don't think its fair to discount Nat's token reserve as "she's been there longer." Amber and Danni's pockets aren't exactly overflowing. Nat's balled out all season and done so despite probably having the least food and comfort of most anyone on the cast. You might not like EoE or the idea of Nat having a good chance to get back in, but I think she at least deserves the credit that she busted her rear end and earned it within the rules of the game they set. I don't have particularly strong feeling about Nat either way, and she has done a good job gathering tokens and using the rules to her advantange. I guess I have a problem with the producers making rules that potentially favor early boots. If anything more fire tokens should have to be given to late boots, but I guess it would be more difficult then to sell the EoE storyline.
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May 8, 2020 22:04
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EoE was at least more interesting this season with the tokens and selling advantages -- but that doesn't make it good. End it at merge, and literally nobody is going to be complaining.
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May 8, 2020 22:28
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Jeff hasn't been trying to downplay the season before or during so I can only assume EoE returnee wins (as long as it's Natalie or a man) or Tony wins.
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May 8, 2020 22:34
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I understand from an economics standpoint why they do things like EoE because it costs too much to bring these people out there to get a limited number of episodes out of them but I wish they would come up with another way to keep booted people involved without it impacting the game so much.
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May 8, 2020 23:10
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Adus posted:i'd be very underwhelmed if she did. it doesn't matter how much i like the person. if you get voted out first, then spend 90% of the game somewhere where you can't be eliminated while bonding with the jury, it really just makes everything else we watched irrelevant. As long as EoE is a game mechanic, I am almost always going to be happier seeing someone I like win over someone I dislike no matter what the circumstances  For example, Reem winning would have made the first Edge of Extinction season 10 times better than if anyone who never got voted out of the game had won
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May 8, 2020 23:18
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Rick posted:I understand from an economics standpoint why they do things like EoE because it costs too much to bring these people out there to get a limited number of episodes out of them but I wish they would come up with another way to keep booted people involved without it impacting the game so much. Game getting stale. Just make up new rules. Split the pot. Turn it into 2 games but players don't know until this challenge to "return." *everyone gathers on beach* On island A, we have our New School players playing New School survivor. We think you've had it relatively easy so you're now playing for a little less. What better way to show off your social game skills than by treating all your friends with a $1000 gift card courtesy of Applebees. Your "jury" is all the players who've opted to leave Extinction. So let's bring Sandra out here! Island B, you've been stuck on an island in misery eating poo poo and fighting for scraps. Instead of a challenge to get back into the game you are playing new rules. This last competition is worth $2mil. Starting right now. Let's get it on. Rob, you get a 10 minute head start for reasons. Next time they do EoE, make up new rules all over again.
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May 8, 2020 23:37
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I mean I'm fairly sure a large part of the reason the Edge was used this season was so more of the popular Survivor players would have more tv time/a chance to still win and the show retain ratings so viewers aren't tuning out when Boston Rob/Parvati/etc are voted out early
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May 9, 2020 00:10
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OFFICER LIGER posted:I mean I'm fairly sure a large part of the reason the Edge was used this season was so more of the popular Survivor players would have more tv time/a chance to still win and the show retain ratings so viewers aren't tuning out when Boston Rob/Parvati/etc are voted out early Yea, of course it's this, I would be EOE will be retired after this season is done. Although in a lot of ways it is a bit BS that the person voted out of the game first has had so much control on the game. Picking who gets to buy the advantage is kind of lame and I would certainly understand why people wouldn't be too happy about it.
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May 9, 2020 00:52
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Stokes posted:She didn't succeed though. She's a first boot. No, they absolutely don't. It's the opposite, deep down they know that spending a long time on extinction and making friends and a good story for yourself is a proven-winning strategy. So far 100% of Extinction Island having seasons end with an extinction player winning. For all players in this season, they'd be foolish and worse players to not factor extinction into their strategy throughout the game. Even without directly interacting with extinction players, remaining non-extinct players still have to deal with the relationships and strategies employed with those people. Like it or not, there's actually another layer of strategy added and throughout the game we've seen live-players advantaged or disadvantaged based on choices made by how extinction players feel about those players. Anyway, it still totally sucks and everyone hates it loudly and it's very likely to be going away forever, which isn't something we can say for a lot of other bullshit game elements added over the years. idol-free island aint happenin
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May 9, 2020 01:08
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100% being the only season where the returnee played a perfect game in and was up against two players the jury didn't seem to like much personally or respect their game at all. Chris didn't win because he fed and bonded with the jury. He won because he played more in like 6 days than the other 2 played all season. There's not really a "good story" for EoE returnees, especially early boots. Their story had some lovely writing at the start and a bunch of blank pages. There aren't 2 bad, unlikable players left even if you include Ben as 1 of them. freeman fucked around with this message at 01:56 on May 9, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 01:54
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Khanstant posted:idol-free island aint happenin That's because pagongings suck and it would especially suck if the ratings tanked and the show stopped producing just to appease a few purists. Hope that helps.
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May 9, 2020 01:57
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xbilkis posted:For example, Reem winning would have made the first Edge of Extinction season 10 times better than if anyone who never got voted out of the game had won I've seen people suggesting EoE get cleared out at the merge, which is something. It's still a broken concept (making friends for weeks w/o voting people out) but if we are compelled to have a Losers Bracket I like this idea a lot more than current EoE or the show-wrecking Redemption Island arena.
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May 9, 2020 02:08
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Production is always rear end backwards. First blood vs water. New Players vs Returnee Players. GEE I WONDER HOW THAT WILL TURN OUT. At least Redemption Island kind of makes sense for *~emotional~* reasons. Second Blood vs Water. Redemption Island wouldn't be totally unfair with all newbie players. NAH JK. EXILE ISLAND "TWIST". Oh hello? Yes? Tyler Perry? Yeah sure! Great loving idea for an idol that can be played after the votes were read! Nah we never would have thought of that except for the time we already did it. Also contestants should never be given swimsuits like we usually do around merge? Make the women supremely uncomfortable wearing bras that only function to make their tits look good and aren't meant to be worn non-stop for a month? Perfect. Zesty fucked around with this message at 02:17 on May 9, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 02:12
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one day someone's going to get voted out and they'll suddenly make sense of a clue everyone got earlier in the game... surprise! it's an idol you can only find and play after you've been voted out if you spot it before reaching the exit interview booth.
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May 9, 2020 05:51
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a season of survivor where the twist is that the final 4 players are the jury and they have to choose the winners from people who got voted out already.
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May 9, 2020 05:52
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Survivor: Women vs. Boys the first season with half the cast under the age of 11 to finally settle who is more stronglier, adults or children.
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May 9, 2020 05:53
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Khanstant posted:Survivor: Women vs. Boys the first season with half the cast under the age of 11 to finally settle who is more stronglier, adults or children. I don’t think they need a lawsuit from the MILF Island crew
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May 9, 2020 06:33
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While I hate Edge, if they really do insist on it then I actually like that the early boots have an advantage by having more time/opportunity to win the fire tokens to spend on advantages. Whenever Big Brother does battlebacks it's always pretty boring when the most recent person comes back, it just feels like a big waste of time with everything just reset to the previous round or whatever. When it's someone who's been out for a while it has a more exciting "wild card" feel. Regarding tokens, I don't hate them but their implementation this season was really poor. Opportunities to spend them in the game were so rare that everyone just bought everything they got offered. There was never any interesting bidding or anything since only one player got the offer each week. And the prices were generally so low most people could buy them without even trying to get money from others (in the only two cases people had to borrow from others it was completely trivial because there was no point in saying no since opportunities to spend them were so rare). Fire tokens were really not functionally different from the Island of the Idols games except the receiver of the advantage only sometimes had to do a little activity first instead of all the time. I think a bartering system in the longterm could be kind of fun but also kind of hokey. I guess it was vaguely interesting when Parvati and Wendell danced around selling their vote for tokens, but it also made the game feel kind of petty and small and gamey, especially since it never even amounted to anything. They were mostly just quibbling over trinkets without even knowing why, just a vague sense it was a thing they should be quibbling about. There's no real reason to cut deals with the tokens if there isn't ample opportunity to spend them, and there's not really any way to incorporate ways to regularly spend them without breaking the game wide open with multiple advantages and idols every single week. Here's my attempt of an idea to fix the tokens: The only way to spend fire tokens is through a menu that is publicly available from day one with all prices and items/advantages listed on Day 1. The catch is there's only one of each, the prices are escalating, and only the currently lowest priced item is buyable. So maybe there's a small bag of rice for 2 tokens, a big bag of rice for 4 tokens, an idol good for 2 Tribals at 6 tokens, and so on. You can't buy the idol until the rice and the beans are both purchased first. You then have to try to simultaneously have to save up tokens to get the "good" item but also have to get people to spend their tokens on the "bad" items first. It also creates paranoia if everyone knows the idol will be on sale soon, worrying about who might get enough tokens to buy it first. They could even anonymize it so once the idol is bought no one knows who bought it. It also solves one of my biggest pet peeves with the modern show: no one knows what advantages are in play at any moment so no one can effectively strategize around them. But if all advantages are publically listed on day one and you know when they're purchased, you actually have a shot of strategizing appropriately.
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May 9, 2020 08:13
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Zesty posted:Production is always rear end backwards. The first Blood vs Water actually turned out fine? I mean yeah Tyson kind of ended up stomping everyone but Vytas, Hayden and Ciera were compelling players and Katie/Caleb were nice enough I suppose. At least I think they'd have a fighting chance. Honestly aside from Tyson, Tina and Aras, the rest of the returning players were kinda bad.
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May 9, 2020 08:58
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Hey, I love Tyson. But mixed new/returnee seasons are bad game design.
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May 9, 2020 09:50
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I wonder if they delay things until the Fiji taping is possible or if they bite the bullet and film it in the US. There's definitely some islands in the US territory they could use but I almost hope they do a throwback to the early seasons where it wasn't an island every time. If it's not snowy it would be cool to see a woodland survivor and if it's not sweltering, the desert
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May 9, 2020 11:29
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OFFICER LIGER posted:I mean I'm fairly sure a large part of the reason the Edge was used this season was so more of the popular Survivor players would have more tv time/a chance to still win and the show retain ratings so viewers aren't tuning out when Boston Rob/Parvati/etc are voted out early Rumor is that the only reason Amber agreed to do the show is if something like Edge was added for this exact reason. They bent over backwards for her because Jeff REALLY wanted her for this season.
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May 9, 2020 13:22
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OFFICER LIGER posted:I mean I'm fairly sure a large part of the reason the Edge was used this season was so more of the popular Survivor players would have more tv time/a chance to still win and the show retain ratings so viewers aren't tuning out when Boston Rob/Parvati/etc are voted out early Yeah fully agreed, especially if production predicted that the original players would get voted out first. We'll see how it plays out. It feels like we're going into the final with a lot of players still left but i dunno if that's just the normal amount. Also i'm kinda on board with Boston Rob getting back in just so he gives Ben some poo poo
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May 9, 2020 13:59
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Stokes posted:Rumor is that the only reason Amber agreed to do the show is if something like Edge was added for this exact reason. They bent over backwards for her because Jeff REALLY wanted her for this season. If she wasn't on, they would have had to enlist Jeff to give the teary confessionals about admiring Rob and that would have hurt his credibility as host.
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May 9, 2020 16:32
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I don't love the fire tokens, but they really should have done a Fire Tokens season first so iron out some of the issues. But then again they did an EOE season that was horribly received and made no changes at all, so
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May 9, 2020 16:37
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Stokes posted:Rumor is that the only reason Amber agreed to do the show is if something like Edge was added for this exact reason. They bent over backwards for her because Jeff REALLY wanted her for this season. "Fine, we'll bring it back...but you exclusively get extreme closeup interviews as a result."
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May 9, 2020 17:01
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Stokes posted:Rumor is that the only reason Amber agreed to do the show is if something like Edge was added for this exact reason. They bent over backwards for her because Jeff REALLY wanted her for this season. Whew, thank God they gave in, I definitely, totally would have noticed if Amber were completely absent from this season, yep.
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May 9, 2020 21:56
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